[thelist] Frame Bashing (was: frameborder=0)

[Mark Hadley]

james wrote:

> Sorry, I originally tested using a white background and didn't see
> the remaining space between the frames. This is a case, unfortunately,
where
> there is apparently *no* standards-compliant way to remove the spacing
> between the frames. Placing a border attribute with a value of "0" in the
> frameset seems to be the only cross-browser way to accomplish this,
although
> IE also supports a framespacing attribute on the frameset element which
does
> the same thing.
> Reluctantly, I have to blame the W3C for this one. While it may be
> that there is no intrinsic reason that framesets with the frameborder
> attribute set to "0" should still display some type of border,
compatibility
> with the de facto standard set by existing browsers should have dictated
an
> attribute within the W3C standard to eliminate the extra space. After all,
> HTML 4.x was developed long after both Netscape and Microsoft had widely
> distributed browsers that supported frames and exhibited this behavior.

I have come to the same conclusion on this issue, and find it extremely
annoying that there seems to be no way to get a frameset without borders to
validate in either HTML4 or XHTML. I think i will complain!!

On the subject of frames, it seems to me as if designers/coders like to dis
frames alot. Personally, I disagree. I think that framesets when well
executed can add significantly to the layout and navigation of a site. I
also think that they can *improve* accessibility options by providing
dedicated <no frames> options for noframes text/speech browsers. And i an
sick and tired of non-framed sites where the navigation disappears off into
the sky somewhere all the time. Is it true that W3C are considering
depreciating frames? Why don't you like them?? Discuss!!

Mark.