From elfur at hugvit.is  Thu Feb  1 05:17:48 2001
From: elfur at hugvit.is (elfur at hugvit.is)
Date: Thu Feb  1 05:17:48 2001
Subject: [thesite] comments on the site
Message-ID: <OF7F5944C1.232585D0-ON002569E6.00359C59@europe.is>

Have to start by saying, that I haven't been able to follow the mail on
thesite for last two weeks, but thought I'd let you know anyway, in case
you hadn't noticed.

I was re-reading my comment on scott's anniversary article
http://evolt.org/article/After_2_Years_I_m_Finally_Defining_Evolt/25/4212/index.html
when I notived that all the linebreaks I inserted at the time, aren't
showing

there are only two line breaks in that comment of mine and those are the
<br> ones I did.
Is there some fault in the comment display?
I went to edit the comment, but when the text is in the text area, all the
linebreaks are showing.

well, anyways just thought I'd let you know

:kve?ja
: elfur
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
: Elfur Logad?ttir
: elfur at hugvit.is
: GoPro-Landsteinar Group
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
: Workers of the web :: evolt.org!
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
: Age is like a state of mind
: If you don't mind, it don't matter
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::





From djc at starkmedia.com  Thu Feb  1 10:19:48 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Thu Feb  1 10:19:48 2001
Subject: [thesite] [Fwd: [Fwd: evolt error]]
Message-ID: <3A797868.4050903@starkmedia.com>

clues? I can't check this out right now..


Peter Van Dijck wrote:

     Hi, upon editing an article of mine, I got this error:

     Error Diagnostic Information
     Oracle Error Code = 1401
     ORA-01401: inserted value too large for column
     SQL = "UPDATE content SET categoryid = '20', datemod = '26-Jan-01',
     signdate = sysdate, contentname = 'A brief introduction to metadata
     and the
     semantic web', synopsis = 'The web is growing fast. And peer to peer
     computing promises even faster growth of stuff we can access. And
     logically, the more stuff there is, the harder it becomes to find the
     particular stuff you were looking for. Metadata could be the
     answer.', body
     = :1, signoff = 3 WHERE contentid = 5263"
     Query Parameter Value(s) -
     Parameter #1 =
     (terms used, links and metadata about this article at the bottom)
     The web is growing fast. And peer to peer computing promises even
     faster
     growth of stuff we can access. And logically, the more stuff there
     is, the
     harder it becomes to find the particular stuff you were looking for.
     Metadata could be the answer.
     The problem
     Web documents lack metadata.
     Sure, some sites use some of the metatags, and the title tag gets
     used a
     lot, but even this limited amount of metadata is poorly defined
     (what is
     supposed to go in that title tag anyway?) and poorly used.
     This lack of metadata makes it really hard to search the web, and
     limits
     it's use. It's really hard to search for related documents for example.
     The solution
     The core of the World Wide Web Consortium's (W3C) metadata vision is a
     concept known as the Semantic Web. The semantic web means that all the
     stuff out there has metadata with it that describes it.
     But is the W3C then going to define thousands of metatags for every
     possible subject? Don't think so, Jose.
     Enter the Resource Description Framework (RDF).
     The resource description Framework is an XML-like standard for defining
     vocabularies that define metadata.
     These vocabularies can then be used to describe documents. There
     already
     are a bunch of vocabularies out there (mostly for describing books),
     that
     can be used, but anyone could invent a new one. Market forces decide
     which
     ones get popular.
     The future
     This is all of little consequence to web developers right now. But
     anyone
     involved in content management should watch this space, interesting
     times
     are ahead.
     Terms used
     Metadata: metadata is data about data. I'll illustrate with a few
     examples:
     the author of a book is metadata. The category a library classifies
     a book
     in is metadata about that book. The title argument of an tag is
     metadata.
     Related links:
     The power of metadata
     http://openp2p.com/pub/a/p2p/2001/01/18/metadata.html
     (a really good introduction at http://openp2p.com)
     What is RDF?
     http://www.xml.com/lpt/a/2001/01/24/rdf.html
     (really good as well at http://xml.com)
     Some metadata about this article (you may have noticed, more is
     provided by
     evolt):
     Author: Peter Van Dijck, aka pedrito
     (for example, for meta data on the author, click on the author link
     at the
     top of the article)
     Title: Introduction to metadata and the semantic web.
     Inspiration: the above articles
     Date of writing: Friday, January 2001
     keywords: metadata, semantic web, p2p, Resource Description
     Framework, rdf,
     xml, content management.
     Data Source = "EVOLT"
     The error occurred while processing an element with a general
     identifier of
     (CFQUERY), occupying document position (24:7) to (24:56) in the
     template
     file /home/evolt/main_html/evolt/article/act_process.cfm.
     Date/Time: Thu Feb 1 04:11:02 2001
     Browser: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.5; Windows NT 4.0)
     Remote Address: 213.38.76.82
     HTTP Referer:
     http://evolt.org/article/index.html?action=edit&tid=18&aid=5263
     <http://evolt.org/article/index.html?action=edit&tid=18&aid=5263>
     Query String: section=article&action=process


-- 
Daniel J. Cody
Systems Administrator

Starkmedia | for the web
219 N. Milwaukee Street
Milwaukee, WI 53202

p 414.226.2710
f 414.226.2716
e dan at starkmedia.com
w http://www.starkmedia.com




From djc at mail.starkmedia.com  Thu Feb  1 23:01:37 2001
From: djc at mail.starkmedia.com (djc at mail.starkmedia.com)
Date: Thu Feb  1 23:01:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] Re: [Admin] List Archive Search Down
In-Reply-To: <3A7A13B2.518743F@csi1st.net>
References: <3A7A13B2.518743F@csi1st.net>
Message-ID: <200102020335.f123ZL404408@mail.starkmedia.com>

its temporarily fixed ATM.. I mussed up some hardcoded 
styles paying with the new stylesheets..

david et all, can i get the finalized version of the 
l.e.o stylesheets - and templates for the other pages 
if you have the time - tonite or friday maybe?? :)

thnx

.djc.

Quoting Ron Dorman <rwd at csi1st.net>:

> I get this trying to search:
>
>
>
>  Error Diagnostic Information
>
>  An error occurred while evaluating the expression:
>
>  #blue#
>
>  Error near line 106, column 60.
>
>
>  Error resolving parameter BLUE
>
>  ColdFusion was unable to determine the value of the 
parameter. This
> problem is very likely due to the fact that either:
>
>    1.You have misspelled the parameter name, or
>    2.You have not specified a QUERY attribute for a 
CFOUTPUT, CFMAIL, or
> CFTABLE tag.
>
>  The error occurred while processing an element with 
a general
> identifier of (#blue#), occupying document position 
(106:59)
>  to (106:64) in the template file 
/home/mailman/public_html/search.cfm.
>
>  Date/Time: Thu Feb 1 21:16:22 2001
>  Browser: Mozilla/4.7 [en] (Win95; I)
>  Remote Address: 209.48.124.60
>  HTTP Referer: http://lists.evolt.org/
>
>
> can someone fix this for us?



From mccreath at ak.net  Fri Feb  2 00:00:37 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Fri Feb  2 00:00:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] Re: [Admin] List Archive Search Down
In-Reply-To: <200102020335.f123ZL404408@mail.starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEEEAACGAA.mccreath@ak.net>

> david et all, can i get the finalized version of the
> l.e.o stylesheets - and templates for the other pages
> if you have the time - tonite or friday maybe?? :)

I'll get everything wrapped up tomorrow evening, Saturday morning at the
latest.

I'd work tonight, but other stuff is pressing. :(

David




From djc at mail.starkmedia.com  Fri Feb  2 00:13:37 2001
From: djc at mail.starkmedia.com (djc at mail.starkmedia.com)
Date: Fri Feb  2 00:13:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] Re: [Admin] List Archive Search Down
In-Reply-To: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEEEAACGAA.mccreath@ak.net>
References: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEEEAACGAA.mccreath@ak.net>
Message-ID: <200102020447.f124lGE04751@mail.starkmedia.com>

sounds good.. thanks brotha :)

Quoting mccreath <mccreath at ak.net>:
> I\'ll get everything wrapped up tomorrow evening, 
Saturday morning at the
> latest.
>
> I\'d work tonight, but other stuff is pressing. :(



From djc at mail.starkmedia.com  Fri Feb  2 00:35:39 2001
From: djc at mail.starkmedia.com (djc at mail.starkmedia.com)
Date: Fri Feb  2 00:35:39 2001
Subject: [thesite] b.e.o move..
Message-ID: <200102020509.f1259Dq04843@mail.starkmedia.com>

I bought some more parts today to go with the donated 
cheetah drives i got last week. Together, they form the 
new and improved - stand alone server - 
browsers.evolt.org; this soon to be collectors item is 
at the top of every hobbyists wish list!

Featuring:
an 800Mhz AMD Athlon processor
256Mb of extreme! 200Mhz RAM
65Gb of heart thumpin, chest pounding, 80Mb transfer 
ratin\' SCSI2 disk space

Sexy developers sold seperatly. Must take inventory 
from dealer stock.

errr.. i\'ve already moved the DNS for b.e.o to point to 
the new IP addy and am thinking about putting l.e.o on 
this box too for a variety of reasons, #1 being the 
ineptness of oracular in mainting their network, 
servers, etc..

with this move, i\'m for sure gonna open up the 
members.evolt.org account thing again since there is 
now a big enough box to have people put their sites if 
their interested in that(CF, PHP, chilisoft).. this 
should also open up enough room for 
members.evolt.org/jeff/WebCamPr0n ;)

anyone have thoughts or other ideas? I have 2 more 18GB 
cheetahs here that aren\'t being used right now cus i 
didnt see the need to stick 85Gb in one server..  if 
the need comes up i\'ll do it of course, but i was 
thinking about buying some more hardware and using 
those drives for our very own web/db server or something

what do you all think? got any ideas on cool projects 
to tackle? evolt radio? free member space? online 
courses? irc type chat rooms? pr0n.evolt.org? :)

seriously, lets hear them.. and lemme know if 
everything sounds kosher :)

.djc.



From djc at starkmedia.com  Fri Feb  2 19:07:37 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Fri Feb  2 19:07:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] testing new relay server..delete
Message-ID: <3A7B458B.4020701@starkmedia.com>

sgd uses frontpage!!




From mccreath at ak.net  Sat Feb  3 15:07:37 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Sat Feb  3 15:07:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEIEDACGAA.mccreath@ak.net>

Dan --

I've finished a bunch of the layout for leo. Everything is pretty much done
EXCEPT for the tip harvester display page. I've got it set up three ways:
<textarea>, <pre>, and <p>. <pre> and <p> are murder on the tables, so I
think the <textarea> is prolly the way to go, but I think we should also put
some sort of explanation about why all the tips are in <textarea>s on the
tip harvester index page. Do we have a concise explanation of that already
written up? It seems like it was addressed recently, but I can't find it
anywhere.

http://home.gci.net/~mccreath/evolt/leo/

Go to the tip harvester and you'll see links to the three different display
pages.

Here's the CSS file that you proposed as the final and that aardvark and I
agreed to.

http://home.gci.net/~mccreath/evolt/leo/isaaclists.css

Oh yeah -- can we wrap this around the thelist archive page? Or is that just
a tremendous pain in the butt?

Lemme know if there's anything else you need.

David




From djc at starkmedia.com  Sat Feb  3 15:20:37 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Sat Feb  3 15:20:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
References: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEIEDACGAA.mccreath@ak.net>
Message-ID: <3A7C761A.1020701@starkmedia.com>

you rule :)

i'll be on this right now..

mccreath wrote:

> Dan --
> 
> 
> 
> I've finished a bunch of the layout for leo. Everything is pretty much done
> 
> EXCEPT for the tip harvester display page. I've got it set up three ways:
> 
> <textarea>, <pre>, and <p>. <pre> and <p> are murder on the tables, so I
> 
> think the <textarea> is prolly the way to go, but I think we should also put
> 
> some sort of explanation about why all the tips are in <textarea>s on the
> 
> tip harvester index page. Do we have a concise explanation of that already
> 
> written up? It seems like it was addressed recently, but I can't find it
> 
> anywhere.
> 
> 
> 
> http://home.gci.net/~mccreath/evolt/leo/
> 
> 
> 
> Go to the tip harvester and you'll see links to the three different display
> 
> pages.
> 
> 
> 
> Here's the CSS file that you proposed as the final and that aardvark and I
> 
> agreed to.
> 
> 
> 
> http://home.gci.net/~mccreath/evolt/leo/isaaclists.css
> 
> 
> 
> Oh yeah -- can we wrap this around the thelist archive page? Or is that just
> 
> a tremendous pain in the butt?
> 
> 
> 
> Lemme know if there's anything else you need.
> 




From r937 at interlog.com  Sat Feb  3 15:21:37 2001
From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy)
Date: Sat Feb  3 15:21:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
Message-ID: <01c08e27$2aa1f620$024d149a@rudy>

> EXCEPT for the tip harvester display page.
> I've got it set up three ways:
><textarea>, <pre>, and <p>.

<pre>

the other two are fatally non-usable, er, un-usable, er, contrary to the
principles of usability


nothing to see here, folks, move along, move along...




From mccreath at ak.net  Sat Feb  3 15:31:37 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Sat Feb  3 15:31:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
In-Reply-To: <01c08e27$2aa1f620$024d149a@rudy>
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEMEDBCGAA.mccreath@ak.net>

Okay. I haven't made it out the door yet.

> > EXCEPT for the tip harvester display page.
> > I've got it set up three ways:
> ><textarea>, <pre>, and <p>.
>
> <pre>
>
> the other two are fatally non-usable, er, un-usable, er, contrary to the
> principles of usability

But we're using it on weo. I agree that it's not ideal, but the <pre> tags
just mess up the tables too much. The other option would be a layout for the
<tip>s display that didn't use the sidebar, but changing (removing) the
sidebar like that could also be construed as contrary to the principles of
usability (and it wouldn't help 100%, either).

?




From r937 at interlog.com  Sat Feb  3 15:45:37 2001
From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy)
Date: Sat Feb  3 15:45:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
Message-ID: <01c08e2a$79d5cfc0$024d149a@rudy>

> the <pre> tags just mess up the tables too much.

but the <textarea> and <p> versions mangle the code

a lot o' them tips have code in them (think about it)

those line breaks are super important

i'm one of the most vocal anti-horizontal-scroll fanatics, but i'd rather
keep the code intact than flowed

maybe insert some line breaks strategically?   or would that require too
much work?   could it even be done programmatically?   any regexp gurus
around?  stick in a line break every 45 characters unless you encounter one
sooner?






From djc at starkmedia.com  Sat Feb  3 16:25:39 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Sat Feb  3 16:25:39 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
References: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEIEDACGAA.mccreath@ak.net>
Message-ID: <3A7C8566.7000206@starkmedia.com>

ok, its all mostly up and mostly working.. i'll finish up later tonite 
with this.

things that are fucked: most of the harvester is displaying fucked 
uplike cus i haven't removed the hardcoded styles from them yet

things that are wack: the subscribe page is a mess code wise, which is 
my fault.. some of the tables go wacky after subscribing.. totally 
rewriting this shit tonite.

other than that, everything looks good.. thanks again david, all your 
work made it a lot easier for me :)

.djc.

mccreath wrote:

> Dan --
> 
> 
> 
> I've finished a bunch of the layout for leo. Everything is pretty much done
> 
> EXCEPT for the tip harvester display page. I've got it set up three ways:




From oliver at lineham.co.nz  Sat Feb  3 20:14:37 2001
From: oliver at lineham.co.nz (Oliver Lineham)
Date: Sat Feb  3 20:14:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] Re: [thelist] Search engines and dynamic sites using query
 strings
In-Reply-To: <3A798438.9070701@starkmedia.com>
References: <200102011651.f11GpYn01437@farmer.oracular.com>
Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.20010204150029.01959e90@mail.paradise.net.nz>

At 09:43 1/02/2001 -0600, you wrote:

[404 header from evolt]
>but for browsers other than wack combos of IE and windows, it isn't a problem.

if evolt.org is sending 404 headers, that causes big problems for search 
engine indexing.  search engines generally refuse to index pages that give 
404 headers - they delete the URL from the index, in fact.

we've been running the new site long enough that altavista *should* by now 
be indexing articles with the new URLs.


<wrap>
http://www.altavista.com/cgi-bin/query?q=%2Bhost%3Aevolt.org+-host%3Alists&k 
l=XX&pg=q&Translate=on
</wrap>

list shows all AV indexed pages on evolt.org (not counting 
lists.evolt.org). it totals 8 pages, none of which have the new URL scheme.


i also can't find any new-URL pages indexed by www.google.com:
<wrap>
http://www.google.com/search?q=evolt+site%3Aevolt.org+-site%3Alists.evolt.or 
g&hl=en&lr=&safe=off
</wrap>

lists 46 pages, none of which are the new-URL scheme. notice that almost 
all of them show the page title as "Update your bookmarks! - evolt.org" yet 
the new pages aren't indexed. so the crawler has been here at least.


returning a 404 header completely negates the SE benefits of a 
query-string-less URL scheme.

:(

</ol>

____________________________________________________
  phone +64 21 210-7845       http://www.vibe.co.nz/
  po box 10-492              wellington, new zealand



From roselli at earthlink.net  Sat Feb  3 21:01:37 2001
From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark)
Date: Sat Feb  3 21:01:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
In-Reply-To: <01c08e2a$79d5cfc0$024d149a@rudy>
Message-ID: <3A7C7F11.7849.212675C5@localhost>

> From: "rudy" <r937 at interlog.com>
[...] 
> maybe insert some line breaks strategically?   or would that require too
> much work?   could it even be done programmatically?   any regexp gurus
> around?  stick in a line break every 45 characters unless you encounter one
> sooner?

how about use a <p>, and replace all line feed / carriage returns 
with a <br>?  yeah, it can make things format oddly on smaller 
displays, but it might be the most generic approach we can find... 
larger displays will just see short lines, around 60-80 chars...




From martin at members.evolt.org  Sun Feb  4 09:02:37 2001
From: martin at members.evolt.org (martin burns)
Date: Sun Feb  4 09:02:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
In-Reply-To: <01c08e2a$79d5cfc0$024d149a@rudy>
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.0.20010204145921.02bb2380@members.evolt.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

At 21:44 03/02/01, rudy wrote:
>i'm one of the most vocal anti-horizontal-scroll fanatics, but i'd rather
>keep the code intact than flowed

Besides, won't the lines be a maximum 80 chars anyway?

Do you think it's worth dropping the font size?

