From barney at clickwork.net  Mon Oct 19 05:08:56 2009
From: barney at clickwork.net (Barney Carroll)
Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2009 11:08:56 +0100
Subject: [thelist] Defer CSS to user agent styles using Javascript?
Message-ID: <472577830910190308g3d29ae67sa0ced7117bd4235e@mail.gmail.com>

Hello list,

Does anyone know of a way to define ultra-meak CSS rules? I am looking to
define presentational properties for HTML5 elements that should defer to
existing values if any are available. What I'm really looking for is
negative specificity, or a weakness value, for my selectors (which might not
be such a bad idea for CSS as a whole)?

I'm fairly certain there's no way of doing this with pure CSS ? I imagine
there might be some Javascript method, though; I initially thought of
something *like *

var newEl = document.createElement('newelement')
if(newEl.style.display && newEl.style.display != ''){
meakStyles += 'newEl {display:block;}\r\n'
}

This method doesn't work because element.style.property only returns
author-defined values.

Any ideas?


Regards,
Barney Carroll

barney.carroll at gmail.com
07594 506 381

From sales at lycosa.co.uk  Mon Oct 19 06:39:36 2009
From: sales at lycosa.co.uk (Sales @ Lycosa)
Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2009 12:39:36 +0100
Subject: [thelist] Defer CSS to user agent styles using Javascript?
In-Reply-To: <472577830910190308g3d29ae67sa0ced7117bd4235e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6DCA9280E12A409FA07EA6065049387E@DEV>

Barney,

Is this browser/user system specific? If so, could you write the style on
the fly with a server side script?

Phil Parker


From lee.kowalkowski at googlemail.com  Mon Oct 19 07:08:54 2009
From: lee.kowalkowski at googlemail.com (Lee Kowalkowski)
Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2009 13:08:54 +0100
Subject: [thelist] Defer CSS to user agent styles using Javascript?
In-Reply-To: <472577830910190308g3d29ae67sa0ced7117bd4235e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <472577830910190308g3d29ae67sa0ced7117bd4235e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <610592c90910190508t16f41b0ax47e5eed2063c55c3@mail.gmail.com>

On 19/10/2009, Barney Carroll <barney at clickwork.net> wrote:
> This method doesn't work because element.style.property only returns
> author-defined values.
>
> Any ideas?

element.style specifically refers to the style attribute of the
element, you'd need to use element.currentStyle and whatever its
non-IE counterpart is (getComputedStyle()? - probably need to look
that one up).

-- 
Lee
www.webdeavour.co.uk

From Ron.Luther at hp.com  Mon Oct 19 14:18:03 2009
From: Ron.Luther at hp.com (Luther, Ron)
Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2009 19:18:03 +0000
Subject: [thelist] Online Shop with 3rd party provisioning
In-Reply-To: <007f01ca4f30$92d4bb00$b87e3100$@net>
References: <007f01ca4f30$92d4bb00$b87e3100$@net>
Message-ID: <6C571521FE9E4348AA16498E72C483BB170BB26F8A@GVW0671EXC.americas.hpqcorp.net>

Hi Simon,


As others have pointed out; this is a very common business model.

The basic concept is that as a 'demand aggregator' a middleman like your client can negotiate a lower price with the suppliers, pass some of that savings on to his customers and make his living off the remainder.

Yes - there are certainly ways to turn this into a scam.  But the basic business proposition appears to be on the up and up.


Good Luck,
RonL.

Who sees a fair amount of this kind of thing from several different sides.  ;-)

[Here is a tip for you and your client: Pay very close attention to how you handle expectations on product returns.  I suspect most of your client's customers will purchase with the expectation of being able to return goods directly to your client - rather than to the original manufacturer.  That's an especially important thing to consider in places like EMEA (or even the Tex/Mex border) where an international return may require export licensing paperwork that your average end-customer may not be equipped to deal with.]


From simonmacdonald at uk2.net  Tue Oct 20 04:40:32 2009
From: simonmacdonald at uk2.net (Simon MacDonald)
Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2009 10:40:32 +0100
Subject: [thelist] Online Shop with 3rd party provisioning
Message-ID: <004101ca5169$5e0c22b0$1a246810$@net>


Thanks to everyone for the advice - very useful, I'm now looking at drop
shipping in more detail.
Thanks again,

Simon
 

__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature
database 4525 (20091020) __________

The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.

http://www.eset.com
 


From martin at easyweb.co.uk  Tue Oct 20 01:30:17 2009
From: martin at easyweb.co.uk (Martin Burns)
Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2009 07:30:17 +0100
Subject: [thelist] Online Shop with 3rd party provisioning
In-Reply-To: <6C571521FE9E4348AA16498E72C483BB170BB26F8A@GVW0671EXC.americas.hpqcorp.net>
References: <007f01ca4f30$92d4bb00$b87e3100$@net>
	<6C571521FE9E4348AA16498E72C483BB170BB26F8A@GVW0671EXC.americas.hpqcorp.net>
Message-ID: <0F3F11D9-B0E4-49D0-9BC4-FD5991D286DB@easyweb.co.uk>


On 19 Oct 2009, at 20:18, Luther, Ron wrote:

> The basic concept is that as a 'demand aggregator' a middleman like  
> your client can negotiate a lower price with the suppliers, pass  
> some of that savings on to his customers and make his living off the  
> remainder.


Which is of course the basic proposition of retail. And pretty much  
all agency arrangements.

Cheers
Martin

--
 > Spammers: Send me email -> yumyum at easyweb.co.uk to train my filter
 > http://dspam.nuclearelephant.com/






From bobm at dottedi.biz  Tue Oct 20 17:31:00 2009
From: bobm at dottedi.biz (Bob Meetin)
Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2009 16:31:00 -0600
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
Message-ID: <4ADE3A24.4040803@dottedi.biz>

I 'm sure the responses will be situationally applicable.  Websites have 
many different organizational methods/structure.

With many templates I see a banner with an <h1> tag with either a 
business name or logo that links to home.

Then you have columns or modules and main content.  With an <h1> already 
in the banner and perhaps an <h2> reserved for a slogan, would you start 
another <h1> in the main content?

Launching further, with Joomla and the corePHP blog component, by 
default you give the blog a title which of course is enclosed in <h1> tags.

In this scenario you could have something like:

<div id="banner">
    <h1>business name</h1>
    <h2>slogan</h2>
</div>
<div id="content_header">
    <h1>blog title (i.e. Paul's Super Fantastic WebLog)</h1>
    <h2>blog slogan</h2>
</div>
<div id="blog_entry_title">
    <h1>Smelling like a Rose</h1>
    <h2>Paragraph title, etc</h2>
</div>

What I am wondering about of this is a logical structure or even 
relevant?  Of course this supposedly talks to SEO as well.

It feels like an unbalanced weighing method.

Bob 



From Paul.Bennett at mch.govt.nz  Tue Oct 20 19:06:01 2009
From: Paul.Bennett at mch.govt.nz (Paul Bennett)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 13:06:01 +1300
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
In-Reply-To: <4ADE3A24.4040803@dottedi.biz>
References: <4ADE3A24.4040803@dottedi.biz>
Message-ID: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>

Hi Bob,

You can / should only have one h1 per page (as per the (X)HTML spec and
better for SEO)

Something like this may suffice?

<div id="banner">
    <div id="businessName">business name</div>
    <div class="strapline">slogan</div>
</div>
<div id="content_header">
    <div id="blogTitle">blog title (i.e. Paul's Super Fantastic
WebLog)</div>
    <div class="strapline">blog slogan</div>
</div>
<div id="blog_entry_title">
    <h1>Smelling like a Rose</h1>
    <h2>Paragraph title, etc</h2>
</div>

Eg: the entry title is the best summary of the content of the page, and
each header under that is a summary of the next paragraph.

Paul 

www.mch.govt.nz  -  www.teara.govt.nz  -  www.nzhistory.net.nz  -  www.nzlive.com

The information contained in this email message does not necessarily reflect the views of the Ministry for Culture and Heritage and may contain information that is confidential or subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient and receive this email in error: please notify the Ministry for Culture and Heritage by return email or telephone (64 4 499 4229) and delete this email; you must not use, disclose, copy or distribute this message or the information in it.

