I remember a discussion a few months back about playing around with the DOM and what could be achieved with it that would actually benifit the user. If you havn't sen thi site before take a look at it: http://youngpup.net/?request=/snippets/sleight.xml Doesn't seem that special at first, but then take a look at the nav at the top. Then design that you don't like the side bar. It's fully scalable. You can scale elements like in a GUI. Very useful IMO. (o: - Kevin