[thelist] Old Browsers old Software, cut bait and move on.

[Mark Cheng]

>-----Original Message-----
>From: thelist-admin at lists.evolt.org
>>
>> What about the DOM?  From my brief flirt with the DOM it appears that
>> having it makes it a hell of a lot easier to build user customisable
>> pages.  Eg sorting lists/columns etc.  If a web designer is going to
>> present an objective view, surely they need to present an overview of
>> the things you can't do if you cater for older browsers.  Also, DOM
>> manipulation can easily be done client side, taking the load off the
>> client server.
>
>*the* DOM?  like there haven't been DOMs before?

:) ok, you got me.  I overly emphasised. (But you know what I meant)

>
>either way, yes, you can do that, and in *applications* and the like
>it's great... but again, we started by talking about transactional e-
>comm sites...
>
>are you doing all that DOM manipulation to have a user go from
>your product page to an order receipt, leaving their cc info along the
>way?  why not?  probably because it isn't *necessary*... so if you
>don't need that, then why *can't* that e-commerce piece work for
>all browsers?
>

What about being able to sort a list of previous orders by date? amount?
product? purchaser?  all client side.  Serve up the data in a table and let
the user machine worry about sorting.

I have over a page of past orders which I can see in one of the estores -
being able to sort that would be useful for me.  For business using ecom it
would probably be very useful - they'd have more orders.


>> As a couple of people have said, a web designers job is to educate,
>> and provide objective views.  Well, do that.  Tell clients that you
>> can have a client side page sort, reshuffle layout, whatever, if they
>> are willing to go with the Gen 5.
>
>even if they don't need it?  again, keep in mind the context, it's not
>necessary for a cart... for an overall site, sure, but usually those
>'features' are just eye-candy and don't add too much to the
>function... if it's truly an online app, then you're talking
>intra/extranet, where you actually have some control over your
>users...

You always have to take context into account.  However, even for a cart it
could be useful - eg companies buying stationary over the web.  They may not
buy just one page of items.

As always, context is key.

>
>> >no, it's a *web* page, and people have certain expectations, certain
>> >usability rules still apply, and old-school marketing tactics about
>> >customer loyalty still rule...
>>
>> Change useability to accessability and I agree with you.
>
>you should agree with it as usability, too... why wouldn't Fitt's Law
>apply on a web page?  well, it does...

Fitt's Law??  (sorry I'm new to this and in Oz)

>
>> >don't insult 'em, don't kick 'em out, and keep 'em happy...
>>
>> If you are referring to clients - I agree.  Potential clients (users)
>> are a dime a dozen.  Everyone is a potential client and while most
>> business would love to have everyone as a client, most couldn't handle
>> more than say, 500,000 actual clients.
>
>if you feel every user/customer at a site is a dime a dozen, they
>will sense it and feel undervalued... customers are good at finding
>sites that act like they appreciate their time/business/patronage...
>again, old-world marketing still applies...
>

Whoa,  I was trying to draw a distinction between customers and users.
There are millions of users, but only a few customers.  Design for the bulk
of your customers.


PS  the comments to the disclaimer crack me up! LOL


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