[thechat] rationality is not enough (was: New Year's Resolution)

[Joe Crawford]

On Tue, 7 Jan 2003, Madhu Menon wrote:
> At 12:15 AM 07-01-03, Joe Crawford wrote:
> >It's interesting, I see athiest dogma and religious dogma as very closely
> >related. And evangelists for either tend to get tedious.
>
> I beg to differ, Joe.
>
> I rarely discuss religion with people. Why? Because I don't *have* any
> beliefs to peddle. I don't want to convince anyone my god or way of life
> is better. I only mention my atheism if someone directly asks me, or if
> it comes up in the discussion.
>
> So I don't think you'll find too many "evangelists" for atheism.
> Advocates for evolutionary theory, perhaps. But we're not moving from
> door to door telling people that the Lord ISN'T coming, and to give us
> money. ;0 See, I don't really care if people join me in my beliefs (or
> lack thereof.)  :)
>
> I'm not out there preaching "Convert to atheism now. You'll find true
> happiness, you'll find salvation etc."
>
> Have *you* found such people?

Yep. Often. It's pretty egregious and sometimes comes with insulting
comments toward those who are religious.

Not evangelism in the sense of door-to-door -- but talk about the
religious as though they were idiots. They are *so* stupid to be a part of
an organized religion.

The fact is, being part of an organized religion does not a priori make
one an idiot.

Being an idiot makes one an idiot. :-)

I hope I'm making better sense.

> >Sometimes I really wish we were all in the same room having
> ><?=$beverage_of_choice?> and talking about this stuff. Maybe with a jazz
> >trio playing in the corner.
>
> We'd end up killing each other. ;)

You don't *believe* that do you? I think it'd be rad.

> I prefer not to discuss religion because:
>
> a) I'll probably lose a friend
> b) I'll probably NOT convince him/her of my position
> c) He/she may try to kill me because I'm an infidel. No point taking a
>    risk.

I've dealt with this with my Mom. I feared if I explicitly stated my
position (agnostic) to her she would think me damned. Truth is, I was
honest, truthful with her, and she was more accepting than I could have
imagined.

I certainly hope 3) is not the case. That's scary. Religious tolerance is
one of the things guaranteed in the USA - and we're still trying to figure
out how to get it right. It's hard work negotiating lots of different
absolute truths. :-)

Anyway Madhu, take care,

	Joe