PLEASE CONSIDER THE ENVIRONMENT BEFORE YOU PRINT THIS EMAIL




From bobm at dottedi.biz  Tue Oct 20 22:25:27 2009
From: bobm at dottedi.biz (Bob Meetin)
Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2009 21:25:27 -0600
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and h1 tags
In-Reply-To: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
References: <4ADE3A24.4040803@dottedi.biz>
	<E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
Message-ID: <4ADE7F27.1050404@dottedi.biz>

Paul Bennett wrote:
> Hi Bob,
>
> You can / should only have one h1 per page (as per the (X)HTML spec and
> better for SEO)
>
> Something like this may suffice?
>
> <div id="banner">
>     <div id="businessName">business name</div>
>     <div class="strapline">slogan</div>
> </div>
> <div id="content_header">
>     <div id="blogTitle">blog title (i.e. Paul's Super Fantastic WebLog)</div>
>     <div class="strapline">blog slogan</div>
> </div>
> <div id="blog_entry_title">
>     <h1>Smelling like a Rose</h1>
>     <h2>Paragraph title, etc</h2>
> </div>
>
> Eg: the entry title is the best summary of the content of the page, and
> each header under that is a summary of the next paragraph.
>
> Paul 
>   
Thanks.  That jives with what I was thinking and the reason for the 
post.  I have seen similar in other template systems as well.  What 
seems to happen in some instances is that when you mix and match modules 
and various template sources you sometimes run into this compounded 
effect.  Fortunately it's fairly easy to resolve.

Just to be sure about the SEO benefits I googled "seo h1 per page" and 
numerous results support one per page.  One even suggested that an 
example with three was approaching spam - the dealkiller.

-- 
Bob Meetin
www.dottedi.biz
303-926-0167
www.Twitter.com/bobmeetin

Standards - you gotta love em with so many to choose from!
Rocket Science - the Art of Managing Distractions



From sarahwbs at gmail.com  Wed Oct 21 10:50:06 2009
From: sarahwbs at gmail.com (Sarah Adams)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 12:50:06 -0300
Subject: [thelist] good drupal tutorial for non-web devs
Message-ID: <4ADF2DAE.5080409@gmail.com>

I'm looking for a good Drupal tutorial that I can point a client to.
I've set up her site, done some of the basic configuration, and now it's
time for her to add her content. Unfortunately all the tutorials I've
found seem to be geared towards developers, with too much technical
info, info about installing, etc. Anyone know of a good one that covers
what a client needs to know to do basic stuff like add content to their
site, add menu items, etc? I could write something for her myself but
I'd prefer not to reinvent the wheel here.

-- 
sarah adams
web developer & programmer
http://sarah.designshift.com

From d.a.shaver at dashaver.com  Wed Oct 21 11:39:54 2009
From: d.a.shaver at dashaver.com (David Shaver)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 11:39:54 -0500
Subject: [thelist] good drupal tutorial for non-web devs
In-Reply-To: <4ADF2DAE.5080409@gmail.com>
References: <4ADF2DAE.5080409@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <fdd05acf0910210939h619c71eav34de11c810ba7b4b@mail.gmail.com>

I wrote a short simple one at
http://www.dashaver.com/Add-Content-Drupal-WebSite I could add menus

David A. Shaver
D. A. Shaver Web Design
Web Page Design for Small Business
www.dashaver.com
PO Box 594 Galesburg,IL 61402-0594
309.343.0027



On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:50 AM, Sarah Adams <sarahwbs at gmail.com> wrote:

> I'm looking for a good Drupal tutorial that I can point a client to.
> I've set up her site, done some of the basic configuration, and now it's
> time for her to add her content. Unfortunately all the tutorials I've
> found seem to be geared towards developers, with too much technical
> info, info about installing, etc. Anyone know of a good one that covers
> what a client needs to know to do basic stuff like add content to their
> site, add menu items, etc? I could write something for her myself but
> I'd prefer not to reinvent the wheel here.
>
> --
> sarah adams
> web developer & programmer
> http://sarah.designshift.com
> --
>
> * * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
> http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
>
> For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester
> and archives of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org
> Workers of the Web, evolt !
>

From nan at nanharbison.com  Wed Oct 21 11:47:44 2009
From: nan at nanharbison.com (Nan Harbison)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 12:47:44 -0400
Subject: [thelist] good drupal tutorial for non-web devs
In-Reply-To: <4ADF2DAE.5080409@gmail.com>
References: <4ADF2DAE.5080409@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <F83111F9D9554418B56FEDC3AA9C19F6@nancyb0bda4ba6>

Did you look at the Drupal website:
http://drupal.org/getting-started

Specifically, the Drupal cookbook was helpful, I thought.
http://drupal.org/handbook/customization/tutorials/beginners-cookbook

Nan 

-----Original Message-----
From: thelist-bounces at lists.evolt.org
[mailto:thelist-bounces at lists.evolt.org] On Behalf Of Sarah Adams
Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 11:50 AM
To: thelist
Subject: [thelist] good drupal tutorial for non-web devs

I'm looking for a good Drupal tutorial that I can point a client to.
I've set up her site, done some of the basic configuration, and now it's
time for her to add her content. Unfortunately all the tutorials I've found
seem to be geared towards developers, with too much technical info, info
about installing, etc. Anyone know of a good one that covers what a client
needs to know to do basic stuff like add content to their site, add menu
items, etc? I could write something for her myself but I'd prefer not to
reinvent the wheel here.

--
sarah adams
web developer & programmer
http://sarah.designshift.com
-- 

* * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/

For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester and archives
of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org Workers of the Web, evolt ! 


From nan at nanharbison.com  Wed Oct 21 11:48:51 2009
From: nan at nanharbison.com (Nan Harbison)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 12:48:51 -0400
Subject: [thelist] good drupal tutorial for non-web devs
In-Reply-To: <fdd05acf0910210939h619c71eav34de11c810ba7b4b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4ADF2DAE.5080409@gmail.com>
	<fdd05acf0910210939h619c71eav34de11c810ba7b4b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CF6FF77DAF784DCF89B5DCC350676B47@nancyb0bda4ba6>

Wow, David, your tutorial is great!
 

-----Original Message-----
From: thelist-bounces at lists.evolt.org
[mailto:thelist-bounces at lists.evolt.org] On Behalf Of David Shaver
Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 12:40 PM
To: thelist at lists.evolt.org
Subject: Re: [thelist] good drupal tutorial for non-web devs

I wrote a short simple one at
http://www.dashaver.com/Add-Content-Drupal-WebSite I could add menus

David A. Shaver
D. A. Shaver Web Design
Web Page Design for Small Business
www.dashaver.com
PO Box 594 Galesburg,IL 61402-0594
309.343.0027



On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:50 AM, Sarah Adams <sarahwbs at gmail.com> wrote:

> I'm looking for a good Drupal tutorial that I can point a client to.
> I've set up her site, done some of the basic configuration, and now 
> it's time for her to add her content. Unfortunately all the tutorials 
> I've found seem to be geared towards developers, with too much 
> technical info, info about installing, etc. Anyone know of a good one 
> that covers what a client needs to know to do basic stuff like add 
> content to their site, add menu items, etc? I could write something 
> for her myself but I'd prefer not to reinvent the wheel here.
>
> --
> sarah adams
> web developer & programmer
> http://sarah.designshift.com
> --
>
> * * Please support the community that supports you.  * * 
> http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
>
> For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester and 
> archives of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org Workers of the Web, 
> evolt !
>
-- 

* * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/

For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester and archives
of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org Workers of the Web, evolt ! 


From d.a.shaver at dashaver.com  Wed Oct 21 12:24:28 2009
From: d.a.shaver at dashaver.com (David Shaver)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 12:24:28 -0500
Subject: [thelist] good drupal tutorial for non-web devs
In-Reply-To: <CF6FF77DAF784DCF89B5DCC350676B47@nancyb0bda4ba6>
References: <4ADF2DAE.5080409@gmail.com>
	<fdd05acf0910210939h619c71eav34de11c810ba7b4b@mail.gmail.com>
	<CF6FF77DAF784DCF89B5DCC350676B47@nancyb0bda4ba6>
Message-ID: <fdd05acf0910211024x52feaf62u86f8ac545a766403@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks!

