From paladin at fuse.net  Tue Jan  6 21:30:31 2009
From: paladin at fuse.net (Scott Glasgow)
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 22:30:31 -0500
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <785BC903-6C90-4D76-B4BF-41F49A7392A6@clearimageonline.com>
References: <6AA13190-4D65-4EF9-A6E4-D0890B52F078@clearimageonline.com><8E604801-5AA0-4AE0-B93D-0A5619CCEB9F@clearimageonline.com>
	<785BC903-6C90-4D76-B4BF-41F49A7392A6@clearimageonline.com>
Message-ID: <24ED88C36085493BA8F23EA5B08B001D@BadBoy3>

I haven't received anything from the list since November 29th. I had moved 
from XP and OE to Vista and Windows Mailll, which resulted in all my 
identities being consolidated and all my message rules biting the dust 
except those of the main identity. So, just checking, I tried to subscribe 
to the list and received a mail saying that I was already subscribed.

So, has the list actually been dead since 11/29, or is something else going 
on that I need to investigate?

cheers,
scott 


From Joel at CommonsenseEntrepreneur.com  Tue Jan  6 22:15:16 2009
From: Joel at CommonsenseEntrepreneur.com (Joel D Canfield)
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 20:15:16 -0800
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
References: <6AA13190-4D65-4EF9-A6E4-D0890B52F078@clearimageonline.com><8E604801-5AA0-4AE0-B93D-0A5619CCEB9F@clearimageonline.com><785BC903-6C90-4D76-B4BF-41F49A7392A6@clearimageonline.com>
	<24ED88C36085493BA8F23EA5B08B001D@BadBoy3>
Message-ID: <72E9FAA171D63B48AAC707C72900E6B40195FEB0@ireland.spinhead.com>

> So, has the list actually been dead since 11/29

maybe comatose rather than dead

or maybe it's just you and I . . . 

joel


From peter at brunone.com  Tue Jan  6 22:22:47 2009
From: peter at brunone.com (Peter Brunone)
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 21:22:47 -0700
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
Message-ID: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>

From: "Joel D Canfield" <Joel at CommonsenseEntrepreneur.com>
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 10:16 PM

> or maybe it's just you and I . . . 

Sharing our love together...

Nah, it's the whole list as far as I can tell.  The whole industry seemed to shut down over the holidays.

From ekm at seastorm.com  Tue Jan  6 22:31:20 2009
From: ekm at seastorm.com (Erika Meyer)
Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2009 20:31:20 -0800
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>
Message-ID: <49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>

Peter Brunone wrote:
> From: "Joel D Canfield" <Joel at CommonsenseEntrepreneur.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 10:16 PM
> 
>> or maybe it's just you and I . . . 
> 
> Sharing our love together...
> 
> Nah, it's the whole list as far as I can tell.  The whole industry seemed to shut down over the holidays.
> _______________________________________________

I've been on this list a few months.  I don't know anything about it.  I 
  am not sure how I even found out it existed.  I don't know how anyone 
knows about it... It's not listed on the evolt.org lists page.  I don't 
know how it started. I don't know its intended audience.  I'm pretty 
curious what this list is all about.

Erika

From Joel at CommonsenseEntrepreneur.com  Wed Jan  7 00:22:43 2009
From: Joel at CommonsenseEntrepreneur.com (Joel D Canfield)
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 22:22:43 -0800
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>
	<49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>
Message-ID: <72E9FAA171D63B48AAC707C72900E6B40195FEC0@ireland.spinhead.com>

> I'm pretty
> curious what this list is all about.

it used to be about javascript.

now it's about curiosity.

joel


From paladin at fuse.net  Tue Jan  6 21:30:31 2009
From: paladin at fuse.net (Scott Glasgow)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 04:30:31 +0100
Subject: [Javascript]  Probe....
In-Reply-To: <785BC903-6C90-4D76-B4BF-41F49A7392A6@clearimageonline.com>
References: <6AA13190-4D65-4EF9-A6E4-D0890B52F078@clearimageonline.com><8E604801-5AA0-4AE0-B93D-0A5619CCEB9F@clearimageonline.com><785BC903-6C90-4D76-B4BF-41F49A7392A6@clearimageonline.com>
Message-ID: <24ED88C36085493BA8F23EA5B08B001D@BadBoy3>

I haven't received anything from the list since November 29th. I had moved

from XP and OE to Vista and Windows Mailll, which resulted in all my 
identities being consolidated and all my message rules biting the dust 
except those of the main identity. So, just checking, I tried to subscribe

to the list and received a mail saying that I was already subscribed.