Cheers
Martin


________________
Martin Burns, Content Management Consultant
tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985
http://www.evolt.org/user/MartinB/32/evolt.org
http://www.easyweb.co.uk/
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From sgd at ti3.com  Sun Feb  4 10:56:37 2001
From: sgd at ti3.com (Scott Dexter)
Date: Sun Feb  4 10:56:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] testing new relay server..delete
Message-ID: <8C8B8745C0FE7A43BFA6CABAB321117223FC8C@gate.ti3.com>

Dan uses Motif!

sgd
--
work: http://www.ti3.com/
non: http://thinksafely.org/

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Daniel J. Cody [mailto:djc at starkmedia.com]
> sgd uses frontpage!!



From martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com  Mon Feb  5 06:52:37 2001
From: martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com (martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com)
Date: Mon Feb  5 06:52:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo mail delivery disable not working
Message-ID: <802569EA.0045DCCD.00@uk-emamta003.ema.pwcinternal.com>


Memo from Martin P Burns of PricewaterhouseCoopers

-------------------- Start of message text --------------------

Goes to:
http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/index.cfm?action=jackson

which gives a 404

Cheers
Martin


--------------------- End of message text --------------------

The principal place of business of PricewaterhouseCoopers and its associate
partnerships is 1 Embankment Place, London WC2N 6NN where lists of the
partners' names are available for inspection. All partners in the associate
partnerships are authorised to conduct business as agents of, and all
contracts for services to clients are with, PricewaterhouseCoopers. The UK
firm of PricewaterhouseCoopers is authorised by the Institute of Chartered
Accountants in England and Wales to carry on investment business.
PricewaterhouseCoopers is a member of the world-wide
PricewaterhouseCoopers organisation.
----------------------------------------------------------------
The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which
it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material.  Any
review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action
in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the
intended recipient is prohibited.   If you received this in error, please
contact the sender and delete the material from any computer.





From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb  5 09:48:39 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb  5 09:48:39 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo mail delivery disable not working
References: <802569EA.0045DCCD.00@uk-emamta003.ema.pwcinternal.com>
Message-ID: <3A7ECAAF.4080507@starkmedia.com>

fixed..

martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com wrote:

> 
> Memo from Martin P Burns of PricewaterhouseCoopers
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------- Start of message text --------------------
> 
> 
> 
> Goes to:
> 
> http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/index.cfm?action=jackson
> 
> 
> 
> which gives a 404






From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb  5 10:11:37 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb  5 10:11:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] l.e.o fixing..
Message-ID: <3A7ED0B2.7070800@starkmedia.com>

ok, the tip harvester pages should be formatting correctly now.. 
currently, they're being wrapped in one big ass <pre> tag.. if you guys 
think another way might be better, lemme know..

fixing the tables on the list subscription pages now, then everything on 
the new l.e.o should be good to go.. unless i'm missing something.

lemme know :)

.djc.




From r937 at interlog.com  Mon Feb  5 10:51:40 2001
From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy)
Date: Mon Feb  5 10:51:40 2001
Subject: [thesite] Re: [Admin] l.e.o fixing..
Message-ID: <01c08f93$8c301620$774d149a@rudy>

>the new l.e.o should be good to go.. unless i'm missing something.

the "go" button on the archive search is outside the form tags,
consequently nothing happens when you click on it

(pressing enter actually submits the form, heh heh, and you are taken to
the old-style search.cfm results page)

rudy




From seth at sethbienek.com  Mon Feb  5 10:58:39 2001
From: seth at sethbienek.com (Seth Bienek)
Date: Mon Feb  5 10:58:39 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
In-Reply-To: <3A7C8566.7000206@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDIAEJLDEAA.seth@sethbienek.com>

Why not do a find-and-replace function on the server side?  I know it's an
extra step, but it would solve all of the other problems with displaying and
stuff...

<cfset thistip = #replacelist(queryname.foo, ">,<,""", "&gt;,&lt;,&quot;")#>

Just a suggesiton..

Seth

------------------------------
Seth Bienek
Solutions Development Manager
Stonebridge Technologies, Inc.
972.455.7294 tel
972.404.9754 fax
ICQ #7673959
------------------------------

> -----Original Message-----
> From: thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org
> [mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of Daniel J. Cody
> Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2001 4:26 PM
> To: thesite at lists.evolt.org; admin at lists.evolt.org
> Subject: Re: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
>
>
> ok, its all mostly up and mostly working.. i'll finish up later tonite
> with this.
>
> things that are fucked: most of the harvester is displaying fucked
> uplike cus i haven't removed the hardcoded styles from them yet
>
> things that are wack: the subscribe page is a mess code wise, which is
> my fault.. some of the tables go wacky after subscribing.. totally
> rewriting this shit tonite.
>
> other than that, everything looks good.. thanks again david, all your
> work made it a lot easier for me :)
>
> .djc.
>
> mccreath wrote:
>
> > Dan --
> >
> >
> >
> > I've finished a bunch of the layout for leo. Everything is
> pretty much done
> >
> > EXCEPT for the tip harvester display page. I've got it set up
> three ways:
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
> and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/
>





From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb  5 11:12:37 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb  5 11:12:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
References: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDIAEJLDEAA.seth@sethbienek.com>
Message-ID: <3A7EDEF7.5080100@starkmedia.com>

it wasn't the <tip> tags that i needed to replace, it was the <html> 
<body> <font> etc kinda tags that were built on the fly by a perl script..

thanks for the suggestino though :)

.djc.

Seth Bienek wrote:

> Why not do a find-and-replace function on the server side?  I know it's an
> 
> extra step, but it would solve all of the other problems with displaying and
> 
> stuff...
> 
> 
> 
> <cfset thistip = #replacelist(queryname.foo, ">,<,""", "&gt;,&lt;,&quot;")#>
> 
> Just a suggesiton..




From seth at sethbienek.com  Mon Feb  5 11:16:37 2001
From: seth at sethbienek.com (Seth Bienek)
Date: Mon Feb  5 11:16:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
In-Reply-To: <3A7EDEF7.5080100@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDIEEJMDEAA.seth@sethbienek.com>

Eh.. That's what I get for letting my attention wander.. Sorry.

We can parse those other things out just as well though..  Wanna ship me the
source file, or is it pulled from a database?

Seth

------------------------------
Seth Bienek
Solutions Development Manager
Stonebridge Technologies, Inc.
972.455.7294 tel
972.404.9754 fax
ICQ #7673959
------------------------------

> -----Original Message-----
> From: thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org
> [mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of Daniel J. Cody
> Sent: Monday, February 05, 2001 11:12 AM
> To: thesite at lists.evolt.org
> Subject: Re: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
>
>
> it wasn't the <tip> tags that i needed to replace, it was the <html>
> <body> <font> etc kinda tags that were built on the fly by a perl script..
>
> thanks for the suggestino though :)
>
> .djc.
>
> Seth Bienek wrote:
>
> > Why not do a find-and-replace function on the server side?  I
> know it's an
> >
> > extra step, but it would solve all of the other problems with
> displaying and
> >
> > stuff...
> >
> >
> >
> > <cfset thistip = #replacelist(queryname.foo, ">,<,""",
> "&gt;,&lt;,&quot;")#>
> >
> > Just a suggesiton..
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
> and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/
>





From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb  5 11:54:37 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb  5 11:54:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] Re: [Admin] l.e.o fixing..
References: <01c08f93$8c301620$774d149a@rudy>
Message-ID: <3A7EE8DD.8060907@starkmedia.com>

oops.. totally forgot about the search engine template :)

both the go button and the results template should be fixed..

thanks rude :)

.djc.

rudy wrote:

>> the new l.e.o should be good to go.. unless i'm missing something.
> 
> 
> 
> the "go" button on the archive search is outside the form tags,
> 
> consequently nothing happens when you click on it
> 
> 
> 
> (pressing enter actually submits the form, heh heh, and you are taken to
> 
> the old-style search.cfm results page)




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb  5 22:19:37 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb  5 22:19:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] dave, questino?
Message-ID: <3A7F990E.9040709@starkmedia.com>

hey dave, if you get a sec..

http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/show/c/Week-of-Mon-200006121.html


check out the background there.. whats up with that?

also, do you want me to change anything on the search results page?

not to rush, just getting it out there :)

.djc.




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb  5 22:23:43 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb  5 22:23:43 2001
Subject: [thesite] evolt's 404 problem.
Message-ID: <3A7F99E8.2030809@starkmedia.com>

(sending this to thelist cus I know there are some people there that 
this affects)
jeff and i talked on the phone tonite for about a half hour to try to 
sort out what we're going to do to fix our 404 dilema on the evolt.org site

jeff is going to talk to some people at allaire this week and try to see 
if there's anything he can give them in the way of sexual favors so that 
we can get some source for the linux port of CF so that i can hack the 
CF source and have *it* - not apache - (sorry thesite, you guys missed 
some private discussion about things we tried..ask if you want) rewrite 
the 404 error code..

in the meantime, i'm going to start rewriting the current site back to a 
classic fusebox architecture.. inronically, we had this done after the 
first codefest last fall.. no prob though.. i've got karma and liquor to 
burn..

i'm going to be rewriting thesite on the new server i got last week - 
its currently housing browsers.evolt.org. this will become the new 
test.evolt.org and possibly the new live site..

other than that, not much to say.. hopefully we can get this resolved - 
in one way or another - ASAP so we don't have to deal with the problems 
we're having now with people not being able to view our site because of 
the URL scheme we put in place.. ya live ya learn.

if anyone has extensive experience with apache and header rewriting, 
feel free to contact me off list if you want to help :)

thanks for the patience, we're trying new things and finding out some of 
those things don't always work 100%

.djc.

np: The http1.1 RFC blues




From mccreath at ak.net  Mon Feb  5 23:03:37 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Mon Feb  5 23:03:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] dave, questino?
In-Reply-To: <3A7F990E.9040709@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEKEGHCGAA.mccreath@ak.net>

> hey dave, if you get a sec..
>
> http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/show/c/Week-of-Mon-20
> 0006121.html
>
> check out the background there.. whats up with that?

I don't see anything untoward on W2K/NN/IE. Whassup?

> also, do you want me to change anything on the search results page?

This is what the search results page says:

"Your search for "linux"
returned 11 matches out of 160786 documents:"

But I've got pages and pages and pages of results. ? Is that 11 supposed to
be the total number of hits? Or the number on each page? Me confoozed.

And is it possible to do more complete paging for the results? I don't know
nuttin about verity or whatever it is you're using to generate the results,
but at least a "back" button to go with the "more"...

Um...how about giving all the rows in the results a valign="top" attribute?

Colors...colors... I like the alternating row colors, but the red is too
dark. I'd do it with either the two grays or with white and the lighter
gray. The white/gray gets my vote.

white/gray:

http://home.gci.net/~mccreath/evolt/leo/danresults.html

gray/gray:

http://home.gci.net/~mccreath/evolt/leo/danresults2.html



Oh, yah...when I was talking about the leo architecture earlier, I was using
the wrong word. I meant the structure that a user sees and how some of the
pages are organized. It's nothing that can't wait, and I don't have anything
concrete written down. Just some impressions, like putting the three forms
that are on the subscribe page on three different pages. It's a little
confusing that there are three different places to put in your email
address... Just shit like that. Ain't nothin to worry about right now.

David




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb  5 23:58:37 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb  5 23:58:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] dave, questino?
References: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEKEGHCGAA.mccreath@ak.net>
Message-ID: <3A7FB04E.8070301@starkmedia.com>

mccreath wrote:


>> http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/show/c/Week-of-Mon-20
> 
>> 0006121.html
>> check out the background there.. whats up with that?
> I don't see anything untoward on W2K/NN/IE. Whassup?

erm. either i've popped to many tabs or the background of the main table 
on that page is looking like the green of the w.e.o site.. maybe its 
just me though.. ;)


> "Your search for "linux"
> returned 11 matches out of 160786 documents:"
> But I've got pages and pages and pages of results. ? Is that 11 supposed to
> be the total number of hits? Or the number on each page? Me confoozed.

well dave, if you have matches but you've got pages and pages of 
results, maybe you should try Evolflex; a presciption medicine thats 
recommend for "Active" adults as part of a comprehensive treatment for 
chronic "One of these things is not like the other.." syndrom. Evolflex 
may have certain side-affects which may include, but are not limited to; 
forgetfullness, loss of appetite, confusing matches and pages, herpes, 
headache, and/or confusion regarding search engine result syntax(SERS). 
SERS affects millions of Americans a year... Please talk to your doctor 
about if taking Evolflex is right for you. 'EvolFlex, this thing is not 
like the others...'

err... heh :) pass the bong.

> Um...how about giving all the rows in the results a valign="top" attribute?

> http://home.gci.net/~mccreath/evolt/leo/danresults.html
> http://home.gci.net/~mccreath/evolt/leo/danresults2.html

cool

.djc.
the 9th out of 10th doctor




From mccreath at ak.net  Tue Feb  6 00:12:37 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Tue Feb  6 00:12:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] dave, questino?
In-Reply-To: <3A7FB04E.8070301@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEKEGICGAA.mccreath@ak.net>

> erm. either i've popped to many tabs or the background of the main table
> on that page is looking like the green of the w.e.o site.. maybe its
> just me though.. ;)

Craziness. I'm not seeing it. Did you use my style sheet (isaaclists.css) or
did you copy the values into yours? That's weird.

> well dave, if you have matches but you've got pages and pages of
> results, maybe you should try Evolflex; a presciption medicine thats

[...craaaaazy drug/booze talk snipped...]

> about if taking Evolflex is right for you. 'EvolFlex, this thing is not
> like the others...'

aroo? "Now with more Confusion(TM)!"

> err... heh :) pass the bong. Box some of that shit and send it up here,
you fiend.

Indeed. Dude.

> .djc.
> the 9th out of 10th doctor

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I wanna know where the 11th doctor is, dammit. Or the
hundredth webmonkey. Or sumpin.




From djc at starkmedia.com  Tue Feb  6 08:41:37 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Tue Feb  6 08:41:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] dave, questino?
References: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEKEGICGAA.mccreath@ak.net>
Message-ID: <3A800CE9.5010701@starkmedia.com>

mccreath wrote:


> did you copy the values into yours? That's weird.

i copied the .css file that you had on your site actually.. on this 
monitor it doesnt look as green.. *shrug* :)

>> about if taking Evolflex is right for you. 'EvolFlex, this thing is not
> 
>> like the others...'
> aroo? "Now with more Confusion(TM)!"

hehe..

gracias..

.djc.




From djc at starkmedia.com  Tue Feb  6 08:43:37 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Tue Feb  6 08:43:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] leo stuff -- code display
References: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDIEEJMDEAA.seth@sethbienek.com>
Message-ID: <3A800D6F.7010307@starkmedia.com>

heya..

actually the tips we have up there now are static text files that i'm 
including in the page.. they were made from dean's perl tip harvester.. 
couldn't the thing you wrote a while back just skim over those text 
files and grep out the tips and throw them in the db?

if you wanna see the source files, check the l.e.o server.. the username 
and passwd are still the same- email me offlist ifyou forgot the them :)

thnx.

.djc.

Seth Bienek wrote:

> Eh.. That's what I get for letting my attention wander.. Sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> We can parse those other things out just as well though..  Wanna ship me the
> 
> source file, or is it pulled from a database?




From sgd at ti3.com  Tue Feb  6 10:22:39 2001
From: sgd at ti3.com (Scott Dexter)
Date: Tue Feb  6 10:22:39 2001
Subject: [thesite] dave, questino?
Message-ID: <8C8B8745C0FE7A43BFA6CABAB321117223FCBB@gate.ti3.com>

> > the 9th out of 10th doctor
> 
> Yeah, yeah, yeah. I wanna know where the 11th doctor is, 
> dammit. Or the
> hundredth webmonkey. Or sumpin.
> 

one doctor out of five thinks the others are fucking nuts
sgd



From djc at starkmedia.com  Tue Feb  6 11:00:37 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Tue Feb  6 11:00:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] dave, questino?
References: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEKEGHCGAA.mccreath@ak.net>
Message-ID: <3A802D6D.1030705@starkmedia.com>

mccreath wrote:


> But I've got pages and pages and pages of results. ? Is that 11 supposed to
> be the total number of hits? Or the number on each page? Me confoozed.

should be fixed now..

 
> And is it possible to do more complete paging for the results? I don't know
> 
> nuttin about verity or whatever it is you're using to generate the results,
> 
> but at least a "back" button to go with the "more"...

see what i can do..

> Um...how about giving all the rows in the results a valign="top" attribute?
> http://home.gci.net/~mccreath/evolt/leo/danresults.html

should be good to go.

> Oh, yah...when I was talking about the leo architecture earlier, I was using
> the wrong word. I meant the structure that a user sees and how some of the

i hear what you're saying about redoing some of the forms.. take a look 
at the index.cfm in thelist/ directory sometime ;)

.djc.




From bheerssen at visualbridge.tv  Thu Feb  8 12:58:31 2001
From: bheerssen at visualbridge.tv (Bruce Heerssen)
Date: Thu Feb  8 12:58:31 2001
Subject: [thesite] problem w/ tip harvester
Message-ID: <NEBBIMBEPMEGCEIMGFLDAEJDCFAA.bheerssen@visualbridge.tv>

something is up here guys, text is the same color as the background
winnt/ie5.5

http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/show/c/Week-of-Mon-20000320.html

just letting you know

Bruce




From bheerssen at visualbridge.tv  Thu Feb  8 13:21:40 2001
From: bheerssen at visualbridge.tv (Bruce Heerssen)
Date: Thu Feb  8 13:21:40 2001
Subject: [thesite] problem w/ tip harvester
In-Reply-To: <NEBBIMBEPMEGCEIMGFLDAEJDCFAA.bheerssen@visualbridge.tv>
Message-ID: <NEBBIMBEPMEGCEIMGFLDAEJECFAA.bheerssen@visualbridge.tv>

oops sorry for the duplicate post, i just read the "dave, questino" thread.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org
> [mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of Bruce Heerssen
> Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2001 11:36 AM
> To: thesite at lists.evolt.org
> Subject: [thesite] problem w/ tip harvester
> 
> 
> something is up here guys, text is the same color as the background
> winnt/ie5.5
> 
> http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/show/c/Week-of-Mon-20000320.html
> 
> just letting you know
> 
> Bruce
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
> and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/



From djc at starkmedia.com  Thu Feb  8 13:41:37 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Thu Feb  8 13:41:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] problem w/ tip harvester
References: <NEBBIMBEPMEGCEIMGFLDAEJDCFAA.bheerssen@visualbridge.tv>
Message-ID: <3A82E1A9.3010909@starkmedia.com>

fixed.. Thanks bruce, lemme know if you see any more problems :)

.djc.

