Seb wrote > No paid-for ads on evolt, or sponsorship of evolt. Now or ever. > > If companies want to donate, fine, but they don't get anything for it > whatsoever, except equal billing on the donations wall with every other > donor. > > If anybody doesn't understand why I say this, you might want to remember > why evolt.org started nearly 5 years ago. There's also a huge list of > practical reasons why ads and sponsorhsip are bad things. I have been following evolt's progress...or lack of...for quite a long time. I do not see any particular claim for virtue that has any merit...potential..yes but merit no. even the stated reasons have not been held in high esteem by many of the posters on my screen. The lack of a business model ...no bank account...no financial info..other than a snapshot in time. And look at the trail of badly used benefactors...Dan and Dorman comes to mind. Seb, I would like to see a verified list of your contributions. Now, we are going to argue about a membership program, that even if it was implemented would not have a bank account. And if a bank account was to be opened...it would have no accounting safeguards... Give me a break! No advertising, a selection process to screen out sponsors. for text ads even!!! Spare me. The evolt hierarchy is cloaked in secrecy, indeed there is no hierarchy, just an unwieldy anonymous crowd scattered from Timbuktu to Atlantis...all clinging to something that they cannot control, don't want to, and wouldn't even have the means to control. Then sit back and whine about any attempt to put the organization...or rather non-organization...on a good financial footing. We could us Google's AdSense program...just past a snippet of code at the place on each page that you want the ad to appear....probably in the right side and maybe on the left below the menu on each and every page. Google will do a good job of matching the ad to the content of the page. Several hundred vetoes are available for blocking certain web sites. Start setting up co-loco servers and offer lean and mean web hosting with forum support. 5 mb to 5gig web sites with unlimited everything with controls on mb and bandwidth...you pay for what you get and if it is exceeded nothing works until you upgrade...and pay for. Go with clickbank or set up your own affiliate program and run all the ads your self on a rotating basis. I guarantee that if you set up a good affiliate program and accept non-porn ads that there is an income in software and internet services alone that will produce more that enough to right the course of this faulty business model...yes business model...is that a dirty word. If business is a dirty word then all you web designers can just start giving away their services... it makes just as much sense. Dan was told to take down his archives because they consumed too much bandwidth. He bought in to the free business model and paid for it dearly...both in whining criticism from people who would not contribute themselves, but would contribute to the raucous clamor for his head. I'll bet Dan never recovered a cent...huh? ...Answer that! Well, the model has been flawed from the start...offering services that consume a ton of bandwith that can readily be accessed free by typing in a keyword to google. We would be just as well of doing that and make pages and pages of bookmarks. There is community here...but it is community just so long as it is free. There is nothing more ridiculous that sitting here in a strait jacket and whining about commercials. Russell Griechen ...Opting for a free model but let the advertisers pay...for we all respond to ads that interest us.