I need a text area to show and retain newlines. Is wrap="off" still the only (invalid) way? I couldn't get any combination of white-space and overflow css to now wrap and show a scroll bar. The top textarea is what I'm after: http://hank.org/textarea.html (I realized I can force validation by applying wrap="off" with javascript, but that's not my question). Thanks, -- Bill Moseley moseley at hank.org