So, has the list actually been dead since 11/29, or is something else
going 
on that I need to investigate?

cheers,
scott 

_______________________________________________
Javascript mailing list
Javascript at lists.evolt.org
http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript


From john at jwarner.com  Wed Jan  7 07:30:55 2009
From: john at jwarner.com (John Warner)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 08:30:55 -0500
Subject: [Javascript] Probe....
In-Reply-To: <24ED88C36085493BA8F23EA5B08B001D@BadBoy3>
References: <6AA13190-4D65-4EF9-A6E4-D0890B52F078@clearimageonline.com><8E604801-5AA0-4AE0-B93D-0A5619CCEB9F@clearimageonline.com><785BC903-6C90-4D76-B4BF-41F49A7392A6@clearimageonline.com>
	<24ED88C36085493BA8F23EA5B08B001D@BadBoy3>
Message-ID: <037701c970cc$2b749630$825dc290$@com>

List sent your post to me

John Warner


> -----Original Message-----
> From: javascript-bounces at lists.evolt.org [mailto:javascript-
> bounces at lists.evolt.org] On Behalf Of Scott Glasgow
> Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 10:31 PM
> To: JavaScript List
> Subject: [Javascript] Probe....
> 
> I haven't received anything from the list since November 29th. I had
moved
> 
> from XP and OE to Vista and Windows Mailll, which resulted in all my
> identities being consolidated and all my message rules biting the dust
> except those of the main identity. So, just checking, I tried to
subscribe
> 
> to the list and received a mail saying that I was already subscribed.
> 
> So, has the list actually been dead since 11/29, or is something else
> going
> on that I need to investigate?
> 
> cheers,
> scott
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Javascript mailing list
> Javascript at lists.evolt.org
> http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Javascript mailing list
> Javascript at lists.evolt.org
> http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript



From pro_dev.lists at triche-osborne.com  Wed Jan  7 08:36:07 2009
From: pro_dev.lists at triche-osborne.com (Triche Osborne)
Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 08:36:07 -0600
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>
	<49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>
Message-ID: <4964BDD7.4000509@triche-osborne.com>

Erika Meyer wrote:
> I've been on this list a few months.  I don't know anything about it.  I 
>   am not sure how I even found out it existed.  I don't know how anyone 
> knows about it... It's not listed on the evolt.org lists page.  I don't 
> know how it started. I don't know its intended audience.  I'm pretty 
> curious what this list is all about.
> 

It began as a mailing list moderated from Louisiana Tech (university in 
northern Louisiana). Its intended audience--or at least, the majority of 
participants--were intermediate to advanced JavaScripters, and it was 
quite busy and useful. Unfortunately, the moderator had to move on and 
concentrate on his own graduate school studies. The list moved to 
evolt.org, after which it seems to have gone mostly silent.
	I'm sorry to see this. It was an excellent list for a long time.

Triche

From java.script at cutterscrossing.com  Wed Jan  7 09:41:54 2009
From: java.script at cutterscrossing.com (Cutter (JSRelated))
Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 09:41:54 -0600
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <4964BDD7.4000509@triche-osborne.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>	<49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>
	<4964BDD7.4000509@triche-osborne.com>
Message-ID: <4964CD42.8020607@cutterscrossing.com>

It is sad. This (LaTech JS) used to be an outstanding list. When I first 
subscribed, back in '99, Peter Paul Koch (PPK) was a major contributor. 
The professor who taught my JS class through Univ of MD was even an 
active member. I'm still subscribed, but traffic has dropped way off 
since the loss of David Merchant, and the move to Evolt. A shame really...

Steve "Cutter" Blades
Adobe Certified Professional
Advanced Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 Developer

Co-Author of "Learning Ext JS"
http://www.packtpub.com/learning-ext-js/book
_____________________________
http://blog.cutterscrossing.com

Triche Osborne wrote:
> Erika Meyer wrote:
>> I've been on this list a few months.  I don't know anything about it.  I 
>>   am not sure how I even found out it existed.  I don't know how anyone 
>> knows about it... It's not listed on the evolt.org lists page.  I don't 
>> know how it started. I don't know its intended audience.  I'm pretty 
>> curious what this list is all about.
>>
> 
> It began as a mailing list moderated from Louisiana Tech (university in 
> northern Louisiana). Its intended audience--or at least, the majority of 
> participants--were intermediate to advanced JavaScripters, and it was 
> quite busy and useful. Unfortunately, the moderator had to move on and 
> concentrate on his own graduate school studies. The list moved to 
> evolt.org, after which it seems to have gone mostly silent.
> 	I'm sorry to see this. It was an excellent list for a long time.
> 
> Triche
> _______________________________________________
> Javascript mailing list
> Javascript at lists.evolt.org
> http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript


From hassan at webtuitive.com  Wed Jan  7 10:11:09 2009
From: hassan at webtuitive.com (Hassan Schroeder)
Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 08:11:09 -0800
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>
	<49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>
Message-ID: <4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>

Erika Meyer wrote:

>     I don't know how anyone 
> knows about it... It's not listed on the evolt.org lists page. 

Yes, and that would seem to be something that could be corrected by
an evolt site maintainer pretty easily, eh? :-)

As another long-standing list member, I agree it's unusually quiet,
but that's also true of many of the other tech lists I'm on.

FWIW,
-- 
Hassan Schroeder ----------------------------- hassan at webtuitive.com
Webtuitive Design ===  (+1) 408-621-3445   === http://webtuitive.com

                           dream.  code.

From scott at randomchaos.com  Wed Jan  7 11:12:14 2009
From: scott at randomchaos.com (Scott Reynen)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 10:12:14 -0700
Subject: [Javascript] Unit testing AJAX calls (Was: Probe...)
In-Reply-To: <4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>
	<49643018.6020400@seastorm.com> <4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>
Message-ID: <66E93517-4B12-41A9-BAD6-2DA9BA9C0D5D@randomchaos.com>

On [Jan 7], at [ Jan 7] 9:11 , Hassan Schroeder wrote:

> As another long-standing list member, I agree it's unusually quiet,
> but that's also true of many of the other tech lists I'm on.


