[thelist] HTML Tables for layout rather than strictly for data presentaion

[Joshua OIson]

From: "rudy" <r937 at interlog.com>
Subject: Re: [thelist] HTML Tables for layout rather than strictly for data
presentaion


> i'll go with the intent of *avoid* and will use tables whenever i have to

Thank you for the clarification, rudy.  I casually glanced over the "avoid"
clause.  But this is still a subject which is of interest to me.  So, does
anybody have any links to page reading software that I can run just to "see"
what kind of experience a vision impared user goes through with "viewing" a
page and trying to navigate to other pages?

> also -- and this is an important point, to me anyway -- the w3c says
> "Tables should be used to mark up truly tabular information ("data
> tables")."
>
> okay, i've been in the data architecture business for a very long time,
and
> this is a topic i have argued many times
>
> successfully
>
>   <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">
>   <tr><th align="right">morning: </th><td>cereal/milk, coffee(s)</td></tr>
>   <tr><th align="right">noon: </th><td>vegetables, water</td></tr>
>   <tr><th align="right">dinner: </th><td>meat/potatoes/veggies,
> beer(s)</td></tr>
>   <tr><th align="right">evening: </th><td>more beer</td></tr>
>   </table>

Good counter argument.  Obviously the specification were not designed with
this orientation of data in mind.

> data is basically what you *want* it to be
>
> this means i will often do stuff like the above not only because it's the
> fastest way i know how to achieve that effect and i wouldn't know where to
> begin to code the equivalent styles (nor trust them being
cross-browser)...
>
> ... but also because the stuff in that table happens to *be* data

-joshua