David A. Shaver
D. A. Shaver Web Design
Web Page Design for Small Business
www.dashaver.com
PO Box 594 Galesburg,IL 61402-0594
309.343.0027



On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 11:48 AM, Nan Harbison <nan at nanharbison.com> wrote:

> Wow, David, your tutorial is great!
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: thelist-bounces at lists.evolt.org
> [mailto:thelist-bounces at lists.evolt.org] On Behalf Of David Shaver
> Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 12:40 PM
> To: thelist at lists.evolt.org
> Subject: Re: [thelist] good drupal tutorial for non-web devs
>
> I wrote a short simple one at
> http://www.dashaver.com/Add-Content-Drupal-WebSite I could add menus
>
> David A. Shaver
> D. A. Shaver Web Design
> Web Page Design for Small Business
> www.dashaver.com
> PO Box 594 Galesburg,IL 61402-0594
> 309.343.0027
>
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:50 AM, Sarah Adams <sarahwbs at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I'm looking for a good Drupal tutorial that I can point a client to.
> > I've set up her site, done some of the basic configuration, and now
> > it's time for her to add her content. Unfortunately all the tutorials
> > I've found seem to be geared towards developers, with too much
> > technical info, info about installing, etc. Anyone know of a good one
> > that covers what a client needs to know to do basic stuff like add
> > content to their site, add menu items, etc? I could write something
> > for her myself but I'd prefer not to reinvent the wheel here.
> >
> > --
> > sarah adams
> > web developer & programmer
> > http://sarah.designshift.com
> > --
> >
> > * * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
> > http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
> >
> > For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester and
> > archives of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org Workers of the Web,
> > evolt !
> >
> --
>
> * * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
> http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
>
> For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester and archives
> of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org Workers of the Web, evolt !
>
> --
>
> * * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
> http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
>
> For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester
> and archives of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org
> Workers of the Web, evolt !
>

From Paul.Bennett at mch.govt.nz  Wed Oct 21 13:55:57 2009
From: Paul.Bennett at mch.govt.nz (Paul Bennett)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 07:55:57 +1300
Subject: [thelist] good drupal tutorial for non-web devs
In-Reply-To: <4ADF2DAE.5080409@gmail.com>
References: <4ADF2DAE.5080409@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8AE@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>

Hi there,

Lullabot sell some stuff especially for this:
http://store.lullabot.com/products/administering-drupal

Check out the free 10 minute video - it may be of some help :)

Paul 

www.mch.govt.nz  -  www.teara.govt.nz  -  www.nzhistory.net.nz  -  www.nzlive.com

The information contained in this email message does not necessarily reflect the views of the Ministry for Culture and Heritage and may contain information that is confidential or subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient and receive this email in error: please notify the Ministry for Culture and Heritage by return email or telephone (64 4 499 4229) and delete this email; you must not use, disclose, copy or distribute this message or the information in it.

PLEASE CONSIDER THE ENVIRONMENT BEFORE YOU PRINT THIS EMAIL




From steveax at pobox.com  Wed Oct 21 15:44:55 2009
From: steveax at pobox.com (Steve Axthelm)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 13:44:55 -0700
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
In-Reply-To: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
Message-ID: <r307ps-1058i-67AADA64246A419A9277FB496710D3F3@MBP.local>

On 2009-10-20 Paul Bennett wrote:

>You can / should only have one h1 per page (as per the (X)HTML spec and
>better for SEO)

There's nothing in the HTML 4 (or XHTML) specs that specify that 
only one h1 tag per page is allowed.

<body>
<h1>foo!</h1>
<h1>bar!</h1>
</body>

Validates just fine as any of the html flavors, including the stricts.

Personally I think it makes more sense to have just one, and 
usually author that way, but then I like outlines. One can 
certainly make a reasonable argument for more than one h1 on a 
page, and given the mashup nature of today's web, it's not uncommon.

The html5 sectioning and headings have been modified to be more 
flexible in this regard:

<http://dev.w3.org/html5/spec/Overview.html#headings-and-sections>

And I think will be much more useful.

As for SEO, I'd really doubt that any of the search engines 
would penalize multiple h1's, but then I don't follow the weekly 
google dance music.

HTH,


-Steve

-- 
Steve Axthelm
steveax at pobox.com


From Paul.Bennett at mch.govt.nz  Wed Oct 21 15:47:31 2009
From: Paul.Bennett at mch.govt.nz (Paul Bennett)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 09:47:31 +1300
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
In-Reply-To: <r307ps-1058i-67AADA64246A419A9277FB496710D3F3@MBP.local>
References: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
	<r307ps-1058i-67AADA64246A419A9277FB496710D3F3@MBP.local>
Message-ID: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8B2@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>

Steve - that's 2 of my myth's busted in one day.

Now I have to go and learn some new fake stuff to tell people... 

www.mch.govt.nz  -  www.teara.govt.nz  -  www.nzhistory.net.nz  -  www.nzlive.com

The information contained in this email message does not necessarily reflect the views of the Ministry for Culture and Heritage and may contain information that is confidential or subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient and receive this email in error: please notify the Ministry for Culture and Heritage by return email or telephone (64 4 499 4229) and delete this email; you must not use, disclose, copy or distribute this message or the information in it.

PLEASE CONSIDER THE ENVIRONMENT BEFORE YOU PRINT THIS EMAIL




From barney.carroll at gmail.com  Wed Oct 21 16:13:40 2009
From: barney.carroll at gmail.com (Barney Carroll)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 22:13:40 +0100
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
In-Reply-To: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8B2@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
References: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
	<r307ps-1058i-67AADA64246A419A9277FB496710D3F3@MBP.local> 
	<E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8B2@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
Message-ID: <472577830910211413x4b4d77e1kf4c089d6877844ba@mail.gmail.com>

The h1 has especial SEO value as it dictates the content of the page. The
whole h1-6 archetype is frought with argument as to how much meaning they
can have - they have no hierarchical validity associations, why are there as
many as/only 6?, etc, etc...

By tradition the company logo or site title is contained within the h1,
although there is also practice of using page-specific, page-distinguishing
headers as the h1, with the generic site title not being of great
importance. w3 says that h1 should to a large degree reflect the title
element.

Multiple h1s are generally believed to be very bad for SEO.


Regards,
Barney Carroll

barney.carroll at gmail.com
07594 506 381


2009/10/21 Paul Bennett <Paul.Bennett at mch.govt.nz>

> Steve - that's 2 of my myth's busted in one day.
>
> Now I have to go and learn some new fake stuff to tell people...
>
> www.mch.govt.nz  -  www.teara.govt.nz  -  www.nzhistory.net.nz  -
> www.nzlive.com
>
> The information contained in this email message does not necessarily
> reflect the views of the Ministry for Culture and Heritage and may contain
> information that is confidential or subject to legal privilege. If you are
> not the intended recipient and receive this email in error: please notify
> the Ministry for Culture and Heritage by return email or telephone (64 4 499
> 4229) and delete this email; you must not use, disclose, copy or distribute
> this message or the information in it.
>
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>
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>
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From joel at bizba6.com  Wed Oct 21 19:26:20 2009
From: joel at bizba6.com (Joel Canfield)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 17:26:20 -0700
Subject: [thelist] fun with Wordpress
Message-ID: <619d00930910211726m336b8386qbead1c6ce963d13c@mail.gmail.com>

Been having some fun getting my head around Wordpress's CSS. The blogs are
on the new hosting, so they're not all linked up yet.

One of my business sites

http://www.businessheretics.com/ck/

<http://www.businessheretics.com/ck/>and matching blog

http://72.9.251.146/~bizbacom/ck/blog/

<http://72.9.251.146/~bizbacom/ck/blog/>and another site

http://www.chiefvirtualofficer.com/cvo/

<http://www.chiefvirtualofficer.com/cvo/>and matching blog

http://72.9.251.146/~bizbacom/cvo/blog/

<http://72.9.251.146/~bizbacom/cvo/blog/>Minor tweaks still needed here and
there (margins and padding in some cases; fixed width on the BH blog) but
overall, I'm pleased with the results.

joel

-- 
Joel at Bizba6.com
http://BizBa6.com/

From martin at easyweb.co.uk  Wed Oct 21 19:34:57 2009
From: martin at easyweb.co.uk (Martin Burns)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 01:34:57 +0100
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
In-Reply-To: <472577830910211413x4b4d77e1kf4c089d6877844ba@mail.gmail.com>
References: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
	<r307ps-1058i-67AADA64246A419A9277FB496710D3F3@MBP.local>
	<E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8B2@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
	<472577830910211413x4b4d77e1kf4c089d6877844ba@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <FF8AC0FE-3E81-406C-A279-2C5A8E4AC3CB@easyweb.co.uk>


On 21 Oct 2009, at 22:13, Barney Carroll wrote:

> By tradition the company logo or site title is contained within the  
> h1,


Which tradition would this be?
Presumably the one that puts the site title in the <title> element,  
rather than the page title. Which only ever made sense for one page  
sites. (Well, OK then - also for applications where the site  
effectively *is* one page, rather than content)

Always struck me as indicative of rank amateurism, FrontPage and all  
that goes with it. Really doesn't help anyone - human or machine - to  
understand what that page is about.