Holidays, recession, and increasing use of web forums for this type of  
discussion are all likely contributing factors here.  Also, the  
ongoing meta-discussion about the list itself is a good way to drive  
away members.  :)

In the interest of bringing this back on-topic, a JavaScript question:

Does anyone do unit testing on AJAX calls, and if so, how?  I can do  
unit testing on most other JavaScript simply by running the code and  
then testing the result, but with AJAX calls, I'd have to change the  
code itself to call the test framework on response, since the actual  
results of the code are not complete until the AJAX response actually  
comes back.  And I'd like to keep the test framework outside the  
production code.  Suggestions?

Peace,
Scott


From mwarden at gmail.com  Wed Jan  7 11:44:01 2009
From: mwarden at gmail.com (Matt Warden)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 12:44:01 -0500
Subject: [Javascript] Unit testing AJAX calls (Was: Probe...)
In-Reply-To: <66E93517-4B12-41A9-BAD6-2DA9BA9C0D5D@randomchaos.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>
	<49643018.6020400@seastorm.com> <4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>
	<66E93517-4B12-41A9-BAD6-2DA9BA9C0D5D@randomchaos.com>
Message-ID: <bbc8fa430901070944p2303633br908511b4f077f842@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 12:12 PM, Scott Reynen <scott at randomchaos.com> wrote:
> Does anyone do unit testing on AJAX calls, and if so, how?  I can do
> unit testing on most other JavaScript simply by running the code and
> then testing the result, but with AJAX calls, I'd have to change the
> code itself to call the test framework on response, since the actual
> results of the code are not complete until the AJAX response actually
> comes back.  And I'd like to keep the test framework outside the
> production code.  Suggestions?

I generally point to a static version of the XML that I know is valid
for "unit testing" purposes in this regard. It's more just removing
the variables introduced by the server side code than unit testing.


-- 
Matt Warden
Cincinnati, OH, USA
http://mattwarden.com


This email proudly and graciously contributes to entropy.

From paladin at fuse.net  Wed Jan  7 13:12:41 2009
From: paladin at fuse.net (Scott Glasgow)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 14:12:41 -0500
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com><49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>
	<4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>
Message-ID: <DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>

Thanks to everyone for replying. So, the list is not dead, just "dead." I 
was just surprised because up until the 29th there seemed to be fairly 
regular traffic. Not blistering, but stuff coming in at least every day or 
two. I was thinking that perhaps what had happened to the wdvltalk list 
might have happened here.

My ISP uses a server-side SPAM filter, blacklist-based, and for some reason 
the list got themselves... er, listed. Tech support surmise was possibly an 
open SMTP relay somewhere, which the SPAM filter considers doubleplus 
ungood.

I went back and forth with the ISP tech support and the list admin for a 
while, then finally gave up. Glad to hear that at least in this case I don't 
have to worry about that particular issue.

cheers,
scott 


From java.script at cutterscrossing.com  Wed Jan  7 13:29:30 2009
From: java.script at cutterscrossing.com (Cutter (JSRelated))
Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 13:29:30 -0600
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com><49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>	<4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>
	<DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>
Message-ID: <4965029A.5050000@cutterscrossing.com>

"fairly regular traffic..."

I remember when this list got 200+ emails a day, and responses were 
generally within 15 minutes of asking...

Steve "Cutter" Blades
Adobe Certified Professional
Advanced Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 Developer

Co-Author of "Learning Ext JS"
http://www.packtpub.com/learning-ext-js/book
_____________________________
http://blog.cutterscrossing.com


From ekm at seastorm.com  Wed Jan  7 13:44:03 2009
From: ekm at seastorm.com (Erika Meyer)
Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 11:44:03 -0800
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <4964BDD7.4000509@triche-osborne.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>	<49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>
	<4964BDD7.4000509@triche-osborne.com>
Message-ID: <49650603.8020504@seastorm.com>

Triche Osborne wrote:
>Unfortunately, the moderator had to move on and 
> concentrate on his own graduate school studies. The list moved to 
> evolt.org, after which it seems to have gone mostly silent.
> I'm sorry to see this. It was an excellent list for a long time.
> 
> Triche

Cutter (JSRelated) wrote:
> It is sad. This (LaTech JS) used to be an outstanding list. When I first 
> subscribed, back in '99, Peter Paul Koch (PPK) was a major contributor. 
> The professor who taught my JS class through Univ of MD was even an 
> active member. I'm still subscribed, but traffic has dropped way off 
> since the loss of David Merchant, and the move to Evolt. A shame really...
> 
> Steve "Cutter" Blades
> Adobe Certified Professional
> Advanced Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 Developer
> 


Thanks for the background.  evolt.org is basically a flat-structured 
cooperative and so if you want something to happen, you basically have 
the opportunity to make it happen.

If there is an old-timer on this list who cares enough and is able to 
put in the effort to building it back into something, I'm willing to 
help out with things like making sure the lists page gets updated (not 
as straightforward as it might seem since it is not yet in our CMS, but 
can be done I'm sure).

