[thelist] How excusable is the use of frames?

[martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com]

Memo from Martin P Burns of PricewaterhouseCoopers

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Hi PPK

Not sure I agree that fashion is the answer.

Frames were all the rage in 97 when Netscape introduced them because they
allowed designers with no server-side smarts to introduce a commonality of
navigation with central management.

Then 2 things happened:
1) The usability issues were investigated and found to be significant
2) Front end designers learned that there were server-side ways to do the
same
    thing, either via SSIs (even FrontPage allowed includes without knowing
    any code), or building the whole site as an application.

Both impacted frames' cost/benefit analysis significantly. This was a
knowledge
development, not a fashion one.

I don't think you'll see a big corporation with a new site which uses
frames in
any significant way. Most big corp sites which do were developed some time
ago, before the above were understood.

I have only ever seen 2 models for successfully using frames for the
benefit of the user:

1) http://www.anytimenow.com/ (although the same argument could be made for
    any webmail site), to simulate an email client interface, allowing
users to scroll
    through subject lines while keeping a static frame for the current
email's content
2) http://www.mcspotlight.org (not there any more), which used frames to
present
    the live McDonalds site and critique it in context.

Unless you can use one of these models (or find a new one which benefits
users,
(not site managers) more than the usability issues which frames introduce),
then
using frames is a bit of a cop-out to development issues.

Martin




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Subject:  Re: [thelist] How excusable is the use of frames?

>my problem lies exactly on the use of frames....I have heard so many
>arguments against the use of frames but at the same time I have seen big
>corporations using it without any guilt....

Presently many developers are against the use of frames (witness many mails
on many lists), but this is mainly a question of fashion. Current wisdom
denounces frames, while the wisdom of two years ago embraced them. I fully
expect frames to make a triumphant comeback in 2002.




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