Cheers
Martin

--
 > Spammers: Send me email -> yumyum at easyweb.co.uk to train my filter
 > http://dspam.nuclearelephant.com/






From Paul.Bennett at mch.govt.nz  Wed Oct 21 19:41:47 2009
From: Paul.Bennett at mch.govt.nz (Paul Bennett)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 13:41:47 +1300
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
In-Reply-To: <FF8AC0FE-3E81-406C-A279-2C5A8E4AC3CB@easyweb.co.uk>
References: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz><r307ps-1058i-67AADA64246A419A9277FB496710D3F3@MBP.local><E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8B2@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz><472577830910211413x4b4d77e1kf4c089d6877844ba@mail.gmail.com>
	<FF8AC0FE-3E81-406C-A279-2C5A8E4AC3CB@easyweb.co.uk>
Message-ID: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8C6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>

I agree Martin,

Think of what happens when someone bookmarks the page based on the
content they liked and the bookmark only has 'site name'.

IMO, it's much better to have something like:
'Page title - page category - site name' for the title and (my
preference) <h1>Page Title</h1>

Paul
 

www.mch.govt.nz  -  www.teara.govt.nz  -  www.nzhistory.net.nz  -  www.nzlive.com

The information contained in this email message does not necessarily reflect the views of the Ministry for Culture and Heritage and may contain information that is confidential or subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient and receive this email in error: please notify the Ministry for Culture and Heritage by return email or telephone (64 4 499 4229) and delete this email; you must not use, disclose, copy or distribute this message or the information in it.

PLEASE CONSIDER THE ENVIRONMENT BEFORE YOU PRINT THIS EMAIL




From bobm at dottedi.biz  Wed Oct 21 21:25:20 2009
From: bobm at dottedi.biz (Bob Meetin)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 20:25:20 -0600
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
In-Reply-To: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8C6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
References: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz><r307ps-1058i-67AADA64246A419A9277FB496710D3F3@MBP.local><E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8B2@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz><472577830910211413x4b4d77e1kf4c089d6877844ba@mail.gmail.com>	<FF8AC0FE-3E81-406C-A279-2C5A8E4AC3CB@easyweb.co.uk>
	<E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8C6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
Message-ID: <4ADFC290.4040502@dottedi.biz>

Paul Bennett wrote:
> I agree Martin,
>
> Think of what happens when someone bookmarks the page based on the
> content they liked and the bookmark only has 'site name'.
>
> IMO, it's much better to have something like:
> 'Page title - page category - site name' for the title and (my
> preference) <h1>Page Title</h1>
>
> Paul
This last bit was a bit confusing.  I believe that only if the title tag 
<title>key phrase, key phrase, maybe short company name</title> is empty 
that the bots will look into the page body for something useful to 
display in search results and as a bookmark.  I've never checked, but it 
may even look at meta description first before cruising body content 
such as h1, h2, etc.



From julian.rickards at gmail.com  Wed Oct 21 21:13:25 2009
From: julian.rickards at gmail.com (Julian Rickards)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 22:13:25 -0400
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
In-Reply-To: <472577830910211413x4b4d77e1kf4c089d6877844ba@mail.gmail.com>
References: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
	<r307ps-1058i-67AADA64246A419A9277FB496710D3F3@MBP.local>
	<E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8B2@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
	<472577830910211413x4b4d77e1kf4c089d6877844ba@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7613e9690910211913x68af221djf87abb835ca06fc6@mail.gmail.com>

My approach has been the following. I think you could say that every page
has a single purpose whether it be describing the company, providing contact
information, giving detailed information about a particular product and so
on. This purpose should be encapsulated in the H1 and therefore, since there
can't be two or more purposes for a page, there can be only one H1. If you
can think of more than one purpose for the page, either you have too much
conflicting information on the page or you haven't properly summarized the
content of the page. For example, if you are providing detail about a
particular bike your site is selling and also the page is providing contact
information for your company, then the information is conflicting and should
be split into two pages. However, if you are providing both a staff
directory and driving directions to the company, then the H1 should
encapsulate these and H2s should be used to split them.
The only page that can be difficult is the home page of a site. Sometimes
the page is constantly changing, possibly because the products on sale
change from day to day or week to week. Sometimes the home page is really a
gateway to the various sections on the site. I might agree that the only
constant on this type of page is the business name and would concede that
marking up the business name and slogan with H1 and H2 would be acceptable.

Just my 2 cents,

Jules
-- 
E-mail: julian dot rickards at gmail dot com

From martin at easyweb.co.uk  Thu Oct 22 01:19:07 2009
From: martin at easyweb.co.uk (Martin Burns)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 07:19:07 +0100
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
In-Reply-To: <4ADFC290.4040502@dottedi.biz>
References: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz><r307ps-1058i-67AADA64246A419A9277FB496710D3F3@MBP.local><E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8B2@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz><472577830910211413x4b4d77e1kf4c089d6877844ba@mail.gmail.com>	<FF8AC0FE-3E81-406C-A279-2C5A8E4AC3CB@easyweb.co.uk>
	<E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8C6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
	<4ADFC290.4040502@dottedi.biz>
Message-ID: <DEAA621E-AC1F-4891-9B04-D0C0E9692762@easyweb.co.uk>


On 22 Oct 2009, at 03:25, Bob Meetin wrote:

>  believe that only if the title tag
> <title>key phrase, key phrase, maybe short company name</title> is  
> empty
> that the bots will look into the page body for something useful to
> display in search results and as a bookmark.


Surely it's our job to build sites for *users*, and bots' job to parse  
them accordingly...

Cheers
Martin

--
 > Spammers: Send me email -> yumyum at easyweb.co.uk to train my filter
 > http://dspam.nuclearelephant.com/






From martin at easyweb.co.uk  Thu Oct 22 01:23:38 2009
From: martin at easyweb.co.uk (Martin Burns)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 07:23:38 +0100
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
In-Reply-To: <7613e9690910211913x68af221djf87abb835ca06fc6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
	<r307ps-1058i-67AADA64246A419A9277FB496710D3F3@MBP.local>
	<E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8B2@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
	<472577830910211413x4b4d77e1kf4c089d6877844ba@mail.gmail.com>
	<7613e9690910211913x68af221djf87abb835ca06fc6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <0DE332B2-69D9-4E11-A1E0-EA64162396E6@easyweb.co.uk>


On 22 Oct 2009, at 03:13, Julian Rickards wrote:

> This purpose should be encapsulated in the H1 and therefore, since  
> there
> can't be two or more purposes for a page, there can be only one H1.  
> If you
> can think of more than one purpose for the page, either you have too  
> much
> conflicting information on the page or you haven't properly  
> summarized the
> content of the page.

Yep, that's about right

> However, if you are providing both a staff
> directory and driving directions to the company, then the H1 should
> encapsulate these and H2s should be used to split them.


Better example: your page provides location info for the company, you  
might structure it as:

<h1>How to find us</h1>
	<h2>Driving Directions</h2>
	<h2>Directions by Public Transport</h2>

or

<h1>How to find us</h1>
	<h2>Map</h2>
	<h2>How to reach us
		<h3>Driving Directions</h3>
		<h3>Directions by Public Transport</h3>

Each of those sections/subsections could conceivably be its own page,  
but by putting them together on one, you organise hierarchically.

Cheers
Martin
--
 > Spammers: Send me email -> yumyum at easyweb.co.uk to train my filter
 > http://dspam.nuclearelephant.com/






From evolt at roselli.org  Thu Oct 22 08:00:34 2009
From: evolt at roselli.org (aardvark)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 09:00:34 -0400
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
In-Reply-To: <7613e9690910211913x68af221djf87abb835ca06fc6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <472577830910211413x4b4d77e1kf4c089d6877844ba@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4AE01F32.19648.D07C1@localhost>

On 21 Oct 2009 at 22:13, Julian Rickards wrote:
[...]
> The only page that can be difficult is the home page of a site. Sometimes
> the page is constantly changing, possibly because the products on sale
> change from day to day or week to week. Sometimes the home page is really a
> gateway to the various sections on the site. I might agree that the only
> constant on this type of page is the business name and would concede that
> marking up the business name and slogan with H1 and H2 would be acceptable.
[...]

i would argue that it's just as easy for the home page... regardless 
of your layout, the home page usually has some sort of hierarchy and 
can be represented with appropriate headings...

if your home page has two or three competing messages, perhaps then 
your h1 is the company name and each message is an h2 (i wouldn't 
ever make the slogan an h2)... if you have promotionals or other bits 
that are sub to each of those, they get h3 and so on down the line... 
even if your highlighted products changed hourly, you should have an 
understanding of where the "highlighted product" block of content 
fits within that hierarchy...

if you attack your home page content as content (what's the message, 
the call to action, the priorities, etc.) and look at it from an IA 
perspective, then you're probably in good shape... if you look at it 
as a design problem first, then you may have trouble identifying your 
structure (or your message and so on)...