Without anyone stepping up to steward this (new to evolt.org) list, 
nurture it, evangelize it, etc, I'm not even sure what the point is of 
keeping it, since thelist is a generalist list.

Erika







From list_mail at att.net  Wed Jan  7 14:03:25 2009
From: list_mail at att.net (Gene Berger)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 15:03:25 -0500
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <4965029A.5050000@cutterscrossing.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com><49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>	<4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>	<DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>
	<4965029A.5050000@cutterscrossing.com>
Message-ID: <00b701c97103$01f9abb0$05ed0310$@net>

Does anyone even know how many people are still subscribed to the list?

-----Original Message-----
From: javascript-bounces at lists.evolt.org
[mailto:javascript-bounces at lists.evolt.org] On Behalf Of Cutter (JSRelated)
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 2:30 PM
To: JavaScript List
Subject: Re: [Javascript] Probe...

"fairly regular traffic..."

I remember when this list got 200+ emails a day, and responses were 
generally within 15 minutes of asking...

Steve "Cutter" Blades
Adobe Certified Professional
Advanced Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 Developer

Co-Author of "Learning Ext JS"
http://www.packtpub.com/learning-ext-js/book
_____________________________
http://blog.cutterscrossing.com

_______________________________________________
Javascript mailing list
Javascript at lists.evolt.org
http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript


From dafneves at gmail.com  Wed Jan  7 14:05:37 2009
From: dafneves at gmail.com (Diogo Neves)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 20:05:37 +0000
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <00b701c97103$01f9abb0$05ed0310$@net>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>
	<49643018.6020400@seastorm.com> <4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>
	<DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>
	<4965029A.5050000@cutterscrossing.com>
	<00b701c97103$01f9abb0$05ed0310$@net>
Message-ID: <87ae45950901071205r17448b73ucd9103abd2ac3c87@mail.gmail.com>

I'm.

On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 8:03 PM, Gene Berger <list_mail at att.net> wrote:

> Does anyone even know how many people are still subscribed to the list?
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: javascript-bounces at lists.evolt.org
> [mailto:javascript-bounces at lists.evolt.org] On Behalf Of Cutter
> (JSRelated)
> Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 2:30 PM
> To: JavaScript List
> Subject: Re: [Javascript] Probe...
>
> "fairly regular traffic..."
>
> I remember when this list got 200+ emails a day, and responses were
> generally within 15 minutes of asking...
>
> Steve "Cutter" Blades
> Adobe Certified Professional
> Advanced Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 Developer
>
> Co-Author of "Learning Ext JS"
> http://www.packtpub.com/learning-ext-js/book
> _____________________________
> http://blog.cutterscrossing.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> Javascript mailing list
> Javascript at lists.evolt.org
> http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript
>
> _______________________________________________
> Javascript mailing list
> Javascript at lists.evolt.org
> http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript
>



-- 
Thanks,

Diogo Neves
Web Developer @ SAPO.pt by PrimeIT.pt

From ekm at seastorm.com  Wed Jan  7 14:27:43 2009
From: ekm at seastorm.com (Erika Meyer)
Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 12:27:43 -0800
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <00b701c97103$01f9abb0$05ed0310$@net>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com><49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>	<4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>	<DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>	<4965029A.5050000@cutterscrossing.com>
	<00b701c97103$01f9abb0$05ed0310$@net>
Message-ID: <4965103F.7060801@seastorm.com>

Gene Berger wrote:
> Does anyone even know how many people are still subscribed to the list?
> 
> -----

Dean is listed as the Javascript list administrator.

He does a lot of the admin work for evolt.org.

Erika

From ekm at seastorm.com  Wed Jan  7 14:29:27 2009
From: ekm at seastorm.com (Erika Meyer)
Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 12:29:27 -0800
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <00b701c97103$01f9abb0$05ed0310$@net>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com><49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>	<4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>	<DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>	<4965029A.5050000@cutterscrossing.com>
	<00b701c97103$01f9abb0$05ed0310$@net>
Message-ID: <496510A7.6090402@seastorm.com>

Gene Berger wrote:
> Does anyone even know how many people are still subscribed to the list?
> 
> -----

Dean is listed as the Javascript list administrator.
http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript

his email in the page footer, and he would have access to the member list.

(sorry last one sent accidentally)

Erika


From riegel at clearimageonline.com  Wed Jan  7 15:07:53 2009
From: riegel at clearimageonline.com (Terry Riegel)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 16:07:53 -0500
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <49650603.8020504@seastorm.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>	<49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>
	<4964BDD7.4000509@triche-osborne.com>
	<49650603.8020504@seastorm.com>
Message-ID: <01FF6BE3-D5D5-4321-855B-37E98D107CD5@clearimageonline.com>

> Cutter (JSRelated) wrote:
>> It is sad. This (LaTech JS) used to be an outstanding list. When I  
>> first
>> subscribed, back in '99, Peter Paul Koch (PPK) was a major  
>> contributor.
>> The professor who taught my JS class through Univ of MD was even an
>> active member. I'm still subscribed, but traffic has dropped way off
>> since the loss of David Merchant, and the move to Evolt. A shame  
>> really...
>>
>> Steve "Cutter" Blades
>> Adobe Certified Professional
>> Advanced Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 Developer
>>


> Without anyone stepping up to steward this (new to evolt.org) list,
> nurture it, evangelize it, etc, I'm not even sure what the point is of
> keeping it, since thelist is a generalist list.
>
> Erika

I have been a member for 5 or 6 years and I have always found the list  
to be invaluable to me and my learning/understanding of Javascript.