Bruce Heerssen wrote:

> something is up here guys, text is the same color as the background
> 
> winnt/ie5.5
> 
> 
> 
> http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/show/c/Week-of-Mon-20000320.html
> 
> 
> 
> just letting you know




From djc at starkmedia.com  Fri Feb  9 16:48:09 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Fri Feb  9 16:48:09 2001
Subject: [thesite] testing new server..
Message-ID: <3A8473AA.9030706@starkmedia.com>

lets see how it handles larger load..




From martin at easyweb.co.uk  Sun Feb 11 16:33:29 2001
From: martin at easyweb.co.uk (Martin Burns)
Date: Sun Feb 11 16:33:29 2001
Subject: [thesite] Re: [Admin] If you have a members.evolt.org account..
In-Reply-To: <3A845546.9000709@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.0.20010211223015.02b96bf0@pop.easyweb.co.uk>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

At 20:38 09/02/01, Daniel J. Cody wrote:
>Please don't update it for the next couple hours(till about 5pm CST). I'm 
>transferring data to a newer, faster machine

So will this mean that members.evolt.org addresses will
*really* be such, and not resolved by some systems
as lists.evolt.org (makes it a bugger to unsub from some
mailing lists...)


>When the move is done I'm going to open up the machine again for evolt 
>members for 10Mb of space.. Its going to have PHP4, CF4.5, and perhaps 
>chilisoft ASP if anyone wants it.. I'm also going to have an Oracle8/9i 
>and PostgreSQL database for people to use on this too.. Should be pretty 
>cool, and hopefully some of you folks are interested in taking advantage 
>of it..


woohoo!

Cheers
Martin


________________
Martin Burns, Content Management Consultant
tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985
http://www.evolt.org/user/MartinB/32/evolt.org
http://www.easyweb.co.uk/
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From india_design at yahoo.com  Mon Feb 12 17:41:45 2001
From: india_design at yahoo.com (Ashish)
Date: Mon Feb 12 17:41:45 2001
Subject: [thesite] Bug Report : User Info Page
Message-ID: <000e01c0954d$58c7e690$3c0a0a0a@MKTG1>

Got 2 errors on the site :

1. In the user info page, where informarion regarding name, email, password,
etc is displayed, there is a link beneath like so :

Change your subscription options to thelist

When I click on this link, I get an error like so :

--start of error 1

Error in Program Execution

Error Information

Date: Mon Feb 12 17:35:08 2001
The file that has the error: /home/evolt/leo_html/thelist/index.cfm
The query string:
The IP of the user with the error: 63.207.108.34
The user's browser: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.5; Windows NT 5.0; COM+
1.0.2204)
The referring Script: http://www.evolt.org/user/index.html?action=edit
The information on the error:

An error occurred while evaluating the expression:

 url.action is 'jackson'


Error near line 188, column 22.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----

Error resolving parameter URL.ACTION

The specified URL parameter cannot be found. This problem is very likely due
to the fact that you have misspelled the parameter name.

The error occurred while processing an element with a general identifier of
(CFELSEIF), occupying document position (188:2) to (188:35).

Send this error report to dcody at oracular.com

--End of error 1

2. On the page    http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thesite ,
when I click on the   "visit the thesite Archives" link, get a 404 error.
Maybe some problem with the 404 error handler ?

Am on Windows 2000 Professional, and browser info is already displayed in
error 1.



Regards,
Ashish


_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 12 17:50:15 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 12 17:50:15 2001
Subject: [thesite] Bug Report : User Info Page
References: <000e01c0954d$58c7e690$3c0a0a0a@MKTG1>
Message-ID: <3A8876B7.4070701@starkmedia.com>

fixed.. thanks for the heads up :)

Ashish wrote:

> Got 2 errors on the site :
> 
> 
> 
> 1. In the user info page, where informarion regarding name, email, password,
> 
> etc is displayed, there is a link beneath like so :
> 
> 
> 
> Change your subscription options to thelist
> 
> 
> 
> When I click on this link, I get an error like so :
> 
> 
> 
> --start of error 1
> 
> 
> 
> Error in Program Execution
> 
> 
> 
> Error Information
> 
> 
> 
> Date: Mon Feb 12 17:35:08 2001
> 
> The file that has the error: /home/evolt/leo_html/thelist/index.cfm
> 
> The query string:
> 
> The IP of the user with the error: 63.207.108.34
> 
> The user's browser: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.5; Windows NT 5.0; COM+
> 
> 1.0.2204)
> 
> The referring Script: http://www.evolt.org/user/index.html?action=edit
> 
> The information on the error:
> 
> 
> 
> An error occurred while evaluating the expression:
> 
> 
> 
>  url.action is 'jackson'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Error near line 188, column 22.
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> ----
> 
> 
> 
> Error resolving parameter URL.ACTION
> 
> 
> 
> The specified URL parameter cannot be found. This problem is very likely due
> 
> to the fact that you have misspelled the parameter name.
> 
> 
> 
> The error occurred while processing an element with a general identifier of
> 
> (CFELSEIF), occupying document position (188:2) to (188:35).
> 
> 
> 
> Send this error report to dcody at oracular.com
> 
> 
> 
> --End of error 1
> 
> 
> 
> 2. On the page    http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thesite ,
> 
> when I click on the   "visit the thesite Archives" link, get a 404 error.
> 
> Maybe some problem with the 404 error handler ?




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 12 20:20:15 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 12 20:20:15 2001
Subject: [thesite] need a hand..
Message-ID: <3A8899E1.1040208@starkmedia.com>

Can someone check out

http://members.evolt.org

give it a whirl, try to sign up for an account(i wont be adding whatever 
you guys test out..)

basically, is that cool? anything else i should add?

thanks

:)




From roselli at earthlink.net  Mon Feb 12 20:30:15 2001
From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark)
Date: Mon Feb 12 20:30:15 2001
Subject: [thesite] need a hand..
In-Reply-To: <3A8899E1.1040208@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <3A8855BB.27600.F8E9BE5@localhost>

i suspect you know the 'terms of service' is 404...

hey, you got <label>s on everything... coolio...

ok, the error page for when i leave stuff out sucks... redraw the 
page?  highlight fields that are missing info? use an inline style... 
or something...

there are a couple lines at the bottom of the page... about 10px 
below the left edge of the 'Register Me' button is a ~5px x 1px 
black line... down and to the left is another... IE5/win98...

does this tie in with the member db at all?

am i really waiting for a db?

> From: "Daniel J. Cody" <djc at starkmedia.com>
[...] 
> http://members.evolt.org
> 
> give it a whirl, try to sign up for an account(i wont be adding whatever 
> you guys test out..)
> 
> basically, is that cool? anything else i should add?



From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 12 20:35:30 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 12 20:35:30 2001
Subject: [thesite] need a hand..
References: <3A8855BB.27600.F8E9BE5@localhost>
Message-ID: <3A889D72.1070300@starkmedia.com>

aardvark wrote:

> i suspect you know the 'terms of service' is 404...

http://members.evolt.org/tos.cfm is? I'm not seeing it.. anyone else? 
Where'd it 404 from? the link on the front page?


> hey, you got <label>s on everything... coolio...

thought you'd like that :)

its pretty much ripped from the user signup page on w.e.o

 
> ok, the error page for when i leave stuff out sucks... redraw the 
> page?  highlight fields that are missing info? use an inline style... 
> or something...

ya, i'll get to that.. icing on the cake though.


> there are a couple lines at the bottom of the page... about 10px 
> below the left edge of the 'Register Me' button is a ~5px x 1px 
> black line... down and to the left is another... IE5/win98...

noticed those too.. thought it was mozilla.. any idea what it is?

> does this tie in with the member db at all?
 
manually for now.. when a person signs up, i check to see if they have a user account on evolt
.. hopefully more than a couple days old. if they do, i add them to the
user table and to the linux box itself..

when i can get some more time to work on it, it will all be automated 
hopefully

 
 
> am i really waiting for a db?

? Oracle? I'm haggling with a PR guy at oracle to send me one of their 
applicances for evolt.. being a non-profit has its fucking benefits :)

.djc.




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 12 20:38:15 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 12 20:38:15 2001
Subject: [thesite] Re: [Admin] need a hand..
References: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F0160248D@EXPO1>
Message-ID: <3A889E16.7060401@starkmedia.com>

ok. change the link.. i'll put a check on the signup page to only allow 
links from the TOS page to make sur they read.

McCreath_David wrote:


> The only thing I would say from a functional point of view is that they need
> 
> to at least click through the terms of service. You currently have a link to
> 
> the sign up form under "Anything Else", before "Great! What Else." Maybe
> 
> kill that link and give the last section a heading of "One Last Thing" or
> 
> sumpin?





From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 12 20:45:00 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 12 20:45:00 2001
Subject: [thesite] Re: need a hand..
References: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F0160248D@EXPO1> <3A889E16.7060401@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <3A889FA8.8050009@starkmedia.com>

done.

Daniel J. Cody wrote:

> ok. change the link.. i'll put a check on the signup page to only allow 
> links from the TOS page to make sur they read.




From roselli at earthlink.net  Mon Feb 12 20:48:33 2001
From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark)
Date: Mon Feb 12 20:48:33 2001
Subject: [thesite] need a hand..
In-Reply-To: <3A889D72.1070300@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <3A8859ED.22959.F9F0070@localhost>

> From: "Daniel J. Cody" <djc at starkmedia.com>
> 
> > i suspect you know the 'terms of service' is 404...
> 
> http://members.evolt.org/tos.cfm is? I'm not seeing it.. anyone else? 
> Where'd it 404 from? the link on the front page?

cheater... it works now... maybe it was some other error and not a 
404?  who knows...

> > hey, you got <label>s on everything... coolio...
> 
> thought you'd like that :)
> 
> its pretty much ripped from the user signup page on w.e.o

you da man...

> > ok, the error page for when i leave stuff out sucks... redraw the 
> > page?  highlight fields that are missing info? use an inline style... 
> > or something...
> 
> ya, i'll get to that.. icing on the cake though.

dig

> > there are a couple lines at the bottom of the page... about 10px 
> > below the left edge of the 'Register Me' button is a ~5px x 1px 
> > black line... down and to the left is another... IE5/win98...
> 
> noticed those too.. thought it was mozilla.. any idea what it is?

nup... perhaps the class 'blackSides' is somehow cascading?

> > does this tie in with the member db at all?
>  
> manually for now.. when a person signs up, i check to see if they have a user account on evolt
> .. hopefully more than a couple days old. if they do, i add them to the
> user table and to the linux box itself..
> 
> when i can get some more time to work on it, it will all be automated 
> hopefully

hmmm... being the resident paranoid, i think manual is better... 
hell, i think some other form of authentication is better, like a valid 
photo ID and an I-9 form... who knows what kinda weird-ass shit 
people are gonna post (or spam)... but that's just me...



From india_design at yahoo.com  Mon Feb 12 20:55:15 2001
From: india_design at yahoo.com (Ashish)
Date: Mon Feb 12 20:55:15 2001
Subject: [thesite] need a hand..
In-Reply-To: <3A8899E1.1040208@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <000c01c09568$861367d0$3c0a0a0a@MKTG1>

Hi Dan,
    It looks cool, but you could add some more validation on the server - my
email ID as foo at yah was taken in. That is not a valid email id, correct ?
   This is making me sound picky, even If I do not tick the Other box (below
Perl / Python), can enter input in the textbox below that.
   The user name field is the only one which has a 'maxlength' attribute,
none of the others have a maxlength attribute.
   A suggestion - you could color the 'error page' a bit (when form entries
have not been made completely).
Regards,
Ashish

-----Original Message-----
From: thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org
[mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of Daniel J. Cody
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2001 6:20 PM
To: admin at lists.evolt.org; thesite at lists.evolt.org
Subject: [thesite] need a hand..


Can someone check out

http://members.evolt.org

give it a whirl, try to sign up for an account(i wont be adding whatever
you guys test out..)

basically, is that cool? anything else i should add?

thanks

:)


_______________________________________________
http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/


_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 12 20:58:30 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 12 20:58:30 2001
Subject: [thesite] need a hand..
References: <000c01c09568$861367d0$3c0a0a0a@MKTG1>
Message-ID: <3A88A2D1.8060502@starkmedia.com>

Ashish wrote:

> Hi Dan,
> 
>     It looks cool, but you could add some more validation on the server - my
> email ID as foo at yah was taken in. That is not a valid email id, correct ?

is there javascript i can use to do this? jeff? what are we using now?

>    This is making me sound picky, even If I do not tick the Other box (below
> Perl / Python), can enter input in the textbox below that.

good call.. jeff?? heh.. javascript for this? anyone? only when the 
checkbox for 'other' is active can you input text into it.. anyone know 
how to do that client side?

>    The user name field is the only one which has a 'maxlength' attribute,
> none of the others have a maxlength attribute.

i saw your long ass email come in and just put maxlengths on everythign :)

>    A suggestion - you could color the 'error page' a bit (when form entries 
> have not been made completely).

yup, get to that.. but not a priority

thanks :)

.djc.




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 12 21:02:30 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 12 21:02:30 2001
Subject: [thesite] need a hand..
References: <3A8859ED.22959.F9F0070@localhost>
Message-ID: <3A88A3BC.4070603@starkmedia.com>

aardvark wrote:

>> are are a couple lines at the bottom of the page... about 10px 
>>> below the left edge of the 'Register Me' button is a ~5px x 1px 
>>> black line... down and to the left is another... IE5/win98...
>> noticed those too.. thought it was mozilla.. any idea what it is?
> 
> nup... perhaps the class 'blackSides' is somehow cascading?

ok.. david, its your stylesheet, whats up wit dat?!? :)

.djc.




From india_design at yahoo.com  Mon Feb 12 21:05:15 2001
From: india_design at yahoo.com (Ashish)
Date: Mon Feb 12 21:05:15 2001
Subject: [thesite] Re: [Admin] need a hand..
In-Reply-To: <3A889E16.7060401@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <000501c09569$cf2950f0$3c0a0a0a@MKTG1>

The generated page (source) does not have a closing </html> tag

-----Original Message-----
From: thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org
[mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of Daniel J. Cody
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2001 6:38 PM
To: admin at lists.evolt.org; thesite at lists.evolt.org
Subject: [thesite] Re: [Admin] need a hand..


ok. change the link.. i'll put a check on the signup page to only allow
links from the TOS page to make sur they read.

McCreath_David wrote:


> The only thing I would say from a functional point of view is that they
need
>
> to at least click through the terms of service. You currently have a link
to
>
> the sign up form under "Anything Else", before "Great! What Else." Maybe
>
> kill that link and give the last section a heading of "One Last Thing" or
>
> sumpin?



_______________________________________________
http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/


_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com




From r937 at interlog.com  Mon Feb 12 21:28:00 2001
From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy)
Date: Mon Feb 12 21:28:00 2001
Subject: [thesite] need a hand..
Message-ID: <01c0956c$d7668280$b450149a@rudy>

>  i think manual is better...

+1

it's the same as the deal with articles, we don't post those automatically
either

member accounts has potential for more embarrassment to evolt than a mere
article

rudy




From joshua at alphashop.net  Mon Feb 12 21:38:15 2001
From: joshua at alphashop.net (Joshua OIson)
Date: Mon Feb 12 21:38:15 2001
Subject: [thesite] need a hand..
References: <01c0956c$d7668280$b450149a@rudy>
Message-ID: <025a01c09588$8865aeb0$38360141@mrtnz1.ga.home.com>

You might add padding-top: 5 or 6px to labels or something to push the first
name, last name, text field labels down in line with the text boxes.

Also, If possible, you might try to totally get away from CF form
validation.  If you don't have it already, I can give you a tag called
cf_validate which *greatly* simplifies form validation in a totally generic
way.

-joshua




From mccreath at ak.net  Mon Feb 12 22:54:00 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Mon Feb 12 22:54:00 2001
Subject: [thesite] need a hand..
In-Reply-To: <3A88A3BC.4070603@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKECEDCCHAA.mccreath@ak.net>

> aardvark wrote:
> >
> > nup... perhaps the class 'blackSides' is somehow cascading?
>
> ok.. david, its your stylesheet, whats up wit dat?!? :)
>
> .djc.

Here's the offending code. At the bottom of the content table you have
(reformatted for ease of reading):

     <tr>
       <td colspan="3">

          <img src="images/space.gif" width="1" height="5" alt="" />
                           ^^^^^^^^^
       </td>
    </tr>
  </table>
  <!-- ## End Insert Content -->

The little black bar that we're seeing is the 1 x 5 pixel version of the
generic image icon, because it can't find the image "space.gif". It should
be "spacer.gif". Then all will be booty-full.

http://home.gci.net/~mccreath/evolt/members.html
(It uses a base href of http://members.evolt.org/)

<muttering type="crazybum">
Pff. My stylesheet, indeed. Hah! Pffffff! Ha!
</muttering>

 ;)

David, who can't wait to learn some CF.




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 12 23:33:15 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 12 23:33:15 2001
Subject: [thesite] need a hand..
References: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKECEDCCHAA.mccreath@ak.net>
Message-ID: <3A88E4E5.90305@starkmedia.com>

mccreath wrote:


> The little black bar that we're seeing is the 1 x 5 pixel version of the
> 
> generic image icon, because it can't find the image "space.gif". It should
> 
> be "spacer.gif". Then all will be booty-full.

coolio. fixed it right up :) thanks

> David, who can't wait to learn some CF.

heres a good chance :)

.djc.




From joshua at alphashop.net  Tue Feb 13 09:17:31 2001
From: joshua at alphashop.net (Joshua OIson)
Date: Tue Feb 13 09:17:31 2001
Subject: [thesite] members.evolt.org signup confirmation oddity
References: <3A88F33A.5020109@starkmedia.com> <017901c095b3$56b32700$e202730a@pc365>
Message-ID: <02bc01c095ea$3b4dbc50$38360141@mrtnz1.ga.home.com>

I see a strange "0 9" just after the confirmation text after I signup on
members.evolt.org between the comments such as so:

<!-- ## End Insert Content -->



0
9
<!-- ## End Insert Content -->

-joshua




From john at userfrenzy.com  Wed Feb 14 05:10:17 2001
From: john at userfrenzy.com (John Handelaar)
Date: Wed Feb 14 05:10:17 2001
Subject: [thesite] Thelist web signup form on l.e.o
In-Reply-To: <02bc01c095ea$3b4dbc50$38360141@mrtnz1.ga.home.com>
Message-ID: <EGEJLEDKICBEPECJIBNBGEMECMAA.john@userfrenzy.com>

I'm being informed from across the hallway that
it's doing nowt on Moz 0.7/Linux...

[clickety click]

Oh, the opening <form> tag is missing.

------------------------------------------
John Handelaar

T +44 20 7209 4117       M +44 7930 681789
F +44 870 169 7657   E john at userfrenzy.com
------------------------------------------

[btw - K3w1 account, Dan.  Thanks.  You do know that
all the mail says l.e.o in the headers, though?]