From martin at easyweb.co.uk  Thu Oct 22 01:25:01 2009
From: martin at easyweb.co.uk (Martin Burns)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 07:25:01 +0100
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
In-Reply-To: <7613e9690910211913x68af221djf87abb835ca06fc6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
	<r307ps-1058i-67AADA64246A419A9277FB496710D3F3@MBP.local>
	<E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8B2@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>
	<472577830910211413x4b4d77e1kf4c089d6877844ba@mail.gmail.com>
	<7613e9690910211913x68af221djf87abb835ca06fc6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1670C0B6-0531-40CF-AE33-A97B0901D48F@easyweb.co.uk>


On 22 Oct 2009, at 03:13, Julian Rickards wrote:

> Sometimes the home page is really a
> gateway to the various sections on the site. I might agree that the  
> only
> constant on this type of page is the business name and would concede  
> that
> marking up the business name and slogan with H1


Yes, because the home page's subject is the organisation and its main  
brand message.

Cheers
Martin
--
 > Spammers: Send me email -> yumyum at easyweb.co.uk to train my filter
 > http://dspam.nuclearelephant.com/






From webdad at tampabay.rr.com  Thu Oct 22 08:18:49 2009
From: webdad at tampabay.rr.com (Bob Boisvert)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 09:18:49 -0400
Subject: [thelist] Site optimization & Google keyword changes
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAFDf1oQ7ryZLppK9y+pdNeTCgAAAEAAAAKL9WLG/tApGlnXR21h44KMBAAAAAA==@tampabay.rr.com>

Hi All,

I've gotten into the habit of keyword optimization when I'm optimizing a
website but now that Google isn't looking at keywords anymore, how has or
should the optimization process change to achieve a higher ranking? I have a
very simple formula that I have been using which included keywords at least
in the meta tags and definitely in the copy but now I'm not sure of how to
approach the optimization.

Any suggestions?

Thanks

Bob Boisvert
SarJen Web Design
www.sarjen-webdesign.com
Phone: 727-593-9493

Website Hosting and Domains: www.sarjen-webhosting.com




From evolt at roselli.org  Thu Oct 22 10:07:05 2009
From: evolt at roselli.org (aardvark)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 11:07:05 -0400
Subject: [thelist] Site optimization & Google keyword changes
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAFDf1oQ7ryZLppK9y+pdNeTCgAAAEAAAAKL9WLG/tApGlnXR21h44KMBAAAAAA==@tampabay.rr.com>
Message-ID: <4AE03CD9.5547.80DC86@localhost>

On 22 Oct 2009 at 9:18, Bob Boisvert wrote:
[...]
> I've gotten into the habit of keyword optimization when I'm optimizing a
> website but now that Google isn't looking at keywords anymore, how has or
> should the optimization process change to achieve a higher ranking? I have a
> very simple formula that I have been using which included keywords at least
> in the meta tags and definitely in the copy but now I'm not sure of how to
> approach the optimization.
[...]

Google (and others) have ignored meta content for years in evaluating 
pages [1]...

writing good copy that contains your targeted brand, message, and 
other language is a good start... however, none of this really 
increases your page rank... having the complete *lack* of a 
word/phrase on a page means it's probably not going to come up in a 
search for that word/phrase... loading the page with that 
word/phrase, on the other hand, won't necessarily increase where it 
comes up in the results, except when considered alongside other pages 
from your site...

one of the best ways to increase your page rank is from qualified 
inbound links... link farms hurt you... 300 blogs that link to some 
great content on your site help... 1 link from a CNN article helps...

i'm greatly oversimplifying, but the simple strategy is to write good 
content that people will want to link to, and then hope they do (you 
can move that along with more traditional methods, like press 
releases, phone calls, etc.)... in short, it's not a technology or 
code trick... it's good old fashioned communications and relationship 
management...

[1] Verified: Google Ignores Meta Keywords
http://evolt.org/node/62267



From bobm at dottedi.biz  Thu Oct 22 13:28:55 2009
From: bobm at dottedi.biz (Bob Meetin)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 12:28:55 -0600
Subject: [thelist] A question of semantics and tags
In-Reply-To: <1670C0B6-0531-40CF-AE33-A97B0901D48F@easyweb.co.uk>
References: <E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8A6@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>	<r307ps-1058i-67AADA64246A419A9277FB496710D3F3@MBP.local>	<E6C26C56F0675B46B71BC19CBB53DFB80688E8B2@mchexchange.mchdomain.mch.govt.nz>	<472577830910211413x4b4d77e1kf4c089d6877844ba@mail.gmail.com>	<7613e9690910211913x68af221djf87abb835ca06fc6@mail.gmail.com>
	<1670C0B6-0531-40CF-AE33-A97B0901D48F@easyweb.co.uk>
Message-ID: <4AE0A467.1050108@dottedi.biz>

Doing some additional nosing around, I found something incredibly useful 
on the W3C page,  http://validator.w3.org/, that I never actually 
checked before. If you click on More Options, there is a "Show Outline" 
checkbox function:  http://validator.w3.org/#validate_by_uri+with_options

-Bob



From fredthejonester at gmail.com  Thu Oct 22 14:18:26 2009
From: fredthejonester at gmail.com (Fred Jones)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 21:18:26 +0200
Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
Message-ID: <177c0a10910221218l5e248588y804a2256cc1ed46a@mail.gmail.com>

I'm not into blogging, but now I am working on one for someone. :)

I found these tools for sharing links:

http://addthis.com/
http://sharethis.com/
http://www.addtoany.com/

Are there others? Is one recommended over another?

Are these button packages better than just putting OUT IN THE OPEN a
few of the main sharing sites? Seems like it's easier to just click on
a simple Digg link then to try to figure out what the heck this popup
window is and what it does--for the average non-techie user I mean.

Thanks!

From vaspers at inbox.com  Wed Oct 21 13:35:20 2009
From: vaspers at inbox.com (steven streight)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 10:35:20 -0800
Subject: [thelist] disabling web text copy & paste
Message-ID: <05152EFC0A2.00000090vaspers@inbox.com>

What is the HTML (JavaScript) code that prevents web browsers from copy & paste on text? You cannot highlight text and paste it, for example, to quote it in a blog post.

I rarely see it done. It seems super protective in an anti-web way. But some sites may need this security measure to avoid people stealing their content in special situations, which I sympathize with.

But why Snopes?


http://www.snopes.com/


Steven E. Streight 
www.pluperfecter.blogspot.com


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From rob at rob-n-steph.net  Thu Oct 22 15:17:51 2009
From: rob at rob-n-steph.net (Robert Lee)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 16:17:51 -0400
Subject: [thelist] disabling web text copy & paste
In-Reply-To: <05152EFC0A2.00000090vaspers@inbox.com>
References: <05152EFC0A2.00000090vaspers@inbox.com>
Message-ID: <015f01ca5354$bd405a70$37c10f50$@net>

While they really only present a speed bump for someone that really wants to
copy the text, you can Google "disable text selection script" or "no text
selection script" and you should be able to find what you are looking for.

HTH,
Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: thelist-bounces at lists.evolt.org
[mailto:thelist-bounces at lists.evolt.org] On Behalf Of steven streight
Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 2:35 PM
To: thelist at lists.evolt.org
Subject: [thelist] disabling web text copy & paste

What is the HTML (JavaScript) code that prevents web browsers from copy &
paste on text? You cannot highlight text and paste it, for example, to quote
it in a blog post.

I rarely see it done. It seems super protective in an anti-web way. But some
sites may need this security measure to avoid people stealing their content
in special situations, which I sympathize with.

But why Snopes?


http://www.snopes.com/


Steven E. Streight 
www.pluperfecter.blogspot.com



From JGERSTEN at lchb.com  Thu Oct 22 15:22:37 2009
From: JGERSTEN at lchb.com (Gersten, John)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 13:22:37 -0700
Subject: [thelist] disabling web text copy & paste
In-Reply-To: <05152EFC0A2.00000090vaspers@inbox.com>
Message-ID: <3CBA52B9335F054FB6D2E68618E018C608589495@sfmail01.lchb.com>

Don't have an answer, sorry, but I've been surprised recently to see a
few sites (LA Times, for one) sneakily setting things up so that you
*can* copy-and-paste, but whatever you select gets auto-injected with
the site/page URL (!). Clever, and a much classier approach, IMHO.

And no, I don't know how they do that, either <g>.