There is a lot more information online nowadays regarding more proper  
javascript usage (like unobtrusive js), but I find asking here usually  
gets me a well rounded answer that not only solves my problems, but  
also gives me some insight into best practices and trends.

I think the seemingly ubiquitous "library/framework" is believed to be  
the "solution" to all our javascript issues. I personally find it a  
bit confusing and appreciate a list like this where I can get answers  
about javascript not how to use a framework.

So generally if I am using a framework it is helpful to speed up some  
of my development, but a list like this helps my brain actually get a  
grasp on how it works.

Terry


From pro_dev.lists at triche-osborne.com  Wed Jan  7 15:31:56 2009
From: pro_dev.lists at triche-osborne.com (Triche Osborne)
Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 15:31:56 -0600
Subject: [Javascript] Probe...
In-Reply-To: <01FF6BE3-D5D5-4321-855B-37E98D107CD5@clearimageonline.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>	<49643018.6020400@seastorm.com>	<4964BDD7.4000509@triche-osborne.com>	<49650603.8020504@seastorm.com>
	<01FF6BE3-D5D5-4321-855B-37E98D107CD5@clearimageonline.com>
Message-ID: <49651F4C.2060001@triche-osborne.com>

Terry Riegel wrote:
> 
> So generally if I am using a framework it is helpful to speed up some  
> of my development, but a list like this helps my brain actually get a  
> grasp on how it works.
> 

Exactly. For years, I wrote everything from scratch. Lately, I've 
considered using a library. I still don't like the overhead, but it does 
speed development. That said, the last thing I want to do is to use it 
blindly. Frameworks aside, programming languages still aren't toasters.

Triche

From dean.mah at gmail.com  Wed Jan  7 22:35:11 2009
From: dean.mah at gmail.com (Dean Mah)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 21:35:11 -0700
Subject: [Javascript] ADMIN: State of Affairs
Message-ID: <f4a098c50901072035v53606fc3q16188f5c84cc9078@mail.gmail.com>

This list has 637 members currently subscribed.

The Javascript list is not officially an evolt.org list.  evolt.org
only hosts this list as we do with css-d.  Similarly to css-d, we took
over the hosting of the list when the maintainer could not, or was not
interested, in hosting it themselves so that it would not disappear
completely.

There has been less traffic to this list but I would hesitate to
attribute that to the move to evolt.org.  As far as I know, there
hasn't been anyone from the JS community that has stepped up to take
over this list, i.e., moderation, promotion, etc.

Dean

From paladin at fuse.net  Wed Jan  7 13:12:41 2009
From: paladin at fuse.net (Scott Glasgow)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 20:12:41 +0100
Subject: [Javascript] Probe....
In-Reply-To: <4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com><49643018.6020400@seastorm.com><4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>
Message-ID: <DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>

Thanks to everyone for replying. So, the list is not dead, just "dead." I 
was just surprised because up until the 29th there seemed to be fairly 
regular traffic. Not blistering, but stuff coming in at least every day or

two. I was thinking that perhaps what had happened to the wdvltalk list 
might have happened here.

My ISP uses a server-side SPAM filter, blacklist-based, and for some
reason 
the list got themselves... er, listed. Tech support surmise was possibly
an 
open SMTP relay somewhere, which the SPAM filter considers doubleplus 
ungood.

I went back and forth with the ISP tech support and the list admin for a 
while, then finally gave up. Glad to hear that at least in this case I
don't 
have to worry about that particular issue.

cheers,
scott 

_______________________________________________
Javascript mailing list
Javascript at lists.evolt.org
http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript


From Conleyj at kubota-kma.com  Fri Jan  9 08:08:33 2009
From: Conleyj at kubota-kma.com (James Conley)
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 09:08:33 -0500
Subject: [Javascript] Probe....
In-Reply-To: <DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com><49643018.6020400@seastorm.com><4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>
	<DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>
Message-ID: <CF12DB4653A04C42B6CFC325480098280127A03F@STATION.kubota-kma.com>

Apparently everyone stopped doing JavaScript / Ajax work altogether or
at least stopped having problems with it.

James

From john at jwarner.com  Fri Jan  9 08:39:51 2009
From: john at jwarner.com (John Warner)
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 09:39:51 -0500
Subject: [Javascript] Probe....
In-Reply-To: <CF12DB4653A04C42B6CFC325480098280127A03F@STATION.kubota-kma.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com><49643018.6020400@seastorm.com><4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>	<DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>
	<CF12DB4653A04C42B6CFC325480098280127A03F@STATION.kubota-kma.com>
Message-ID: <000b01c97268$2142c900$63c85b00$@com>

Speaking of that what is a good JSON tutorial online (free)?

