Ok solved this and its partly my fault if you guys didn't see the problem. My include was this: <? include("http://www.sparklesparties.com/includes/navigation.php");?> I had chopped the URL to save space in the explanation. Apparently when you go all the way outside as it were like that, somehow the variable is out of scope. When I changed the include to: <? include("includes/footer.php");?> It worked. Thanks for all the help in troubleshooting! That should teach me to copy things AS IS. doh. Tom ===== http://www.pixelmech.com/ :: Web Development Services http://www.DMXzone.com/ :: JavaScript Author / Every Friday! http://www.thywordistruth.net/ :: Eternal Life [Those who say that I am finished, and am through, will have to run over my dead body to beat me...]