[thelist] flash detection

[Erik Mattheis]

The way some of you talk, one would think you could walk into the 
marketing department of BMW, Disney ... wherever ... and tell them 
that they're wrong for using Flash. And do you think such places 
haven't done studies that have shown a measurable benefit from using 
Flash instead of straight HTML? Do you think they'd still be using 
Flash otherwise? Why are some of you afraid to look outside of your 
fascinating web safe color command-line world? It's not too scarry, 
I'm sure.

I get lots of use out of this list, and attempt to give back 
something ... most of what I have to offer regards Flash ... it 
pisses me off that lately the F word can't be mentioned without 
someone thinking of something critical to say.

I wrote this:
>  >Try browsing the net for a while with Netscape 2, or any browser with
>>stylesheets disabled

At 7:17 PM +0100 5/4/01, Martin wrote:
>Lack of stylesheets doesn't prevent you accessing the content/services.
>The worst you'll get is lack of surface prettiness.
>
>>(or stylesheets ENABLED on a Mac).
>
>bullshit. Only causes problems when developers don't think beyond
>Win/IE

You're right, stylesheets were a bad example ... but my point is that 
nomatter what the reason ... some sites do not support a few visitors 
unless they want to jump through some sort of hoop - and there's no 
way anyone can say it's OK to not support visitors without component 
X but it's not OK to support visitors without component. So why don't 
people here bitch and moan about JavaScript 1.1 or PDFs?

If your goal is to reach as many people as possible, doing it with a 
website is a stupid idea in the first place ... er wait, sorry, I 
forget - most public libraries offer Internet access.

>  >Flash has been shipping with the major browsers for like ... years.
>>It's up to developers to force their audience to use reasonably
>>current technology.
>
>Erik - you've just debarred yourself from any work for a commercial
>client. The job of a developer is to help the client achieve their
>business objectives.

?!?!? No more work ... damn ....? er, maybe oh, GOD ... maybe I've 
never dopne any work to begin with! ... is, is, is this whole thing 
about me thinking I'm a Flash developer some sort of coping 
mechanism? Maybe I haven't worked in years and all this is a 
delusion? Maybe I'm in the loony bin explaining to the orderlies how 
their screen resolution is larger than most people's!

Thanks for the advice, but I'd say I'd be out of line if I decided I 
was going to help a client better "achieve their business objectives" 
by telling them to scrap the Flash idea after they've been referred 
to me as someone who does Flash work. Last time I checked there were 
plenty other individuals and design firms that squeek by doing little 
other than Flash.

At 11:42 AM -0500 5/4/01, Ben Dyer wrote:
>My, that's pig-headed.
>
>It's our jobs as developers to be at least somewhat accomodating, 
>even if that means more work.  The problem I have is that most 
>developers think that our users owe us something.  Why don't they 
>upgrade?, well they must just be morons or Luddites.  We'll force 
>them to upgrade, that'll show 'em.

You've got it backwards ... the reason for requiring Flash is to 
deliver the user a higher quality experience.

Add to your list of Morons and Luddites: "People's who's Network 
Admin enforces a policy against changing the standard configuration" 
and "Stubborn developers who are so bland they disable it" and you've 
pretty much covered the Internet users I usually don't give a hoot 
about past telling them they need something they don't have. Well, I 
do wish the "stubborn" group would give in ... they'd be better 
developers with a bigger tool chest.

At 5:03 PM -0400 5/4/01, deke wrote:
>Hey, do what you want. It's a lot of time and money building
>traffic, and if you want to tell users to go fubar themselves,
>I'm sure that webmasters with sites that compete with yours
>will applaud your decision.

I wasn't aware I was competing with anyone, but do I sense an 
impending challenge of some sort? That would be fun. I can't think of 
any creative taunts.

I do love you goons. I am confident that if we spend a little bit of 
time each week on this therapy through confrontation, you'll on the 
road to health in no time.


-- 
- Erik Mattheis

"Everything's better"
http://gozz.com/
(612) 827 3963