John Warner

> -----Original Message-----
> From: javascript-bounces at lists.evolt.org [mailto:javascript-
> bounces at lists.evolt.org] On Behalf Of James Conley
> Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 9:09 AM
> To: JavaScript List
> Subject: Re: [Javascript] Probe....
> 
> Apparently everyone stopped doing JavaScript / Ajax work altogether or
> at least stopped having problems with it.
> 
> James
> _______________________________________________
> Javascript mailing list
> Javascript at lists.evolt.org
> http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript



From david at dorward.me.uk  Fri Jan  9 08:48:51 2009
From: david at dorward.me.uk (David Dorward)
Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 14:48:51 +0000
Subject: [Javascript] JSON (was Probe....)
In-Reply-To: <000b01c97268$2142c900$63c85b00$@com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com><49643018.6020400@seastorm.com><4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>	<DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>	<CF12DB4653A04C42B6CFC325480098280127A03F@STATION.kubota-kma.com>
	<000b01c97268$2142c900$63c85b00$@com>
Message-ID: <496763D3.2070702@dorward.me.uk>

John Warner wrote:
> Speaking of that what is a good JSON tutorial online (free)?
>   
The spec: http://json.org/

JSON is dead simple.

-- 
David Dorward
http://dorward.me.uk/

From darren.west at gmail.com  Fri Jan  9 09:00:53 2009
From: darren.west at gmail.com (Darren West)
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 16:00:53 +0100
Subject: [Javascript] JSON (was Probe....)
In-Reply-To: <496763D3.2070702@dorward.me.uk>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>
	<49643018.6020400@seastorm.com> <4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>
	<DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>
	<CF12DB4653A04C42B6CFC325480098280127A03F@STATION.kubota-kma.com>
	<000b01c97268$2142c900$63c85b00$@com> <496763D3.2070702@dorward.me.uk>
Message-ID: <71769ee80901090700g25ef2e79ka76fc9350d1b001c@mail.gmail.com>

Are you joking!?

2009/1/9 David Dorward <david at dorward.me.uk>:
> John Warner wrote:
>> Speaking of that what is a good JSON tutorial online (free)?
>>
> The spec: http://json.org/
>
> JSON is dead simple.
>
> --
> David Dorward
> http://dorward.me.uk/
> _______________________________________________
> Javascript mailing list
> Javascript at lists.evolt.org
> http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript
>

From darren.west at gmail.com  Fri Jan  9 09:01:13 2009
From: darren.west at gmail.com (Darren West)
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 16:01:13 +0100
Subject: [Javascript] JSON (was Probe....)
In-Reply-To: <71769ee80901090700g25ef2e79ka76fc9350d1b001c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>
	<49643018.6020400@seastorm.com> <4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>
	<DCA09686960B4BD2A493F3D50C4FFFB6@BadBoy3>
	<CF12DB4653A04C42B6CFC325480098280127A03F@STATION.kubota-kma.com>
	<000b01c97268$2142c900$63c85b00$@com> <496763D3.2070702@dorward.me.uk>
	<71769ee80901090700g25ef2e79ka76fc9350d1b001c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <71769ee80901090701y7acaf276meda95c23102c490f@mail.gmail.com>

lol, ah, misread sorry

2009/1/9 Darren West <darren.west at gmail.com>:
> Are you joking!?
>
> 2009/1/9 David Dorward <david at dorward.me.uk>:
>> John Warner wrote:
>>> Speaking of that what is a good JSON tutorial online (free)?
>>>
>> The spec: http://json.org/
>>
>> JSON is dead simple.
>>
>> --
>> David Dorward
>> http://dorward.me.uk/
>> _______________________________________________
>> Javascript mailing list
>> Javascript at lists.evolt.org
>> http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript
>>
>

From scott at randomchaos.com  Fri Jan  9 09:08:38 2009
From: scott at randomchaos.com (Scott Reynen)
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 08:08:38 -0700
Subject: [Javascript] Unit testing AJAX calls (Was: Probe...)
In-Reply-To: <bbc8fa430901070944p2303633br908511b4f077f842@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d3d8cbd95ac34ba1a6aabfadba47593b@maila15.webcontrolcenter.com>
	<49643018.6020400@seastorm.com> <4964D41D.5070308@webtuitive.com>
	<66E93517-4B12-41A9-BAD6-2DA9BA9C0D5D@randomchaos.com>
	<bbc8fa430901070944p2303633br908511b4f077f842@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <44C2C5BC-A992-4663-88C9-8F69D4E64B6C@randomchaos.com>

On [Jan 7], at [ Jan 7] 10:44 , Matt Warden wrote:

>> Does anyone do unit testing on AJAX calls, and if so, how?
>
> I generally point to a static version of the XML that I know is valid
> for "unit testing" purposes in this regard. It's more just removing
> the variables introduced by the server side code than unit testing.

Yeah, as you said, that's not really unit testing.  The whole point of  
unit testing is to ensure that sections of code are working properly  
so I don't have to worry about them ever again as I use them in  
conjunction with other sections of code.  I can't really be confident  
the production code is working properly if I tested something slightly  
different.  But I don't see a way to test code with AJAX calls without  
changing the code itself, as you suggested.  Apparently no one does  
real unit testing on AJAX calls.  Thanks anyway.

Peace,
Scott


From paul at juniperwebcraft.com  Sat Jan 10 02:12:09 2009
From: paul at juniperwebcraft.com (Paul Novitski)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 00:12:09 -0800
Subject: [Javascript] JavaScript Bible comments
Message-ID: <E1LLYvt-0001xj-Pa@cl40.gs01.gridserver.com>

I would love to get your critical comments on Danny Goodman's JavaScript Bible
http://ca.wiley.com/WileyCDA/WileyTitle/productCd-0470069163.html

Are you familiar with the latest (6th) edition?  What do you like and 
(more importantly) not like about the book?  I would be grateful for 
your detailed remarks.