-John

> -----Original Message-----
> From: thelist-bounces at lists.evolt.org 
> [mailto:thelist-bounces at lists.evolt.org] On Behalf Of steven streight
> Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 11:35 AM
> To: thelist at lists.evolt.org
> Subject: [thelist] disabling web text copy & paste
> 
> What is the HTML (JavaScript) code that prevents web browsers 
> from copy & paste on text? You cannot highlight text and 
> paste it, for example, to quote it in a blog post.
> 
> I rarely see it done. It seems super protective in an 
> anti-web way. But some sites may need this security measure 
> to avoid people stealing their content in special situations, 
> which I sympathize with.
> 
> But why Snopes?
> 
> 
> http://www.snopes.com/
> 
> 
> Steven E. Streight
> www.pluperfecter.blogspot.com
> 
> 
> Confidentiality Notice: This electronic message and/or 
> advertising approval, including any attachments, is for the 
> sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain 
> confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized 
> review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited.
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Receive Notifications of Incoming Messages
> Easily monitor multiple email accounts & access them with a click.
> Visit http://www.inbox.com/notifier and check it out!
> -- 
> 
> * * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
> http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
> 
> For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester 
> and archives of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org 
> Workers of the Web, evolt ! 
> 

From bobm at dottedi.biz  Thu Oct 22 16:59:07 2009
From: bobm at dottedi.biz (Bob Meetin)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 15:59:07 -0600
Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
In-Reply-To: <177c0a10910221218l5e248588y804a2256cc1ed46a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <177c0a10910221218l5e248588y804a2256cc1ed46a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4AE0D5AB.10803@dottedi.biz>

Fred Jones wrote:
> I'm not into blogging, but now I am working on one for someone. :)
>
> I found these tools for sharing links:
>
> http://addthis.com/
> http://sharethis.com/
> http://www.addtoany.com/
>
> Are there others? 
>   
http://ping.fm/


From lee.kowalkowski at googlemail.com  Thu Oct 22 16:18:19 2009
From: lee.kowalkowski at googlemail.com (Lee Kowalkowski)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 22:18:19 +0100
Subject: [thelist] disabling web text copy & paste
In-Reply-To: <05152EFC0A2.00000090vaspers@inbox.com>
References: <05152EFC0A2.00000090vaspers@inbox.com>
Message-ID: <610592c90910221418k6d226333q4540a5fd13f4c8ef@mail.gmail.com>

> What is the HTML (JavaScript) code that prevents web browsers from copy & paste on text? You cannot highlight text and paste it, for example, to quote it in a blog post.

Worthless.  I hate it, I was on a site where they wanted me to enter
my email address twice, and they went out of their way to prevent me
from copy / pasting it from one field to the next, presumably to
reduce errors.  Charming!  Whose bright idea was it to prevent users
from pasting it from their address books?  Get a life!  Woah, back on
topic...

> I rarely see it done. It seems super protective in an anti-web way. But some sites may need this security measure to avoid people stealing their content in special situations, which I sympathize with.

I can't think of a single way to do it which would be easy to maintain
yet impossible to work around.

What's the point!? "Oh we know the bad guys can get our content, we
can't afford to stop them, but we'll do our best to stop the good
guys".  The 'good guys' are small fry compared to how much content a
bot writer can harvest.

> But why Snopes?
> http://www.snopes.com/

They're paranoid?  They forgot CTRL-A, CTRL-C though.  Or just switch
off JS which isn't difficult in most browsers, and you can select away
until your heart is content.

The script they're using is embedded in the page (view-source / CTRL-U
in most browsers).

Make a favelet to switch it off -
javascript:document.onselectstart=disableselect=reEnable;void 0;

--
Lee
webdeavour.co.uk

From vaspers at inbox.com  Thu Oct 22 17:21:01 2009
From: vaspers at inbox.com (steven streight)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 14:21:01 -0800
Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
In-Reply-To: <177c0a10910221218l5e248588y804a2256cc1ed46a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <13A047F964C.00000AEBvaspers@inbox.com>

Blog link exchanges and link promotion sites are pretty worthless.

I've been a hardcore blogger for several years now you can go to my blog shown below for my credentials.

Digg, Stumble Upon, and similar sites are often used to "game" the system. The traffic you get from these sites is generally unqualified curiosity surfers. Conversion to sales is miserable. You get a temporary bump in hits, but that just gives you a false sense of "popularity".

Best way to get people to link to your blog is to post comments, lots of conversation-enriching remarks, at other blogs that are relevant to your own.

Steven E. Streight 
www.pluperfecter.blogspot.com


Confidentiality Notice: This electronic message and/or advertising approval, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: fredthejonester at gmail.com
> Sent: Thu, 22 Oct 2009 21:18:26 +0200
> To: thelist at lists.evolt.org
> Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
> 
> I'm not into blogging, but now I am working on one for someone. :)
> 
> I found these tools for sharing links:
> 
> http://addthis.com/
> http://sharethis.com/
> http://www.addtoany.com/
> 
> Are there others? Is one recommended over another?
> 
> Are these button packages better than just putting OUT IN THE OPEN a
> few of the main sharing sites? Seems like it's easier to just click on
> a simple Digg link then to try to figure out what the heck this popup
> window is and what it does--for the average non-techie user I mean.
> 
> Thanks!
> --
> 
> * * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
> http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
> 
> For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester
> and archives of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org
> Workers of the Web, evolt !

From sales at lycosa.co.uk  Fri Oct 23 05:28:06 2009
From: sales at lycosa.co.uk (Sales @ Lycosa)
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 11:28:06 +0100
Subject: [thelist] LAN connection quesry
Message-ID: <9D3A4ACFEF61475489F3BBA91570674F@DEV>

One of my customers has a router (I don't know what make) for their LAN and
they are experiencing sporadic connection difficulties to cPanel on my
production server. They can connect for a while, then they get locked out,
but can still access the associated website. They have a dynamic IP address
for their internet connection, and use ESET for antivirus. I know the
website / cPanel are working, as I can access them at these times.

Any ideas?

Phil


From vaspers at inbox.com  Fri Oct 23 08:55:36 2009
From: vaspers at inbox.com (steven streight)
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 05:55:36 -0800
Subject: [thelist] disabling web text copy & paste
In-Reply-To: <610592c90910221418k6d226333q4540a5fd13f4c8ef@mail.gmail.com>
References: <05152efc0a2.00000090vaspers@inbox.com>
Message-ID: <1BC934CCED0.000000ABvaspers@inbox.com>

@lee kowalski

Wow. That was a lot of honest information. I agree with you that disabling copy & paste seems self-defeating, when bloggers like to quote at least a portion of text, then link back to the source, which drives traffic to the original site you got the copy from.

Thanks for the work-arounds. I'm sure they'll come in handy!

:^)


Steven E. Streight 
www.pluperfecter.blogspot.com





From sarahwbs at gmail.com  Fri Oct 23 09:14:07 2009
From: sarahwbs at gmail.com (Sarah Adams)
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 11:14:07 -0300
Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
In-Reply-To: <177c0a10910221218l5e248588y804a2256cc1ed46a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <177c0a10910221218l5e248588y804a2256cc1ed46a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4AE1BA2F.3000006@gmail.com>

> http://addthis.com/
> http://sharethis.com/
> http://www.addtoany.com/
> 
> Are there others? Is one recommended over another?
> 
> Are these button packages better than just putting OUT IN THE OPEN a
> few of the main sharing sites? Seems like it's easier to just click on
> a simple Digg link then to try to figure out what the heck this popup
> window is and what it does--for the average non-techie user I mean.

There are probably others, I haven't heard anything good or bad about
any of them (yet). But I think it depends on your site and your
audience. If most of your audience uses only 2 or 3 out of the dozens of
social networking sites out there, why not just have links for sharing
with those specific sites? Might be a good time to check your stats and
see how many incoming visits you get referred from social networking sites.

-- 
sarah adams
web developer & programmer
http://sarah.designshift.com

From joel at bizba6.com  Fri Oct 23 08:11:33 2009
From: joel at bizba6.com (Joel Canfield)
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 06:11:33 -0700
Subject: [thelist] LAN connection quesry
In-Reply-To: <9D3A4ACFEF61475489F3BBA91570674F@DEV>
References: <9D3A4ACFEF61475489F3BBA91570674F@DEV>
Message-ID: <619d00930910230611w302e7516ob668dade4d7fe202@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 23, 2009 at 3:28 AM, Sales @ Lycosa <sales at lycosa.co.uk> wrote:

> One of my customers has a router (I don't know what make) for their LAN and
> they are experiencing sporadic connection difficulties to cPanel on my
> production server.


