[Theforum] Reimbursing Dan

Martin martin at members.evolt.org
Sun Apr 21 19:11:18 CDT 2002

On Sunday, April 21, 2002, at 11:00  pm, Michele Foster wrote:

> To the best of my knowledge, we don't have an evolt.org banking account.
> Which is why the paypal account is in Dan's name, as a real bank
> account is
> required in order to use/receive funds via paypal.

Understood that that's an entirely appropriate temporary measure, but
it is not desirable that evolt.org's funds go through *any* individual's
private account. So if we're to continue accepting and spending funds,
it needs to move to a more formal footing, and we certainly need to
remove the risk of accusations of fraud (not that there would be any
fraud, but where funds are going through private accounts with no
audit trail, it's much easier for accusations to be made than to disprove

Marlene's problem IIRC was that without an evolt.org organisation
recognised as an NFP or not), she was having problems opening a bank
which didn't impact her tax status (which it wouldn't really be fair to

Some info here:

(side-note - we'd need to make sure that reimbursement to Dan/whoever
didn't go through PayPal unless really necessary as their clip on
is substantial...)

> So, what I want to do, and what I think Hugh wants to do, is send some
> cash
> through the paypal account, to be used specifically as outlined above
> and
> previous emails.  So, what would be the best thing for us to do?
> Should we
> put through the transaction with paypal like normal and then send an
> email
> to Dan and Marlene what we want those funds to be used for?  What's the
> best
> way to keep proper record of these things?

In the short-term (ie with funds going through Dan's account, see above
why this is short-term), either:
1) We change the payment account so that the notification goes to
    treasurer at evolt.org, even though the payment continues to go to Dan
   and then Marlene notifies Dan plus records the donation in the accounts
   and receipts (and thanks!) the donor
2) Dan notifies Marlene of incoming funds, and Marlene records the
    in the accounts and receipts (and thanks) the donor.

The first method gives the better visibility between incoming donations
funds available to evolt.org, and would allow an easier migration to a
formal setup involving an evolt.org bank account.

In either case, to provide transparency to donors, accounts should be
visible on request which lists all donations (not naming donors without
their consent), any requests for ringfencing which came along with them,
and how that ringfencing was fulfilled (ties up to the expenditure
Whether that's an automated system, a live one, or not is a slightly
question (anyone know if Sage/MYOB has a web export facility?)

> What I don't want to have happen is, 6 months down the line when
> someone (or
> a group of individuals) are reviewing the accounts, then they say
> "where did
> Dan get the authorization to use Michele and Hugh's (and others) amounts
> specifically as reimbursement for the original start-up hardware?"

100% +42 on that. That trackability is the whole raison d'etre of having
proper accounting and audit procedures.

Although there *are* issues with ringfenced donations as there can be
discrepancies between what donors want to buy and what the organisation

> Sure, I can tell Dan to accept this donation as payment for the
> hardware he
> already has being used for evolt.org.  My question becomes, who else
> should
> I tell?  How and by whom does it get recorded?

This shouldn't be an issue for the donor (they've done their bit), but
for how
evolt.org's organisation and structure handles it.

> Can we get these ideas/suggestions put on the wiki .. doesn't have to be
> anything formal .. but let's keep the conversations flowing and getting
> all
> these little pieces ironed out.  Then, if we decide to go with the
> "groups"
> as outlined in the restructure agreement, at least there will be some
> pages/words/discussion that can then be handed over to the individual
> group
> (the money group in this case) to sort out and determine what
> procedures and
> processes they want to implement.
> Personally, I'm finding it difficult to focus on so many things.  And
> there
> *are* so many things to focus on.  :)   Can you look after making sure
> stuff
> gets put on the wiki in a logical format?

The Wiki essence is that each user should do that (and somewhat that
it should be unstructured - there's a certain joy in putting in a
and discovering there's already a page for it), but yes, I am doing
tidies as and when they seem logical. Because the hierarchy isn't based
on folders, stuff can be moved about without breaking the URL (Jakob
would love it).

> I'm finding it difficult to find
> things if they don't appear on the frontpage.  Can the frontpage be a
> sort
> of site map/road map to all of the pages available and all the inner
> pages
> (something like what we see on the top of each page, but for the entire
> wiki
> contents)?

I've added a full sitemap to the front page. There's also sitemap linked
the sidebar of each page btw, highlighting where that page is in the

The problem with doing email notifications of updates is that the place
where this is hosted doesn't have access to an outgoing mail server
(more detailed Zope reason - it doesn't have the MailHost product
installed to talk to an SMTP server, and I don't have access to the box
to install it. I could (probably) add a notification without too much
if it were on a *eo (zeo I guess ;-) ) box).

email: martin at easyweb.co.uk             PGP ID:	0xA835CCCB
	martin at members.evolt.org      snailmail:	30 Shandon Place
   tel:	+44 (0)774 063 9985				Edinburgh,
   url:	http://www.easyweb.co.uk			Scotland

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