Thanks very much,

Paul
__________________________

Paul Novitski
Juniper Webcraft Ltd.
http://juniperwebcraft.com


From riegel at clearimageonline.com  Sat Jan 10 14:11:39 2009
From: riegel at clearimageonline.com (Terry Riegel)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 15:11:39 -0500
Subject: [Javascript] JavaScript Bible comments
In-Reply-To: <E1LLYvt-0001xj-Pa@cl40.gs01.gridserver.com>
References: <E1LLYvt-0001xj-Pa@cl40.gs01.gridserver.com>
Message-ID: <2358E27A-18F4-4622-894F-4E54750D4FB9@clearimageonline.com>

I'll have to add it to my wish list.

When/if I get it I would be more than happy to offer my thoughts on it.

Terry

On Jan 10, 2009, at 3:12 AM, Paul Novitski wrote:

> I would love to get your critical comments on Danny Goodman's  
> JavaScript Bible
> http://ca.wiley.com/WileyCDA/WileyTitle/productCd-0470069163.html
>
> Are you familiar with the latest (6th) edition?  What do you like and
> (more importantly) not like about the book?  I would be grateful for
> your detailed remarks.
>
> Thanks very much,
>
> Paul
> __________________________
>
> Paul Novitski
> Juniper Webcraft Ltd.
> http://juniperwebcraft.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> Javascript mailing list
> Javascript at lists.evolt.org
> http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript


From llay at laysercomputing.com  Sun Jan 11 11:00:47 2009
From: llay at laysercomputing.com (L Lay)
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 12:00:47 -0500
Subject: [Javascript] JavaScript Bible comments
In-Reply-To: <E1LLYvt-0001xj-Pa@cl40.gs01.gridserver.com>
References: <E1LLYvt-0001xj-Pa@cl40.gs01.gridserver.com>
Message-ID: <496A25BF.5040902@laysercomputing.com>


It's not bad.  My major complaint is actually more to do with the 
printing of the book rather than the content.  The pages are very thin - 
so much so that the text shows through from the backside page.  The text 
is also tiny - it makes for a difficult read physically.  I also wish 
they had simply published two volumes instead of putting the second on cd.

It's not a beginners book.  It's more of a reference.  I find the 
examples lacking.  I'm not an advanced JavaScript programmer and find 
that when I finally do find what I am looking for, Goodman's explanation 
often isn't enough for me to figure out what's going on.

His coverage is very comprehensive.  I have seen questions on various 
lists that are answered by this book.  The thing I really like is he 
tries to cover the differences between browser implementation.

I think this is a good reference book that would probably be very 
beneficial to someone who's done a bit more scripting than me.  I don't 
regret buying it.

...Lori


Paul Novitski wrote:
> I would love to get your critical comments on Danny Goodman's JavaScript Bible
> http://ca.wiley.com/WileyCDA/WileyTitle/productCd-0470069163.html
>
> Are you familiar with the latest (6th) edition?  What do you like and 
> (more importantly) not like about the book?  I would be grateful for 
> your detailed remarks.
>
> Thanks very much,
>
> Paul
> __________________________
>
> Paul Novitski
> Juniper Webcraft Ltd.
> http://juniperwebcraft.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> Javascript mailing list
> Javascript at lists.evolt.org
> http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/javascript
>
>   

From riegel at clearimageonline.com  Mon Jan 12 11:31:00 2009
From: riegel at clearimageonline.com (Terry Riegel)
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 12:31:00 -0500
Subject: [Javascript]  cache ajax
Message-ID: <914095E2-9957-498C-B4BF-BB834F468F48@clearimageonline.com>

Hello All,

I am getting into a new project and would like to cache my ajax  
requests into a global variable.

Any ideas on how I might be able to do this?

I have the following function

  function showcat()
    {
      var category = this.id;

      var pars = '?ajaxrequest='+category+'&returndiv=maincategorydiv';
      $('maincategorydiv').innerHTML='<img src="/newsite/images/ 
spinner.gif" width="24" height="24" alt="loading" />';

      var myAjax = new Ajax.Updater('maincategorydiv', this.ajax, 
{method: 'get', parameters: pars,
                       onComplete: function(transport){accordion = new  
Accordion(category+"-accordion", 3);}

});


    }


What I would like to do is set category to the html returned by my  
ajax call

prodcat01=returned results

Make sense?

Thanks,

Terry

From tedd at sperling.com  Sun Jan 18 14:35:02 2009
From: tedd at sperling.com (tedd)
Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 15:35:02 -0500
Subject: [Javascript] A Dynamic Select Solution Sought
Message-ID: <p06240801c59938464d2d@[192.168.1.101]>

Hi gang:

On the outside chance that someone is looking for something to do -- 
here's a problem to consider:

http://www.webbytedd.com/b/dynamic-select/

The user can select up to five different time-slots to attend 
meetings -- no problem with the user's initial selection.