I have a Linksys firewall/router and every once in a while my net connection
will start to misbehave in illogical ways. Invariably, I find there's a
firmware update available and once I do the update, the problem goes away.

joel

From barney.carroll at gmail.com  Fri Oct 23 09:18:53 2009
From: barney.carroll at gmail.com (Barney Carroll)
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 15:18:53 +0100
Subject: [thelist] disabling web text copy & paste
In-Reply-To: <1BC934CCED0.000000ABvaspers@inbox.com>
References: <05152efc0a2.00000090vaspers@inbox.com>
	<610592c90910221418k6d226333q4540a5fd13f4c8ef@mail.gmail.com> 
	<1BC934CCED0.000000ABvaspers@inbox.com>
Message-ID: <472577830910230718n6d01f7c4i1eea205032fd9257@mail.gmail.com>

Copy+Paste is an OS standard and the front-end layer of a site shouldn't be
able to interfere with such things. The ability to do such a thing is
malicious from a usability perspective, and can be used for nefarious
purposes as it intrudes into the user's greater context.

Having said all that, Flash can define the clipboard without user input. You
would want to capture the keyboard event of Ctrl/Command+C and then order
Flash to replace the clipboard with an empty string. Sidestepping simple
selection and interrupting the context menu's copy ability is impossible as
this interaction sits outside of the scope of Flash or DOM events.

At the end of the day nothing will stop the determined user being able to
access content they have downloaded, so if you are coming at this from a
genuine security angle I would say accept the risks or don't make the
content available at all.

Regards,
Barney Carroll

barney.carroll at gmail.com
07594 506 381


2009/10/23 steven streight <vaspers at inbox.com>

> @lee kowalski
>
> Wow. That was a lot of honest information. I agree with you that disabling
> copy & paste seems self-defeating, when bloggers like to quote at least a
> portion of text, then link back to the source, which drives traffic to the
> original site you got the copy from.
>
> Thanks for the work-arounds. I'm sure they'll come in handy!
>
> :^)
>
>
> Steven E. Streight
> www.pluperfecter.blogspot.com
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> * * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
> http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
>
> For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester
> and archives of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org
> Workers of the Web, evolt !
>

From sarahwbs at gmail.com  Fri Oct 23 09:09:50 2009
From: sarahwbs at gmail.com (Sarah Adams)
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 11:09:50 -0300
Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
In-Reply-To: <13A047F964C.00000AEBvaspers@inbox.com>
References: <13A047F964C.00000AEBvaspers@inbox.com>
Message-ID: <4AE1B92E.5040904@gmail.com>

steven streight wrote:
> Digg, Stumble Upon, and similar sites are often used to "game" the system. The traffic you get from these sites is generally unqualified curiosity surfers. Conversion to sales is miserable. You get a temporary bump in hits, but that just gives you a false sense of "popularity".

Keep in mind not all blogs exist in order to sell something, and
sometimes people really just want more people to read their blog.

> Best way to get people to link to your blog is to post comments, lots of conversation-enriching remarks, at other blogs that are relevant to your own.

This is true if you are looking for links from other blogs, rather than
simply trying to get more actual *visitors*. It's like the difference
between optimizing for search engines and optimizing for actual users.

-- 
sarah adams
web developer & programmer
http://sarah.designshift.com

From joel at bizba6.com  Fri Oct 23 10:17:41 2009
From: joel at bizba6.com (Joel Canfield)
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 08:17:41 -0700
Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
In-Reply-To: <4AE1B92E.5040904@gmail.com>
References: <13A047F964C.00000AEBvaspers@inbox.com>
	<4AE1B92E.5040904@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <619d00930910230817w654b0d79s39fed27b6a36ed0@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 23, 2009 at 7:09 AM, Sarah Adams <sarahwbs at gmail.com> wrote:

> steven streight wrote:
> > Best way to get people to link to your blog is to post comments, lots of
> conversation-enriching remarks, at other blogs that are relevant to your
> own.
>
> This is true if you are looking for links from other blogs, rather than
> simply trying to get more actual *visitors*. It's like the difference
> between optimizing for search engines and optimizing for actual users.


actually, it's true either way. the single best way to build meaningful
traffic is to go out and be in the community; reading and commenting. folks
will follow you back home if you've said something they like.

(aside: optmising for actual users is the only rational way to optmise for
search engines ;)

joel

From vaspers at inbox.com  Fri Oct 23 11:16:07 2009
From: vaspers at inbox.com (steven streight)
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 08:16:07 -0800
Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
In-Reply-To: <4AE1B92E.5040904@gmail.com>
References: <13a047f964c.00000aebvaspers@inbox.com>
Message-ID: <1D034F57314.0000034Evaspers@inbox.com>

Sarah Adams:

Even when you "just want people to read your blog", numbers mean nothing. Number of visitors can be artificially jacked up, thus providing a false sense of popularity, relevance, and value.

Spammers love to increase hits as do malicious sites and con artist sites.

Steven E. Streight 
www.pluperfecter.blogspot.com


Confidentiality Notice: This electronic message and/or advertising approval, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited.

____________________________________________________________
Receive Notifications of Incoming Messages
Easily monitor multiple email accounts & access them with a click.
Visit http://www.inbox.com/notifier and check it out!

From vaspers at inbox.com  Fri Oct 23 11:19:20 2009
From: vaspers at inbox.com (steven streight)
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 08:19:20 -0800
Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
In-Reply-To: <619d00930910230817w654b0d79s39fed27b6a36ed0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <13a047f964c.00000aebvaspers@inbox.com>
	<4ae1b92e.5040904@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1D0A78C78B4.00000369vaspers@inbox.com>

Joel:

You nailed it, bro.

Optimize the content for users and the search engines will love you. SEO boils down to, aside from good coding of site, simple things like fresh frequent relevant valuable helpful content.

Most clients have trouble understanding content updating. They often want to game the system to increase hits.



Steven E. Streight 
www.pluperfecter.blogspot.com


Confidentiality Notice: This electronic message and/or advertising approval, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: joel at bizba6.com
> Sent: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 08:17:41 -0700
> To: thelist at lists.evolt.org
> Subject: Re: [thelist] Blog Share Links
> 
> On Fri, Oct 23, 2009 at 7:09 AM, Sarah Adams <sarahwbs at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> steven streight wrote:
>>> Best way to get people to link to your blog is to post comments, lots
>>> of
>> conversation-enriching remarks, at other blogs that are relevant to your
>> own.
>> 
>> This is true if you are looking for links from other blogs, rather than
>> simply trying to get more actual *visitors*. It's like the difference
>> between optimizing for search engines and optimizing for actual users.
> 
> 
> actually, it's true either way. the single best way to build meaningful
> traffic is to go out and be in the community; reading and commenting.
> folks
> will follow you back home if you've said something they like.
> 
> (aside: optmising for actual users is the only rational way to optmise
> for
> search engines ;)
> 
> joel
> --
> 
> * * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
> http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
> 
> For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester
> and archives of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org
> Workers of the Web, evolt !

From vaspers at inbox.com  Fri Oct 23 11:13:38 2009
From: vaspers at inbox.com (steven streight)
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 08:13:38 -0800
Subject: [thelist] disabling web text copy & paste
In-Reply-To: <472577830910230718n6d01f7c4i1eea205032fd9257@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1bc934cced0.000000abvaspers@inbox.com>
	<610592c90910221418k6d226333q4540a5fd13f4c8ef@mail.gmail.com>
	<05152efc0a2.00000090vaspers@inbox.com>
Message-ID: <1CFDBFD529A.00000345vaspers@inbox.com>

Barney Carroll:

Thanks. But I'm on your side. I'm totally opposed to disabling back buttons and copy and paste and other browser controls. I'm a web usability analyst.

:*)

Steven E. Streight 
www.pluperfecter.blogspot.com


Confidentiality Notice: This electronic message and/or advertising approval, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: barney.carroll at gmail.com
> Sent: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 15:18:53 +0100
> To: thelist at lists.evolt.org
> Subject: Re: [thelist] disabling web text copy & paste
> 
> Copy+Paste is an OS standard and the front-end layer of a site shouldn't
> be
> able to interfere with such things. The ability to do such a thing is
> malicious from a usability perspective, and can be used for nefarious
> purposes as it intrudes into the user's greater context.
> 
> Having said all that, Flash can define the clipboard without user input.
> You
> would want to capture the keyboard event of Ctrl/Command+C and then order
> Flash to replace the clipboard with an empty string. Sidestepping simple
> selection and interrupting the context menu's copy ability is impossible
> as
> this interaction sits outside of the scope of Flash or DOM events.
> 
> At the end of the day nothing will stop the determined user being able to
> access content they have downloaded, so if you are coming at this from a
> genuine security angle I would say accept the risks or don't make the
> content available at all.
> 
> Regards,
> Barney Carroll
> 
> barney.carroll at gmail.com
> 07594 506 381
> 
> 
> 2009/10/23 steven streight <vaspers at inbox.com>
> 
>> @lee kowalski
>> 
>> Wow. That was a lot of honest information. I agree with you that
>> disabling
>> copy & paste seems self-defeating, when bloggers like to quote at least
>> a
>> portion of text, then link back to the source, which drives traffic to
>> the
>> original site you got the copy from.
>> 
>> Thanks for the work-arounds. I'm sure they'll come in handy!
>> 
>> :^)
>> 
>> 
>> Steven E. Streight
>> www.pluperfecter.blogspot.com
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> * * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
>> http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
>> 
>> For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester
>> and archives of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org
>> Workers of the Web, evolt !
>> 
> --
> 
> * * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
> http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
> 
> For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester
> and archives of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org
> Workers of the Web, evolt !