From djc at starkmedia.com  Wed Feb 14 08:46:47 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Wed Feb 14 08:46:47 2001
Subject: [thesite] Thelist web signup form on l.e.o
References: <EGEJLEDKICBEPECJIBNBGEMECMAA.john@userfrenzy.com>
Message-ID: <3A8A9A53.6060609@starkmedia.com>

doh. my fault. fixing now.. thanks for the heads up

John Handelaar wrote:

> I'm being informed from across the hallway that
> 
> it's doing nowt on Moz 0.7/Linux...
> 
> 
> 
> [clickety click]
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, the opening <form> tag is missing.




From djc at starkmedia.com  Wed Feb 14 09:39:17 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Wed Feb 14 09:39:17 2001
Subject: [thesite] members.evolt.org signup confirmation oddity
References: <3A88F33A.5020109@starkmedia.com> <017901c095b3$56b32700$e202730a@pc365> <02bc01c095ea$3b4dbc50$38360141@mrtnz1.ga.home.com>
Message-ID: <3A8AA6A6.5030202@starkmedia.com>

fixed..

Joshua OIson wrote:

> I see a strange "0 9" just after the confirmation text after I signup on
> 
> members.evolt.org between the comments such as so:
> 
> 
> 
> <!-- ## End Insert Content -->
> 
> 
> 
> 0
> 
> 9
> 
> <!-- ## End Insert Content -->
> 
> -joshua
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
> 
> and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
> 
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/




From martin at members.evolt.org  Wed Feb 14 17:12:29 2001
From: martin at members.evolt.org (martin burns)
Date: Wed Feb 14 17:12:29 2001
Subject: [thesite] need a hand..
In-Reply-To: <01c0956c$d7668280$b450149a@rudy>
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.0.20010214231258.02ba8d60@lists.evolt.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

At 03:27 13/02/01, rudy wrote:
>member accounts has potential for more embarrassment to evolt than a mere
>article

+1 - and their content. We will need heavy as hell disclaimers.

Cheers
Martin


________________
Martin Burns, Content Management Consultant
tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985
http://www.evolt.org/user/MartinB/32/evolt.org
http://www.easyweb.co.uk/
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From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 19 17:26:31 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 19 17:26:31 2001
Subject: [thesite] FYI
Message-ID: <3A91AB84.7040108@starkmedia.com>

Short downtime tonite:

http://www.evolt.org/article/headline/18/5893/index.html

.djc.




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 19 19:06:52 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 19 19:06:52 2001
Subject: [thesite] Re: [thelist] FYI
References: <3A91AB84.7040108@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <3A91B542.7070807@starkmedia.com>

Back up and good to go. Thanks for your patience everyone :)

.djc.

Daniel J. Cody wrote:

> Short downtime tonite:
> 
> http://www.evolt.org/article/headline/18/5893/index.html




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 19 20:03:23 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 19 20:03:23 2001
Subject: [thesite] new links?
Message-ID: <3A91C28E.7080200@starkmedia.com>

anyone have input where we should put links for the members.evolt.org 
site and the 'community' page(the one with all the graphisc and shit on it)?

i know we talked about the latter a while back, but the conversation 
migrated to something else..

thoughts?

.djc.




From djc at starkmedia.com  Tue Feb 20 10:26:26 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Tue Feb 20 10:26:26 2001
Subject: [thesite] new links?
References: <B6B76ECE.1BF5B%dave@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <3A928CD4.4050400@starkmedia.com>


dave mclean wrote:

> On 2/19/01 6:04 PM you wrote:
> 
> 
>> anyone have input where we should put links for the members.evolt.org
>> site and the 'community' page(the one with all the graphisc and shit on it)?

> Browsers | Lists | Tips | Members | FAQ | Submit | Contact

ok. what does everyone else say? I think we c/should wack the contact link there because 
its already an icon on the left side of the page.. same with FAQ probly too..

that would clear some room for more of the 'top level' evolt sites in the
upper right.. thoughts?

> Or something like that... but I think we wanted to make an FAQ category
> where the actual FAQ would be easy to update by any admin. Dynamic, not
> static...

true. we can still decide on its placement now though..

> Dan, do you have an agenda for Austin's formal meeting?  Can we sneak a
> peek?  Maybe outline some things that others think we should talk about?

ya, i'll let you all know this week sometime whats shakin

.djc.




From roselli at earthlink.net  Tue Feb 20 11:07:24 2001
From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark)
Date: Tue Feb 20 11:07:24 2001
Subject: [thesite] new links?
In-Reply-To: <3A928CD4.4050400@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <200102201707.f1KH7GY16817@leo.evolt.org>

> From: "Daniel J. Cody" <djc at starkmedia.com>
>
> > Browsers | Lists | Tips | Members | FAQ | Submit | Contact
> 
> ok. what does everyone else say? I think we c/should wack the contact link there because 
> its already an icon on the left side of the page.. same with FAQ probly too..

+1

> that would clear some room for more of the 'top level' evolt sites in the
> upper right.. thoughts?

although at some point we should discuss using the icon buttons 
vs. the text buttons that (i think) emily made up...




From isaac at members.evolt.org  Tue Feb 20 21:20:25 2001
From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac)
Date: Tue Feb 20 21:20:25 2001
Subject: [thesite] new links?
In-Reply-To: <200102201707.f1KH7GY16817@leo.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <NDBBIKHMNKANLGEBLMLBAEIMEHAA.isaac@members.evolt.org>

> although at some point we should discuss using the icon buttons
> vs. the text buttons that (i think) emily made up...

it was marlene, and i definitely vote for her text buttons over my stupid
icons.


i




From djc at starkmedia.com  Thu Feb 22 11:25:29 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Thu Feb 22 11:25:29 2001
Subject: [thesite] Re: [Admin] member account pages
References: <01c09c96$60c31900$2450149a@rudy>
Message-ID: <3A953DAF.2040102@starkmedia.com>

moving to thesite..

rudy wrote:

>> Anyway, my point is, can all three sections use the same
>> user information? Usability, ease of use, less confusion, etc.
> 
> 
> this ought to be mandatory
> 
> but perhaps it's hard to do with separate servers -- how would they
> communicate with each other? perhaps the cold fusion experts can comment on
> whether LDAP can do it (i'm way out on a limb as far as that stuff goes)

ldap would be *sweet* since anything and everything can authenticate against it, but 
it is difficult to set up and shit.. i'll look into how difficult

> one user table has to drive everything that the users can do, and be
> updated via user form input from any of the servers

agreed

> separate signups is a pain for users and an even worse nightmare for
> administrators

oh ya.

> as for what needs to be done, i have committed to write up how those tables
> work before the coding begins, and will include sample sql for the cold
> fusion coders if he or she or they wish

that would be nice :)

> if i recall correctly i did populate some of those tables at codefest 2
> with data i snagged from the "us" page, and i think pictures of dan and
> me... anyhow, the tables are ready for testing
> 
> member pages will be pretty simple really, any of you admin folks here
> could do it
> 
> the user style sheets might be a little trickier, because the info has to
> be formatted into valid css statements and (off the top of my head)
> maintained in a session variable


ya, lets  focus on the member info here and we'll hit the stylesheets later

.djc.




From john at userfrenzy.com  Fri Feb 23 12:32:46 2001
From: john at userfrenzy.com (John Handelaar)
Date: Fri Feb 23 12:32:46 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
Message-ID: <EGEJLEDKICBEPECJIBNBEEFNCNAA.john@userfrenzy.com>

Does w.e.o have a headline feed?

I'm opening newmediawhore.com at last and it'd be
nice to add a Slashbox.

[btw - Hi Martin, I saw the registration. Well
remembered...]

------------------------------------------
John Handelaar

T +44 20 7209 4117       M +44 7930 681789
F +44 870 169 7657   E john at userfrenzy.com
------------------------------------------



From djc at starkmedia.com  Fri Feb 23 15:14:46 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Fri Feb 23 15:14:46 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
References: <EGEJLEDKICBEPECJIBNBEEFNCNAA.john@userfrenzy.com>
Message-ID: <3A96C4E4.5090405@starkmedia.com>

errr.. at one time i made a feeble attempt to do something like that..
http://www.evolt.org/xml/xml_new.cfm

uses the old url scheme, but the query is solid..

is that kinda what you were thinking or something else?

John Handelaar wrote:

> Does w.e.o have a headline feed?
> 
> I'm opening newmediawhore.com at last and it'd be
> nice to add a Slashbox.
> 
> [btw - Hi Martin, I saw the registration. Well
> remembered...]





From jeff at members.evolt.org  Fri Feb 23 19:17:31 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Fri Feb 23 19:17:31 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <3A96C4E4.5090405@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELAEKBFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

djc & john,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: Daniel J. Cody
:
: errr.. at one time i made a feeble attempt
: to do something like that..
: http://www.evolt.org/xml/xml_new.cfm
:
: uses the old url scheme, but the query is
: solid..
:
: is that kinda what you were thinking or
: something else?
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

fwiw, i took the attempt you made djc and rewrote it to address the new url
scheme.  i also fit it into the site architecture where we can eventually
offer additional xml outputs for other things.  you can find that output
here:

http://www.evolt.org/xml/articles/index.html

enjoy,

.jeff




From dave at members.evolt.org  Fri Feb 23 22:11:01 2001
From: dave at members.evolt.org (dave mclean)
Date: Fri Feb 23 22:11:01 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELAEKBFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <B6BC74B8.1C1C8%dave@members.evolt.org>

On 2/23/01 5:20 PM you wrote:

>  i also fit it into the site architecture where we can eventually
> offer additional xml outputs for other things.  you can find that output
> here:
> 
> http://www.evolt.org/xml/articles/index.html

Cool Jeff, but what does it do? Gives a list of articles obviously, but they
aren't URIs.  Is there a way to generate the following easily:

---------------
evolt.org logo
Article 1 - Author - Date Posted
Article 1 Summary
URI to full article

Article 2 - Author - Date Posted
Article 2 Summary
URI to full article

Article 3 - Author - Date Posted
Article 3 Summary
URI to full article

Article 4 - Author - Date Posted
Article 4 Summary
URI to full article

Article 5 - Author - Date Posted
Article 5 Summary
URI to full article

evolt.org mission statement
Contact link
---------------

So that we can deliver our content to PDAs and other wireless devices?  I'm
very interested in doing this, especially since the redesign, my AvantGo
channel has been messed up by the graphics (and until recently our 404
problem.)

Branding, 5 Article Titles, Summaries and Links to full story (which, in
itself would be pared down.)

Thoughts...?

________
"remember, if all someone can do is insult your heritage, you've got
nothing to worry about..."

            Adrian "aardvark" Roselli




From jeff at members.evolt.org  Fri Feb 23 22:56:16 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Fri Feb 23 22:56:16 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <B6BC74B8.1C1C8%dave@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELGEKMFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

dave,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: dave mclean
:
: > http://www.evolt.org/xml/articles/index.html
:
: Cool Jeff, but what does it do?  Gives
: a list of articles obviously, but they
: aren't URIs.
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

what does it do?  it generates the xml for syndication.  you're not seeing
the whole picture if you don't view the source of the page though.

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: Is there a way to generate the following
: easily:
:
: [example snipped]
:
: So that we can deliver our content to
: PDAs and other wireless devices?  I'm
: very interested in doing this, especially
: since the redesign, my AvantGo channel has
: been messed up by the graphics (and until
: recently our 404 problem.)
:
: Branding, 5 Article Titles, Summaries and
: Links to full story (which, in itself would
: be pared down.)
:
: Thoughts...?
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

sure.  can you give me some links to some developer resources for the
avantgo?  once i have that i can build a template that the avantgo users use
when accessing thesite with just some basic functionality like last 5
articles, next/previous 5, and links to the articles themselves.  is that
going to be enough?

thanks,

.jeff

name://jeff.howden
game://web.development
http://www.evolt.org/
mailto:jeff at members.evolt.org




From dave at members.evolt.org  Sat Feb 24 03:44:02 2001
From: dave at members.evolt.org (dave mclean)
Date: Sat Feb 24 03:44:02 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELGEKMFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <B6BCC2BE.1C1DF%dave@members.evolt.org>

On 2/23/01 8:59 PM you wrote:
> sure.  can you give me some links to some developer resources for the
> avantgo?  once i have that i can build a template that the avantgo users use
> when accessing thesite with just some basic functionality like last 5
> articles, next/previous 5, and links to the articles themselves.  is that
> going to be enough?

Hi Jeff,

Found a whole pile of links, but basically it seems that we're looking at
anything that fits into a 150pixel screen for most PDAs. Basic HTML 3.2
support and really with the CF outputting an HTML page that's all we need.

Here are a few of the links I thought might be helpful for you.  Let me know
what else I can do.

The Ultimate AvantGo developer's Checklist
-- I can handle all the administrative stuff...
https://avantgo.com/developer/web/checklist.html

Matrix of Supported HTML tags:
http://avantgo.com/developer/web/matrix.html

A guide to promoting our content channel on AvantGo
(Obviously this is where my work comes in. ;-)
http://avantgo.com/developer/web/content_partner/promote_your_channel.html

So there you have it.  Hope this helps and we can get a channel going soon.
Talk to you soon,

Dave

_____
"i'm feeling something, but i think it's the Vaseline... oooh..."

           - A. Roselli
             Critic of Web sites




From jeff at members.evolt.org  Sat Feb 24 04:30:32 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Sat Feb 24 04:30:32 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <B6BCC2BE.1C1DF%dave@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELIELEFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

dave,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: dave mclean
:
: Found a whole pile of links, but basically
: it seems that we're looking at anything that
: fits into a 150pixel screen for most PDAs.
: Basic HTML 3.2 support and really with the
: CF outputting an HTML page that's all we need.
:
: Here are a few of the links I thought might
: be helpful for you.  Let me know what else
: I can do.
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

how about sending me your palm?  if that's not feasible, then i'll need you
to make yourself available for testing this thing.  it shouldn't take very
long to actually get set up.

go ahead and visit the site and tell me what you see.  if everything works
correctly you should see a document that gives some details about your pda.

thanks,

.jeff

name://jeff.howden
game://web.development
http://www.evolt.org/
mailto:jeff at members.evolt.org




From dave at members.evolt.org  Sat Feb 24 13:38:47 2001
From: dave at members.evolt.org (dave mclean)
Date: Sat Feb 24 13:38:47 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELIELEFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <B6BD4E2D.1C1FF%dave@members.evolt.org>

On 2/24/01 2:33 AM you wrote:

> how about sending me your palm?

Hmmm...  no.

> to make yourself available for testing this thing.  it shouldn't take very
> long to actually get set up.

Yep, I'm all good for that.  I'll be around all weekend.
 
> go ahead and visit the site and tell me what you see.  if everything works
> correctly you should see a document that gives some details about your pda.

COLORDEPTH,SCREENHEIGHT,SCREENSIZE,SCREENWIDTH
AvantGo.COLORDEPTH=4
AvantGo.SCREENHEIGHT =150
AvantGo.SCREENSIZE =150x150
AvantGo.SCREENWIDTH=150

But, of course these are the dimensions for the palm.  WinCE and mobile
phones will be different.  We're best off leaving the content out of a fixed
width table so we can make sure it wraps to full screen.  Also, just because
my colordepth is 4 doesn't mean that we can't use a colour logo on a white
background.

-d

_____
If at first you don't succeed, skydiving is not for you.





From martin at members.evolt.org  Sat Feb 24 13:58:02 2001
From: martin at members.evolt.org (martin burns)
Date: Sat Feb 24 13:58:02 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <B6BC74B8.1C1C8%dave@members.evolt.org>
References: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELAEKBFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.0.20010224190214.01ae82e0@members.evolt.org>

At 20:12 23/02/01 -0700, dave mclean wrote:
>So that we can deliver our content to PDAs and other wireless devices?  I'm
>very interested in doing this, especially since the redesign, my AvantGo
>channel has been messed up by the graphics (and until recently our 404
>problem.)


yeah - an AvantGo channel is still on my tdl from oooh August or so.

cheers
martin





From martin at members.evolt.org  Sat Feb 24 13:59:47 2001
From: martin at members.evolt.org (martin burns)
Date: Sat Feb 24 13:59:47 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELGEKMFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
References: <B6BC74B8.1C1C8%dave@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.0.20010224190307.01aebb30@members.evolt.org>

At 19:59 23/02/01 -0800, jeff wrote:
>sure.  can you give me some links to some developer resources for the
>avantgo?  once i have that i can build a template that the avantgo users use
>when accessing thesite with just some basic functionality like last 5
>articles, next/previous 5, and links to the articles themselves.  is that
>going to be enough?

Um there's some from me way back in August on thesite.

Essentially, it's basic HTML - there are a couple of extra tags
you have to put in before it will use tables at all (ie telling AvantGo
that the URI it's accessing *is* formatted for it)

Cheers
Martin




From martin at members.evolt.org  Sat Feb 24 14:01:02 2001
From: martin at members.evolt.org (martin burns)
Date: Sat Feb 24 14:01:02 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELIELEFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
References: <B6BCC2BE.1C1DF%dave@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.0.20010224190506.01ae9b80@members.evolt.org>

At 01:33 24/02/01 -0800, jeff wrote:
>how about sending me your palm?  if that's not feasible, then i'll need you
>to make yourself available for testing this thing.  it shouldn't take very
>long to actually get set up.

There's an emulator somewhere on the Avantgo site.

Cheers
Martin




From mccreath at ak.net  Sat Feb 24 16:47:03 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Sat Feb 24 16:47:03 2001
Subject: [thesite] New styles to look at
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEKEMOCIAA.mccreath@ak.net>

Howdy --

I've made some test stylesheets to look at. The changes address two needs:

1) Better legibility for <h5> and <h6>

2) Adding <th> and <tfoot>

You can find the examples here:

http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/

While I was looking at the style sheet (I got isaac.css from weo to make
sure I was using the latest), I noticed the class "td.content" had been
commented out. Does anyone know why? That class is supposed to add leading
to the articles and synopses for legibility. Was it causing problems
somewhere?

I've uncommented it on the examples linked above.

David




From roselli at earthlink.net  Sat Feb 24 18:01:48 2001
From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark)
Date: Sat Feb 24 18:01:48 2001
Subject: [thesite] New styles to look at
In-Reply-To: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEKEMOCIAA.mccreath@ak.net>
Message-ID: <3A97F62D.9492.20D8883F@localhost>

>From: "mccreath" <mccreath at ak.net>
[...] 
> http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/

i like the indented versions... not the italicized... just as the size 
tells you the relative level, so does the indentation... the italics, 
OTOH, don't offer that visual cue... they're just italic... but not more 
or less than anything, or stepped in any way...