But a problem arises because some of these time-slots overlap -- as 
such, a user can select overlapping times that make it impossible for 
them to attend two (or more) meetings at the same time.

For example, if a person selects the time-slot of 7:00am-9:00am to 
attend Meeting A, then they cannot also attend Meeting B during any 
part of the chosen time-slot. That means that times 7:30am-9:30am, 
8:00am-10:00am, and 8:30am-10:30am should not be available for them 
to select for other meetings.

As an example of the solution -- I would like it such that if the 
user picks the time-slot 7:00am-9:00am in the first selection, then 
all options falling within that time-slot would be dimmed in the 
other four selections.

Likewise, I would like for this solution to continue with the 
remaining selections. IOW, as the user selects time-slots, those 
options will be taken out (i.e., dimmed) from the remaining available 
time-slots.

I know it can be done, but it's taking me far more time than I can 
afford at the moment. Some help would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

tedd

-- 
-------
http://sperling.com  http://ancientstones.com  http://earthstones.com

From tedd at sperling.com  Wed Jan 28 08:39:43 2009
From: tedd at sperling.com (tedd)
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2009 09:39:43 -0500
Subject: [Javascript] Dirty Button
In-Reply-To: <E1LRLdb-00012u-Fa@cl38.gs01.gridserver.com>
References: <p06240802c5a257ca6fcc@[192.168.1.101]>
	<3738517.1232946499445.JavaMail.root@m01>
	<E1LRLdb-00012u-Fa@cl38.gs01.gridserver.com>
Message-ID: <p06240816c5a619b5cc58@[192.168.1.101]>

>At 1/25/2009 12:37 PM, Claude Schneegans wrote:
>>Solution looks fine, but where is the problem?
>>Why do you need to show the user what he selected?
>>If you really need it, just update the "You Selected" innerHTML on 
>>a onchange event.
>
>
>I assume that Tedd's fundamental goal was to ensure (without using 
>XMLHttpRequest) a match between the client-side display and the 
>server-side data, as set by the previous submit, not simply to 
>duplicate the form control settings in the client-side display.
>
>At the risk of being overly obvious, though, I'll point out that the 
>principal problem Tedd is trying to solve exists only when the input 
>form and the calculated result of form submission coexist on the 
>same page.  Another model for the user interface, in which the form 
>and its result each resides on its own page, bypasses this problem 
>completely.  For instance, the results page might have a 'run again' 
>link or button to return to the form which is always populated by 
>the current server-side data.  What such a two-page model may lack 
>in sexiness it certainly makes up for in unambiguous clarity and a 
>guaranteed match between form state and stored data.
>
>>At 1:23 PM -0500 1/25/09, Gene Berger wrote:
>>>I like the concept!  The only thing is that if the EU clicks one of the
>>>dropdowns but does NOT change the selection, the color of the buttons still
>>>changes.  Perhaps if the selection doesn't change the color of the button
>>>shouldn't change.
>
>At 1/25/2009 11:03 AM, tedd wrote:
>>I thought about that as well, but I wanted to keep the solution 
>>simple. I'll give that some thought though.
>
>At 1/25/2009 01:32 PM, Matt Warden wrote:
>>It doesn't seem to work if you use the keyboard to alter the select
>>values rather than the mouse.
>
>Tedd, these criticisms are radical.  To create a signal that the 
>value has changed and allow it to indicate a situation in which the 
>value hasn't changed, or fail to signal an actual change, means that 
>you haven't finished writing it.  Misleading assistance is worse 
>than no assistance at all.
>
>It would be simple enough to download the form with the current 
>value duplicated -- say as an element in the control's own class -- 
>so that your algorithm can know when it's truly dirty and when it's 
>not.
>
>Regards,
>
>Paul


Paul:

I believe you truly understand the problem and I appreciate your input.

The cursory solution is to update the display as the user changes the 
controls on-the-fly. However, in some cases (as the one I'm currently 
working on) doing so will probably confuse the user more than help.

In some case, the user needs to set all the controls to what they 
want and then calculate the results. Intermediate steps can produce 
confusing and/or nonsensical data.

For example, I'm working with a display that will allow a student to 
pick the course they want, what times they want to take the course, 
what location they want to attend the course, and what tutor they 
want to teach the course. Going from one scenario to another (i.e., 
setting all the controls to different values) may not produce 
meaningful data within the intermediate steps.

I'm not sure what is the optimum solution here and thus the reason 
for my post. I'm still undecided, but I'm favoring the dirty button 
solution.

Thanks,

tedd


-- 
-------
http://sperling.com  http://ancientstones.com  http://earthstones.com

From dean.mah at gmail.com  Thu Jan 29 11:31:15 2009
From: dean.mah at gmail.com (Dean Mah)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 10:31:15 -0700
Subject: [Javascript] ADMIN: Downtime
Message-ID: <f4a098c50901290931p1cc6794ek580c67daf4b7d66d@mail.gmail.com>

Some of you may have noticed a little downtime lately.  We had a hard
drive failure on the new server's hard drive.  We've fallen back to
the old server.  New DNS information should be propagating and lists
will appear to start working again soon.  You may notice that you have
mysteriously been re-subscribed if you unsubscribed while on the new
server.  You will need to re-unsub.

If you are on twitter, you can follow evolt_org or search #evolt for
status updates.

Dean