From sales at lycosa.co.uk  Fri Oct 23 16:55:52 2009
From: sales at lycosa.co.uk (Sales @ Lycosa)
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 22:55:52 +0100
Subject: [thelist] LAN connection quesry
In-Reply-To: <619d00930910230611w302e7516ob668dade4d7fe202@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6D2EC5DF18EF4D73A7F9594EE274F4E4@DEV>

Thanks, Joe. I have suggested it to my client.

Phil 


From JGERSTEN at lchb.com  Fri Oct 23 20:15:26 2009
From: JGERSTEN at lchb.com (Gersten, John)
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 18:15:26 -0700
Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
References: <13a047f964c.00000aebvaspers@inbox.com><4ae1b92e.5040904@gmail.com>
	<1D0A78C78B4.00000369vaspers@inbox.com>
Message-ID: <3CBA52B9335F054FB6D2E68618E018C60762B105@sfmail01.lchb.com>

Agree 100%, and thought this was particularly well (and succinctly) phrased. I will be using "fresh frequent relevant valuable helpful content" in all future discussions with my boss (who still won't listen, but at least I'll save some breath with such a simple and beautiful summation).


-----Original Message-----
From: thelist-bounces at lists.evolt.org on behalf of steven streight
Sent: Fri 10/23/09 9:19
To: thelist at lists.evolt.org
Subject: Re: [thelist] Blog Share Links
 
Joel:

You nailed it, bro.

Optimize the content for users and the search engines will love you. SEO boils down to, aside from good coding of site, simple things like fresh frequent relevant valuable helpful content.

Most clients have trouble understanding content updating. They often want to game the system to increase hits.



Steven E. Streight 
www.pluperfecter.blogspot.com


Confidentiality Notice: This electronic message and/or advertising approval, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: joel at bizba6.com
> Sent: Fri, 23 Oct 2009 08:17:41 -0700
> To: thelist at lists.evolt.org
> Subject: Re: [thelist] Blog Share Links
> 
> On Fri, Oct 23, 2009 at 7:09 AM, Sarah Adams <sarahwbs at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> steven streight wrote:
>>> Best way to get people to link to your blog is to post comments, lots
>>> of
>> conversation-enriching remarks, at other blogs that are relevant to your
>> own.
>> 
>> This is true if you are looking for links from other blogs, rather than
>> simply trying to get more actual *visitors*. It's like the difference
>> between optimizing for search engines and optimizing for actual users.
> 
> 
> actually, it's true either way. the single best way to build meaningful
> traffic is to go out and be in the community; reading and commenting.
> folks
> will follow you back home if you've said something they like.
> 
> (aside: optmising for actual users is the only rational way to optmise
> for
> search engines ;)
> 
> joel
> --
> 
> * * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
> http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
> 
> For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester
> and archives of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org
> Workers of the Web, evolt !
-- 

* * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/

For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester 
and archives of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org 
Workers of the Web, evolt ! 



From martin at easyweb.co.uk  Sat Oct 24 13:29:23 2009
From: martin at easyweb.co.uk (Martin Burns)
Date: Sat, 24 Oct 2009 19:29:23 +0100
Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
In-Reply-To: <1D0A78C78B4.00000369vaspers@inbox.com>
References: <13a047f964c.00000aebvaspers@inbox.com>
	<4ae1b92e.5040904@gmail.com>
	<1D0A78C78B4.00000369vaspers@inbox.com>
Message-ID: <C5D4856E-634C-4246-8C50-651DFC8A1778@easyweb.co.uk>


On 23 Oct 2009, at 17:19, steven streight wrote:

> SEO boils down to, aside from good coding of site, simple things  
> like fresh frequent relevant valuable helpful content.


Which is exactly as it should be, as good Search Engines are simply  
striving to direct users to relevant, valuable, helpful content.

To slightly bastardise David Ogilvy: a gifted site is mightier than a  
gifted SEO.

Cheers
Martin

--
 > Spammers: Send me email -> yumyum at easyweb.co.uk to train my filter
 > http://dspam.nuclearelephant.com/






From fredthejonester at gmail.com  Sat Oct 24 16:32:46 2009
From: fredthejonester at gmail.com (Fred Jones)
Date: Sat, 24 Oct 2009 23:32:46 +0200
Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
In-Reply-To: <13A047F964C.00000AEBvaspers@inbox.com>
References: <177c0a10910221218l5e248588y804a2256cc1ed46a@mail.gmail.com>
	<13A047F964C.00000AEBvaspers@inbox.com>
Message-ID: <177c0a10910241432w2dceec2bre9ee7c4026f3d0e2@mail.gmail.com>

> Blog link exchanges and link promotion sites are pretty worthless.
>
> I've been a hardcore blogger for several years now you can go to my blog shown below for my credentials.
>
> Digg, Stumble Upon, and similar sites are often used to "game" the system. The traffic you get from these sites is generally unqualified curiosity surfers. Conversion to sales is miserable. You get a temporary bump in hits, but that just gives you a false sense of "popularity".

But what about the "Digg Effect?" Doesn't every blogger dream of
getting to the front page of Digg and then getting like a million hits
in that one day?

Must be that *some* of those million are good, no?

Thanks.

From vaspers at inbox.com  Sat Oct 24 16:46:36 2009
From: vaspers at inbox.com (steven streight)
Date: Sat, 24 Oct 2009 13:46:36 -0800
Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
In-Reply-To: <177c0a10910241432w2dceec2bre9ee7c4026f3d0e2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <13a047f964c.00000aebvaspers@inbox.com>
	<177c0a10910221218l5e248588y804a2256cc1ed46a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2C78A5E193A.0000020Fvaspers@inbox.com>

No serious blogger, especially professional men and women, give a crap about "the Digg effect."

A million hits means a million unqualified hits that will not convert to sales or loyal readers of your blog. It might also crash your servers to have artificially ramped up hits on a site.

Curiosity surfers only create a false sense of popularity, which is very damaging to content decisions.



Steven E. Streight 
www.pluperfecter.blogspot.com





> -----Original Message-----
> From: fredthejonester at gmail.com
> Sent: Sat, 24 Oct 2009 23:32:46 +0200
> To: thelist at lists.evolt.org
> Subject: Re: [thelist] Blog Share Links
> 
>> Blog link exchanges and link promotion sites are pretty worthless.
>> 
>> I've been a hardcore blogger for several years now you can go to my blog
>> shown below for my credentials.
>> 
>> Digg, Stumble Upon, and similar sites are often used to "game" the
>> system. The traffic you get from these sites is generally unqualified
>> curiosity surfers. Conversion to sales is miserable. You get a temporary
>> bump in hits, but that just gives you a false sense of "popularity".
> 
> But what about the "Digg Effect?" Doesn't every blogger dream of
> getting to the front page of Digg and then getting like a million hits
> in that one day?
> 
> Must be that *some* of those million are good, no?
> 
> Thanks.
> --
> 
> * * Please support the community that supports you.  * *
> http://evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
> 
> For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester
> and archives of thelist go to: http://lists.evolt.org
> Workers of the Web, evolt !

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From martin at easyweb.co.uk  Sat Oct 24 17:17:17 2009
From: martin at easyweb.co.uk (Martin Burns)
Date: Sat, 24 Oct 2009 23:17:17 +0100
Subject: [thelist] Blog Share Links
In-Reply-To: <177c0a10910241432w2dceec2bre9ee7c4026f3d0e2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <177c0a10910221218l5e248588y804a2256cc1ed46a@mail.gmail.com>
	<13A047F964C.00000AEBvaspers@inbox.com>
	<177c0a10910241432w2dceec2bre9ee7c4026f3d0e2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <93506738-A9A8-4136-86FE-2687C74513C8@easyweb.co.uk>


On 24 Oct 2009, at 22:32, Fred Jones wrote:

> But what about the "Digg Effect?" Doesn't every blogger dream of
> getting to the front page of Digg and then getting like a million hits
> in that one day?
>
> Must be that *some* of those million are good, no?


Not if they can't get to your server cos the others have left it a  
smoking ruin.

Cheers
Martin

--
 > Spammers: Send me email -> yumyum at easyweb.co.uk to train my filter
 > http://dspam.nuclearelephant.com/