> While I was looking at the style sheet (I got isaac.css from weo to
> make sure I was using the latest), I noticed the class "td.content"
> had been commented out. Does anyone know why? That class is supposed
> to add leading to the articles and synopses for legibility. Was it
> causing problems somewhere?

good question... who commented it?




From mccreath at ak.net  Sat Feb 24 20:25:18 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Sat Feb 24 20:25:18 2001
Subject: [thesite] New styles to look at
In-Reply-To: <3A97F62D.9492.20D8883F@localhost>
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEIENBCIAA.mccreath@ak.net>

> From: aardvark
> 
> >From: "mccreath" <mccreath at ak.net>
> [...] 
> > http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/
> 
> i like the indented versions... not the italicized... just as the size 
> tells you the relative level, so does the indentation... the italics, 
> OTOH, don't offer that visual cue... they're just italic... but not more 
> or less than anything, or stepped in any way...

Good point. I'm good with that.

> > While I was looking at the style sheet (I got isaac.css from weo to
> > make sure I was using the latest), I noticed the class "td.content"
> > had been commented out. Does anyone know why? That class is supposed
> > to add leading to the articles and synopses for legibility. Was it
> > causing problems somewhere?
> 
> good question... who commented it?

And is there a reason not to uncomment it?

David



From jeff at members.evolt.org  Sat Feb 24 21:27:18 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Sat Feb 24 21:27:18 2001
Subject: [thesite] New styles to look at
In-Reply-To: <3A97F62D.9492.20D8883F@localhost>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELAENCFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

mccreath & aardvark,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: aardvark
:
: >From: "mccreath" <mccreath at ak.net>
: >
: > While I was looking at the style sheet
: > (I got isaac.css from weo to make sure
: > I was using the latest), I noticed the
: > class "td.content" had been commented out.
: > Does anyone know why? That class is supposed
: > to add leading to the articles and synopses
: > for legibility. Was it causing problems somewhere?
:
: good question... who commented it?
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

i recall doing that actually.  line heights in td's make netscape freak out.
i was finding display problems in articles that had the textareas and/or
images.  as soon as i removed it the problem went away.  i'd love to use
line heights too, but nn4 just doesn't like that.

thanks,

.jeff

name://jeff.howden
game://web.development
http://www.evolt.org/
mailto:jeff at members.evolt.org




From roselli at earthlink.net  Sat Feb 24 23:41:48 2001
From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark)
Date: Sat Feb 24 23:41:48 2001
Subject: [thesite] New styles to look at
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELAENCFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
References: <3A97F62D.9492.20D8883F@localhost>
Message-ID: <3A9845C2.14343.220F72ED@localhost>

> From: "jeff" <jeff at members.evolt.org>
> 
> i recall doing that actually.  line heights in td's make netscape
> freak out. i was finding display problems in articles that had the
> textareas and/or images.  as soon as i removed it the problem went
> away.  i'd love to use line heights too, but nn4 just doesn't like
> that.

works for me... i do know that NN gets wonky with inline images 
and line height, but i guess i hadn't seen it during testing...

would it be better to comment out the line-height attribute (with 
comment) instead of the entire class?



From jeff at members.evolt.org  Sun Feb 25 02:53:18 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Sun Feb 25 02:53:18 2001
Subject: [thesite] New styles to look at
In-Reply-To: <3A9845C2.14343.220F72ED@localhost>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELCENIFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

aardvark,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: aardvark
:
: works for me... i do know that NN gets
: wonky with inline images and line height,
: but i guess i hadn't seen it during
: testing...
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

yeah, i actually discovered this problem while working on a client's site.
in fact, if i recall correctly someone else on this list was complaining
about the problem and i experienced while working on something unrelated.
first place i went was to the stylesheet looking for line-height
declarations.  sure enough, plain as day.  commented it out and it works
like a charm.  if i recall correctly nn6 was also having problems with it
which i found quite odd.

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: would it be better to comment out the
: line-height attribute (with comment)
: instead of the entire class?
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

sure, but what would that gain us?  this is the line from the stylesheet:


/* td.content { line-height : 130% ; } */

if there were other properties set in the class i would've only commented
out the line-height declaration.  since there wasn't i didn't see much point
to messing with it.

any thoughts?

thanks,

.jeff

name://jeff.howden
game://web.development
http://www.evolt.org/
mailto:jeff at members.evolt.org




From martin at members.evolt.org  Sun Feb 25 04:27:48 2001
From: martin at members.evolt.org (martin burns)
Date: Sun Feb 25 04:27:48 2001
Subject: [thesite] New styles to look at
In-Reply-To: <3A97F62D.9492.20D8883F@localhost>
References: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEKEMOCIAA.mccreath@ak.net>
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.0.20010225092644.00a16e30@members.evolt.org>

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Hash: SHA1

At 22:58 24/02/01, aardvark wrote:
> >From: "mccreath" <mccreath at ak.net>
>[...]
> > http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/
>
>i like the indented versions... not the italicized... just as the size
>tells you the relative level, so does the indentation... the italics,
>OTOH, don't offer that visual cue... they're just italic... but not more
>or less than anything, or stepped in any way...

I like these too, but... any para text following an indented title
*also* has to be indented, otherwise it'll look silly.

And if para text is indented, then we'll have to differentiate it
from blockquote (like making blockquote italic, which is standard
print way of doing things)

Cheers
Martin


________________
Martin Burns, Content Management Consultant
tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985
http://www.evolt.org/user/MartinB/32/evolt.org
http://www.easyweb.co.uk/
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From roselli at earthlink.net  Sun Feb 25 10:07:04 2001
From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark)
Date: Sun Feb 25 10:07:04 2001
Subject: [thesite] New styles to look at
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELCENIFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
References: <3A9845C2.14343.220F72ED@localhost>
Message-ID: <3A98D81D.14254.244B3B78@localhost>

> From: "jeff" <jeff at members.evolt.org>
[...] 
> /* td.content { line-height : 130% ; } */
> 
> if there were other properties set in the class i would've only
> commented out the line-height declaration.  since there wasn't i
> didn't see much point to messing with it.

agreed... for some reason i thought there was another style in 
there... so nevermind...



From roselli at earthlink.net  Sun Feb 25 10:08:19 2001
From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark)
Date: Sun Feb 25 10:08:19 2001
Subject: [thesite] New styles to look at
In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.0.20010225092644.00a16e30@members.evolt.org>
References: <3A97F62D.9492.20D8883F@localhost>
Message-ID: <3A98D866.18087.244C576A@localhost>

> From: martin burns <martin at members.evolt.org>
> 
> At 22:58 24/02/01, aardvark wrote:
> > >From: "mccreath" <mccreath at ak.net>
> >[...]
> > > http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/
> >
> >i like the indented versions... not the italicized... just as the
> >size tells you the relative level, so does the indentation... the
> >italics, OTOH, don't offer that visual cue... they're just italic...
> >but not more or less than anything, or stepped in any way...
> 
> I like these too, but... any para text following an indented title
> *also* has to be indented, otherwise it'll look silly.

i don't buy that... why does it *have* to be indented?  i've certainly 
seen cases where headers are indented in print... it's nothing new, 
and i don't think it will confuse people... and indenting the entire 
paragraph brings all sorts of other unnecessary baggage with it...

> And if para text is indented, then we'll have to differentiate it from
> blockquote (like making blockquote italic, which is standard print way
> of doing things)

only if we indent, and i think that's a very good reason why we 
wouldn't indent the paragraph...



From mccreath at ak.net  Sun Feb 25 12:12:49 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Sun Feb 25 12:12:49 2001
Subject: [thesite] New styles to look at
In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.0.20010225092644.00a16e30@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEKENHCIAA.mccreath@ak.net>

> From: martin burns
>
> At 22:58 24/02/01, aardvark wrote:
> > >From: "mccreath" <mccreath at ak.net>
> >[...]
> > > http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/
> >
> >i like the indented versions... not the italicized... just as the size
> >tells you the relative level, so does the indentation... the italics,
> >OTOH, don't offer that visual cue... they're just italic... but not more
> >or less than anything, or stepped in any way...
>
> I like these too, but... any para text following an indented title
> *also* has to be indented, otherwise it'll look silly.
>
> And if para text is indented, then we'll have to differentiate it
> from blockquote (like making blockquote italic, which is standard
> print way of doing things)

Nah. It's not unheard of to indent low-level headers in print. It's a little
unusual, but I think it's our best option here. Besides, indenting  the
paragraphs under a 5 and 6 would be terribly confusing for the reader.

I think it's going to be pretty much a non-issue, because how often have we
had people use 5 and 6?

David




From mccreath at ak.net  Sun Feb 25 12:15:49 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Sun Feb 25 12:15:49 2001
Subject: [thesite] Jeff or Dan - new stylesheet ready for upload
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEOENHCIAA.mccreath@ak.net>

Jeff or Dan -

The new stylesheet is ready to upload. Added th and tfoot, altered <h5> and
<h6>, and left td.content commented out.

Also reformatted and commented .error so it was consistent with the rest of
the document.

http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/0225/isaac.css

Can one of you guys get it?

Thanks!
David




From dave at members.evolt.org  Sun Feb 25 13:00:04 2001
From: dave at members.evolt.org (dave mclean)
Date: Sun Feb 25 13:00:04 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELIELEFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <B6BE969B.1C242%dave@members.evolt.org>

On 2/24/01 2:33 AM you wrote:

> go ahead and visit the site and tell me what you see.  if everything works
> correctly you should see a document that gives some details about your pda.

Anything for me to test, or is it all already done?

-d

___________________________________________________
http://evolt.org - We put the 'rrr' in 'werd' baby! Yeah baby, yeah!!!




From jeff at members.evolt.org  Sun Feb 25 16:34:50 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Sun Feb 25 16:34:50 2001
Subject: [thesite] Jeff or Dan - new stylesheet ready for upload
In-Reply-To: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEOENHCIAA.mccreath@ak.net>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELGEPBFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

david,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: mccreath
: 
: The new stylesheet is ready to upload. Added
: th and tfoot, altered <h5> and <h6>, and left
: td.content commented out.
: 
: Also reformatted and commented .error so it
: was consistent with the rest of the document.
: 
: http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/0225/isaac.css
: 
: Can one of you guys get it?
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

all taken care of on w.e.o.  dan will need to get l.e.o, m.e.o, and b.e.o.

thanks,

.jeff

name://jeff.howden
game://web.development
http://www.evolt.org/
mailto:jeff at members.evolt.org



From jeff at members.evolt.org  Sun Feb 25 16:37:35 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Sun Feb 25 16:37:35 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <B6BE969B.1C242%dave@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELOEPBFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

damclean,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: dave mclean
:
: > go ahead and visit the site and tell
: > me what you see.  if everything works
: > correctly you should see a document
: > that gives some details about your pda.
:
: Anything for me to test, or is it all already done?
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

i actually haven't had a chance to do anything with it since i put that test
page up.  what would be really helpful is if you could tell me how you'd
like the information structured when you visit the site.  give me an idea of
the design you have in mind, ie, you want how many articles listed at a
time, you want next/previous x number of articles links, you want category
links, and where all of this stuff goes in the layout.

thanks,

.jeff

name://jeff.howden
game://web.development
http://www.evolt.org/
mailto:jeff at members.evolt.org




From McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us  Sun Feb 25 16:41:20 2001
From: McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us (McCreath_David)
Date: Sun Feb 25 16:41:20 2001
Subject: [thesite] Jeff or Dan - new stylesheet ready for upload
Message-ID: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A1234A@EXPO1>

Shit. That's what I get for uploading stuff right after I wake up.

Dan, gimme this afternoon to change the stylesheets for l.e.o., b.e.o., and
m.e.o. Unless you want to to it your self. All you need to do is get
isaac.css from the address below and make the appropriate changes.

I'm in the middle of putting together a class for tomorrow, so it'll be a
couple of hours before I can do it. I'll let you know when I'm done.

Oh, thanks, Jeff!

David

>-----Original Message-----
>From: jeff
>
>david,
>
>:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>: From: mccreath
>: 
>: 
>: http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/0225/isaac.css
>: 
>: Can one of you guys get it?
>:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>all taken care of on w.e.o.  dan will need to get l.e.o, 
>m.e.o, and b.e.o.



From jeff at members.evolt.org  Sun Feb 25 16:42:50 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Sun Feb 25 16:42:50 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <B6BD4E2D.1C1FF%dave@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELGEPCFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

damclean,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: dave mclean
:
: > to make yourself available for testing
: > this thing.  it shouldn't take very
: > long to actually get set up.
:
: Yep, I'm all good for that.  I'll be around
: all weekend.
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

excellent.  i've got work stuff on my plate today too, but i have alittle
time i can put in on this.

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: COLORDEPTH,SCREENHEIGHT,SCREENSIZE,SCREENWIDTH
: AvantGo.COLORDEPTH=4
: AvantGo.SCREENHEIGHT =150
: AvantGo.SCREENSIZE =150x150
: AvantGo.SCREENWIDTH=150
:
: But, of course these are the dimensions for
: the palm.  WinCE and mobile phones will be
: different.  We're best off leaving the content
: out of a fixed width table so we can make sure
: it wraps to full screen.
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

of course.  we'd actually be using the width detection to serve up the
appropriate logo.

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: Also, just because my colordepth is 4
: doesn't mean that we can't use a colour
: logo on a white background.
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

i was thinking it would be more appropriate to generate a couple variations
of the logo.  we'd have a b&w one for the 2/4/8 color units and a color one
for the others.

thanks,

.jeff

name://jeff.howden
game://web.development
http://www.evolt.org/
mailto:jeff at members.evolt.org




From martin at members.evolt.org  Sun Feb 25 16:50:05 2001
From: martin at members.evolt.org (martin burns)
Date: Sun Feb 25 16:50:05 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELGEPCFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
References: <B6BD4E2D.1C1FF%dave@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.0.20010225215209.02d99220@members.evolt.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

At 21:46 25/02/01, jeff wrote:
>:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>: Also, just because my colordepth is 4
>: doesn't mean that we can't use a colour
>: logo on a white background.
>:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>i was thinking it would be more appropriate to generate a couple variations
>of the logo.  we'd have a b&w one for the 2/4/8 color units and a color one
>for the others.

+42 for that, if we can get the colour detection.

Palms (other than the colour models) are 4bit greyscale
btw.

Cheers
Martin



________________
Martin Burns, Content Management Consultant
tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985
http://www.evolt.org/user/MartinB/32/evolt.org
http://www.easyweb.co.uk/
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From dave at members.evolt.org  Sun Feb 25 16:50:50 2001
From: dave at members.evolt.org (dave mclean)
Date: Sun Feb 25 16:50:50 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELGEPCFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <B6BECCAE.1C25F%dave@members.evolt.org>

On 2/25/01 2:46 PM you wrote:

> of course.  we'd actually be using the width detection to serve up the
> appropriate logo.
> 
> :~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> : Also, just because my colordepth is 4
> : doesn't mean that we can't use a colour
> : logo on a white background.
> :~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 
> i was thinking it would be more appropriate to generate a couple variations
> of the logo.  we'd have a b&w one for the 2/4/8 color units and a color one
> for the others.

Cool, that works too.

I've gotta go out and get some groceries, but when I get back I'll finish
the sample layout I was thinking of.

Dave

______
"if i sound dumb, it's because i am."
             
                           -R.M.




From jeff at members.evolt.org  Sun Feb 25 16:59:35 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Sun Feb 25 16:59:35 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.0.20010225215209.02d99220@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELEEPEFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

martin,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: martin burns
:
: +42 for that, if we can get the colour
: detection.
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

have you visited thesite lately with your palm?  it'll tell you what your
colordepth is.  reporting the colordepth is built in to avantgo.  it's sent
as a cgi variable in the http headers.

thanks,

.jeff

name://jeff.howden
game://web.development
http://www.evolt.org/
mailto:jeff at members.evolt.org




From jeff at members.evolt.org  Sun Feb 25 17:00:20 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Sun Feb 25 17:00:20 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <B6BECCAE.1C25F%dave@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELIEPEFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

damclean,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: dave mclean
: 
: I've gotta go out and get some groceries,
: but when I get back I'll finish the sample
: layout I was thinking of.
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

i can work on it once you get it in my hands.

thanks,

.jeff

name://jeff.howden
game://web.development
http://www.evolt.org/
mailto:jeff at members.evolt.org



From roselli at earthlink.net  Sun Feb 25 17:17:50 2001
From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark)
Date: Sun Feb 25 17:17:50 2001
Subject: [thesite] RDF?
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELGEPCFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
References: <B6BD4E2D.1C1FF%dave@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <3A993CDA.25057.25D4CD31@localhost>

> From: "jeff" <jeff at members.evolt.org>
> 
> of course.  we'd actually be using the width detection to serve up the
> appropriate logo.
[...]
> i was thinking it would be more appropriate to generate a couple
> variations of the logo.  we'd have a b&w one for the 2/4/8 color units
> and a color one for the others.

just lemme know when and how you need a logo... sizes, colors, 
etc...



From roselli at earthlink.net  Sun Feb 25 17:31:05 2001
From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark)
Date: Sun Feb 25 17:31:05 2001
Subject: [thesite] Jeff or Dan - new stylesheet ready for upload
In-Reply-To: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A1234A@EXPO1>
Message-ID: <3A993FEE.32473.25E0D36C@localhost>

hate to be a party pooper... but what about print.css?  not updated 
yet...



From McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us  Sun Feb 25 17:36:05 2001
From: McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us (McCreath_David)
Date: Sun Feb 25 17:36:05 2001
Subject: [thesite] Jeff or Dan - new stylesheet ready for upload
Message-ID: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A1234C@EXPO1>

No pooping. Thanks for the reminder. I'll get it in a little bit when I get
the l, b, and m sheets.

David

>-----Original Message-----
>From: aardvark
>
>hate to be a party pooper... but what about print.css?  not updated 
>yet...



From McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us  Sun Feb 25 19:48:20 2001
From: McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us (McCreath_David)
Date: Sun Feb 25 19:48:20 2001
Subject: [thesite] new styles for beo, leo, meo, and print
Message-ID: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A12355@EXPO1>

I think I just became a rapper...

