[thelist] was whitespace around form in firefox now OT rant

Matt Warden mwarden at gmail.com
Thu Jul 20 01:38:45 CDT 2006

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Birdie wrote:
> Btw it's amazing how much I have seen the list change in the last 5 years I
> have been lurking, back in those days there were hardly ever any digs at
> people who posted code which wasn't cutting edge or silly newbie questions.
> Just useful help written in a friendly helpful way.  There are some posters
> on this list who reply in such a high and mighty manner that I think I am
> probably not the only one who thinks twice before posting because of the
> flack, the lectures and the tirades that a simple question then brings forth
> and then having to spend the whole night, the precious little time I have to
> work, writing email to defend myself. 
> this list ? I know it was when I joined in the good old days of when Rudy
> was a regular poster. No one was slammed, everyone seemed to enjoy helping
> others. Sometimes now I think some of you get off on pointing out if
> someone's code is bad. What a shame the list is losing someone like Volkan
> for a while - now there is someone who reminds me of the days when the list
> began - always helpful, always polite, always one to suggest a solution
> without being condescending or critical.

People have their different styles. I can empathize a bit with you. When
I was just starting to get into "serious" JavaScript development, I
received a number of strong replies from Christian Heilmann. I could
have gotten defensive (and I may have even a bit), but it's much easier
to simply ignore the gut reaction and listen to someone who is obviously
more experienced in the matter than I. There is no doubt that I'm a much
better JS developer now. Furthermore, I don't think I would have "gotten
it" if he hadn't been so strong.

I think we are getting to a point with web development where philosophy
is becoming increasingly important (possibly even more so with the
problems at the W3C). For example, one of the things I have been
struggling *seriously* with is finding able front end people. Just
finding someone who knows how to write a 'class' in JavaScript is
ridiculously difficult. There is a lot of pressure in this area. Maybe
some of that frustration comes out in replies.

But, the bottom line, I think, is that its up to you whether you will
take the response personally. Certainly more care could be taken in the
tone of responses to your question(s), but you're the one asking for
help, and they are the ones offering their time. I think it's sort of a
take-it-or-leave-it situation.

> rudeness. Fellow listees please think before you hit send, does your email
> help or does your answer have undertones of contempt for others efforts

These aren't mutually exclusive. If you're really here to learn, I would
try to take things less personally. Often times the people with the
strongest opinions are the leaders in their area.


JSLint can be an extremely useful tool: http://jslint.com/

If you are trying to minify your JavaScript code (which is getting to be
a must for any fat client app), make sure you run it through JSLint
first. It will catch syntax that is correct as-is, but will introduce
bugs when minified.

A note of caution: you will get a *crapload* of errors and warnings.
This is one of the major problems with JSLint, and something that
Crockford is trying to improve by adding more options. You need to parse
out which warnings need to be rectified and which do not. You can get an
idea of the types of errors which need fixed here:
http://www.crockford.com/javascript/jsmin.html (see 'Caution' heading).


- --
Matt Warden
Cleveland, OH, USA

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