Dan --

Here are the updated stylesheets for the above sites. "print.css" is for
weo.

http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/0225/browsers.css
http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/0225/lists.css
http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/0225/members.css
http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/0225/print.css

David



From jeff at members.evolt.org  Sun Feb 25 20:09:35 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Sun Feb 25 20:09:35 2001
Subject: [thesite] new styles for beo, leo, meo, and print
In-Reply-To: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A12355@EXPO1>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELIEABFNAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

david,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: McCreath_David
:
: "print.css" is for weo.
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

got it and done.

i also figured out why the print template wasn't outputting any of the
article ratings.  that's fixed now too.

later,

.jeff

name://jeff.howden
game://web.development
http://www.evolt.org/
mailto:jeff at members.evolt.org




From martin at members.evolt.org  Sun Feb 25 20:13:05 2001
From: martin at members.evolt.org (martin burns)
Date: Sun Feb 25 20:13:05 2001
Subject: [thesite] new styles for beo, leo, meo, and print
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELIEABFNAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
References: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A12355@EXPO1>
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.0.20010226011320.02b53500@members.evolt.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

At 01:13 26/02/01, jeff wrote:
>i also figured out why the print template wasn't outputting any of the
>article ratings.  that's fixed now too.

woo! Good stuff!

A thought - do you think it worthwhile maintaining an issues log,
where we can drop all these wee things into a formal queue?

Cheers
Martin


________________
Martin Burns, Content Management Consultant
tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985
http://www.evolt.org/user/MartinB/32/evolt.org
http://www.easyweb.co.uk/
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From McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us  Sun Feb 25 21:19:20 2001
From: McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us (McCreath_David)
Date: Sun Feb 25 21:19:20 2001
Subject: [thesite] new styles for beo, leo, meo, and print
Message-ID: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A1235B@EXPO1>

>:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>: From: McCreath_David
>:
>: "print.css" is for weo.
>:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>got it and done.
>
>i also figured out why the print template wasn't outputting any of the
>article ratings.  that's fixed now too.

Schooly-D.



From r937 at interlog.com  Sun Feb 25 22:40:50 2001
From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy)
Date: Sun Feb 25 22:40:50 2001
Subject: [thesite] new styles for beo, leo, meo, and print
Message-ID: <01c09fa6$201f8ce0$5d50149a@rudy>

>> i also figured out why the print template wasn't outputting 
>> any of the article ratings.  that's fixed now too.

thanks jeff

> A thought - do you think it worthwhile maintaining an issues log,
> where we can drop all these wee things into a formal queue?

good idea

add to issues:   notify article author when somebody adds a comment

rudy




From dave at members.evolt.org  Mon Feb 26 03:01:35 2001
From: dave at members.evolt.org (dave mclean)
Date: Mon Feb 26 03:01:35 2001
Subject: AvantGo (was: Re: [thesite] RDF?)
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELIEPEFMAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <B6BF5BD9.1C2D3%dave@members.evolt.org>

On 2/25/01 3:03 PM you wrote:

> : I've gotta go out and get some groceries,
> : but when I get back I'll finish the sample
> : layout I was thinking of.
> :~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 
> i can work on it once you get it in my hands.

Okay... I'm back.  Had to do some taxes and supper and other things.  Anyway
here's the URI...

http://members.evolt.org/dave/avantgo/

Pretty fancy... not really.  Just plain old text.  All the links, but when
people subscribe they'll have the discretion of how deep they want to link.
They'll need one deep to at least get the full articles and 2 deep will run
them a little further into things.

We could list the categories in between the logo and the front page content,
but I think that would be a little much.  Anyone else have an opinion on
this?

Dave
________
'One of the reasons Arnie (Arnold Palmer) is playing so well is that,
before each tee-shot, his wife takes out his balls and kisses them - Oh my
God,what have I just said?'
USTV commentator




From jeff at members.evolt.org  Mon Feb 26 04:16:35 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Mon Feb 26 04:16:35 2001
Subject: AvantGo (was: Re: [thesite] RDF?)
In-Reply-To: <B6BF5BD9.1C2D3%dave@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELCEBDFNAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

damclean,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: dave mclean
: 
: http://members.evolt.org/dave/avantgo/
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

ok, makes sense to me

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: Pretty fancy... not really.  Just plain old
: text.
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

yup, pretty much like i figured.

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: All the links, but when people subscribe
: they'll have the discretion of how deep
: they want to link.  They'll need one deep
: to at least get the full articles and 2 
: deep will run them a little further into
: things.
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

when people subscribe to what?

how deep they want to link?

they'll need one deep?

can you explain this stuff some more?  maybe back it up with sample layout.

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: We could list the categories in between
: the logo and the front page content, but
: I think that would be a little much. 
: Anyone else have an opinion on this?
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

i was thinking the categories might go at the bottom, but that's just me.

thanks,

.jeff

name://jeff.howden
game://web.development
http://www.evolt.org/
mailto:jeff at members.evolt.org



From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 26 14:50:07 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 26 14:50:07 2001
Subject: [thesite] new styles for beo, leo, meo, and print
References: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A12355@EXPO1>
Message-ID: <3A9AB3C1.8040807@starkmedia.com>

done.

McCreath_David wrote:


> http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/0225/browsers.css
> http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/0225/lists.css
> http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/0225/members.css




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 26 17:01:22 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 26 17:01:22 2001
Subject: [thesite] new styles for beo, leo, meo, and print
References: <01c09fa6$201f8ce0$5d50149a@rudy>
Message-ID: <3A9AD289.3080605@starkmedia.com>

rudy -

i've got this 'more or less' working. more in the sense that when you 
post a comment, *you* won't get a notification, but everyone else in the 
thread will..

less in the sense that if you'll recieve a notification for each time 
you've posted in the thread. 5 posts in a thread ==  5 notification 
emails. the problem is we don't have any sort of index in the replies 
table that says, "this person has already posted for this thread" or 
something like that.. otherwise the query loops the recordset, grabbing 
each userid, getting an email for that and sending an email. rather 
rinse repeat. for example:

SQL =
SELECT
     		users.email,
     		users.notify,
     		users.userid,
     		users.firstname,
     		replies.contentid,
     		replies.userid
      	FROM
     		users,
     		replies
      	WHERE
     		users.userid = replies.userid
       	AND replies.contentid = 3509
	AND users.userid != 5 #this is so it doesnt email the person 					#that just posted..

this sends out an email to each userid that has commented on that 
article, with no regard for if they've already got a notification..

is there some better query to only grab each userid once? sorry about 
being a dumbass, my head is really really really foggy and still 
dripping out bong resin and shit.. thanks :)

.djc.
rudy wrote:


> add to issues:   notify article author when somebody adds a comment




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 26 17:29:07 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 26 17:29:07 2001
Subject: [thesite] [Fwd: [Admin] evolt page titles..]
Message-ID: <3A9AD8F9.3000000@starkmedia.com>

FYI..
-------------- next part --------------
An embedded message was scrubbed...
From: "Daniel J. Cody" <djc at starkmedia.com>
Subject: [Admin] evolt page titles..
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 16:27:47 -0600
Size: 2458
URL: <http://lists.evolt.org/pipermail/thesite/attachments/20010226/a533c344/attachment.eml>

From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 26 18:38:52 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 26 18:38:52 2001
Subject: [thesite] style fucked for l.e.o
Message-ID: <3A9AE965.20309@starkmedia.com>

dave, copied the styles you gave me this mornign without verifying the 
l.e.o site(or my cache didnt reload).. it looks like the stylesheet you 
gave me to upload doesn't have the rigth colors..
http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/0225/lists.css
is the same as the stylesheet for l.e.o

unless i'm totally on crack. :)

lemme know

.djc.




From McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us  Mon Feb 26 19:00:08 2001
From: McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us (McCreath_David)
Date: Mon Feb 26 19:00:08 2001
Subject: [thesite] style fucked for l.e.o
Message-ID: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A12360@EXPO1>

Sorry, Dan --

Musta screwed up when doing a "save as...". Just uploaded a new one with the
correct colors and all the new additions/corrections.

http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/0225/lists.css

David




From r937 at interlog.com  Mon Feb 26 19:16:23 2001
From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy)
Date: Mon Feb 26 19:16:23 2001
Subject: [thesite] new styles for beo, leo, meo, and print
Message-ID: <01c0a052$95cee2e0$LocalHost@rudy>

> ... otherwise the query loops the recordset, grabbing
> userid, getting an email for that and sending an email.
> rather rinse repeat.

ouch!!  ooooh!!  cut it out, man, that HURTS!!

you know those discussions on thelist about content versus presentation?

same deal with queries, you have to separate content from procedure

*never* willingly undertake to do the database's job (procedure)

always state the query in terms of which records you want (content)

what you just said up there sounded as ugly as  <font face=Arial><p><font
face="Comic Sans MS"><b>loops the <i></b>recordset!!</font></i></font></p>

are you doing the looping?  i thought CFMAIL could process the query
results in one statement -- were you perhaps trying to describe this
process?   i would hate to think you are bouncing back and forth between
the cf page and the database, back and forth, back and forth -- which is
what it sounds like you said


> is there some better query to only grab each userid once?

yup, use the DISTINCT keyword in the query

let's do a quick analysis

first, process the add-a-comment form

  insert into replies values ( ... )

the userid for the author of the comment is the logged on user, right?  and
the article id is in the url, right?

okay, assuming that gets done, let's recap what we know

we have the article id of the article, and we know there's at least one
comment on it (the one that was just added), and the comment(s) are from at
least one user (the one that just added the comment), and if there are any
other comments on the article, they could be from any number of users,
including the one that was just added, and any user can have multiple
comments

yeah, use exactly what you have for the where clause --

         WHERE
     users.userid = replies.userid
       AND replies.contentid = 3509
         AND users.userid != 5

just add DISTINCT to the select list

and don't you have to test the notify column to see if the email should go
to each person?


> sorry about being a dumbass, my head is really really really
> foggy and still dripping out bong resin and shit..

whoa, apology not necessary


rudy





From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 26 19:41:37 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 26 19:41:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] style fucked for l.e.o
References: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A12360@EXPO1>
Message-ID: <3A9AF810.2010108@starkmedia.com>

coolio.. fix0r3dz!

.djc.

McCreath_David wrote:

> Sorry, Dan --
> 
> Musta screwed up when doing a "save as...". Just uploaded a new one with the
> correct colors and all the new additions/corrections.
> 
> http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/0225/lists.css




From djc at starkmedia.com  Mon Feb 26 19:47:52 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Mon Feb 26 19:47:52 2001
Subject: [thesite] new styles for beo, leo, meo, and print
References: <01c0a052$95cee2e0$LocalHost@rudy>
Message-ID: <3A9AF98A.9090005@starkmedia.com>


rudy wrote:


> *never* willingly undertake to do the database's job (procedure)
> 
> always state the query in terms of which records you want (content)

oook.. *hangs head in shame*.. sorry was in a hurry.. its not looping anymore, just emailing
everyone X ammounts of times..

> what you just said up there sounded as ugly as  <font face=Arial><p><font
> face="Comic Sans MS"><b>loops the <i></b>recordset!!</font></i></font></p>

doh! but i *like* comic sans ms!! ;( heh

> yup, use the DISTINCT keyword in the query
> 
> let's do a quick analysis
> 
> first, process the add-a-comment form
> 
>   insert into replies values ( ... )
> 
> the userid for the author of the comment is the logged on user, right?  and
> the article id is in the url, right?
> 
> okay, assuming that gets done, let's recap what we know
> 
> we have the article id of the article, and we know there's at least one
> comment on it (the one that was just added), and the comment(s) are from at
> least one user (the one that just added the comment), and if there are any
> other comments on the article, they could be from any number of users,
> including the one that was just added, and any user can have multiple
> comments
> 
> yeah, use exactly what you have for the where clause --
> 
>          WHERE
>      users.userid = replies.userid
>        AND replies.contentid = 3509
>          AND users.userid != 5
> 
> just add DISTINCT to the select list
> 
> and don't you have to test the notify column to see if the email should go
> to each person?

ok rude.. i'll give this a whirl and get back to ya..

thanks brotha man.

.djc.
Chief Wuukie Weki Bad Record Sety




From dave at members.evolt.org  Tue Feb 27 02:05:52 2001
From: dave at members.evolt.org (dave mclean)
Date: Tue Feb 27 02:05:52 2001
Subject: AvantGo (was: Re: [thesite] RDF?)
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELCEBDFNAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <B6C0A04D.1C3A4%dave@members.evolt.org>

On 2/26/01 2:19 AM you wrote:

> when people subscribe to what?

You add channels (Web sites) that AvantGo downloads for you and then sends
them to your Palm as a neat little package when you sync with your pc.  So,
basically you "subscribe" to Web sites and they get the content for you,
wrap it up and give it to you.

> how deep they want to link?

Yeah, it determines how many pages AvantGo retrieves for you.  Each user
controls how many links the program is supposed to follow.  If you go one
deep, that means it will follow every link from the first page and download
the subsequent pages, but no further than that.  It will ignore the links on
the second pages.

Additionally, a link depth of 0 will follow no links.
 
> can you explain this stuff some more?  maybe back it up with sample layout.

Here's a page that has the example:

http://avantgo.com/developer/enterprise/3.6/adminguide/ch5mana2.html#919204

> i was thinking the categories might go at the bottom, but that's just me.

That's all good. Keeps the content up top, which is really important on the
Palm.  Content good.

-d

ps. Here's another tid-bit I just found:

When designing pages for AvantGo, you should include the following META tag
in the HEAD element:

<META name="HandheldFriendly" content="True">

This tag enables several HTML features that are normally turned off. Most
notably, AvantGo ignores all JavaScript and does not try to display TABLE
tags or the HSPACE and VSPACE attributes of IMG tags unless the page is
marked as "HandheldFriendly". Most TABLEs or H/VSPACEs are designed for much
larger screens.

______
Whoops, just spilled salsa on the cat.

               - Em




From jeff at members.evolt.org  Tue Feb 27 03:34:52 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Tue Feb 27 03:34:52 2001
Subject: AvantGo (was: Re: [thesite] RDF?)
In-Reply-To: <B6C0A04D.1C3A4%dave@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELOEIHFNAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

damclean,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: dave mclean
:
: > when people subscribe to what?
:
: You add channels (Web sites) that AvantGo
: downloads for you and then sends them to
: your Palm as a neat little package when
: you sync with your pc.  So, basically you
: "subscribe" to Web sites and they get the
: content for you, wrap it up and give it to
: you.
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

ok, that makes alittle more sense.  by "they" are you meaning avantgo when
referring to who retrieves and wraps up the content?

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: > how deep they want to link?
:
: Yeah, it determines how many pages AvantGo
: retrieves for you.  Each user controls how
: many links the program is supposed to follow.
: If you go one deep, that means it will follow
: every link from the first page and download
: the subsequent pages, but no further than that.
: It will ignore the links on the second pages.
:
: Additionally, a link depth of 0 will follow no
: links.
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

ok, this makes more sense.  do we need to subscribe for them to be able to
do this?

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: > i was thinking the categories might go at
: > the bottom, but that's just me.
:
: That's all good. Keeps the content up top,
: which is really important on the Palm.
: Content good.
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

i just added the categories to the bottom of the page.  lemme know what you
think.  i've got an avantgo version of the article page done as well.  i
just have to do alittle work to get an avantgo user page together as well.
are there any other pages on thesite that you think they should have access
to?

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: When designing pages for AvantGo, you should
: include the following META tag in the HEAD
: element:
:
: <META name="HandheldFriendly" content="True">
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

added that.

lemme know how it looks in avantgo now.

thanks,

.jeff

name://jeff.howden
game://web.development
http://www.evolt.org/
mailto:jeff at members.evolt.org




From djc at starkmedia.com  Tue Feb 27 14:53:39 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Tue Feb 27 14:53:39 2001
Subject: [thesite] new styles for beo, leo, meo, and print
References: <01c0a052$95cee2e0$LocalHost@rudy>
Message-ID: <3A9C0614.2070802@starkmedia.com>


rudy wrote:


> yup, use the DISTINCT keyword in the query

thats the trick..

> and don't you have to test the notify column to see if the email should go
> to each person?

ya, already had that.. As it stands now, it emails the article author and each person who has
commented in the thread once, only if they have the users.notify flag on.

should be good to go.. when you guys post some comments, let me know how it works/doesnt
work..

.djc.




From djc at starkmedia.com  Tue Feb 27 15:28:52 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Tue Feb 27 15:28:52 2001
Subject: [thesite] [Fwd: [Admin] Bug update..]
Message-ID: <3A9C0E51.6070406@starkmedia.com>

shoulda come to you guys first time around..
-------------- next part --------------
An embedded message was scrubbed...
From: "Daniel J. Cody" <djc at starkmedia.com>
Subject: [Admin] Bug update..
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 14:25:03 -0600
Size: 2717
URL: <http://lists.evolt.org/pipermail/thesite/attachments/20010227/363e14d5/attachment.eml>

From djc at starkmedia.com  Tue Feb 27 17:28:07 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Tue Feb 27 17:28:07 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
Message-ID: <3A9C2A4B.1020908@starkmedia.com>

Hey Dave-o :)

I need another template from ya buddy.. Can you wrap the l.e.o L&F 
around an archive page for me? This is a good example:
http://lists.evolt.org/archive/Week-of-Mon-20010226/151430.html

never mind the shitty old school tags in there.. use our styles if you can.

Or if you don't have time for this, lemme know :)

Thanks bunches

.djc.




From McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us  Tue Feb 27 17:32:24 2001
From: McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us (McCreath_David)
Date: Tue Feb 27 17:32:24 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
Message-ID: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A12377@EXPO1>

A little later? Gotta crank out some user docs ATM.

David

>-----Original Message-----
>From: thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org
>[mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of Daniel J. Cody
>Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2001 1:30 PM
>To: thesite at lists.evolt.org
>Subject: [thesite] need another template..
>
>
>Hey Dave-o :)
>
>I need another template from ya buddy.. Can you wrap the l.e.o L&F 
>around an archive page for me? This is a good example:
>http://lists.evolt.org/archive/Week-of-Mon-20010226/151430.html
>
>never mind the shitty old school tags in there.. use our 
>styles if you can.
>
>Or if you don't have time for this, lemme know :)
>
>Thanks bunches
>
>.djc.
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
>and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
>http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/
>



From matt at haughey.com  Tue Feb 27 17:33:37 2001
From: matt at haughey.com (Matthew Haughey)
Date: Tue Feb 27 17:33:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] customizing homesite
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010227142841.00a68748@mail.knownow.com>

I've scoured the web, the help files, and various mailing list archives, 
and I can't find any info on hacking Allaire Homesite's default tag settings.

I'd like to be able to do a few things. Most important, when I hit control 
and enter, I'd like to have a <br /> tag inserted into documents instead of 
<br>. I'd like to auto insert /'s at the end of img tags when img src tags 
are inserted. I'd like to change control-b from inserting <b> to <strong>.

They have a lot of info on customizing the interface and creating new tags 
through their VTM language, and I see in my \homesite\extensions\ directory 
a html tag definition list, but I can't figure out how the tags are built 
up, based on those files. Most of the vtm stuff looks like help popup 
definitions. Anyone ever really hacked homesite before and would be willing 
to give some tips?

Matt




From djc at starkmedia.com  Tue Feb 27 17:35:07 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Tue Feb 27 17:35:07 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
References: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A12377@EXPO1>
Message-ID: <3A9C2BF0.6040009@starkmedia.com>

ya, whenever you get time.. rewritting the archives for accessability..

aard got me on a tear with that shit :)

thnx again

McCreath_David wrote:

> A little later? Gotta crank out some user docs ATM.
> 
> David
> 
> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org
>> [mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of Daniel J. Cody
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2001 1:30 PM
>> To: thesite at lists.evolt.org
>> Subject: [thesite] need another template..
>> 
>> 
>> Hey Dave-o :)
>> 
>> I need another template from ya buddy.. Can you wrap the l.e.o L&F 
>> around an archive page for me? This is a good example:
>> http://lists.evolt.org/archive/Week-of-Mon-20010226/151430.html
>> 
>> never mind the shitty old school tags in there.. use our 
>> styles if you can.
>> 
>> Or if you don't have time for this, lemme know :)
>> 
>> Thanks bunches
>> 
>> .djc.
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
>> and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
>> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/
>> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
> and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/




From djc at starkmedia.com  Tue Feb 27 18:35:07 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Tue Feb 27 18:35:07 2001
Subject: [thesite] customizing homesite
References: <5.0.2.1.2.20010227142841.00a68748@mail.knownow.com>
Message-ID: <3A9C3A01.7050809@starkmedia.com>

matt, did you mean for this to go to thesite list or thelist list?

if you meant for it to go to thesite list, nm

Matthew Haughey wrote:

> I've scoured the web, the help files, and various mailing list archives, 
> and I can't find any info on hacking Allaire Homesite's default tag 
> settings.
> 
> I'd like to be able to do a few things. Most important, when I hit 
> control and enter, I'd like to have a <br /> tag inserted into documents 
> instead of <br>. I'd like to auto insert /'s at the end of img tags when 
> img src tags are inserted. I'd like to change control-b from inserting 
> <b> to <strong>.
> 
> They have a lot of info on customizing the interface and creating new 
> tags through their VTM language, and I see in my \homesite\extensions\ 
> directory a html tag definition list, but I can't figure out how the 
> tags are built up, based on those files. Most of the vtm stuff looks 
> like help popup definitions. Anyone ever really hacked homesite before 
> and would be willing to give some tips?
> 
> Matt
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
> and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/




From djc at starkmedia.com  Tue Feb 27 18:36:37 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Tue Feb 27 18:36:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] evolt images..
Message-ID: <3A9C3A52.7080806@starkmedia.com>

if you folks are interested in using an evolt type image on your site,

http://members.evolt.org/djc/images/

wee!




From djc at starkmedia.com  Tue Feb 27 19:30:07 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Tue Feb 27 19:30:07 2001
Subject: [thesite] just wondering..
Message-ID: <3A9C46E5.4070007@starkmedia.com>

seth, if you ever saw this:
http://www.easyweb.co.uk/thetips/reqs.html

?




From McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us  Tue Feb 27 20:45:37 2001
From: McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us (McCreath_David)
Date: Tue Feb 27 20:45:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
Message-ID: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A1237C@EXPO1>

Hey, Dan --

Something along these lines:

http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/archivemessage.html

Unfortunately, we've got the same problem that we have with the tips.
Preformatted text is going to make the tables puke.

I guess we have a couple of options:

1) We could drop the right hand menu since we've got the breadcrumb trail

2) We could drop the <pre> tags and do a whole lotta text formatting as the
stuff comes into the browser to make sure that line breaks show correctly

Opinions?

David


>-----Original Message-----
>From: thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org
>[mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of Daniel J. Cody
>Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2001 1:37 PM
>To: thesite at lists.evolt.org
>Subject: Re: [thesite] need another template..
>
>
>ya, whenever you get time.. rewritting the archives for accessability..
>
>aard got me on a tear with that shit :)
>
>thnx again
>
>McCreath_David wrote:
>
>> A little later? Gotta crank out some user docs ATM.
>> 
>> David
>> 
>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org
>>> [mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of Daniel J. Cody
>>> Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2001 1:30 PM
>>> To: thesite at lists.evolt.org
>>> Subject: [thesite] need another template..
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Hey Dave-o :)
>>> 
>>> I need another template from ya buddy.. Can you wrap the l.e.o L&F 
>>> around an archive page for me? This is a good example:
>>> http://lists.evolt.org/archive/Week-of-Mon-20010226/151430.html
>>> 
>>> never mind the shitty old school tags in there.. use our 
>>> styles if you can.
>>> 
>>> Or if you don't have time for this, lemme know :)
>>> 
>>> Thanks bunches
>>> 
>>> .djc.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
>>> and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
>>> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
>> and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
>> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
>and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
>http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/
>



From djc at starkmedia.com  Tue Feb 27 22:08:52 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Tue Feb 27 22:08:52 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
Message-ID: <3A9C9702.3010505@starkmedia.com>

heya.. man that looks kinda crowded especially at the top..

for sure we should ditch the sidebar, cus everything is gonna be
wrapped ina  <pre> tag. i'd like to ditch it, but there are too many 
things that dropping it may break..

not that i'm being critical or anything, i appreciate you doing this 
more than you know :)

lemme know what you think

_____________

Hey, Dan --

Something along these lines:

http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/archivemessage.html

Unfortunately, we've got the same problem that we have with the tips.
Preformatted text is going to make the tables puke.

I guess we have a couple of options:

1) We could drop the right hand menu since we've got the breadcrumb trail

2) We could drop the <pre> tags and do a whole lotta text formatting as the
stuff comes into the browser to make sure that line breaks show correctly

Opinions?

David


 >-----Original Message-----




From jeff at members.evolt.org  Tue Feb 27 22:24:22 2001
From: jeff at members.evolt.org (jeff)
Date: Tue Feb 27 22:24:22 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
In-Reply-To: <3A9C9702.3010505@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELMEPIFNAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>

djc & mccreath,

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: From: Daniel J. Cody
:
: > (http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/archivemessage.html)
:
: heya.. man that looks kinda crowded especially
: at the top..
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

only kinda though.  i really like what's being done with it.  i'd suggest
dropping the l.e.o link in the breadcrumb trail and/or making some of the
other items shorter.

i really like the layout of the rest of it though.

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
: for sure we should ditch the sidebar, cus
: everything is gonna be wrapped ina  <pre>
: tag. i'd like to ditch it, but there are
: too many things that dropping it may break..
:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

i'd like to see us try to keep that sidebar for now.  let's ditch it as a
last resort.

what we really need is a custom tag that will parse a message, breaking it
into 70 character lines or less depending on where it finds a space
(chr(32)).

another solution might be to use a really big textarea like we use for code
snippets on thesite and include a link to target the message into a new
window with zero formatting around it for those that wanna just read it.
holler if you wanna go this route i've already got the solution for that in
my head.

another thing too, the font size can probably be safely brought down a size
as well.  that will make the lines less likely to break the design except on
the most narrow of resolutions.

just my 2c,

.jeff

name://jeff.howden
game://web.development
http://www.evolt.org/
mailto:jeff at members.evolt.org




From mccreath at ak.net  Tue Feb 27 22:35:38 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Tue Feb 27 22:35:38 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
In-Reply-To: <3A9C9702.3010505@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEMEFFCJAA.mccreath@ak.net>

> From: Daniel J. Cody
>
> heya.. man that looks kinda crowded especially at the top..

Yeah it does, but it might just be because of the <h1> tags on the message
title, and the spacing of the archive nav stuff. Depending on how flexible
the scripting is that builds the page, we can change all that substantially.
I just pasted a real post into the content area. It's pretty funky looking.

> for sure we should ditch the sidebar, cus everything is gonna be
> wrapped ina  <pre> tag. i'd like to ditch it, but there are too many
> things that dropping it may break..

Frankly, I think we can drop the sidebar on the archive *posts*. This may
help on the tips, too, at least in the short term. If we drop the side bar
and play with some colspans on the table, we can probably get the entire
message into the content area. Like this:

<blacktabnavbarthingie />
--------------------------------------
| thelist | archive                  |
--------------------------------------
| bread > crumb > trail              |
| * archive nav                      |
| * bulleted list                    |
|                                    |
| MESSAGE TITLE                      |
| Message                            |
| *******                            |
--------------------------------------
<footer />

What kind of options to we have for formatting the stuff that comes out of
MG? How are you formatting it? CF? Perl? Knowing how much flexibility we
have with the design will help guide some of these decisions.

> not that i'm being critical or anything, i appreciate you doing this
> more than you know :)

Not taken as such. I just wanted to get something up there that we could
start talking about.

> lemme know what you think

mmmkay...

David




From mccreath at ak.net  Tue Feb 27 22:45:37 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Tue Feb 27 22:45:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELMEPIFNAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEGEFGCJAA.mccreath@ak.net>

> From: jeff
>
> djc & mccreath,
>
> :~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> : heya.. man that looks kinda crowded especially
> : at the top..
> :~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
> only kinda though.  i really like what's being done with it.  i'd suggest
> dropping the l.e.o link in the breadcrumb trail and/or making some of the
> other items shorter.

Yeah, we could easily drop that link. We could also shorten the date to an
international standard like 21 Feb 2001.

> i really like the layout of the rest of it though.
>
> :~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> : for sure we should ditch the sidebar, cus
> : everything is gonna be wrapped ina  <pre>
> : tag. i'd like to ditch it, but there are
> : too many things that dropping it may break..
> :~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
> i'd like to see us try to keep that sidebar for now.  let's ditch it as a
> last resort.

I agree in principal, but I think the usage of the sidebar on leo, beo, and
meo is pretty weak right now. I'd like to see us either standardize it
across the domains or really spend some time specializing for each domain
(like put a list archive search in the sidebar on leo). I think either
approach is valid since we're already delineating between domains with the
color schemes.

In terms of the list archive and the tips archive, we have the breadcrumb
trail that arguably obviates the need for the sidebar. It's a little
questionable in terms of usability and design both to change navigation
schemes like that, but it's not unheard of, especially under special
circumstances.

> what we really need is a custom tag that will parse a message, breaking it
> into 70 character lines or less depending on where it finds a space
> (chr(32)).

That would be the sweetest, agreed.

> another solution might be to use a really big textarea like we
> use for code
> snippets on thesite and include a link to target the message into a new
> window with zero formatting around it for those that wanna just read it.
> holler if you wanna go this route i've already got the solution
> for that in
> my head.

Erm. I dunno. I think putting example code into textareas works for the same
reason that dropdown nav menus do. They've been used so long that people
actually do get them, despite certain arguments against their use. I think
we can come up with better alternatives by parsing the output from MG or
reworking the pages.

> another thing too, the font size can probably be safely brought
> down a size
> as well.  that will make the lines less likely to break the
> design except on
> the most narrow of resolutions.

I can agree with that, but it's just picking up the <pre> from the style
sheet. So we can adjust that for this site, adjust it for all sites, or
create a custom class. I'd say adjust it for all the sites if we're going to
go that route.

David




From dave at members.evolt.org  Wed Feb 28 00:34:37 2001
From: dave at members.evolt.org (dave mclean)
Date: Wed Feb 28 00:34:37 2001
Subject: [thesite] Hey! Ho! Let's Go! Hey! Ho! AvantGo!
In-Reply-To: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELOEIHFNAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <B6C1EA06.1C498%dave@members.evolt.org>

On 2/27/01 1:38 AM you wrote:


> : "subscribe" to Web sites and they get the
> : content for you, wrap it up and give it to
> : you.
> :~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 
> ok, that makes alittle more sense.  by "they" are you meaning avantgo when
> referring to who retrieves and wraps up the content?

Yup.  They do.  AvantGo.

> : Additionally, a link depth of 0 will follow no
> : links.
> :~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 
> ok, this makes more sense.  do we need to subscribe for them to be able to
> do this?

No.  It's in the individuals preferences.  We don't need to subscribe at
all, because you can pretty much add any old URI to AvantGo and it will pull
the info down.  Of course if it's a site with all graphics, it's not going
to do very well.
 
> : That's all good. Keeps the content up top,
> : which is really important on the Palm.
> : Content good.
> :~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 
> i just added the categories to the bottom of the page.  lemme know what you
> think.  i've got an avantgo version of the article page done as well.  i
> just have to do alittle work to get an avantgo user page together as well.
> are there any other pages on thesite that you think they should have access
> to?

Okay, it looks good.  One thing: I'm getting a horiz. scroll bar.  I think
it's because the evolt.org logo is too wide.  But not  quite sure.  Overall
though, it looks like a content site.  We could definitely go with a smaller
logo... ie. 75pixels across so that it doesn't dominate the screen at first
glance.

Also I have link depth set for 1, but I couldn't get into any of the
categories.  Are they displaying hard 404s still?  I found that once we
fixed that 404 thing I was able to download the new site without any
problems, it was just ugly.  Now it's prettttty.  Thanks J.

I can get into the articles from their summaries, but can't load the link
that says 'next 5' That's about it.

Oh yeah, you should see aardvark's article on the Palm.  The screen caps
come out nicely, but not exactly readable.  Still cool.

Dave
ps. if anyone else out there has a pda with AvantGo, try adding evolt.org
and let us know what you think. </dam>

_______
"I'll JAVA you, you stupid Web"

              -http://kvetch.com/




From roselli at earthlink.net  Wed Feb 28 00:48:07 2001
From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark)
Date: Wed Feb 28 00:48:07 2001
Subject: [thesite] Hey! Ho! Let's Go! Hey! Ho! AvantGo!
In-Reply-To: <B6C1EA06.1C498%dave@members.evolt.org>
References: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELOEIHFNAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <3A9C58CD.30311.6124433@localhost>

> From: dave mclean <dave at members.evolt.org>
[...] 
> Okay, it looks good.  One thing: I'm getting a horiz. scroll bar.  I
> think it's because the evolt.org logo is too wide.  But not  quite
> sure.  Overall though, it looks like a content site.  We could
> definitely go with a smaller logo... ie. 75pixels across so that it
> doesn't dominate the screen at first glance.

again, lemme know a final size and bit-depth, and i can work one 
up...

> Oh yeah, you should see aardvark's article on the Palm.  The screen
> caps come out nicely, but not exactly readable.  Still cool.

i wanna see !!!   got a digital camera?



From mccreath at ak.net  Wed Feb 28 01:51:07 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Wed Feb 28 01:51:07 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
In-Reply-To: <3A9C9702.3010505@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEOEFMCJAA.mccreath@ak.net>

One last idea before I hit the sack.

Dan, as a temporary fix, you could use print.css and the print header
include to format the archives while we work out what we're going to to with
the red design. At  least that way the logo would be there and we'd have
some font consistency.

(Adrian, I'll address the font units in print.css tomorrow unless Jeff beats
me to it. I think it's probably been like that since the relaunch. :( I
don't recall changing the units from pt to px, but it could have happened in
the frenzy surrounding the first few days post-launch.)

Night-night

David

> -----Original Message-----
> From: thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org
> [mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of Daniel J. Cody
> Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2001 9:13 PM
> To: thesite at lists.evolt.org
> Subject: re: [thesite] need another template..
>
>
> heya.. man that looks kinda crowded especially at the top..
>
> for sure we should ditch the sidebar, cus everything is gonna be
> wrapped ina  <pre> tag. i'd like to ditch it, but there are too many
> things that dropping it may break..
>
> not that i'm being critical or anything, i appreciate you doing this
> more than you know :)
>
> lemme know what you think
>
> _____________
>
> Hey, Dan --
>
> Something along these lines:
>
> http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/archivemessage.html
>
> Unfortunately, we've got the same problem that we have with the tips.
> Preformatted text is going to make the tables puke.
>
> I guess we have a couple of options:
>
> 1) We could drop the right hand menu since we've got the breadcrumb trail
>
> 2) We could drop the <pre> tags and do a whole lotta text
> formatting as the
> stuff comes into the browser to make sure that line breaks show correctly
>
> Opinions?
>
> David
>
>
>  >-----Original Message-----
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
> and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/




From seth at sethbienek.com  Wed Feb 28 08:15:23 2001
From: seth at sethbienek.com (Seth Bienek)
Date: Wed Feb 28 08:15:23 2001
Subject: [thesite] just wondering..
References: <3A9C46E5.4070007@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <003601c0a191$4d7643e0$6ed4fed1@kbiles2>

Hey Dan,

Someone pointed me to that when I first got started on the project.

The custom tag I wrote parses rfc822-formatted text and returns the results
either as a query recordset or an XML file.

It follows the design document guidelines as far as getting the data into a
database; pulling the data out and displaying it in different ways is the
easy part. :)

As far as I know, there are currently two hold-ups on the project.  The
first being that there is not a database to put the tips into;  well, there
IS a database, but it doesn't match the data that we want to pull out of the
lists, or something.  I haven't worked with it in awhile.  The second
hold-up is the performance hit that the webserver takes parsing through the
megabytes upon megabytes of text in the .mbox files, and more importantly,
the database inserts.  The tag parses about 8 emails per second on my
p3-500, 256Ram NT box; it performs similarly on l.e.o., but when we added
the database insert, it slowed to about 10 seconds per tip.

I could run the process on my machine at home on downloaded mbox files, and
then upload an xml file with the results (if you have a way to get the XML
into Oracle), then run daily's on l.e.o. to process new messages, to keep
from tying up l.e.o., but I'm still concerned about the time it's taking to
get the data into Oracle.

I had thought about rewriting the parsing function in PL/SQL, but I don't
know PL/SQL well enough, and don't have the time to tinker with it.

I'm open to suggestions.. :)  Do you still have that XML file I sent you?

----- Original Message -----
From: Daniel J. Cody <djc at starkmedia.com>
Subject: [thesite] just wondering..


> seth, if you ever saw this:
> http://www.easyweb.co.uk/thetips/reqs.html





From djc at starkmedia.com  Wed Feb 28 08:50:53 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Wed Feb 28 08:50:53 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
References: <ANEOJKCILBBIJMGALNELMEPIFNAA.jeff@members.evolt.org>
Message-ID: <3A9D1025.1040500@starkmedia.com>


jeff wrote:


> :~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> : for sure we should ditch the sidebar, cus
> : everything is gonna be wrapped ina  <pre>
> : tag. i'd like to ditch it, but there are
> : too many things that dropping it may break..
> :~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 
> i'd like to see us try to keep that sidebar for now.  let's ditch it as a
> last resort.
> 
> what we really need is a custom tag that will parse a message, breaking it
> into 70 character lines or less depending on where it finds a space
> (chr(32)).

for the time being, this is a totally non CF deal..this is a rewrite of the native MG
archiving shit in Python.

> another solution might be to use a really big textarea like we use for code
> snippets on thesite and include a link to target the message into a new
> window with zero formatting around it for those that wanna just read it.
> holler if you wanna go this route i've already got the solution for that in
> my head.
> 
> another thing too, the font size can probably be safely brought down a size
> as well.  that will make the lines less likely to break the design except on
> the most narrow of resolutions.

Ya think? I thought that replies were hard to read due to the low contrast and the 
<em>edness of them..

*shrug*

.djc.




From seth at sethbienek.com  Wed Feb 28 10:25:08 2001
From: seth at sethbienek.com (Seth Bienek)
Date: Wed Feb 28 10:25:08 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
In-Reply-To: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKEMEFFCJAA.mccreath@ak.net>
Message-ID: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDIIEJLDGAA.seth@sethbienek.com>

Hey David,

> What kind of options to we have for formatting the stuff that comes out of
> MG? How are you formatting it? CF? Perl? Knowing how much flexibility we
> have with the design will help guide some of these decisions.

I've written some CF custom tags that will parse MG email into query
results, we can parse each part of the email into it's own field.

BTW, can anyone tell me why we're using <pre> to format the email text?  Why
not convert it to html?

Seth

------------------------------
Seth Bienek
Solutions Development Manager
Stonebridge Technologies, Inc.
972.455.7294 tel
972.404.9754 fax
ICQ #7673959
------------------------------





From mccreath at ak.net  Wed Feb 28 10:33:08 2001
From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath)
Date: Wed Feb 28 10:33:08 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
In-Reply-To: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDIIEJLDGAA.seth@sethbienek.com>
Message-ID: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKECEGJCJAA.mccreath@ak.net>

Hi, Seth --

> From: Seth Bienek
>
> I've written some CF custom tags that will parse MG email into query
> results, we can parse each part of the email into it's own field.

Cool. So is there a list of "parts" for each message? Like 'date', 'title',
'author', that kind of stuff?

> BTW, can anyone tell me why we're using <pre> to format the email
> text?  Why not convert it to html?

Well, the reason that my example is in <pre> tags is because I wasn't sure
what we might be capable of or how much trouble we wanted to go to for
formatting.

This is what the same page looks like without the <pre> tags:

http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/archivemessage2.html

So if we're going to parse the message and *not* encase it <pre> tags, we
need to be able to separate the different parts of the message. Probably not
impossible, but beyond my capabilities atm.

David




From djc at starkmedia.com  Wed Feb 28 10:41:23 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Wed Feb 28 10:41:23 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
References: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDIIEJLDGAA.seth@sethbienek.com>
Message-ID: <3A9D2A09.4040007@starkmedia.com>


Seth Bienek wrote:


> I've written some CF custom tags that will parse MG email into query
> results, we can parse each part of the email into it's own field.

thats kind of an intermediate step it seems to me.. gosh i sound like an asshole lately. ;)

right now we have static pages. our ideal archive would have pages built from the
DB.. i think it might be a better idea to concenrate on the ideal solution rather
than an intermediate one.. the reason I'm doing this is just to wrap our current
archive in some evolt l&f for people that come in via search engines..

People are going to come in via cached search results for a long time to come, and 
i'd just like to make sure they're getting something nice on the way in..

> BTW, can anyone tell me why we're using <pre> to format the email text?  Why
> not convert it to html?

idealy, ;) we wont

.djc.




From seth at sethbienek.com  Wed Feb 28 10:51:53 2001
From: seth at sethbienek.com (Seth Bienek)
Date: Wed Feb 28 10:51:53 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
In-Reply-To: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKECEGJCJAA.mccreath@ak.net>
Message-ID: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDIGEJPDGAA.seth@sethbienek.com>

Hey David,

> Cool. So is there a list of "parts" for each message? Like
> 'date', 'title',
> 'author', that kind of stuff

Yes.  These are converted into query result columns.  They are the mandatory
mail fields: From, To, Date, Subject, Message-ID, and In-Reply-To.  I can
also tweak the tags to pick up proprietary headers (X-Headers) if we need
to.

> I wasn't sure
> what we might be capable of or how much trouble we wanted to go to for
> formatting.

We can replace carriage returns with <br> and special characters with their
html entity codes.  I think that this would be preferrable to <pre> because
it will allow the text to wrap if it's absolutely necessarry.


Seth

------------------------------
Seth Bienek
Solutions Development Manager
Stonebridge Technologies, Inc.
972.455.7294 tel
972.404.9754 fax
ICQ #7673959
------------------------------

> -----Original Message-----
> From: thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org
> [mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of mccreath
> Sent: Wednesday, February 28, 2001 10:32 AM
> To: thesite at lists.evolt.org
> Subject: RE: [thesite] need another template..
>
>
> Hi, Seth --
>
> > From: Seth Bienek
> >
> > I've written some CF custom tags that will parse MG email into query
> > results, we can parse each part of the email into it's own field.
>
?
>
> > BTW, can anyone tell me why we're using <pre> to format the email
> > text?  Why not convert it to html?
>
> Well, the reason that my example is in <pre> tags is because I wasn't sure
> what we might be capable of or how much trouble we wanted to go to for
> formatting.
>
> This is what the same page looks like without the <pre> tags:
>
> http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/archivemessage2.html
>
> So if we're going to parse the message and *not* encase it <pre> tags, we
> need to be able to separate the different parts of the message.
> Probably not
> impossible, but beyond my capabilities atm.
>
> David
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
> and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/
>
>





From roselli at earthlink.net  Wed Feb 28 10:58:08 2001
From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark)
Date: Wed Feb 28 10:58:08 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
In-Reply-To: <AKELIMCDPENDPCLOGDKECEGJCJAA.mccreath@ak.net>
References: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDIIEJLDGAA.seth@sethbienek.com>
Message-ID: <200102281658.f1SGw2Y28868@leo.evolt.org>

> From: "mccreath" <mccreath at ak.net>
> 
> > BTW, can anyone tell me why we're using <pre> to format the email
> > text?  Why not convert it to html?
> 
> Well, the reason that my example is in <pre> tags is because I wasn't
> sure what we might be capable of or how much trouble we wanted to go
> to for formatting.
> 
> This is what the same page looks like without the <pre> tags:
> 
> http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/archivemessage2.html
> 
> So if we're going to parse the message and *not* encase it <pre> tags,
> we need to be able to separate the different parts of the message.
> Probably not impossible, but beyond my capabilities atm.

i am also in favor of <pre>... assorted reasons...



From seth at sethbienek.com  Wed Feb 28 10:58:23 2001
From: seth at sethbienek.com (Seth Bienek)
Date: Wed Feb 28 10:58:23 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
In-Reply-To: <3A9D2A09.4040007@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDIAEKADGAA.seth@sethbienek.com>

> thats kind of an intermediate step it seems to me..

Do you mean intermediate as in "down the road, when we have time to mess
with all the database stuff", as opposed to "what we have right now and need
to get online ASAP", or do you mean intermediate as in "It's a step out of
the path we need to take in order to get things where we want them to be"?

Because the only reason I can see for even wanting to parse those big-ass
.mbox files is in order to get them into a db...  So we can wrap them in the
nice Evolt l&f...

I guess I'm confused (again).

Seth

------------------------------
Seth Bienek
Solutions Development Manager
Stonebridge Technologies, Inc.
972.455.7294 tel
972.404.9754 fax
ICQ #7673959
------------------------------





From djc at starkmedia.com  Wed Feb 28 11:39:38 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Wed Feb 28 11:39:38 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
References: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDIAEKADGAA.seth@sethbienek.com>
Message-ID: <3A9D37B1.2040702@starkmedia.com>

sorry i'm not the most organized guy this week and not being clear..

i mean option 3 :)

Was gonna address the problems with the inserts that you were talking 
about before.. but i'll get them here.. the main reason the inserts were 
taking so long on the old box was cus i had indexs one for that table..

i dont mind if its a strain on the server actually.. we can set it to 
run overnight or something. sorry i know i was gonna do this before, but 
got sidetracked with something :)

how about this: What do you need from me to get them into the DB? :)

i can break the mbox file up into smaller, less big-assed chunks too

lemme know

Seth Bienek wrote:

>> thats kind of an intermediate step it seems to me..
> 
> 
> Do you mean intermediate as in "down the road, when we have time to mess
> with all the database stuff", as opposed to "what we have right now and need
> to get online ASAP", or do you mean intermediate as in "It's a step out of
> the path we need to take in order to get things where we want them to be"?
> 
> Because the only reason I can see for even wanting to parse those big-ass
> .mbox files is in order to get them into a db...  So we can wrap them in the
> nice Evolt l&f...




From r937 at interlog.com  Wed Feb 28 12:03:23 2001
From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy)
Date: Wed Feb 28 12:03:23 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
Message-ID: <01c0a1b0$b600ddc0$LocalHost@rudy>

>how about this: What do you need from me to get them into the DB?

are you thinking of using the CONTENT table?  it's ready (natch) but there
are several issues, like, how to distinguish tips from articles

perhaps in two stages -- toss them into a TIPS table for now, get that
working, and then we can figure out how to move them into CONTENT -- this
requires changes to existing pages so they can decide whether to filter out
tips or include them


rudy




From seth at sethbienek.com  Wed Feb 28 12:04:39 2001
From: seth at sethbienek.com (Seth Bienek)
Date: Wed Feb 28 12:04:39 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
In-Reply-To: <3A9D37B1.2040702@starkmedia.com>
Message-ID: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDICEKGDGAA.seth@sethbienek.com>

Hey Dan,

> how about this: What do you need from me to get them into the DB? :)

I'm glad you asked.

All I need is a table with no indexes and the following fields (name them
whatever):

listid (fk to lookup table with list names)
messageid (pk)
hdr_message-id (text-75char)
hdr_fromemail (text-100char)
hdr_fromname (text-100char)
hdr_toemail (text-100char - optional may be used instead of listid?)
hdr_subject (text-100char)
hdr_date (date)
hdr_in-reply-to (text-75char)
bdy_content (long, memo, whatever)

I'm sure all of the fields will not be used, initially anyway, but it makes
sense to parse out and keep everything we can for future use.

Of course that table needs to be accessible from the server that we want to
run the function on...

That's really about it.  If you can set that up, and do not mind l.e.o.
being tied up, I can test this afternoon and kick the process in the wee
hours tonight.

Seth

------------------------------
Seth Bienek
Solutions Development Manager
Stonebridge Technologies, Inc.
972.455.7294 tel
972.404.9754 fax
ICQ #7673959
------------------------------

> -----Original Message-----
> From: thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org
> [mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of Daniel J. Cody
> Sent: Wednesday, February 28, 2001 11:39 AM
> To: thesite at lists.evolt.org
> Subject: Re: [thesite] need another template..
>
>
> sorry i'm not the most organized guy this week and not being clear..
>
> i mean option 3 :)
>
> Was gonna address the problems with the inserts that you were talking
> about before.. but i'll get them here.. the main reason the inserts were
> taking so long on the old box was cus i had indexs one for that table..
>
> i dont mind if its a strain on the server actually.. we can set it to
> run overnight or something. sorry i know i was gonna do this before, but
> got sidetracked with something :)
>
> how about this: What do you need from me to get them into the DB? :)
>
> i can break the mbox file up into smaller, less big-assed chunks too
>
> lemme know
>
> Seth Bienek wrote:
>
> >> thats kind of an intermediate step it seems to me..
> >
> >
> > Do you mean intermediate as in "down the road, when we have time to mess
> > with all the database stuff", as opposed to "what we have right
> now and need
> > to get online ASAP", or do you mean intermediate as in "It's a
> step out of
> > the path we need to take in order to get things where we want
> them to be"?
> >
> > Because the only reason I can see for even wanting to parse
> those big-ass
> > .mbox files is in order to get them into a db...  So we can
> wrap them in the
> > nice Evolt l&f...
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
> and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/
>
>





From seth at sethbienek.com  Wed Feb 28 12:23:08 2001
From: seth at sethbienek.com (Seth Bienek)
Date: Wed Feb 28 12:23:08 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
In-Reply-To: <01c0a1b0$b600ddc0$LocalHost@rudy>
Message-ID: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDIAEKIDGAA.seth@sethbienek.com>

> perhaps in two stages -- toss them into a TIPS table for now, get that
> working, and then we can figure out how to move them into CONTENT -- this
> requires changes to existing pages so they can decide whether to
> filter out
> tips or include them

I was thinking, get the emails into a database first and foremost, then we
can run the tip parser against the emails table, and associate the tips with
their original message, thread, author, etc.. that way..  Kinda helps to tie
everything together.  :)

Rudy?  You're the database guy.. Is it doable using the CONTENT table?   We
would need at least 3 content types, and three (or at least two) external
tables, because there are specialty fields associated with each type of
content, right?

Seth

------------------------------
Seth Bienek
Solutions Development Manager
Stonebridge Technologies, Inc.
972.455.7294 tel
972.404.9754 fax
ICQ #7673959
------------------------------





From djc at starkmedia.com  Wed Feb 28 12:23:53 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Wed Feb 28 12:23:53 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
References: <01c0a1b0$b600ddc0$LocalHost@rudy>
Message-ID: <3A9D4211.9010406@starkmedia.com>

this is for regular thelist posts rudy.. would those be a good idea in 
the content table?

rudy wrote:

>> how about this: What do you need from me to get them into the DB?
> 
> 
> are you thinking of using the CONTENT table?  it's ready (natch) but there
> are several issues, like, how to distinguish tips from articles
> 
> perhaps in two stages -- toss them into a TIPS table for now, get that
> working, and then we can figure out how to move them into CONTENT -- this
> requires changes to existing pages so they can decide whether to filter out
> tips or include them
> 
> 
> rudy
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/
> and new & improved kentucky fried old archives:
> http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/old/




From McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us  Wed Feb 28 12:34:53 2001
From: McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us (McCreath_David)
Date: Wed Feb 28 12:34:53 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
Message-ID: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A1237F@EXPO1>

Dan, Rudy, Seth --

FWIW, I'm keeping up with the conversation, but I'd like to see the storage
issue resolved before doing much more work on the template (plus I'm still
writing userdocs all day).

I think if you can figure out a way to get them into the db, it'll be much
easier to create the template. I played around with my idea of dropping the
sidebar and just having one bigass cell for the message, and it still
spreads too far at anything lower than 800x600. I haven't tried dropping the
font size yet. It might work if we can insert <br>s and use a smaller
variable-width font. More later.

David



From r937 at interlog.com  Wed Feb 28 12:39:40 2001
From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy)
Date: Wed Feb 28 12:39:40 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
Message-ID: <01c0a1b5$b7c3f840$LocalHost@rudy>

>... get the emails into a database first and foremost, then we
> can run the tip parser against the emails table, and associate
> the tips with their original message, thread, author, etc.. that way..
> Kinda helps to tie everything together.  :)

+1

> Is it doable using the CONTENT table?

yes, eventually

the thing is, in the CONTENT table, we have the natural structure which
allows tips to be tied to categories and to the tip author (USERS)

and of course we do want tips to be searchable, and in my opinion, we
should have an option on the search form which allows you to specify
      [] articles  [] tips  [] both

however, like i said, this has to be approached in a planned way, so as not
to upset any of the existing pages which (right now) don't have any filters
to select articles, they just assume everything in CONTENT is an article

so it looks like we need (1) a "landing" table for storing list posts, and
(2) a parsed-tips table

when the tip parser has been fully developed/debugged, we can then write
the queries to extract tips from their table and insert them into CONTENT

by the way, this is the normal practice in datawarehousing -- ETL (extract,
transform, load)

it isn't always done by loading data directly into tables, but the
advantage of using tables is that you can use sql, including judicious
use of NVL, CASE, WHERE, UNION, etc.

matching tip authors to USERS should be an interesting exercise   ;o)


rudy








From djc at starkmedia.com  Wed Feb 28 12:46:23 2001
From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody)
Date: Wed Feb 28 12:46:23 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
References: <01c0a1b5$b7c3f840$LocalHost@rudy>
Message-ID: <3A9D4756.5070007@starkmedia.com>

Ok, I'll create the landing table with the parameters that seth 
suggested in his earlier email..

.djc.

rudy wrote:


 > so it looks like we need (1) a "landing" table for storing list 
posts, and
 > (2) a parsed-tips table





From seth at sethbienek.com  Wed Feb 28 13:03:23 2001
From: seth at sethbienek.com (Seth Bienek)
Date: Wed Feb 28 13:03:23 2001
Subject: [thesite] need another template..
In-Reply-To: <01c0a1b5$b7c3f840$LocalHost@rudy>
Message-ID: <FEEILENNJJNPMEGLELDIEEKKDGAA.seth@sethbienek.com>

> matching tip authors to USERS should be an interesting exercise   ;o)

I've put some thought into this, and the email address seems to be a pretty
consistent link between the user profiles and list emails, right?

I mean, aren't people generally required to have their email address in a
profile before they can post to thelist?

I don't think that this is enforced as well on the other lists, though..

We just have to decide wether to disregard the "Author" attribute when it is
specified, or override the email's "from" address as the tip author when the
"Author" attribute IS specified.

On a side note, it would be nice to have a list of "valid" (that is,
to-be-archived) tip tag attributes (i.e. "type", etc.), but that's another
discussion for down the road.

> Ok, I'll create the landing table with the parameters that seth
> suggested in his earlier email..

Excellente'

Ping me when it's ready and I'll play... :)

Seth

------------------------------
Seth Bienek
Solutions Development Manager
Stonebridge Technologies, Inc.
972.455.7294 tel
972.404.9754 fax
ICQ #7673959
------------------------------





From McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us  Wed Feb 28 20:40:10 2001
From: McCreath_David at xmail.asd.k12.ak.us (McCreath_David)
Date: Wed Feb 28 20:40:10 2001
Subject: [thesite] one more attempt at a template
Message-ID: <9627DBCB3063D311BC4B00902785C55F02A1239F@EXPO1>

Dan, rudy, Seth, jeff, aardvark (anyone else interested) --

I took a minute and redid the template based on some things that I inferred
from the conversation earlier today.

http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/archivemessage4.html

Basically, this would require altering Dan's current Python script to do
three things differently:

1) Put the message title in <h2> tags instead of <h1> (the "thelist |
archives" box is now the <h1> tag for the page)

2) Insert a <br> at every line break

3) Drop the <pre> tags

This would preserve the reply/original structure of each message, but put it
into a fluid format.

I also dropped the last item (view by subject, thread, etc.) from the
navigation bullet list that's currently on every message. Since we have the
breadcrumb trail at the top of each message, it's easy to get back to the
weekly index and resort there.

This is of course, a *way* interim solution. Just another idea.

David