From r937 at interlog.com Wed Jan 2 11:32:56 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Wed Jan 2 11:32:56 2002 Subject: [thesite] what do you call this feature? Message-ID: <01c193b3$976fcc40$954c149a@rudy> i'm using internet explorer 5 on a windows machine on the evolt home page, there's a text input field in the sidebar that lets me search articles when i click twice -- not necessarily a doubleclick, just a second click -- the field expands to show my userid, and i can click on it to select it it does not seem to remember other values i use in previous searches the expanded field has this weird triangular widget in the bottom right corner which allows me to click and drag to expand it -- except there's only one entry in it, my userid what's this called, and where does it come from? i assume this is internet explorer in all it's *cough* user-friendly *cough* glory? i did not get the same behaviour on other web forms, so what triggers it? the only difference i can see is that the field on the evolt page has an access key... rudy From gnarly at punkass.com Wed Jan 2 11:42:58 2002 From: gnarly at punkass.com (Olly Hodgson) Date: Wed Jan 2 11:42:58 2002 Subject: [thesite] what do you call this feature? References: <01c193b3$976fcc40$954c149a@rudy> Message-ID: <024e01c193b5$af17f0f0$0100a8c0@olly> ----- Original Message ----- From: "rudy" Subject: [thesite] what do you call this feature? > what's this called, and where does it come from? i assume this is internet > explorer in all it's *cough* user-friendly *cough* glory? I believe its part of IE's AutoComplete jiggery pokery. You probably turned it off at some point without even knowing it. Its quite useful for those forms where you have to fill out your name, street, town, postcode, etc etc etc... Olly. From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Jan 2 11:56:46 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Jan 2 11:56:46 2002 Subject: [thesite] what do you call this feature? In-Reply-To: <01c193b3$976fcc40$954c149a@rudy> Message-ID: On Jan 2, rudy had something to say about [thesite] what do you call this... >i'm using internet explorer 5 on a windows machine > >on the evolt home page, there's a text input field in the sidebar that lets >me search articles > >when i click twice -- not necessarily a doubleclick, just a second click -- >the field expands to show my userid, and i can click on it to select it > >it does not seem to remember other values i use in previous searches > >the expanded field has this weird triangular widget in the bottom right >corner which allows me to click and drag to expand it -- except there's >only one entry in it, my userid > >what's this called, and where does it come from? i assume this is internet >explorer in all it's *cough* user-friendly *cough* glory? > >i did not get the same behaviour on other web forms, so what triggers it? >the only difference i can see is that the field on the evolt page has an >access key... It's AutoComplete and it's on by default. It doesn't work on type="password" fields of if some attribute (like noautocomplete="true" or something) is set. Also, in my experience, it doesn't seem to work anywhere that is in https:// It's rather handy. Though, I think i've turned it off. I can't remember why, though. I think it may have been when I was testing some of my forms and putting a bunch of junk data in the fields, which IE would so kindly remember. -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 2 11:57:50 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 2 11:57:50 2002 Subject: [thesite] what do you call this feature? In-Reply-To: <01c193b3$976fcc40$954c149a@rudy> Message-ID: rudy, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: rudy > > i'm using internet explorer 5 on a windows machine > > on the evolt home page, there's a text input field in > the sidebar that lets me search articles > > when i click twice -- not necessarily a doubleclick, > just a second click -- the field expands to show my > userid, and i can click on it to select it ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ah, you're talking about auto-complete, a new feature in ie4+. it can also be activated by pressing the down arrow key when focus is on a particular field. pressing the down arrow key again will highlight the first item in the list. alternatively, pressing the up arrow key will highlight the last item (or the first if there's only one) in the list. once an entry is highlighted, pressing the tab or enter key will place that value in the field. if you pressed the tab key then the cursor will be moved to the next visible element in the form. in this way, an entire form can still be navigated using only the keyboard while still being able to utilize this handy, time-saving feature. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > it does not seem to remember other values i use in > previous searches ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< it only remembers values on a per-fieldname basis. the more searches you do, the more you'll find will be saved for future use. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > what's this called, and where does it come from? i > assume this is internet explorer in all it's *cough* > user-friendly *cough* glory? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< use a bit before judging it so harshly. i'd be sunk without auto-complete. to me, it's infinitely usable and time-saving. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > i did not get the same behaviour on other web forms, so > what triggers it? the only difference i can see is that > the field on the evolt page has an access key... ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< the more you use other web forms (with some exceptions) the more you'll see it work other places as well. probably the most common is registration forms that ask for common things like first_name, last_name, address, city, zip, phone, email, etc. -- so long as the fieldnames match. more info here: http://support.microsoft.com/support/kb/articles/Q171/2/30.ASP good luck, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From roselli at earthlink.net Wed Jan 2 12:03:26 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Wed Jan 2 12:03:26 2002 Subject: [thesite] what do you call this feature? In-Reply-To: <024e01c193b5$af17f0f0$0100a8c0@olly> Message-ID: <200201021803.g02I3PMm029094@leo.evolt.org> > From: "Olly Hodgson" > > I believe its part of IE's AutoComplete jiggery pokery. You probably > turned it off at some point without even knowing it. > > Its quite useful for those forms where you have to fill out your name, > street, town, postcode, etc etc etc... correct, although i don't know why it's only pulling the one value, and from login at that... i'd venture to guess that shortly after installing IE, you accidentally typed your userid into the search (or you intended to search on your userid), and perhaps after that you disabled the autocomplete ability to log entries...? by the way, you can call certain values in form fields with an IE- specific attribute(s): VCARD_NAME="vCard.FirstName" VCARD_NAME="vCard.LastName" VCARD_NAME="vCard.Company" VCARD_NAME="vCard.Home.StreetAddress" VCARD_NAME="vCard.Home.City" VCARD_NAME="vCard.Home.State" VCARD_NAME="vCard.Home.Zipcode" VCARD_NAME="vCard.Home.Country" VCARD_NAME="vCard.Home.Phone" VCARD_NAME="vCard.Email" you can get more info at the MS site... From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 2 12:05:23 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 2 12:05:23 2002 Subject: [thesite] what do you call this feature? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: matt, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Warden, Matt > > It's AutoComplete and it's on by default. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< there's a popup the first time you use it the asking if you'd like to leave it on (or is it asking to enable it? i don't recall). ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > It doesn't work on type="password" fields of if some > attribute (like noautocomplete="true" or something) > is set. Also, in my experience, it doesn't seem to > work anywhere that is in https:// ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< it also, regrettably, does not work on textareas. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > It's rather handy. Though, I think i've turned it off. > I can't remember why, though. I think it may have been > when I was testing some of my forms and putting a bunch > of junk data in the fields, which IE would so kindly > remember. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ah, then here's a tip. while an item in your auto complete dropdown is highlighted, press the delete key to remove that item from the list. i use auto complete for quick form fill-in when testing/debugging applications. for me, it's a life-saver. i also regularly find myself deleting entries like "asdf", "adsf", etc. or using those entries on registration forms for sites i'm certain will be spamming me. email? down arrow, highlight "asdf at asdf.asd", tab. *grin* good luck, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From webguru at vsnl.net Wed Jan 2 12:44:30 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Wed Jan 2 12:44:30 2002 Subject: [thesite] what do you call this feature? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020103000358.01d79568@203.197.12.4> At 11:34 PM 1/2/2002, .jeff typed these words: >there's a popup the first time you use it the asking if you'd like to leave >it on (or is it asking to enable it? i don't recall). Yep. It asks whether you want to turn it on. >i use auto complete for quick form fill-in when testing/debugging >applications. for me, it's a life-saver. i also regularly find myself [snip] It's saved me so many keystrokes that I'd be lost without it. Every time a user name, email, etc. has to be entered, autocomplete saves me time and also prevents me from making typos. For example, by using the autocomplete for usernames, I make sure that I actually enter "themadman" every time, eliminating the possibility that I might make a mistake typing it in. In fact, I'm thinking of turning it into a usability tool for some sites. If, for instance, I were setting up a bookstore on the Net, it would be helpful to use the same field name for the input box ("field-keywords") as Amazon.com If the user had searched Amazon for a book earlier and searches for the same book on my site, IE's autocomplete would kick in and help the user. Cool, eh? >deleting entries like "asdf", "adsf", etc. or using those entries on >registration forms for sites i'm certain will be spamming me. email? down >arrow, highlight "asdf at asdf.asd", tab. *grin* Use sneakemail.com, Jeff. Track those spammer vermin down. :) Madhu <<< * >>> Madhu Menon User Experience Consultant e-mail: webguru at vsnl.net From r937 at interlog.com Wed Jan 2 13:48:49 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Wed Jan 2 13:48:49 2002 Subject: [thesite] what do you call this feature? Message-ID: <01c193c6$936a27e0$8350149a@rudy> >... it would be helpful to use the same field name for the input box > ("field-keywords") as Amazon.com > If the user had searched Amazon for a book earlier and searches for the > same book on my site, IE's autocomplete would kick in and help the user. > Cool, eh? no, it's evil evil, evil, evil rudy From djc at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 2 13:54:18 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Wed Jan 2 13:54:18 2002 Subject: [thesite] December stats for evolt.org Message-ID: <3C336479.1000401@members.evolt.org> Namaste! December stats for the gamut of evolt.org websites have hatched: Hits: 1.6Mil Page Views: 667,000(new record by over 100,000!) Hosts Served: 88,000 Page Views/day: 22,400 Data transfer: 79Gb(beating last months record - again) Data transfer/day: 2.6Gb of interest(to me at least ;) : top 5 referers for december were google(100k+ - top search term, 'netscape themes'), chip.de(6900 - evolt and the browser archive got a really nice mention on one of germany's largest sites), slashdot.org (6700 - my 'bad robots' article *still* is pulling people in), altavista.com(6500 - apparently they're indexing again.. top search term, 'CV examples'), and google.de(2900 - google's german website, same top keyword as its american cousin..). the number of netscape based browsers visiting evolt.org rose dramatically from last month. in november, about 171,000 total requests were made with netscape browsers. in december, that number shot up to 221,000 requests from netscape browsers; an increase of about 50k total requests. the opera browser also enjoyed an increase of about 10K total requests compared to november. people using mac based operating systems also jumped back ahead those using unix based operating systems to access the evolt sites after the unix folk enjoyed a one month lead in that category(windows based clients still dominate however), and the person using an atari based system who visited evolt last month didn't visit us in december :( top 5 accounts on members.evolt.org in december were deadL0ck, lfloyd, kroet, djc(hi mom!), and waggener. continuing the longstanding trend, netscape based browsers were downloaded more often than their IE counterparts from browsers.evolt.org. for some odd reason, tuesday is the most common day people visit evolt.org sites. for all that and more usefull/less information, http://browsers.evolt.org/stats/stats.dec2001.html is the place to go have fun, and as always, feel free to shout if there are questions or comments :) .djc. -trying to find a witty title no one will get offended by- From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 2 14:24:20 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 2 14:24:20 2002 Subject: [thesite] what do you call this feature? In-Reply-To: <01c193c6$936a27e0$8350149a@rudy> Message-ID: rudy, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: rudy > > no, it's evil > > evil, evil, evil ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< uh, maybe i'm just missing the big-nose smiley, but why do you think it's evil? .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From martin at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 2 15:16:07 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Wed Jan 2 15:16:07 2002 Subject: [thesite] what do you call this feature? In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020103000358.01d79568@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: On Wednesday, January 2, 2002, at 06:43 pm, Madhu Menon wrote: >> deleting entries like "asdf", "adsf", etc. or using those entries on >> registration forms for sites i'm certain will be spamming me. email? >> down >> arrow, highlight "asdf at asdf.asd", tab. *grin* > > Use sneakemail.com, Jeff. Track those spammer vermin down. :) ... > I make sure that I actually enter "themadman" every time, eliminating > the possibility that I might make a mistake typing it in. Alternatively, use unique variations for each site so you know what said vermin are doing with your information. Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 2 15:26:21 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 2 15:26:21 2002 Subject: [thesite] Author Edit Screen Message-ID: <01fb01c193d4$41c71340$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hi Folks .. I've updated the author edit screen somewhat .. only in HTML though, I didn't edit the file directly. Specifically, the author photo and author biography. http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/authoredit.htm Any comments ? Jeff, you want to incorporate changes or should I? I did change the top part, which said "register | evolt.org" to "edit | user profile". Added some additional spacing between each "section" and put reference to thelist after all of the author info. Was unable to change the "browse" button to be white though?? Michele ___________________________ Michele Foster WordPro Services Aurora, Ontario, Canada mailto:michele at wordpro.on.ca http://wordpro.on.ca/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 2 15:27:06 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 2 15:27:06 2002 Subject: [thesite] To Finish teo --> weo Message-ID: <01e401c193c8$7969be80$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hey guys ... Let's recap what's left to be done on teo so we can roll it up to production .. hopefully this week/end. (1) Finish graphical representation of the ratings bar (.jeff). (Includes deleting old) (2) Test/debug addition of Bio and uploading of photo (Michele and others); report any problems ASAP to thesite. (3) Comment out reference to "thelist" on the sidebar .. not complete yet (Dan). (4) Minor editorial changes to user edit screen (bio and pic sections) (Michele & .jeff). (5) Write article for Community News category (Michele input from others). Anything else? Are we good to go with updating the live DB with the changes Dean made? Do they need to be done the same time as teo gets moved up? Or are we going to leave the teo DB this way until we are confident it has undergone enough testing, then change the live DB at another time? Jeff, let me know your schedule, if you're able to finish up what's remaining to be done. Thanks, Michele From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 2 15:27:25 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 2 15:27:25 2002 Subject: [thesite] Photo Uploading not working ? Message-ID: <01ec01c193ca$4740f200$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Looks like we still have a problem ..... tried to upload my photo .. and ... Error Occurred While Processing Request Error Diagnostic Information Error processing CFFILE Unable to move file '/home/evolttest/public_html/evolt/images/4292/author.gif' to path '/home/evolttest/public_html/evolt/images/4292/author.gif'. No such file or directory The error occurred while processing an element with a general identifier of (CFFILE), occupying document position (41:7) to (41:192) in the template file /home/evolttest/public_html/evolt/user/act_process.cfm. Date/Time: Wed Jan 2 14:13:25 2002 Browser: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.5; Windows 98; T312461) Remote Address: 205.207.148.253 HTTP Referrer: http://test.evolt.org/user/index.html?action=edit Query String: section=user&action=process From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 2 15:30:18 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 2 15:30:18 2002 Subject: [thesite] Fw: Photo Uploading not working ? Message-ID: <020801c193d4$ca536f60$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Ooops, let's try to send this again and not to just me. | | And looking on teo .. the directory was created .. but the image not | uploaded. I didn't change any settings on there .. so, feel free to delete | it and I'll try again later. | | Also, if one enters info on teo, they will need to re-add it on weo? Just | the bio, I mean .. the photos in the images directory will be rolled with | everything else? | | Specifically, just wondering if we should call for a few more testers, to | ensure all is working as intended before we roll the new features. | | Mich | | | ----- Original Message ----- | From: "Michele Foster" | | | | | | | Unable to move file | | '/home/evolttest/public_html/evolt/images/4292/author.gif' to path | | '/home/evolttest/public_html/evolt/images/4292/author.gif'. No such file | or | | directory | | | | The error occurred while processing an element with a general identifier | of | | (CFFILE), occupying document position (41:7) to (41:192) in the template | | file /home/evolttest/public_html/evolt/user/act_process.cfm. | | | | | From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 2 15:49:21 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 2 15:49:21 2002 Subject: [thesite] Photo Uploading not working ? In-Reply-To: <01ec01c193ca$4740f200$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > Looks like we still have a problem ..... tried to > upload my photo .. and ... > > > Error Occurred While Processing Request > Error Diagnostic Information > Error processing CFFILE > > Unable to move file > '/home/evolttest/public_html/evolt/images/4292/author.gif' > to path > '/home/evolttest/public_html/evolt/images/4292/author.gif'. > No such file or directory ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i guess i didn't expect anyone to name their image "author.gif" or "author.jpg" before uploading. at any rate, this is now taken into consideration and should no longer be an issue. wanna try again? thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 2 15:50:36 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 2 15:50:36 2002 Subject: [thesite] Fw: Photo Uploading not working ? In-Reply-To: <020801c193d4$ca536f60$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > Also, if one enters info on teo, they will need to > re-add it on weo? Just the bio, I mean .. the photos > in the images directory will be rolled with everything > else? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< correct. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Specifically, just wondering if we should call for a > few more testers, to ensure all is working as intended > before we roll the new features. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i'm cool with that. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 2 15:56:10 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 2 15:56:10 2002 Subject: [thesite] To Finish teo --> weo In-Reply-To: <01e401c193c8$7969be80$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > (1) Finish graphical representation of the ratings bar > (.jeff). (Includes deleting old) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i'm slow, but i'm on it. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > (4) Minor editorial changes to user edit screen (bio > and pic sections) (Michele & .jeff). ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< regarding the notes on your m.e.o. copy: "JEFF, does the file need to be named author.X?" No, that's taken care of server-side. "This is not mandatory. Simple HTML mark-up can be used, if required. JEFF, verify????" Yes, that is true. We should probably take a quick look at what HTML tags we want to enable for this and turn tag-stripping on for all other tags. Anybody have any ideas? How about the same list as are allowed in articles? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Are we good to go with updating the live DB with the > changes Dean made? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< Possibly. That means a more significant amount of downtime though (potentially). I'd prefer to test alittle more before doing that right now. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Do they need to be done the same time as teo gets moved > up? Or are we going to leave the teo DB this way until > we are confident it has undergone enough testing, then > change the live DB at another time? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< That would be my preference, with one exception. We'll need to have one column added to the Users table -- authorbio LONG NULL. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Jeff, let me know your schedule, if you're able to > finish up what's remaining to be done. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< The rest of this week is shot, but next week looks much better. Thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 2 15:59:29 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 2 15:59:29 2002 Subject: [thesite] Author Edit Screen In-Reply-To: <01fb01c193d4$41c71340$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > Jeff, you want to incorporate changes or should I? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< doesn't matter, but some of them will involve some coldfusion. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > I did change the top part, which said "register | > evolt.org" to "edit | user profile". ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< this is both the new user signup form as well as the existing user edit form. so, the text you changed at the top will actually have to be displayed conditionally. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Added some additional spacing between each "section" and > put reference to thelist after all of the author info. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i'm cool with thelist stuff being after author stuff i guess. it just means that thelist won't get as much exposure. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Was unable to change the "browse" button to be white > though?? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< yeah, nothing you can do about that actually. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 2 16:15:10 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 2 16:15:10 2002 Subject: [thesite] Testers Please ... :) Message-ID: <023c01c193d8$fdad5a20$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hi Folks ... Anyone with a few minutes .. can ya give a final run through on t.e.o. Specifically we want to make sure there are no problems uploading a photo and author bio. Head on over to t.e.o. (http://test.evolt.org), login, click on Edit Account (sidebar), upload a photo (NOTE, size restrictions) and enter a bio, update profile. Double check that photo and bio appear on your articles. Note that the bio will need to be entered again on w.e.o. if you want it on there. The photo will automatically be rolled over when teo goes to weo later this week. Please post browser and platform info when testing. Even if all is working, that's great too. Just want to try and cover the bases before we release this to the main site. I've tested in IE5.5, PC. Thanks, Michele From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 2 16:17:49 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 2 16:17:49 2002 Subject: [thesite] Photo Uploading not working ? References: Message-ID: <023b01c193d8$9df3bca0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> haha That answers that question. Oh well, ya knew *someone* was gonna try that. All is fine now. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: ".jeff" | i guess i didn't expect anyone to name their image "author.gif" or | "author.jpg" before uploading. at any rate, this is now taken into | consideration and should no longer be an issue. wanna try again? | From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 2 16:27:31 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 2 16:27:31 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Info Updated Message-ID: <024601c193d9$7e90f520$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Jeff, After one enters their info .. if they wait long enough ;) .. the page after "user info updated" redirects to the user search page. Can it go somewhere else, like back to the user's edit screen, or else just don't redirect anywhere? Might be just me, but I find the redirects confusing and unnecessary at times. Mich From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 2 16:51:10 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 2 16:51:10 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Info Updated In-Reply-To: <024601c193d9$7e90f520$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > After one enters their info .. if they wait long > enough ;) [...] ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< yeah, 10 seconds. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > .. the page after "user info updated" redirects to the > user search page. Can it go somewhere else, like back > to the user's edit screen, or else just don't redirect > anywhere? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< it's supposed to go back to the user's info screen. i dunno why you'd want it to go back to the edit screen -- that'd be even more confusing than it is now. i'll try to fix it so it goes to the user's info screen of the user that was just edited (don't forget that godmins can edit any user including other godmins). ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Might be just me, but I find the redirects confusing and > unnecessary at times. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< yes, something that will be addressed in v3.0. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From gnarly at punkass.com Wed Jan 2 17:08:58 2002 From: gnarly at punkass.com (Olly Hodgson) Date: Wed Jan 2 17:08:58 2002 Subject: [thesite] Testers Please ... :) References: <023c01c193d8$fdad5a20$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <012301c193e3$23cfba40$0100a8c0@olly> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michele Foster" Subject: [thesite] Testers Please ... :) > Anyone with a few minutes .. can ya give a final run through on t.e.o. Hi, Is the new rating system supposed to work yet? Its just that I tried to rate an article (http://test.evolt.org/article/Testing_CLOB/18/17406/index.html) using the new ratings system and got this lot for my efforts... - Error Diagnostic Information Oracle Error Code = 2291 ORA-02291: integrity constraint (EVOLTTEST.SYS_C001759) violated - parent key not found SQL = "INSERT INTO rating ( ratingid , contentid , userid , ratingvalue , datecreated , lastmod) VALUES (evolt_seq.NextVal , 17406 , 9092 , 2 , sysdate , sysdate)" Data Source = "EVOLTTEST" The error occurred while processing an element with a general identifier of (CFQUERY), occupying document position (25:4) to (25:52) in the template file /home/evolttest/public_html/evolt/rate/act_process.cfm. Date/Time: Wed Jan 2 17:05:25 2002 Browser: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.5; Windows NT 5.0; T312461) Remote Address: 213.122.19.100 HTTP Referrer: http://test.evolt.org/article/Testing_CLOB/18/17406/index.html Query String: section=rate&subsection=Testing_CLOB&action=process - HTH in some way, Olly. From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 2 17:11:32 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 2 17:11:32 2002 Subject: [thesite] To Finish teo --> weo References: Message-ID: <026b01c193e2$f41b3400$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> ----- Original Message ----- From: ".jeff" | michele, | | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | > From: Michele Foster | > | > (1) Finish graphical representation of the ratings bar | > (.jeff). (Includes deleting old) | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | i'm slow, but i'm on it. Sounds good .. :) | | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | > (4) Minor editorial changes to user edit screen (bio | > and pic sections) (Michele & .jeff). | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | regarding the notes on your m.e.o. copy: | | "JEFF, does the file need to be named author.X?" | | No, that's taken care of server-side. Yeah, deleted that reference since. | | "This is not mandatory. Simple HTML mark-up can be | used, if required. JEFF, verify????" | | Yes, that is true. We should probably take a quick look at what HTML tags | we want to enable for this and turn tag-stripping on for all other tags. | Anybody have any ideas? How about the same list as are allowed in articles? I can't imagine the need to allow more than paragraph tags (and
) and tags .. but then I'm not sure what authors are going to want to put in there. Simple is better though, I would think, since this information isn't reviewed prior to submission. But, it really doesn't matter to me personally .. just thinking of different scenarios. Others ? | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | > Are we good to go with updating the live DB with the | > changes Dean made? | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | Possibly. That means a more significant amount of downtime though | (potentially). I'd prefer to test alittle more before doing that right now. Sounds good to me. | | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | > Do they need to be done the same time as teo gets moved | > up? Or are we going to leave the teo DB this way until | > we are confident it has undergone enough testing, then | > change the live DB at another time? | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | That would be my preference, with one exception. We'll need to have one | column added to the Users table -- authorbio LONG NULL. Can you do this? Or Rudy/Dan ? | | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | > Jeff, let me know your schedule, if you're able to | > finish up what's remaining to be done. | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | The rest of this week is shot, but next week looks much better. Ok .. :) Mich From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 2 17:17:06 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 2 17:17:06 2002 Subject: [thesite] Testers Please ... :) In-Reply-To: <012301c193e3$23cfba40$0100a8c0@olly> Message-ID: olly, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Olly Hodgson > > > Anyone with a few minutes .. can ya give a final run > > through on t.e.o. > > Is the new rating system supposed to work yet? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< only the look and feel of the rating system will change. nothing about the server-side functionality of it has changed so should continue to work as it always has. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Its just that I tried to rate an article > (http://test.evolt.org/article/thesite/18/17406/) using > the new ratings system and got this lot for my > efforts... > > - > Error Diagnostic Information > Oracle Error Code = 2291 > ORA-02291: integrity constraint (EVOLTTEST.SYS_C001759) > violated - parent key not found SQL = "INSERT INTO > rating ( ratingid , contentid , userid , ratingvalue , > datecreated , lastmod) VALUES (evolt_seq.NextVal , > 17406 , 9092 , 2 , sysdate , sysdate)" ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< that looks to be a symptom of the recent changes dean made. dean, any thoughts on this? thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 2 17:18:40 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 2 17:18:40 2002 Subject: [thesite] Author Edit Screen References: Message-ID: <027001c193e3$f52b4f00$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> ----- Original Message ----- From: ".jeff" | michele, | | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | > From: Michele Foster | > | > Jeff, you want to incorporate changes or should I? | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | doesn't matter, but some of them will involve some coldfusion. Will do the cosmetic changes than I can figure out easily enough. | | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | > I did change the top part, which said "register | | > evolt.org" to "edit | user profile". | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | this is both the new user signup form as well as the existing user edit | form. so, the text you changed at the top will actually have to be | displayed conditionally. Right .. will leave this up to you if you think it's necessary. I only made the change on the html mock up I was working on. | | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | > Added some additional spacing between each "section" and | > put reference to thelist after all of the author info. | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | i'm cool with thelist stuff being after author stuff i guess. it just means | that thelist won't get as much exposure. Yeah .. that's a definite downside. A problem that is bigger than just cleaning up the edit screen. In fact, I don't see a need for the author pic and bio to be on the Join page, but rather on the Edit page .. but then how is one to know they can enter that information. Rock and a hard place. I'll leave thelist info where it exists now .. the bigger problem can be dealt with the redesign, IA or ueue initiatives. ;) Michele From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 2 17:21:17 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 2 17:21:17 2002 Subject: [thesite] To Finish teo --> weo In-Reply-To: <026b01c193e2$f41b3400$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > | "This is not mandatory. Simple HTML mark-up can be > | used, if required. JEFF, verify????" > | > | Yes, that is true. We should probably take a quick > | look at what HTML tags we want to enable for this and > | turn tag-stripping on for all other tags. Anybody > | have any ideas? How about the same list as are > | allowed in articles? > > I can't imagine the need to allow more than paragraph > tags (and
) and tags .. but then I'm not sure > what authors are going to want to put in there. Simple > is better though, I would think, since this information > isn't reviewed prior to submission. But, it really > doesn't matter to me personally .. just thinking of > different scenarios. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ok, how about the following: a,b,br,dd,dl,dt,em,hr,i,li,ol,p,ul,strong that should cover most anything anyone might wanna put in there, with the exception of images (not sure we want those in there anyway. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > | That would be my preference, with one exception. > | We'll need to have one column added to the Users > | table -- authorbio LONG NULL. > > Can you do this? Or Rudy/Dan ? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i don't think i have direct access to weo so dan or rudy will probably need to take care of that. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 2 17:26:53 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 2 17:26:53 2002 Subject: [thesite] Testers Please ... :) References: Message-ID: <027d01c193e5$18f6b5e0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Interestingly .. doesn't seem to be a problem on old articles, yet it is throwing an error here too on the new one Dean added while testing the other day. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: ".jeff" | that looks to be a symptom of the recent changes dean made. dean, any | thoughts on this? | From dmah at shaw.ca Wed Jan 2 17:49:22 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Wed Jan 2 17:49:22 2002 Subject: [thesite] Testers Please ... :) In-Reply-To: <012301c193e3$23cfba40$0100a8c0@olly> from "Olly Hodgson" at Jan 02, 2002 11:13:49 PM Message-ID: <200201022349.QAA03786@alice.monkeyland.ca> Ah, it looks like the evolt.org database does have foreign key constraints contrary to popular belief. This is a side-effect of the table changes that I made. The RATING table still has a foreign key relationship on the original content table. I'll move that now. Please test again. Dean Olly Hodgson writes: > > Anyone with a few minutes .. can ya give a final run through on t.e.o. > > Hi, > > Is the new rating system supposed to work yet? > > Its just that I tried to rate an article > (http://test.evolt.org/article/Testing_CLOB/18/17406/index.html) using the > new ratings system and got this lot for my efforts... From gnarly at punkass.com Wed Jan 2 17:57:24 2002 From: gnarly at punkass.com (Olly Hodgson) Date: Wed Jan 2 17:57:24 2002 Subject: [thesite] Testers Please ... :) References: <200201022349.QAA03786@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <01e001c193e9$e7fb3e70$0100a8c0@olly> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dean Mah" Subject: Re: [thesite] Testers Please ... :) > Ah, it looks like the evolt.org database does have foreign key > constraints contrary to popular belief. > > This is a side-effect of the table changes that I made. The RATING > table still has a foreign key relationship on the original content > table. I'll move that now. > > Please test again. Sorted. Works now. (New Ratings on http://test.evolt.org/article/Testing_CLOB/18/17406/index.html tested with IE5.5 on W2K Pro) Olly. From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 2 23:55:13 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 2 23:55:13 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ping Message-ID: <02bf01c1941b$5db11a00$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Sleep time. From hblair at hotfootmail.com Wed Jan 2 23:58:59 2002 From: hblair at hotfootmail.com (Hugh Blair) Date: Wed Jan 2 23:58:59 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ping In-Reply-To: <02bf01c1941b$5db11a00$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: pong. > Sleep time. From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 00:45:05 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 00:45:05 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done Message-ID: <02dc01c19422$55ca3a40$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Jeff, I incorporated all of the changes .. I think everything is a-ok .. the file is backed up just in case anything got messy. I added the part to show "register | evolt.org" and "modify | user profile". I took a guess, and it works .. I can copy & paste with the best of them .. but please check anyway ;) I included the tags you suggest in the author's bio write up .. but processing that I'll gladly leave up to you. :) We sure didn't get many testers .. :( Head on over to t.e.o. (http://test.evolt.org), login, click on Edit Account (sidebar), upload a photo (NOTE, size restrictions) and enter a bio, update profile. Any other comments from anyone else? Michele From webguru at vsnl.net Thu Jan 3 01:50:56 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Thu Jan 3 01:50:56 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <02dc01c19422$55ca3a40$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020103125018.01b66218@203.197.12.4> At 12:16 PM 1/3/2002, Michele Foster typed these words: >Head on over to t.e.o. (http://test.evolt.org), login, click on Edit Account >(sidebar), upload a photo (NOTE, size restrictions) and enter a bio, update >profile. > >Any other comments from anyone else? Yeah. 1) I thought we were going to discuss the image dimensions on theforum. IMNSHO, 180*90 is really weird. People's faces are not in a 2:1 ratio. Don't believe me? Measure the length of your face and compare it to its width. It's more like 1:1.5 (although the shapes of faces vary - a lot) I propose 120*140 instead. 2) I've also got a couple of minor issues with the "Options" checkboxes. a) They're verbose. "If this box is checked, you will receive notification when people comment on your articles." can be replaced with a simpler, "Notify me when people comment on my articles". We can safely assume that our audience knows that a checkbox needs to be checked (unlike my mother). b) A checkbox is an affirmative UI element. (My term. Like it?) Always use a checkbox to say "yes" to doing something. Only shady sites use it to NOT do something. Remember how some sites say, "Check this if you do *not* want to receive mails from our sponsors"? Therefore, I suggest we change the text to "Display my email address on the author information page" and leave it checked by default. 3) As for allowed HTML tags, I don't see a reason to allow all the tags used in articles. IMO, only the following will suffice:

,
,,,,, 4) In the author's photo bit, change: "Note that the image must be in "GIF" or "JPG" format, and must be exactly 180 pixels wide by 90 pixels tall." to bulleted points. Boldface "exactly". 5) Last question: what will be shown in the "author photo" section when a photo already exists? Will there be any indication that it does? That's it for me. Sorry I haven't been able to test the photo uploading bit. I couldn't find any way to squeeze any of my photos into 180*90 without cutting out parts of my face ;) Madhu <<< * >>> Madhu Menon User Experience Consultant e-mail: webguru at vsnl.net From gnarly at punkass.com Thu Jan 3 03:55:43 2002 From: gnarly at punkass.com (Olly Hodgson) Date: Thu Jan 3 03:55:43 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: <02dc01c19422$55ca3a40$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <00a801c1943c$7e732af0$0100a8c0@Comp2> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michele Foster" Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done > We sure didn't get many testers .. :( > > Head on over to t.e.o. (http://test.evolt.org), login, click on Edit Account > (sidebar), upload a photo (NOTE, size restrictions) and enter a bio, update > profile. > > Any other comments from anyone else? Are the picture and/or bio supposed to show up on the member info page? (I cant remember what was decided :-) I now have a pic and bio but theres no sign of them at http://test.evolt.org/user/gnarly/9092/index.html Olly. From dmah at shaw.ca Thu Jan 3 07:54:30 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Thu Jan 3 07:54:30 2002 Subject: [thesite] Testers Please ... :) In-Reply-To: <023c01c193d8$fdad5a20$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> from "Michele Foster" at Jan 02, 2002 05:01:11 PM Message-ID: <200201031354.GAA00914@alice.monkeyland.ca> - NN4.76, Linux 2.2 Worked without problem. I agree with Madhu that the checkbox text is a little verbose and not intuitive. Dean Michele Foster writes: > Anyone with a few minutes .. can ya give a final run through on t.e.o. > Specifically we want to make sure there are no problems uploading a photo > and author bio. > > I've tested in IE5.5, PC. From djc at starkmedia.com Thu Jan 3 09:33:07 2002 From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Thu Jan 3 09:33:07 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020103125018.01b66218@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: <3C3478A2.4000201@starkmedia.com> i know we(jeff and i) rapped about this on irc the other day, but madhu brings up a good point.. i couldn't find any pictures that were lengthwise of myself either. headshots are usually taller than wide so uimm. +1 Madhu Menon wrote: > 1) I thought we were going to discuss the image dimensions on theforum. > IMNSHO, 180*90 is really weird. People's faces are not in a 2:1 ratio. > Don't believe me? Measure the length of your face and compare it to its > width. It's more like 1:1.5 (although the shapes of faces vary - a lot) > > I propose 120*140 instead. From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 09:33:30 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 09:33:30 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020103125018.01b66218@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: <002101c1946c$2a56e080$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Madhu, ----- Original Message ----- From: "Madhu Menon" | At 12:16 PM 1/3/2002, Michele Foster typed these words: | >Head on over to t.e.o. (http://test.evolt.org), login, click on Edit Account | >(sidebar), upload a photo (NOTE, size restrictions) and enter a bio, update | >profile. | > | >Any other comments from anyone else? | | Yeah. | | 1) I thought we were going to discuss the image dimensions on theforum. | IMNSHO, 180*90 is really weird. People's faces are not in a 2:1 ratio. | Don't believe me? Measure the length of your face and compare it to its | width. It's more like 1:1.5 (although the shapes of faces vary - a lot) | | I propose 120*140 instead. Doesn't matter to me .. Jeff will have to modify the code for that .. I only update the text ;) | | | 2) I've also got a couple of minor issues with the "Options" checkboxes. | | a) They're verbose. | "If this box is checked, you will receive notification when people comment | on your articles." can be replaced with a simpler, "Notify me when people | comment on my articles". We can safely assume that our audience knows that | a checkbox needs to be checked (unlike my mother). | | b) A checkbox is an affirmative UI element. (My term. Like it?) Always use | a checkbox to say "yes" to doing something. Only shady sites use it to NOT | do something. Remember how some sites say, "Check this if you do *not* want | to receive mails from our sponsors"? | | Therefore, I suggest we change the text to "Display my email address on the | author information page" and leave it checked by default. These weren't modified in any way. Your suggestions sound fine .. I've no problem changing them .. but someone else will need to double check the code and that they will still work properly or make modifications as necessary. Jeff or Dan will have to deal with this. Specficially, the first option (the second one you list) will change, as you are suggesting checking if you DO want your email displayed, whereas currently it is check if you DO NOT want your email displayed. So, the trigger has to change that gets put into the DB. (If we go with the new wording that is.) | | | 3) As for allowed HTML tags, I don't see a reason to allow all the tags | used in articles. IMO, only the following will suffice: | |

,
,,,,, Doesn't matter to me personally ...... I used Jeff's list that he had ... Jeff, whatcha think? | | | 4) In the author's photo bit, change: | | "Note that the image must be in "GIF" or "JPG" format, and must be exactly | 180 pixels wide by 90 pixels tall." | | to bulleted points. Boldface "exactly". | Ok, this I can do .. but I'll wait until the image dimensions are decided for sure. ;) | | 5) Last question: what will be shown in the "author photo" section when a | photo already exists? Will there be any indication that it does? Yeah, the photo shows up if it is there .. once you upload it, save the changes then go back to that page the photo displays, along with a checkbox that says "Delete the current photo without replacing it?" Michele From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 09:39:01 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 09:39:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <02dc01c19422$55ca3a40$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: I tested it, but everything went okay (except that I didn't notice the directional components of the dimensions and made my image 90 wide and 180 high. It looked funny.), so I didn't say anything. Bad tester! *swat* Netscape 6.2, W2K I agree with the few comments that 180w x 90h is a weird aspect, but I wasn't in on the original discussions. However, I would like to opine that any *bigger* than that would be too big. Madhu, if you put a 120w x 140h picture in that box, you'd be using a fairly significant chunk of page real estate for the picture, even on a 600 x 800 screen, especially if you take into account the rest of the box. Not to derail the progress, and knowing that I wasn't here for the original conversation, but is there a reason that we can't specify a *maximum* width and height and let people work within those? Don't hold up the code roll because of this, but I'm curious. FWIW, I just made mine a transparent gif. http://test.evolt.org/article/blah/1/16189/index.html Can we lose the border around the image? I don't think it's necessary, and it's not the same size as the

below (the
is a few pixels wider), so it bugs the anal retentive in me. David From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 09:39:04 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 09:39:04 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: <02dc01c19422$55ca3a40$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <00a801c1943c$7e732af0$0100a8c0@Comp2> Message-ID: <003101c1946c$f0aaf8c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Olly, ----- Original Message ----- From: "Olly Hodgson" | Are the picture and/or bio supposed to show up on the member info page? (I | cant remember what was decided :-) | | I now have a pic and bio but theres no sign of them at | http://test.evolt.org/user/gnarly/9092/index.html Thanks for testing .... Since you haven't written an article .. the information isn't displayed anywhere yet. Jeff, how difficult would it be to add the author's pic and bio to the user page? I know it'll all change once the redesign is done and the member pages take over. As an interim measure, is the effort there worth adding these two pieces to that page? Michele From miriam at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 09:39:45 2002 From: miriam at members.evolt.org (Miriam Frost) Date: Thu Jan 3 09:39:45 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020103125018.01b66218@203.197.12.4> <3C3478A2.4000201@starkmedia.com> Message-ID: <001501c1946c$aac06980$79cff3cd@walthers.com> +1 Subject: Re: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done > > 1) I thought we were going to discuss the image dimensions on theforum. > > IMNSHO, 180*90 is really weird. People's faces are not in a 2:1 ratio. > > Don't believe me? Measure the length of your face and compare it to its > > width. It's more like 1:1.5 (although the shapes of faces vary - a lot) > > I propose 120*140 instead. From skaiser1 at skdesigns.com Thu Jan 3 09:45:42 2002 From: skaiser1 at skdesigns.com (Shirley Kaiser, SKDesigns) Date: Thu Jan 3 09:45:42 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020103125018.01b66218@203.197.12.4> References: <02dc01c19422$55ca3a40$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020103074211.01eb32d0@mail.midtown.net> At 11:49 PM 01/02/2002, Madhu Menon typed: >1) I thought we were going to discuss the image dimensions on theforum. >IMNSHO, 180*90 is really weird. People's faces are not in a 2:1 ratio. >Don't believe me? Measure the length of your face and compare it to its >width. It's more like 1:1.5 (although the shapes of faces vary - a lot) > >I propose 120*140 instead. +1 -- Shirley E. Kaiser, M.A. SKDesigns mailto:skaiser at skdesigns.com Website Design, Development http://www.skdesigns.com/ Pianist, Composer http://www.shirleykaiser.com/ Brainstorms and Raves http://www.brainstormsandraves.com/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 09:46:11 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 09:46:11 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: Message-ID: <003a01c1946d$ee5b6e00$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> ----- Original Message ----- From: "mccreath" | | I agree with the few comments that 180w x 90h is a weird aspect, but I | wasn't in on the original discussions. However, I would like to opine that | any *bigger* than that would be too big. Madhu, if you put a 120w x 140h | picture in that box, you'd be using a fairly significant chunk of page real | estate for the picture, even on a 600 x 800 screen, especially if you take | into account the rest of the box. That's a good point ... what "would" be a good size of image? I think we want to maintain consistency and enforce a specific image size for all pics. So that the block of information is always the same .. I'm guessing anyway. Anyone have time to mock up a couple samples at different image sizes so we can pick the one that looks the best within the block? | | http://test.evolt.org/article/blah/1/16189/index.html | | Can we lose the border around the image? I don't think it's necessary, and | it's not the same size as the
below (the
is a few pixels wider), | so it bugs the anal retentive in me. Does look odd when the image doesn't fill the box .. looks like that block isn't centred. Let's play with the image size, then tweak the box a bit more. Michele From miriam at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 10:11:13 2002 From: miriam at members.evolt.org (Miriam Frost) Date: Thu Jan 3 10:11:13 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: <003a01c1946d$ee5b6e00$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <004301c19471$10f8ca40$79cff3cd@walthers.com> Hmm. Thinking about this a bit more... I really like the look of the wide picture, but admittedly, it might be tricky to find a pic that works in that size. What if we offer two size options, one the nice wide-look format, and one for smaller headshots like the other one that was posted a few minutes ago? (Sorry, can't find the link, just deleted a bunch of mail. D'oh.) > From: "mccreath" > | I agree with the few comments that 180w x 90h is a weird aspect, but I > | wasn't in on the original discussions. However, I would like to opine that > | any *bigger* than that would be too big. Madhu, if you put a 120w x 140h > | picture in that box, you'd be using a fairly significant chunk of page > That's a good point ... what "would" be a good size of image? I think we > want to maintain consistency and enforce a specific image size for all pics. > Does look odd when the image doesn't fill the box .. looks like that block > isn't centred. Let's play with the image size, then tweak the box a bit > more. From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 10:15:38 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 10:15:38 2002 Subject: [thesite] Evolt Images Message-ID: <006b01c19472$0d576b20$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Adrian and Olly (and everyone else) I've forgotten all about this .. and now I can't remember what I'm supposed to do. (Sorry this is a conversation from early Dec.) We talked about adding source files to the images FAQ .. but I don't know which files on Adrian's site to actually add... http://roselli.org/new_evolt/logos.asp logo_all_50.psd ? or logo_all.psd ? What about the cubes? Also, I just now d/l the file Olly posted, referenced below .. and its a variation of the logo .. "hosted by evolt.org" .. should it just be added as a gif? Or also added as a source file? Or should we keep the source files as only the "official" logos? "confused" Michele ----- Original Message ----- From: "Olly Hodgson" | On a related note, I have put together a PSD (Photoshop 6) file based on the | transparent logo images on... | http://www.evolt.org/evolt_images/ | | Everything is on separate layers, and it has a transparent background, so | that I could set my own alias colour in PS's Save for Web dialog (for | instance I use #6699CC on my site). Its on... | http://members.evolt.org/gnarly/evolt_bits/small_evolt_logo.psd | ..at present but I was wondering if it was worth adding it to the evolt | image collection in its present PSD format? That way other people can set up | their own alias colour using the Save for Web dialog - the current .gif | images only provide for black and white do they not? From roselli at earthlink.net Thu Jan 3 10:49:09 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Thu Jan 3 10:49:09 2002 Subject: [thesite] Evolt Images In-Reply-To: <006b01c19472$0d576b20$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <200201031649.g03Gn8lf009754@leo.evolt.org> > From: "Michele Foster" [...] > We talked about adding source files to the images FAQ .. but I don't > know which files on Adrian's site to actually add... > > http://roselli.org/new_evolt/logos.asp > > logo_all_50.psd ? > or > logo_all.psd ? logo_all_50.psd is the proper version of the logo with the cube lines aliased... logo_all.psd is the EPS converted to a PSD and with the RGB colors inserted... it's a good base to make any size image, assuming the person doing it then aliases the edges of the cubes... > What about the cubes? mini-cubes? i like the ones we're using for number of articles better, even though they aren't the exact replica of the logo cubes... > Also, I just now d/l the file Olly posted, referenced below .. and its > a variation of the logo .. "hosted by evolt.org" .. should it just be > added as a gif? Or also added as a source file? Or should we keep > the source files as only the "official" logos? we should add it to the evolt.org 50px file, but as a mini-font so aliasing it isn't an issue... if people need a smaller version of the logo, they just take that layer with the 'hosted by' and stuff it into a smaller version of the logo... we can't build *all* the files everyone might need, but we can give them all the building blocks... i can work on that later on... From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 11:17:01 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 11:17:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Evolt Images References: <200201031649.g03Gn8lf009754@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <000e01c1947a$8cb0c300$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Awesome .. thanks. Holler if there's anything I need to do .. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "aardvark" | we should add it to the evolt.org 50px file, but as a mini-font so | aliasing it isn't an issue... if people need a smaller version of the | logo, they just take that layer with the 'hosted by' and stuff it into a | smaller version of the logo... we can't build *all* the files everyone | might need, but we can give them all the building blocks... | | i can work on that later on... From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 12:06:13 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David Mccreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 12:06:13 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done Message-ID: <8344126.4126834@augustine.gci.net> > what "would" be a good size of image? I think we > want to maintain consistency and enforce a specific image size > for all pics. So that the block of information is always the > same .. I'm guessing anyway. Okay -- for the sake of conversation (and still with trepidation of rehasing stuff that's already been decided) ... Is it really necessary that the pictures all be the same size? Everything else on the site is fluid and the way that block is built (using a right-aligned table), the text will flow around it as necessary. Can we just specify a maximum size in each direction and let people upload what they want? I think the current sizes are reasonable as maximums: a 90px tall picture with a 1:1.5 (w:h) aspect would be 60px wide, which seems plenty big for a headshot to me. If you wanted to give a little more room for traditional headshots, you could bump the height up to 98px, which would give you a width of 72px. David From roselli at earthlink.net Thu Jan 3 12:15:44 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Thu Jan 3 12:15:44 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <8344126.4126834@augustine.gci.net> Message-ID: <200201031815.g03IFhlf012525@leo.evolt.org> > From: David Mccreath [...] > Is it really necessary that the pictures all be the same size? > Everything else on the site is fluid and the way that block is built > (using a right-aligned table), the text will flow around it as > necessary. [...] then what do we put in the width and height attributes? missing width/height will fail validation... From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 13:16:35 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 13:16:35 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: <200201031815.g03IFhlf012525@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <3C34AE13.2060301@ak.net> > [...] > >>Is it really necessary that the pictures all be the same size? >>Everything else on the site is fluid and the way that block is built >>(using a right-aligned table), the text will flow around it as >>necessary. >> > [...] > > then what do we put in the width and height attributes? > > missing width/height will fail validation... Truedat. Check the file as the page is loading and plop the dimensions in? That's probably a little hard on the server since we're loading that picture on every single article page (instead of just the user's page), so it may not be worth it at this point. (Don't know enough about CF to figure it out, but I know two ways to do it in an IIS/ASP envrionment would be with a compiled component or the FileSystemObject, both of which have their drawbacks.) Is something like ImageMagick an option here? Or is that only useful in the uploading process than the viewing process? I'm really okay with it the way it is, especially since I can't offer any code fixes, and I'm not against requiring a specific image size, it just seems like an unusual aspect where most people will likely want to upload a headshot. Tha'sall. Reiterating, just to make sure everyone gets sick of hearing it: I know this has all been discussed. I only jumped in when someone asked for specific input. :) David From webguru at vsnl.net Thu Jan 3 13:29:28 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Thu Jan 3 13:29:28 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <003a01c1946d$ee5b6e00$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020104004714.01c6cfe8@203.197.12.4> At 09:17 PM 1/3/2002, Michele Foster typed these words: >That's a good point ... what "would" be a good size of image? I think we >want to maintain consistency and enforce a specific image size for all pics. >So that the block of information is always the same .. I'm guessing anyway. OK, so clearly 140*120 is a bit too big to fit well into the existing design. 100*80, however, is pretty good. (Well, considering that it's going against an olive-khaki background.) >Anyone have time to mock up a couple samples at different image sizes so we >can pick the one that looks the best within the block? I've done two: 1) http://members.evolt.org/madhu/authorpic1.htm is at 80*100 and left aligned. No border either 'cause I think it sucks ;) 2) http://members.evolt.org/madhu/authorpic2.htm is at 150*120. I wish I could crop the image a bit to get it to 140*120, but there was nothing I could take out. I wanted a decent quality image to use in my mock-up, so I borrowed one from Uncle Jakob's high-res gallery - http://www.useit.com/jakob/photos (Jakob actually mentions the brand names of his shirts in the ALT text, e.g., "Jakob Nielsen in red Turnbull & Asser shirt". wtf?) Madhu From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 13:50:06 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 13:50:06 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020104004714.01c6cfe8@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: madhu, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Madhu Menon > > 1) http://members.evolt.org/madhu/authorpic1.htm is at > 80*100 and left aligned. No border either 'cause I > think it sucks ;) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< no offense, but i think the photo looks like a major afterthought in this one. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > 2) http://members.evolt.org/madhu/authorpic2.htm is at > 150*120. I wish I could crop the image a bit to get > it to 140*120, but there was nothing I could take > out. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< this is only slightly better than the other one. the photo *really* needs to stretch to the width of the container for it to look right. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > (Jakob actually mentions the brand names of his shirts > in the ALT text, e.g., "Jakob Nielsen in red Turnbull > & Asser shirt". wtf?) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< that's better than what you used for alt text. ;p .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From webguru at vsnl.net Thu Jan 3 14:15:02 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Thu Jan 3 14:15:02 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020104004714.01c6cfe8@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020104012510.01c2be90@203.197.12.4> At 01:19 AM 1/4/2002, .jeff typed these words: >no offense, but i think the photo looks like a major afterthought in this >one. Well, yeah. I just threw it together in 2 minutes to show image size :) Also, not everyone will adjust their photos to fit our colour scheme beautifully. See earlier message about olive-khaki bg, etc. >this is only slightly better than the other one. the photo *really* needs >to stretch to the width of the container for it to look right. That would make the photo approximately 160*200 to maintain proportion. Too big. The 180*90 alternative isn't pretty. >that's better than what you used for alt text. ;p Thought you might notice that ;) If only I got paid $20000 per day like Uncle Jakob... Madhu <<< * >>> Madhu Menon User Experience Consultant e-mail: webguru at vsnl.net From ben_dyer at imaginuity.com Thu Jan 3 14:22:47 2002 From: ben_dyer at imaginuity.com (Ben Dyer) Date: Thu Jan 3 14:22:47 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020104012510.01c2be90@203.197.12.4> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020104004714.01c6cfe8@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020103141756.033f0d18@mail.imaginuity.com> On 02:13 PM 1/3/2002, Madhu Menon said to me: >>this is only slightly better than the other one. the photo *really* needs >>to stretch to the width of the container for it to look right. > >That would make the photo approximately 160*200 to maintain proportion. >Too big. The 180*90 alternative isn't pretty. OK, soooo...the solution is to have it like it was? http://test.evolt.org/article/User_Defined_Window_Targeting_w_JavaScript/17/16286/index.html Wider than taller to better accomodate the look at a reasonable height? --Ben ----------------------------------------------------------------- Ben Dyer, Senior Internet Developer, Imaginuity Interactive http://www.imaginuity.com/ ----------------------------------------------------------------- | http://members.evolt.org/OKolzig37/ | http://www.evolt.org/ | ----------------------------------------------------------------- From webguru at vsnl.net Thu Jan 3 14:29:17 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Thu Jan 3 14:29:17 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20020103141756.033f0d18@mail.imaginuity.com> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020104012510.01c2be90@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104004714.01c6cfe8@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020104015457.01bb92a0@203.197.12.4> At 01:51 AM 1/4/2002, Ben Dyer typed these words: >OK, soooo...the solution is to have it like it was? >http://test.evolt.org/article/User_Defined_Window_Targeting_w_JavaScript/17/16286/index.html > >Wider than taller to better accomodate the look at a reasonable height? Well, many people don't think that's a good idea, Ben (as you can see from recent messages), which is why we were trying these new sizes. See my email from a few hours ago explaining why "wider than taller" isn't so hot :) I for one don't want to display just my eyes (though they're beautiful ;) or just my nose, or just my forehead :P Cheers, Madhu <<< * >>> Madhu Menon User Experience Consultant e-mail: webguru at vsnl.net From ben_dyer at imaginuity.com Thu Jan 3 14:45:10 2002 From: ben_dyer at imaginuity.com (Ben Dyer) Date: Thu Jan 3 14:45:10 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020104015457.01bb92a0@203.197.12.4> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020103141756.033f0d18@mail.imaginuity.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104012510.01c2be90@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104004714.01c6cfe8@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020103143620.0343e588@mail.imaginuity.com> On 02:27 PM 1/3/2002, Madhu Menon said to me: >At 01:51 AM 1/4/2002, Ben Dyer typed these words: >>OK, soooo...the solution is to have it like it was? >>http://test.evolt.org/article/User_Defined_Window_Targeting_w_JavaScript/17/16286/index.html >> >>Wider than taller to better accomodate the look at a reasonable height? > >Well, many people don't think that's a good idea, Ben (as you can see from >recent messages), which is why we were trying these new sizes. See my >email from a few hours ago explaining why "wider than taller" isn't so hot :) >I for one don't want to display just my eyes (though they're beautiful ;) >or just my nose, or just my forehead :P Yeah, but I read through everything and watched each potential option vanish. :) OK, so: - A small 1:2 WxH ratio (more or less) doesn't fit right. From .jeff: "no offense, but i think the photo looks like a major afterthought in this one." - A large 1:2 WxH ratio (more or less) is too big: From yourself: "That would make the photo approximately 160*200 to maintain proportion. Too big." - A compromise 1:2 WxH ratio (more or less) still doesn't fit right. From .jeff again: "this is only slightly better than the other one. the photo *really* needs to stretch to the width of the container for it to look right." - And a 2:1 WxH ratio doesn't match up with people's faces. From David (and others): "I agree with the few comments that 180w x 90h is a weird aspect..." And each comment is completely valid and I agree with each one, but it doesn't leave many options. If I had to choose from the four above, I'd still roll with what's there now, weird aspect ratio and all. --Ben ----------------------------------------------------------------- Ben Dyer, Senior Internet Developer, Imaginuity Interactive http://www.imaginuity.com/ ----------------------------------------------------------------- | http://members.evolt.org/OKolzig37/ | http://www.evolt.org/ | ----------------------------------------------------------------- From evolt at spinhead.com Thu Jan 3 14:51:42 2002 From: evolt at spinhead.com (spinhead) Date: Thu Jan 3 14:51:42 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020103141756.033f0d18@mail.imaginuity.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104012510.01c2be90@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104004714.01c6cfe8@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.0.20020103143620.0343e588@mail.imaginuity.com> Message-ID: <000f01c19498$4f191bf0$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> > And each comment is completely valid and I agree with each one, but it > doesn't leave many options. If I had to choose from the four above, I'd > still roll with what's there now, weird aspect ratio and all. > > --Ben > I think the wide aspect ratio gives folks some room to be artsy or creative or post two pics or whatver. I like the way the shape fits the overall space. joel From miriam at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 14:53:27 2002 From: miriam at members.evolt.org (Miriam Frost) Date: Thu Jan 3 14:53:27 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020103141756.033f0d18@mail.imaginuity.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104012510.01c2be90@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104004714.01c6cfe8@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.0.20020103143620.0343e588@mail.imaginuity.com> <000f01c19498$4f191bf0$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> Message-ID: <005101c19498$7c050c50$79cff3cd@walthers.com> +1 > I think the wide aspect ratio gives folks some room to be artsy or creative > or post two pics or whatver. I like the way the shape fits the overall > space. > joel From rwd at csi1st.net Thu Jan 3 14:58:30 2002 From: rwd at csi1st.net (Ron Dorman) Date: Thu Jan 3 14:58:30 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020103141756.033f0d18@mail.imaginuity.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104012510.01c2be90@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104004714.01c6cfe8@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.0.20020103143620.0343e588@mail.imaginuity.com> <000f01c19498$4f191bf0$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> Message-ID: <3C34C738.4B76A430@csi1st.net> spinhead wrote: > > And each comment is completely valid and I agree with each one, but it > > doesn't leave many options. If I had to choose from the four above, I'd > > still roll with what's there now, weird aspect ratio and all. > > > > --Ben > > > > I think the wide aspect ratio gives folks some room to be artsy or creative > or post two pics or whatver. I like the way the shape fits the overall > space. this makes sense to me and is the better looking of the options presented. make the current size the spec and let the user make the best use of it they can. Ron D. From webguru at vsnl.net Thu Jan 3 14:58:55 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Thu Jan 3 14:58:55 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <000f01c19498$4f191bf0$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020103141756.033f0d18@mail.imaginuity.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104012510.01c2be90@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104004714.01c6cfe8@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.0.20020103143620.0343e588@mail.imaginuity.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020104022533.028ae228@203.197.12.4> At 02:20 AM 1/4/2002, spinhead typed these words: >I think the wide aspect ratio gives folks some room to be artsy or creative >or post two pics or whatver. But then we're forcing "creativity" down the throats of people less inclined to fool around in an image editor program. A typical backend programmer, for example, probably doesn't want to do that. Madhu (off to bed now) <<< * >>> Madhu Menon User Experience Consultant e-mail: webguru at vsnl.net From djc at starkmedia.com Thu Jan 3 15:03:38 2002 From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Thu Jan 3 15:03:38 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020103141756.033f0d18@mail.imaginuity.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104012510.01c2be90@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104004714.01c6cfe8@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.0.20020103143620.0343e588@mail.imaginuity.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104022533.028ae228@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: <3C34C61B.8050301@starkmedia.com> ya. i mean, if i wanna be creative, i'll break out the crayolas. i just want to upload my picture to evolt.org.. i'll be interested to see how many people have uploaded pics after a month .djc. Madhu Menon wrote: > At 02:20 AM 1/4/2002, spinhead typed these words: > >> I think the wide aspect ratio gives folks some room to be artsy or >> creative >> or post two pics or whatver. > > > But then we're forcing "creativity" down the throats of people less > inclined to fool around in an image editor program. A typical backend > programmer, for example, probably doesn't want to do that. From roselli at earthlink.net Thu Jan 3 15:27:06 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Thu Jan 3 15:27:06 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020104022533.028ae228@203.197.12.4> References: <000f01c19498$4f191bf0$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> Message-ID: <200201032127.g03LR5lf019254@leo.evolt.org> > From: Madhu Menon > > But then we're forcing "creativity" down the throats of people less > inclined to fool around in an image editor program. A typical backend > programmer, for example, probably doesn't want to do that. they don't *have* to, they can still just add white space to the edges... but i suspect we'll find more people will play with it than you think... i say keep the wide aspect ratio, it's cumbersome for photos, but fits well into the design, and i already plan on making a photo that works... maybe i'll just recyclye one from a local buffalo pun: http://algonquinstudios.com/files/as_images/photos/aar.jpg From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 15:37:03 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 15:37:03 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: <000f01c19498$4f191bf0$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> <200201032127.g03LR5lf019254@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <3C34CEFF.2020907@ak.net> aardvark wrote: >>From: Madhu Menon >> >>But then we're forcing "creativity" down the throats of people less >>inclined to fool around in an image editor program. A typical backend >>programmer, for example, probably doesn't want to do that. > > they don't *have* to, they can still just add white space to the > edges... but i suspect we'll find more people will play with it than > you think... Okay, I'm good with the aspect ratio as is for now, but would like to be able to revisit it if we hear squawking. Cool? But can we *please* lose the border? I personally like the way my headshot looks (centered in the box), but the border really looks like ass. If we're going to leave the creativity up to the user, let's not force the border on them. Them what wants 'em can build 'em into the images. Dig? Also, Madhu, remember that you can include witty text in the whitespace of your image! :) David From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 15:46:25 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 15:46:25 2002 Subject: [thesite] author info box option Message-ID: <3C34D136.8020904@ak.net> Okay, one last question and I'll shut up. Are there plans to make the display of this box optional? Because, frankly, I look at mine and feel like a l4m3r. Two articles in 2+ years is pretty weak, especially since they were just news items, not real articles. Given the option, I'd probably turn mine off until I got something posted that I wanted to show off. my final 2 cents (unless somebody pokes me with a stick again). David From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 15:48:38 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 15:48:38 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <3C34CEFF.2020907@ak.net> Message-ID: david, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: David McCreath > > Okay, I'm good with the aspect ratio as is for now, but > would like to be able to revisit it if we hear > squawking. Cool? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< yeah. this is only an interim solution anyway. it's likely all to change when the site goes through the redesign. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > But can we *please* lose the border? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i'd really rather not. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > I personally like the way my headshot looks (centered in > the box), but the border really looks like ass. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ewww, no. of course you don't like the border cause you've added khaki-colored whitespace to both sides and the border makes it obvious what you're up to. ;p ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > If we're going to leave the creativity up to the user, > let's not force the border on them. Them what wants 'em > can build 'em into the images. Dig? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< and have those that add khaki-colored whitespace look like ass cause they're far too narrow for the display area and have too much whitespace? i'd personally prefer to leave the border as a design constraint -- ie, fill up the damn box goofball. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 16:03:41 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 16:03:41 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: Message-ID: <3C34D53E.9010801@ak.net> .jeff wrote: > this is only an interim solution anyway. it's likely all to change > when the site goes through the redesign. I figgered. (/me narrowly misses stepping on soapbox about appropriate page for the user info box being the user page, not each article page, and decides to save that for the redesign discussion. ;p ) >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >>But can we *please* lose the border? >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > i'd really rather not. (Comment retained for future reference.) > of course you don't like the border cause you've added > khaki-colored whitespace to both sides and the border makes it obvious what > you're up to. ;p Ha! It's not whitespace! It's *transparent*! >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >>If we're going to leave the creativity up to the user, >>let's not force the border on them. Them what wants 'em >>can build 'em into the images. Dig? >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > and have those that add khaki-colored whitespace look like ass cause they're > i'd personally prefer to leave the border as a design constraint > far too narrow for the display area and have too much whitespace? Thank you for your opinion and your valiant attempt to protect me from making a page that *you* think looks like ass. Will you aid me in my attempt to make a page that *I* don't think looks like ass? Either you give the user creative freedom or you don't. Middle ground? I'll stop with the aspect stuff, but I'd really be a happy camper to see the border go away. > -- ie, fill up the damn box "i'd really rather not." ;p > goofball. doofus. > .jeff David From mwarden at mattwarden.com Thu Jan 3 16:03:51 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Thu Jan 3 16:03:51 2002 Subject: [thesite] author info box option In-Reply-To: <3C34D136.8020904@ak.net> Message-ID: On Jan 3, David McCreath had something to say about [thesite] author info... >Okay, one last question and I'll shut up. Are there plans to make the >display of this box optional? Because, frankly, I look at mine and feel >like a l4m3r. Two articles in 2+ years is pretty weak, especially since >they were just news items, not real articles. Given the option, I'd >probably turn mine off until I got something posted that I wanted to >show off. I would turn it off, too. Personally, though, I'd like to turn them all off, because I don't like them -- as a user who finds them distracting when I'm trying to read. So, if there's interest in making that a customizable option, I'm 100% down with that. Otherwise, I'll just suffer through it. -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From hblair at hotfootmail.com Thu Jan 3 16:08:58 2002 From: hblair at hotfootmail.com (Hugh Blair) Date: Thu Jan 3 16:08:58 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Creativity like this? ;) http://www.hotfootmail.com/evimgtest.html Sorry .jeff, you page seems to be the one used the most for these examples. -Hugh > -----Original Message----- > [mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of .jeff > Subject: RE: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > If we're going to leave the creativity up to the user, > > let's not force the border on them. Them what wants 'em > > can build 'em into the images. Dig? > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 16:09:50 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 16:09:50 2002 Subject: [thesite] author info box option In-Reply-To: <3C34D136.8020904@ak.net> Message-ID: david, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: David McCreath > > Okay, one last question and I'll shut up. Are there > plans to make the display of this box optional? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< not this iteration. perhaps when we do the redesign. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Because, frankly, I look at mine and feel like a l4m3r. > Two articles in 2+ years is pretty weak, especially > since they were just news items, not real articles. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i hardly see the point though. if you're trying to keep this from the viewer, this very same information is one click away on the user page. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Given the option, I'd probably turn mine off until I got > something posted that I wanted to show off. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< thereby removing any possibility of continuity for the end-user? .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 16:11:14 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 16:11:14 2002 Subject: [thesite] author info box option In-Reply-To: Message-ID: matt, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Warden, Matt > > I would turn it off, too. > > Personally, though, I'd like to turn them all off, > because I don't like them -- as a user who finds them > distracting when I'm trying to read. > > So, if there's interest in making that a customizable > option, I'm 100% down with that. Otherwise, I'll just > suffer through it. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< you've already got that option -- click through to "print view" and no more annoyances. enjoy, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From hblair at hotfootmail.com Thu Jan 3 16:13:54 2002 From: hblair at hotfootmail.com (Hugh Blair) Date: Thu Jan 3 16:13:54 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Let's change "you" to "your" / .jeff to David Sorry, -Hugh > Creativity like this? ;) > > http://www.hotfootmail.com/evimgtest.html > > Sorry .jeff, you page seems to be the one used the most > for these examples. > > -Hugh From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 16:21:28 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 16:21:28 2002 Subject: [thesite] author info box option References: Message-ID: <3C34D969.7000306@ak.net> >>Okay, one last question and I'll shut up. Are there >>plans to make the display of this box optional? >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > not this iteration. perhaps when we do the redesign. Noted. > i hardly see the point though. if you're trying to keep this from the > viewer, this very same information is one click away on the user page. I'm not trying to keep it from the viewer, I'm just trying to not wave it in front of the viewer's nose. > thereby removing any possibility of continuity for the end-user? Mmm. That's one way to look at it, but I also think that you could easily look at this as a personalization feature, like the posting of the email address. As for the end-user, if it's there, the reader will look at it and gain knowledge about the author, if it's not there, the reader will just read the article. I don't see it being a jarring discontinuity. But, as you said, we're not making it optional in this iteration, so onto the next topic! Thanks for the info, Jeff. David From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 16:23:46 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 16:23:46 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <3C34D53E.9010801@ak.net> Message-ID: david, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: David McCreath > > (/me narrowly misses stepping on soapbox about > appropriate page for the user info box being the > user page, not each article page, and decides to > save that for the redesign discussion. ;p ) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< you whispered too loudly so i have to say something. we already know this information belongs on the user *also*. however, it's already been debated about whether or not it's appropriate to have this on the article pages. the stronger argument lies with those that say it brings some personality to an otherwise bland bit of content, making the subject matter more approachable. it puts info about the author in front of the end-user who may not be likely to click through to the user page and otherwise see the info. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Thank you for your opinion and your valiant attempt to > protect me from making a page that *you* think looks > like ass. Will you aid me in my attempt to make a page > that *I* don't think looks like ass? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< take a quick peek at some of the other pics that have been put up already (themadman and mishka are good examples). the border around the pic actually works very well as it gives a nice finished off demarcation between the edge of the photo and its container. now, most photos that fill the entire space will benefit from this. but, will most users think to add the border to their photo? probably not. so we do it for them to aid in the presentation. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Either you give the user creative freedom or you don't. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< oh, right, and i suppose your high school art teacher let you use clay for an oil-painting project? ;p creativity thrives with constraints. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > -- ie, fill up the damn box > > "i'd really rather not." ;p ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< then don't, whether or not the border is there it'll still look like ass. /me ducks. i seriously think your approach to the aspect ratio will be in the minority and therefore the need you're citing to remove the border will also be in the minority. i see it benefiting far more than harming and would be very reluctant to remove it. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 16:24:37 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 16:24:37 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: Message-ID: <3C34DA22.7090805@ak.net> Dude, I haven't had a pony tail in *years*. And my mug shots usually look better than that. ;) David Hugh Blair wrote: > > > Let's change "you" to "your" / .jeff to David > > Sorry, > -Hugh > > >>Creativity like this? ;) >> >>http://www.hotfootmail.com/evimgtest.html >> >>Sorry .jeff, you page seems to be the one used the most >>for these examples. From djc at starkmedia.com Thu Jan 3 16:28:56 2002 From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Thu Jan 3 16:28:56 2002 Subject: [thesite] author info box option References: Message-ID: <3C34DA18.4060007@starkmedia.com> +1.. can't we just make it like the bio blurb? a radio button next to it saying, 'show this to gods|admins|logged in people|anyone|noone' i can see this is mostly done, but theres still alot up in the air(it seems to me at least). i don't want my name showing in that box for example. how do i, as a user, have it not show up? also, the form times out for me when i try to update my user information, no one is logged in via FTP at the moment either editing anything. also, where is the 'additional articles published..' at the bottom of an article getting its results from? the 5 articles it pulls up for me are totally random, which perhaps is the purpose.. but it should at least by mentioned that its random since any other site that does a 'other articles by so and so' feature usually has it in an orderly fashion. and wow, do we make people scroll to post a comment. some of these new features just seem to be there and as they are because thats the way they first got written(example would be the author picture.. because(from what i can tell) the first image jeff tested the feature with happened to be 176x91 or whatever it originally was) and haven't, for the most part, changed since. not trying to rehash anything here or make more work for anyone, or direct this at anyones personal self.. just thinking outloud Warden, Matt wrote: > I would turn it off, too. > > Personally, though, I'd like to turn them all off, because I don't like > them -- as a user who finds them distracting when I'm trying to read. > > So, if there's interest in making that a customizable option, I'm 100% > down with that. Otherwise, I'll just suffer through it. From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 16:53:01 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 16:53:01 2002 Subject: author picture border (was Re: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done) References: Message-ID: <3C34E0CB.4040205@ak.net> Quick question: Does anyone else have anything to say about the border? I don't want this to be just me an .jeff waving our m4d d3z1gn sk1llz in each others' faces. Now, on with the intellectualizing ... > you whispered too loudly so i have to say something. I'm sorry. I really shouldn't have brought that up, because I did skim the conversations surrounding it. I was just horsing around. (Although I do strongly believe that it clutters the article page, as designed. But I'm going to drop it. Until we get to the redesign discussion.) > take a quick peek at some of the other pics that have been put up already > (themadman and mishka are good examples). the border around the pic > actually works very well as it gives a nice finished off demarcation between > the edge of the photo and its container. now, most photos that fill the > entire space will benefit from this. but, will most users think to add the > border to their photo? probably not. so we do it for them to aid in the presentation. What? You're making them go to the effort of finding/creating/altering an image that will fit in that box and then assuming that they won't take the extra 5 seconds to put a 1 pixel stroke around it if they thinks it's warranted? Bah. You're just too attached to that border, man. >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >>Either you give the user creative freedom or you don't. >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > oh, right, and i suppose your high school art teacher let you use clay for > an oil-painting project? ;p Yer damn skippy she did. I do multi-media, man. Get your rules off me! >:E > creativity thrives with constraints. I believe that the contraint of 180 x 90 is enough. > whether or not the border is there it'll still look like ass. > /me ducks. har-har. har-de-har-har. /me sobs quietly into hanky. > i see it benefiting far more than harming and would be very > reluctant to remove it. I disagree. Can we please at least *try* it on teo before we roll the code up? thanks, David From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 17:02:40 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 17:02:40 2002 Subject: [thesite] author info box option In-Reply-To: <3C34DA18.4060007@starkmedia.com> Message-ID: djc, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Daniel J. Cody > > +1.. can't we just make it like the bio blurb? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< it is like the bio blurb ... everyone sees it. ;p ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > a radio button next to it saying, > 'show this to gods|admins|logged in people|anyone|noone' ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< um, no. can't we just get past "features" for the current iteration and just roll it up to w.e.o. already? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > i don't want my name showing in that box for example. > how do i, as a user, have it not show up? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< you don't. more people wanted the name to show than those that didn't. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > also, the form times out for me when i try to update my > user information, no one is logged in via FTP at the > moment either editing anything. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< dunno what to tell ya, it seems to work just fine for everyone else that's used it today. it's probably just t.e.o. i've noticed it's being *really* slow today. i just tried it again a couple of times and it worked just peachy. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > also, where is the 'additional articles published..' at > the bottom of an article getting its results from? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< uh, the content table. ;p ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > the 5 articles it pulls up for me are totally random, > which perhaps is the purpose.. but it should at least > by mentioned that its random since any other site that > does a 'other articles by so and so' feature usually > has it in an orderly fashion. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< they do huh? i rarely see enough information available in "other articles by so and so" blocks to make the determination that there's some order to how they're displayed. fwiw, i think you know where they're coming from and why they're in the order they're in. you were one of the chief participants in the discussion about how that portion of the page worked. do i need to go over the find points again? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > and wow, do we make people scroll to post a comment. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< yup, moving along. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > some of these new features just seem to be there and as > they are because thats the way they first got written > (example would be the author picture.. because(from what > i can tell) the first image jeff tested the feature with > happened to be 176x91 or whatever it originally was) and > haven't, for the most part, changed since. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< that's only one tiny detail of the author block, the majority of the details of which have been vastly altered since the initial attempts. what exactly are you getting at? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > not trying to rehash anything here or make more work for > anyone, or direct this at anyones personal self.. just > thinking outloud ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< then what are you getting at? .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 17:13:37 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 17:13:37 2002 Subject: author picture border (was Re: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done) In-Reply-To: <3C34E0CB.4040205@ak.net> Message-ID: david, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: David McCreath > > I'm sorry. I really shouldn't have brought that up, > because I did skim the conversations surrounding it. I > was just horsing around. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< cool. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > (Although I do strongly believe that it clutters the > article page, as designed. But I'm going to drop it. > Until we get to the redesign discussion.) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i agree that it looks alittle too cluttered as well. however, it's better than what we have now (no author block) and will undoubtedly become better and more integrated into the design with the redesign. so, with that being said, i'd like to get it out in the wild and get some feedback. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > What? You're making them go to the effort of > finding/creating/altering an image that will fit in that > box and then assuming that they won't take the extra 5 > seconds to put a 1 pixel stroke around it if they thinks > it's warranted? Bah. You're just too attached to that > border, man. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< anybody that's going to upload a photo is going to "go to the effort of finding/creating/altering an image that will fit in that box". thinking they'll consider how it'll look with a border around it is quite a stretch, whether or not it really takes 5 seconds. sure i'm attached to the border because i think that in the majority of the cases it serves a useful purpose. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > oh, right, and i suppose your high school art teacher > > let you use clay for an oil-painting project? ;p > > Yer damn skippy she did. I do multi-media, man. > Get your rules off me! >:E ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< bah, you didn't listen to the question. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > creativity thrives with constraints. > > I believe that the contraint of 180 x 90 is enough. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< and i don't view the border as a constraint. ;p i view it as a design element of the author block. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > i see it benefiting far more than harming and would be > > very reluctant to remove it. > > I disagree. Can we please at least *try* it on teo > before we roll the code up? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< where were you when we were working on this a month or two ago? ;p seriously, i can take the border off to see what people think (quick, go look), how much more effort are we going to go through in trying to get this ready to roll up to w.e.o.? .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 17:20:46 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 17:20:46 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Info Updated In-Reply-To: <024601c193d9$7e90f520$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > After one enters their info .. if they wait long enough > ;) .. the page after "user info updated" redirects to > the user search page. Can it go somewhere else, [...] ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< fixed. now sends the user back to the user page for the user being edited. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From ben_dyer at imaginuity.com Thu Jan 3 17:23:15 2002 From: ben_dyer at imaginuity.com (Ben Dyer) Date: Thu Jan 3 17:23:15 2002 Subject: author picture border (was Re: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done) In-Reply-To: References: <3C34E0CB.4040205@ak.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020103172145.03366c00@mail.imaginuity.com> On 05:12 PM 1/3/2002, .jeff said to me: >seriously, i can take the border off to see what people think (quick, go >look), how much more effort are we going to go through in trying to get this >ready to roll up to w.e.o.? Oog. Turn it back on. The thing is we have hard borders everywhere else on the page and it just looks wrong without the border. Bah. I'm with Jeff. --Ben ----------------------------------------------------------------- Ben Dyer, Senior Internet Developer, Imaginuity Interactive http://www.imaginuity.com/ ----------------------------------------------------------------- | http://members.evolt.org/OKolzig37/ | http://www.evolt.org/ | ----------------------------------------------------------------- From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 17:24:25 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 17:24:25 2002 Subject: author picture border (was Re: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done) References: Message-ID: <3C34E829.1060906@ak.net> > i'd like to get it out in the wild and get some feedback. I totally agree. >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >>>oh, right, and i suppose your high school art teacher >>>let you use clay for an oil-painting project? ;p >>> >>Yer damn skippy she did. I do multi-media, man. >>Get your rules off me! >:E >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > bah, you didn't listen to the question. Sure I did. I just didn't answer it. I had to get the "get your rules off me" shot in there somehow. > and i don't view the border as a constraint. ;p > > i view it as a design element of the author block. Nuh-uh. > where were you when we were working on this a month or two ago? ;p Very, very busy. Now I'm back to make your life more pleasant. > seriously, i can take the border off to see what people think (quick, go > look), how much more effort are we going to go through in trying to get this > ready to roll up to w.e.o.? Seriously, don't do it just for me. If nobody else speaks up, let's drop it and get back to biz. I'll work with the border if I have to, but your're just wrong wrong wrong. *shudder* David np - a very old, confusing mix tape that has so far gone through D.O.A. (vancouver punk), Motorhead, pre-fame Beasties, and Bocephus and just landed on Redd Kross. That must have been a great night ... From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 17:31:26 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 17:31:26 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: author picture border References: Message-ID: <00ef01c194ae$dd4fcf20$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> haha better look quick .. cos I'm about to change the CSS too ;) I like it with the border .. but it doesn't really matter to me. On a more important note .. I will be altering which CSS file is used on teo in about an hour .. I'll restore the original when I'm done. Umm.. what file contains the link to the css file? Do I need to change the application.cfm file? Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: ".jeff" | seriously, i can take the border off to see what people think (quick, go | look), how much more effort are we going to go through in trying to get this | ready to roll up to w.e.o.? From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 17:32:52 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 17:32:52 2002 Subject: author picture border (was Re: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done) References: <3C34E0CB.4040205@ak.net> <5.1.0.14.0.20020103172145.03366c00@mail.imaginuity.com> Message-ID: <3C34EA27.6050306@ak.net> > Oog. Turn it back on. The thing is we have hard borders everywhere > else on the page and it just looks wrong without the border. > > Bah. I'm with Jeff. At the crackhouse? ;) You're both higher than kites. It gives people the option! BAH! Anyway. That's two to one. So, unless somebody else has something to say post-haste, I'm done. I've dragged it out too long already. Move along folks ... nothing to see here ... Thanks for indulging me, jeff. David From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 17:35:02 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 17:35:02 2002 Subject: author picture border (was Re: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done) In-Reply-To: <3C34E829.1060906@ak.net> Message-ID: david, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: David McCreath > > > and i don't view the border as a constraint. ;p > > > > i view it as a design element of the author block. > > Nuh-uh. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< wanna bet? what other elements of the design contain borders on one or more edges like that? answer? lots. it's more of a design element than you might think. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > where were you when we were working on this a month or > > two ago? ;p > > Very, very busy. Now I'm back to make your life more > pleasant. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< cool. /me mutters "now where did i put that anti-itch ointment again?" ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > seriously, i can take the border off to see what > > people think (quick, go look), how much more effort > > are we going to go through in trying to get this ready > > to roll up to w.e.o.? > > Seriously, don't do it just for me. If nobody else > speaks up, let's drop it and get back to biz. I'll > work with the border if I have to, but your're just > wrong wrong wrong. *shudder* ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< um, maybe you missed it cause it was a parenthetical. QUICK, GO LOOK. is that better? .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 17:44:07 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 17:44:07 2002 Subject: author picture border (was Re: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done) References: Message-ID: <3C34ECC3.7040406@ak.net> > cool. /me mutters "now where did i put that anti-itch ointment again?" "Gold Bond! Soothes persistent mccreaths!" > um, maybe you missed it cause it was a parenthetical. > > QUICK, GO LOOK. No, I missed it because I read too quickly. > is that better? Well, of course it is. But as I said in response to Ben's post, put it back and roll it, baby. I'll figure out a way to live wit it. *sigh* David From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 17:53:58 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 17:53:58 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... Message-ID: <010701c194b2$065667a0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> I'm confused .. Jeff, I need your help .. As discussed previously, I've added the following ... rating { background : #9AA486 ; /* RatingBGColor */ border-color: #000000" ; /* RatingBorderColor */ border-style: solid ; } /*-- */ But .. ummm .. don't I need to add another class to show the negative? I've thrown together a brief test page ... http://test.evolt.org/article/Just_a_Test/18/17463/index.html How do I show the non-rated portion? I think I need two classes, rating_on and rating_off to get this to work. Do you have any other options? David? You're back ... your thoughts/advice? Mich From roselli at earthlink.net Thu Jan 3 17:57:58 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Thu Jan 3 17:57:58 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... In-Reply-To: <010701c194b2$065667a0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C34A97E.2855.DC36E5B9@localhost> > From: "Michele Foster" > > As discussed previously, I've added the following ... > > rating > { background : #9AA486 ; /* RatingBGColor */ > border-color: #000000" ; /* RatingBorderColor */ > border-style: solid ; } /*-- */ > > But .. ummm .. don't I need to add another class to show the negative? why? isn't the page bg more than adequate? > I've thrown together a brief test page ... > > http://test.evolt.org/article/Just_a_Test/18/17463/index.html > > How do I show the non-rated portion? I think I need two classes, > rating_on and rating_off to get this to work. Do you have any other > options? you're gonna have to help me out, i only see the need for the first class, not a class for unhighlighted portion of the bar... From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 18:00:40 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 18:00:40 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... References: <010701c194b2$065667a0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C34F0A9.3020008@ak.net> > How do I show the non-rated portion? I think I need two classes, rating_on > and rating_off to get this to work. Do you have any other options? The simplest solution is to not apply a class to those cells; only apply it to the cells required to show the rating. Make sense? David From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 18:04:05 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 18:04:05 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: author picture border In-Reply-To: <00ef01c194ae$dd4fcf20$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > better look quick .. cos I'm about to change the CSS > too ;) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< except the css doesn't control this. ;p ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > On a more important note .. I will be altering which CSS > file is used on teo in about an hour .. I'll restore the > original when I'm done. Umm.. what file contains the > link to the css file? Do I need to change the > application.cfm file? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< yes, that's one of the places. i think it also happens in /login/act_login.cfm as well. whatcha doing? would probably be easier to just replace the contents of isaac.css with your own purposes rather than altering the cf code to use the new one. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 18:10:58 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 18:10:58 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... References: <010701c194b2$065667a0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <3C34F0A9.3020008@ak.net> Message-ID: <011201c194b4$65123240$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Yeah, it does .. which is what I had original thought .. but the lines don't work. And, my understanding is that we want to be able to colourize the border .. i.e. in this CSS it is black, but in say oldschoolevolt.css, we will probably want to use the blue border. To backtrack .. we've left inline style for the sides of the borders .. i.e. each cell either does or doesn't have a 1 px width border applied. Then the background, border colour and border type (in this case solid) comes from the CSS. I've modified the sample article, removing the class="rating" from the last cell, see what I mean? http://test.evolt.org/article/Just_a_Test/18/17463/index.html Thanks guys ... Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "David McCreath" | > How do I show the non-rated portion? I think I need two classes, rating_on | > and rating_off to get this to work. Do you have any other options? | | | The simplest solution is to not apply a class to those cells; only apply | it to the cells required to show the rating. Make sense? | From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 18:12:44 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 18:12:44 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: author picture border References: Message-ID: <011701c194b4$a5dc8000$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> That's what I'll do .. when I get around to doing it .. better idea than modifying the code. All I'm doing is fixing up the CSS files so they are inline with isaac.css .... instead of creating a bunch of sample pages to test locally, thought I'd cheat and test it on teo. I'll use your suggestion .. that's better. Mich (back in an hour or so) ----- Original Message ----- From: ".jeff" | whatcha doing? | | would probably be easier to just replace the contents of isaac.css with your | own purposes rather than altering the cf code to use the new one. | From roselli at earthlink.net Thu Jan 3 18:13:05 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Thu Jan 3 18:13:05 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... In-Reply-To: <010701c194b2$065667a0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C34AD08.17534.DC44B821@localhost> >From: "Michele Foster" [...] > http://test.evolt.org/article/Just_a_Test/18/17463/index.html don't forget that for now, i believe we've decided to maintain the same rating scale (the demo one has different descriptors attached to each number than the old one)... From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 18:22:40 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 18:22:40 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... In-Reply-To: <3C34AD08.17534.DC44B821@localhost> Message-ID: aardvark, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: aardvark > > > http://test.evolt.org/article/Test/18/17463/index.html > > don't forget that for now, i believe we've decided to > maintain the same rating scale (the demo one has > different descriptors attached to each number than the > old one)... ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< and here i thought we'd voted in the changes to the desciptors. +1 to a voting application to keep this shit straight and in one place. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 18:29:06 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 18:29:06 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... In-Reply-To: <010701c194b2$065667a0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > I'm confused .. > > Jeff, I need your help .. > > As discussed previously, I've added the following ... > > rating > { background : #9AA486 ; /* RatingBGColor */ > border-color: #000000" ; /* RatingBorderColor */ > border-style: solid ; } /*-- */ ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< doesn't that class definition need a leading period? .rating { blah: blah; } ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > But .. ummm .. don't I need to add another class to > show the negative? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< depending on how joel coded his example, you shouldn't need the negative color, just let the background show through. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 18:29:48 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 18:29:48 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... References: <010701c194b2$065667a0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <3C34F0A9.3020008@ak.net> <011201c194b4$65123240$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C34F780.9050202@ak.net> Oh, I see. Yeah. I think you're going to need either another style like "rating-empty" to get the "solid" and "#000" attributes on the border, or put those attributes inline with the "1px" attributes. (That's how I got it to work, anyway.) Since I assume you're assigning those classes dynamically, it would be easiest to create another class and assign that where aard and I were saying you'd leave off the class altogether. (Give it a bright pink background, okay? ;p ) Oh, and the widths of the individual cells should be "20%" each, but you probably already knew that. David Michele Foster wrote: > Yeah, it does .. which is what I had original thought .. but the lines don't > work. And, my understanding is that we want to be able to colourize the > border .. i.e. in this CSS it is black, but in say oldschoolevolt.css, we > will probably want to use the blue border. > > To backtrack .. we've left inline style for the sides of the borders .. i.e. > each cell either does or doesn't have a 1 px width border applied. Then the > background, border colour and border type (in this case solid) comes from > the CSS. > > I've modified the sample article, removing the class="rating" from the last > cell, see what I mean? > > http://test.evolt.org/article/Just_a_Test/18/17463/index.html > > Thanks guys ... > > Mich > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "David McCreath" > > | > How do I show the non-rated portion? I think I need two classes, > rating_on > | > and rating_off to get this to work. Do you have any other options? > | > | > | The simplest solution is to not apply a class to those cells; only apply > | it to the cells required to show the rating. Make sense? > | > > > > _______________________________________________ > For unsubscribe, archive, and options, go to: > http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thesite > > From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 18:34:57 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 18:34:57 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... In-Reply-To: <3C34F780.9050202@ak.net> Message-ID: david, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: David McCreath > > Oh, and the widths of the individual cells should be > "20%" each, but you probably already knew that. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< actually, they really are 25% each. that's because there is no zero rating hence no need to show the 0-1 section of the rating bar. that leaves four sections -- 1-2, 2-3, 3-4, and 4-5 -- or 25% each. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 18:47:54 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 18:47:54 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... References: Message-ID: <3C34FBBA.5040009@ak.net> Tonight on ABC: It's the .jeff and Dave show! Watch Dave try to catch up on three months of development while .jeff rolls his eyes and sets him straight! .jeff wrote: > david, > >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >>From: David McCreath >> >>Oh, and the widths of the individual cells should be >>"20%" each, but you probably already knew that. >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > actually, they really are 25% each. that's because there is no zero rating > hence no need to show the 0-1 section of the rating bar. that leaves four > sections -- 1-2, 2-3, 3-4, and 4-5 -- or 25% each. Well, the table is coded like this: So if it's uniformly 25%, there should only be four cells. HOWEVER! I think there should be five cells. Why? If the rating bar is going to show above the radio buttons (the way the red background one does currently), then the 0-1 section gives the whole thing a nice visual continuity [poking with blunt stick]. Having five radio buttons and four sections would be confusing. David From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 19:04:35 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 19:04:35 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... References: <3C34FBBA.5040009@ak.net> Message-ID: <013201c194bb$e3ba09e0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> LMAO ... I dunno if this helps or hinders .. but here's Joel's final version .. that Jeff's to code http://members.evolt.org/spinhead/teo/ratings_bar5dec.html The Fruit Punch is a joke, btw. :) Lots of variations/iterations available in the comments for this article. http://test.evolt.org/article/yeah/17/16286/index.html Don't worry David .. we'll have ya up to speed in a .. 3 months ? ;) So, back to my original question .. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "David McCreath" | Tonight on ABC: It's the .jeff and Dave show! Watch Dave try to catch up | on three months of development while .jeff rolls his eyes and sets him | straight! From jeff at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 19:07:21 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Thu Jan 3 19:07:21 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... In-Reply-To: <3C34FBBA.5040009@ak.net> Message-ID: david, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: David McCreath > > Tonight on ABC: It's the .jeff and Dave show! Watch > Dave try to catch up on three months of development > while .jeff rolls his eyes and sets him straight! ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< where do we send the pilot? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Well, the table is coded like this: > > > > > > > > > > So if it's uniformly 25%, there should only be four > cells. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< um what? that's for a table that's showing a rating of 3.4 (68%). the 18% and 7% width cells are to show the 0.4 portion beyond 3.0. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > HOWEVER! I think there should be five cells. Why? > > If the rating bar is going to show above the radio > buttons (the way the red background one does > currently), then the 0-1 section gives the whole thing > a nice visual continuity [poking with blunt stick]. > Having five radio buttons and four sections would be > confusing. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< perhaps you need to catch up on the conversations that michele, joel, and i had that led up to this: http://test.evolt.org/article/rating_convo/17/16286/#comments after you read the conversation and look at the various iterations i'm sure it'll make more sense why it's ended up the way it has. enjoy, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 19:08:03 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 19:08:03 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... References: Message-ID: <013501c194bc$60c0dfe0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Jeff, | > As discussed previously, I've added the following ... | > | > rating | > { background : #9AA486 ; /* RatingBGColor */ | > border-color: #000000" ; /* RatingBorderColor */ | > border-style: solid ; } /*-- */ | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | doesn't that class definition need a leading period? | | .rating { | blah: blah; | } Yeah, it's correct in the file .. I just missed it when I C&P it into the email message. | | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | > But .. ummm .. don't I need to add another class to | > show the negative? | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | depending on how joel coded his example, you shouldn't need the negative | color, just let the background show through. | Ok, but how do I build the borders then? The border colour is set in the CSS .. if we default it to black, it won't show up in evoltoldschool (or other dark colour variations that may one day be created). Note the widths for the border *are* set inline .. just not the colour. I think my only option *is* to add another class. Mich From mccreath at ak.net Thu Jan 3 19:09:35 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Thu Jan 3 19:09:35 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... References: <3C34FBBA.5040009@ak.net> <013201c194bb$e3ba09e0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C3500D1.7070209@ak.net> Michele Foster wrote: > LMAO ... > > I dunno if this helps or hinders .. but here's Joel's final version .. that > Jeff's to code > > http://members.evolt.org/spinhead/teo/ratings_bar5dec.html Oh, I see what you're talking about. Okay. Groovylicious. Carry on. > So, back to my original question .. New class. Since you're defining the solidity and color of the border in the stylesheet instead of inline, you need a new class. Just be sure to comment that it should have the same background color as the .content class. And ignore my suggestion to put a hyphen in it. Don't put a hyphen in it. David From evolt at spinhead.com Thu Jan 3 20:01:30 2002 From: evolt at spinhead.com (spinhead) Date: Thu Jan 3 20:01:30 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... References: <013501c194bc$60c0dfe0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <012601c194c3$adb023e0$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> > | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > | > But .. ummm .. don't I need to add another class to > | > show the negative? > | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > | > | depending on how joel coded his example, you shouldn't need the negative > | color, just let the background show through. > | > > Ok, but how do I build the borders then? The border colour is set in the > CSS .. if we default it to black, it won't show up in evoltoldschool (or > other dark colour variations that may one day be created). Note the widths > for the border *are* set inline .. just not the colour. > > I think my only option *is* to add another class. > > > Mich (Sorry I've been missing all this.) Not necessary. Here's how I caused your current befuddlement: in my version the 'blank' area is really filled with the same color as the background. All we have to do is not specify the background for those cells, and they're trans-flippin-parent. Ta-daaaa! Yes? joel From evolt at spinhead.com Thu Jan 3 20:06:28 2002 From: evolt at spinhead.com (spinhead) Date: Thu Jan 3 20:06:28 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... References: <013501c194bc$60c0dfe0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <012601c194c3$adb023e0$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> Message-ID: <013a01c194c4$6a73f650$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> (Oh, look, he's talking to himself.) My code doesn't use 'label' tags 'cause I forgot 'em in the final version. Also, the version on the test page isn't the one from my 5dec page. Am I confused? Can I do anything to pretend to be helpful? joel > > I think my only option *is* to add another class. > > > > > > Mich > > > Not necessary. Here's how I caused your current befuddlement: in my version > the 'blank' area is really filled with the same color as the background. All > we have to do is not specify the background for those cells, and they're > trans-flippin-parent. Ta-daaaa! > > Yes? > > joel From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 20:06:46 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 20:06:46 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... References: <013501c194bc$60c0dfe0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <012601c194c3$adb023e0$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> Message-ID: <014d01c194c4$94e7bac0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Yes, except that I need to set the colour for the border. I'm just back now .. will have .ratingOn and .ratingOff. This will all change with the redesign no doubt anyway. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "spinhead" | | Not necessary. Here's how I caused your current befuddlement: in my version | the 'blank' area is really filled with the same color as the background. All | we have to do is not specify the background for those cells, and they're | trans-flippin-parent. Ta-daaaa! | | Yes? From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 3 20:12:44 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 3 20:12:44 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... References: <013501c194bc$60c0dfe0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <012601c194c3$adb023e0$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> <013a01c194c4$6a73f650$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> Message-ID: <015401c194c5$6a4a31c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Joel, Not for me .. I'm ok at the moment .. just working on CSS files at the moment. I only added a table to the "test" article so I can test the colours in the various CSS files .. make sure all the classes get colourized properly and are viewable in the different files. I'll leave the coding/labelling, etc. to .jeff. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "spinhead" | (Oh, look, he's talking to himself.) | My code doesn't use 'label' tags 'cause I forgot 'em in the final version. | Also, the version on the test page isn't the one from my 5dec page. Am I | confused? | | Can I do anything to pretend to be helpful? | | joel From isaac at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 3 20:56:15 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Thu Jan 3 20:56:15 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done In-Reply-To: <3C34C61B.8050301@starkmedia.com> Message-ID: > ya. i mean, if i wanna be creative, i'll break out the crayolas. i just > want to upload my picture to evolt.org.. i'll be interested to see how > many people have uploaded pics after a month nah, you want to be creative. we all remember that "i don't want anyone to see what i look like, so i'll split my photo into 3 components" effort of yours... ;) i From michele at wordpro.on.ca Fri Jan 4 00:21:23 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Fri Jan 4 00:21:23 2002 Subject: [thesite] CSS Files Updated Message-ID: <016e01c194e8$26872880$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> CSS files updated on teo include: isaac easter granite evoltoldschool members lists slate BUT, do not move leo/meo/beo's .. since the HTML needs fixing on those pages. Will do that soon. ;) Left to still do: fresh_tchai afistapart latte mocchatchaino I'll try to get to them in the morning .. too tired now. Not sure if I'll do emerald (deo) or not .. since I don't know PHP, its probably not worth the effort. But I'll look at it later. Holler if anything is amiss. Thanks, Michele From roselli at earthlink.net Fri Jan 4 01:22:40 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Fri Jan 4 01:22:40 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... In-Reply-To: References: <3C34AD08.17534.DC44B821@localhost> Message-ID: <3C3511BA.20598.DDCE0FE6@localhost> > From: ".jeff" > > > > > http://test.evolt.org/article/Test/18/17463/index.html > > > > don't forget that for now, i believe we've decided to > > maintain the same rating scale (the demo one has > > different descriptors attached to each number than the > > old one)... > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > and here i thought we'd voted in the changes to the desciptors. but if we do that, who goes and recategorizes all the ratings for poor (which would be a 1 instead of a 2) and good (which would now be a 3 instead of a 4)? that was the gist of the argument... > +1 to a voting application to keep this shit straight and in one > +place. hmmm... From hblair at hotfootmail.com Fri Jan 4 01:31:31 2002 From: hblair at hotfootmail.com (Hugh Blair) Date: Fri Jan 4 01:31:31 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... In-Reply-To: <3C3511BA.20598.DDCE0FE6@localhost> Message-ID: On Behalf Of aardvark > > From: ".jeff" > > > > > +1 to a voting application to keep this shit straight and in one > > +place. > > hmmm... Or simply a web page that: 1 - recaps the issue 2 - shows the final vote/poll results? 3 - gets updated by {someone} every time there's a vote? Simple. -Hugh From gnarly at punkass.com Fri Jan 4 08:52:38 2002 From: gnarly at punkass.com (Olly Hodgson) Date: Fri Jan 4 08:52:38 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020103141756.033f0d18@mail.imaginuity.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104012510.01c2be90@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.2.20020104004714.01c6cfe8@203.197.12.4> <5.1.0.14.0.20020103143620.0343e588@mail.imaginuity.com> <000f01c19498$4f191bf0$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> Message-ID: <014101c1952f$dd6d3d90$0100a8c0@olly> ----- Original Message ----- From: "spinhead" Subject: Re: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done > I think the wide aspect ratio gives folks some room to be artsy or creative > or post two pics or whatver. I like the way the shape fits the overall > space. +1 Olly. From michele at wordpro.on.ca Fri Jan 4 10:48:29 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Fri Jan 4 10:48:29 2002 Subject: [thesite] Ratings Bar .. CSS .. yet again ... References: Message-ID: <01c901c1953f$659ab300$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> I can do this .. I have the vote files I was maintaining ... for the issues I called votes on anyway .. it won't happen this weekend .. and next week is a mess .. but I'll try to squeeze it in sometime. In the meantime, I've attached the text files. Holler if anyone has questions. :) Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Hugh Blair" | Or simply a web page that: | 1 - recaps the issue | 2 - shows the final vote/poll results? | 3 - gets updated by {someone} every time there's a vote? | | Simple. | | -Hugh -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: vote results.txt URL: -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: leo vote.txt URL: -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: graph bar vote.txt URL: From michele at wordpro.on.ca Fri Jan 4 15:59:59 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Fri Jan 4 15:59:59 2002 Subject: [thesite] CSS Files Updated References: <016e01c194e8$26872880$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <005201c1956b$425cc5a0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michele Foster" These four files have also been updated ... so, all the CSS files are now in line with the latest and greatest version of isaac.css on teo. (except emerald, deo .. which I'm still not going to do, as the benefits do not outweigh the efforts required at this time.) | | fresh_tchai | afistapart | latte | mocchatchaino | Michele From r937 at interlog.com Fri Jan 4 23:45:55 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Fri Jan 4 23:45:55 2002 Subject: [thesite] Testers Please ... :) Message-ID: <01c193f1$6f89fc80$8350149a@rudy> >This is a side-effect of the table changes that I made. The RATING >table still has a foreign key relationship on the original content >table. I'll move that now. whoops, my fault for not making this fact more visible yes, i added some constraints in codefest 2 sorry it was a "hidden feature" gotta document, gotta document.... rudy From elfur at elfur.is Sat Jan 5 16:51:40 2002 From: elfur at elfur.is (Elfur Logadottir) Date: Sat Jan 5 16:51:40 2002 Subject: [thesite] User Page (Signup) Done References: Message-ID: <048301c1963b$d03b5230$0100a8c0@DWARFS> From: "isaac" | nah, you want to be creative. we all remember that "i don't want anyone to | see what i look like, so i'll split my photo into 3 components" effort of | yours... ;) or rather i split that photo of that model into 3 components ;) (saw that photo as an hugo boss ad in the airport on my way to dc last year, just forgot to tease him about it. ... and then i thought it would be to late ... but i guess, if you stick around long enough, things always come back ;) cheers elfur From djc at members.evolt.org Mon Jan 7 16:22:02 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Mon Jan 7 16:22:02 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [Theforum] [Fwd: SIGIA-L: perpetual hopeful push for progress] In-Reply-To: <3C3999F8.DAF0C0C4@mantruc.com> Message-ID: javi - cool idea.. one thing that was made crystal clear in the feedback from the survey is that our archives need a lot of work to make them easier to use and just plain *better*.. who better to help with that than a bunch of IA'er type people? :) I'm down for helping build, what/who/where next? :) .djc. On Mon, 7 Jan 2002, javier velasco wrote: > hey evolters: > > I've been talking to Lou Rosenfeld about the idea of bulding a > collaboration bridge between evolt.org and the IA community. > > For example: They have fantastic ideas for list archives, so, if we > could help build them, we could improve our own archives to state of the > art archives. > > Thoughts? > > > From dmah at shaw.ca Tue Jan 8 09:30:11 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Tue Jan 8 09:30:11 2002 Subject: [thesite] Oracle test box down? Message-ID: <200201081531.IAA01298@alice.monkeyland.ca> From djc at starkmedia.com Tue Jan 8 09:33:22 2002 From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Tue Jan 8 09:33:22 2002 Subject: [thesite] t.e.o oracle box back.. Message-ID: <3C3B1055.7030806@starkmedia.com> sorry about the downtime, power went out last night and that box isn't on UPS.. From lists at mantruc.com Tue Jan 8 09:40:56 2002 From: lists at mantruc.com (javier velasco) Date: Tue Jan 8 09:40:56 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Fwd: SIGIA-L: perpetual hopeful push for progress] Message-ID: <3C3999F8.DAF0C0C4@mantruc.com> hey evolters: I've been talking to Lou Rosenfeld about the idea of bulding a collaboration bridge between evolt.org and the IA community. For example: They have fantastic ideas for list archives, so, if we could help build them, we could improve our own archives to state of the art archives. Thoughts? -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: "Louis Rosenfeld" Subject: SIGIA-L: perpetual hopeful push for progress Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 20:45:31 -0500 Size: 3639 URL: From djc at starkmedia.com Tue Jan 8 09:42:33 2002 From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Tue Jan 8 09:42:33 2002 Subject: [thesite] Oracle test box down? References: <200201081531.IAA01298@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <3C3B127B.9080802@starkmedia.com> its back up now deano Dean Mah wrote: > _______________________________________________ > For unsubscribe, archive, and options, go to: > http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thesite > From miriam at members.evolt.org Tue Jan 8 09:50:17 2002 From: miriam at members.evolt.org (Miriam Frost) Date: Tue Jan 8 09:50:17 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Fwd: SIGIA-L: perpetual hopeful push for progress] References: <3C3999F8.DAF0C0C4@mantruc.com> Message-ID: <002401c1985c$0b301c00$79cff3cd@walthers.com> Great idea. We may need to finish making the evolt archive more useable... > I've been talking to Lou Rosenfeld about the idea of bulding a > collaboration bridge between evolt.org and the IA community. > For example: They have fantastic ideas for list archives, so, if we > could help build them, we could improve our own archives to state of the > art archives. > Thoughts? From seb at members.evolt.org Tue Jan 8 10:06:52 2002 From: seb at members.evolt.org (Seb) Date: Tue Jan 8 10:06:52 2002 Subject: [thesite] password input on user account page Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020108155517.048d5830@members.evolt.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi guys, I'm just trying to get up to speed on thesite, as it's been a few months since I've had the time to actually contribute properly. In doing so, I've been playing around with a lot of the new features, and all I can say is 'wow'. I do have one suggestion which impacts security and usability. On the user account page where you can change your info, the password boxes are populated. This is a minor security hazard, as you could now potentially find a user's login details just by searching through their cache. I know it sounds unlikely to impact anyone, but it's not unheard of for sysadmins (ie. people like me) to get bored and go searching network caches for this kind of thing. Obvious minor change to code: don't update the password if the input is empty. Now, would anyone be kind enough to write a couple of paragraphs of cliff's-notes to help me catch up on [thesite]? Pretty please? Seb. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPfreeware 7.0.3 for non-commercial use iQA/AwUBPDsZXL2V451Vxr52EQIvOwCg8PPXEoEQ2HE8O4Pol0Xbahyw5YwAoJlD bgeXsHRfHujV/i9RXfdGFhI1 =6q9R -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From michele at wordpro.on.ca Tue Jan 8 10:15:47 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Tue Jan 8 10:15:47 2002 Subject: [thesite] password input on user account page References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020108155517.048d5830@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <011201c1985f$fb881880$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Seb, I'll be putting together an article later on today .. that highlights the main features of teo before we roll it to production. The changelog lists a lot of items as well .. some of which I'll include in my above-mentioned article .. some not. There's always going back to the original codefest task list .. http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/CodeFest_2001/ which we're pretty much still working from ... or at least that's the changes you'll see on teo now that are almost ready to roll up. There's discussions on theforum with respect to the survey results and the new IA that Javi's been diligently working on. These will greatly impact what the next work load is for thesite. I think the actual redesign is on hold, while the IA is being discussed. I have to admit to being very behind on that list .. :( Also, Dean's done a fair bit of work on the tips harvester, which wouldn't be highlighted in the changelog on teo. Anyway .. any questions just ask :) Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Seb" | | Now, would anyone be kind enough to write a couple of paragraphs of | cliff's-notes to help me catch up on [thesite]? Pretty please? | From peter.vandijck at vardus.com Tue Jan 8 10:50:19 2002 From: peter.vandijck at vardus.com (Peter Van Dijck) Date: Tue Jan 8 10:50:19 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Fwd: SIGIA-L: perpetual hopeful push for progress] References: <3C3999F8.DAF0C0C4@mantruc.com> Message-ID: <022b01c19863$73973c40$d801000a@peter> Yes, techies and IA's join! Very good idea, hope it works out. Peter > I've been talking to Lou Rosenfeld about the idea of bulding a > collaboration bridge between evolt.org and the IA community. From jeff at members.evolt.org Tue Jan 8 13:30:52 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Tue Jan 8 13:30:52 2002 Subject: [thesite] password input on user account page In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20020108155517.048d5830@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: seb, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Seb > > I do have one suggestion which impacts security and > usability. > > On the user account page where you can change your > info, the password boxes are populated. This is a > minor security hazard, as you could now potentially > find a user's login details just by searching through > their cache. I know it sounds unlikely to impact > anyone, but it's not unheard of for sysadmins (ie. > people like me) to get bored and go searching network > caches for this kind of thing. > > Obvious minor change to code: don't update the password > if the input is empty. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i think i'd be willing to do that, but what kind of security implication are we willing talking about? imo, not much of a concern. we're not a bank. we're not amazon.com. there really isn't much to gain by logging in as someone else. just a thought, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From mwarden at mattwarden.com Tue Jan 8 19:30:32 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Tue Jan 8 19:30:32 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Fwd: SIGIA-L: perpetual hopeful push for progress] In-Reply-To: <002401c1985c$0b301c00$79cff3cd@walthers.com> Message-ID: On Jan 8, Miriam Frost had something to say about Re: [thesite] [Fwd:... >Great idea. >We may need to finish making the evolt archive more useable... Yes. We do. Javi, I use the archive for most of the lists I'm on and there are usability things that just annoy the hell out of me. Let me know how you wanna hook up (this list, offlist email, ICQ, IRC, etc.) and I'll try and show you what I mean and why certain operations (like returning to the main index page of an archive from a specific week's listing or an individual post) are impossible without hacking the address in the address bar and/or using back & forward browser operations (the latter isn't as bad). thanks, -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com Wed Jan 9 07:56:06 2002 From: martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com (martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com) Date: Wed Jan 9 07:56:06 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Mail Alert! - Wed Jan 09 17541 Message-ID: Memo from Martin P Burns of PricewaterhouseCoopers -------------------- Start of message text -------------------- This one didn't have any content in the linked page, and the full list of mails doesn't list it. Martin ---------------------- Forwarded by Martin P Burns/UK/MCS/PwC on 09/01/2002 13:51 --------------------------- "evolt.org info" @lists.evolt.org on 09/01/2002 07:47:49 Please respond to admin at lists.evolt.org Sent by: admin-admin at lists.evolt.org To: "evolt.org admin" cc: Subject: [admin] Mail Alert! - Wed Jan 09 17541 There is a mail message on the evolt site- From: Orlando Minor Date: 09-Jan-02 07:47 AM CST Answer at: http://admin.evolt.org/email/index.cfm?action=detail&cid=17541 UA: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.01; Windows NT 5.0) IP: 24.179.30.221 From: http://test.evolt.org/article/ASP_email_made_easy_using_CDO/17/14951/index.html Message: I charge by credit card on a website that I'm developing. They enter all the pertinent info including email address. How would I send a automated email receipt to the email address of the customer once they have been verified, as well as have the website send me an email notifying me of the sell? Would someone please answer it? Thank you sexily. ___________________________________________________ Happy *hic* New Year --------------------- End of message text -------------------- This e-mail is sent by the above named in their individual, non-business capacity and is not on behalf of PricewaterhouseCoopers. PricewaterhouseCoopers may monitor outgoing and incoming e-mails and other telecommunications on its e-mail and telecommunications systems. ---------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. From djc at starkmedia.com Wed Jan 9 09:36:15 2002 From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Wed Jan 9 09:36:15 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Mail Alert! - Wed Jan 09 17541 References: Message-ID: <3C3C625B.9070301@starkmedia.com> martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com wrote: > Memo from Martin P Burns of PricewaterhouseCoopers > > -------------------- Start of message text -------------------- > > This one didn't have any content in the linked page, and the full list of > mails doesn't > list it. > > Martin > From: > http://test.evolt.org/article/ASP_email_made_easy_using_CDO/17/14951/index.html ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ someone sent email from test.evolt.org, and since it uses a seperate DB, the email app wouldn't show it. > Message: > > I charge by credit card on a website that I'm developing. They enter all > the pertinent info including email address. How would I send a automated > email receipt to the email address of the customer once they have been > verified, as well as have the website send me an email notifying me of the > sell? From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 9 14:19:19 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 9 14:19:19 2002 Subject: [thesite] Caching Questions Message-ID: <008701c1994b$0be15c00$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hi everyone ... For my own information .. I'm just wondering about the caching of the front page on teo and what exactly it is doing. I posted a new comment, and it doesn't show up right away. I also noticed it the other day that the front page indicated a certain number of ratings for a particular article, yet when I viewed the article there were more ratings. How long is the caching? Is it just teo or will this also appear on weo? Will the delays be as noticeable on weo, since its a better optimized machine(s) and DB? I understand our desire to get that homepage loading quicker. I'm just curious as to what's going on behind the scenes. Thanks, Michele From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 9 14:48:23 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 9 14:48:23 2002 Subject: [thesite] Final changes to change log Message-ID: <009e01c1994f$1a9011c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Jeff, Dan .. Please review .. these items need to be added/modified for the change log for the current version of teo. + added "recent threads on thelist" box back to the sidebar. updated the html for it along with title attributes. - djc & .jeff This should (a) be deleted or (b) indicate that this feature is currently commented out within the code until it is fully functional. Things to add: (1) Brief note about user selected stylesheets, even though that feature is currently unavailable. Much of the backend code is there? djc (Dan, I'm guessing on this??) (2) Author recognition features added. A floating table which appears on each article page which displays author-specific information, including, email address, links to user's page and bio, user since, last login, # of articles written, average rating received, and total number of ratings. (Note some additional queries exist that are not currently being used, they have been commented out.) User's page has been modified to allow uploading of author's photos. .jeff, isaac, Michele (Jeff, verify or add yourself ;) (3) Added a new column to the user's table to store author's bio information. Modified user page to allow submission and editing of author's bio. Author's bio is shown on each article page at the end of the article. Also included is "additional articles by this author" if they exist. .jeff (Jeff, want to expand upon this?) (4) Added graphical representation of article ratings. Article ratings changed from "1 - bad, 2 - poor, 3 - okay, 4 - good, 5 great!!" -- to -- "1 - poor, 2 - average, 3 - good, 4 - great, 5 - excellent". (Jeff please expand) I think that's it ?? Mich From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Jan 9 15:22:10 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Jan 9 15:22:10 2002 Subject: [thesite] Caching Questions In-Reply-To: <008701c1994b$0be15c00$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: On Jan 9, Michele Foster had something to say about [thesite] Caching Questions >Hi everyone ... > >For my own information .. I'm just wondering about the caching of the front >page on teo and what exactly it is doing. I posted a new comment, and it >doesn't show up right away. I also noticed it the other day that the front >page indicated a certain number of ratings for a particular article, yet >when I viewed the article there were more ratings. > >How long is the caching? It's just the queries that are cached, not the page. From the code, it looks like 20 minutes. Though, I don't claim to be any kind of CF programmer, so I might be interpreting it wrongly: CreateTimeSpan(0, 0, 20, 0) docs say that 20 is minutes, so... hth, -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From djc at starkmedia.com Wed Jan 9 15:30:22 2002 From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Wed Jan 9 15:30:22 2002 Subject: [thesite] Caching Questions References: Message-ID: <3C3CB559.9080001@starkmedia.com> thats just on t.e.o so the front page doesn't timeout because the DB behind it is so slow.. once it's moved up to production, it'll be live and uncached Warden, Matt wrote: > On Jan 9, Michele Foster had something to say about [thesite] Caching Questions > > >>Hi everyone ... >> >>For my own information .. I'm just wondering about the caching of the front >>page on teo and what exactly it is doing. I posted a new comment, and it >>doesn't show up right away. I also noticed it the other day that the front >>page indicated a certain number of ratings for a particular article, yet >>when I viewed the article there were more ratings. >> >>How long is the caching? >> > > It's just the queries that are cached, not the page. > >>From the code, it looks like 20 minutes. Though, I don't claim to be any > kind of CF programmer, so I might be interpreting it wrongly: > > CreateTimeSpan(0, 0, 20, 0) > > docs say that 20 is minutes, so... From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 9 15:31:16 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 9 15:31:16 2002 Subject: [thesite] Caching Questions In-Reply-To: <008701c1994b$0be15c00$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > For my own information .. I'm just wondering about the > caching of the front page on teo and what exactly it is > doing. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< just the queries themselves are being cached so they don't have to be run *everytime* the page is loaded/reloaded. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > I posted a new comment, and it doesn't show up right > away. I also noticed it the other day that the front > page indicated a certain number of ratings for a > particular article, yet when I viewed the article there > were more ratings. > > How long is the caching? Is it just teo or will this > also appear on weo? Will the delays be as noticeable > on weo, since its a better optimized machine(s) and > DB? I understand our desire to get that homepage > loading quicker. I'm just curious as to what's going > on behind the scenes. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< so long as the text of the sql query doesn't change and there's a hit to the page within the specified timeout (20 minutes i believe, though i could be wrong. it might actually be shorter) then it will use the resultset that's cached. however, if either the text of the sql changes or the page isn't called within the timeout, it will go to the database to get a fresh resultset and the process starts over. make sense? .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 9 15:35:33 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 9 15:35:33 2002 Subject: [thesite] Caching Questions In-Reply-To: <3C3CB559.9080001@starkmedia.com> Message-ID: djc, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Daniel J. Cody > > thats just on t.e.o so the front page doesn't timeout > because the DB behind it is so slow.. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< no, i added that because it makes good sense performance-wise. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > once it's moved up to production, it'll be live and > uncached ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< um, why? .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From djc at starkmedia.com Wed Jan 9 16:00:26 2002 From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Wed Jan 9 16:00:26 2002 Subject: [thesite] Caching Questions References: Message-ID: <3C3CBC5F.50908@starkmedia.com> the 512Mb of ram i just plunked down for the oracle box will probably be better used in a different box if we're not going to be hitting the DB for the front page... whatever though.. .jeff wrote: > djc, > > >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >>From: Daniel J. Cody >> >>thats just on t.e.o so the front page doesn't timeout >>because the DB behind it is so slow.. >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >> > > no, i added that because it makes good sense performance-wise. > > >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >>once it's moved up to production, it'll be live and >>uncached >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >> > > um, why? > > .jeff > > http://evolt.org/ > jeff at members.evolt.org > http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > For unsubscribe, archive, and options, go to: > http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thesite > From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 9 17:49:27 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 9 17:49:27 2002 Subject: [thesite] Caching Questions References: <3C3CBC5F.50908@starkmedia.com> Message-ID: <00d501c19968$64117a00$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> hmmm .. How about this .. we roll the code up to production without the caching on for the time being. Give us a chance to test the performance of the new code, the new RAM and the tweaking Dean did (that I don't understand, so you'll have to ask him if ya want to know). Run some performance tests over the next few weeks, then we can discuss if its a good idea to cache the homepage or not? Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Daniel J. Cody" | the 512Mb of ram i just plunked down for the oracle box will probably be | better used in a different box if we're not going to be hitting the DB | for the front page... whatever though.. | | .jeff wrote: | | > | >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | >>once it's moved up to production, it'll be live and | >>uncached | >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | >> | > | > um, why? | > From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 9 19:20:47 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 9 19:20:47 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Article] Draft - Changes to the evolt.org web site Message-ID: <012601c19975$24974000$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hey Folks... Here's a draft article for posting to community news when we roll teo to weo. http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/art_updates_jan02.htm Comments appreciated. And a new title would be great .. I'm drawing a blank on something witty. One note each for Dan and Jeff to provide clarification. Anything I've forgotten, let me know. Thanks, Michele From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 9 19:20:58 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 9 19:20:58 2002 Subject: [thesite] Let's rock and roll .. teo --> weo Message-ID: <012701c19975$2de21860$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Folks, Final changes that need to be done before we move teo --> weo. Let's aim for Friday??? (1) Jeff, add code to process Bio information entered on user page, based on the accepted html tags. (2) Dan, Jeff, make changes to changelog as mentioned in an earlier email I sent out today. (3) Jeff, code the new ratings bar as discussed. (4) Rudy, Dean or Dan .. add a column to the live DB for the author's bio. (I've forgotten the details .. sorry, ask Jeff or check teo) (5) Jeff, Dan decide on caching issue. (6) I think Jeff had the right idea about not changing the DB on weo yet, to reflect the changes Dean made, long to clob (or whatever it was ;). That said, there weren't any objections from the DB gurus that I saw ... However, Dean said .. "This is a side-effect of the table changes that I made. The RATING table still has a foreign key relationship on the original contenttable. I'll move that now." Does the code on teo need to be changed (briefly) so that we can roll it up to weo? (Someone check this please .. I have no clue.) (7) Jeff, Dan review proposed article (that I just posted as a draft), answer any questions or fill in blanks. Everyone else, please provide comments too. That's it .. I think. Mich From martin at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 9 21:14:03 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Wed Jan 9 21:14:03 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Mail Alert! - Wed Jan 09 17541 In-Reply-To: <3C3C625B.9070301@starkmedia.com> Message-ID: On Wednesday, January 9, 2002, at 03:31 pm, Daniel J. Cody wrote: >> http://test.evolt.org/article/ASP_email_made_easy_using_CDO/17/14951/index. >> html > > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > someone sent email from test.evolt.org, and since it uses a seperate > DB, the email app wouldn't show it. D'oh. Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 9 23:15:48 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 9 23:15:48 2002 Subject: [thesite] Caching Questions In-Reply-To: <3C3CBC5F.50908@starkmedia.com> Message-ID: dan, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Daniel J. Cody > > the 512Mb of ram i just plunked down for the oracle box > will probably be better used in a different box if we're > not going to be hitting the DB for the front page... ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i fail to see the reasoning in that. the front page is still hitting the database, just not quite as often. when it *is* hitting the database, it's taking too long right now. i don't see any reason why the homepage shouldn't be down around 1000ms or so without caching. the ram should help that. on top of that, there are all the rest of the pages on the site that still hit the database. surely the time on those pages could use some improving as well. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 9 23:32:07 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 9 23:32:07 2002 Subject: [thesite] Caching Questions In-Reply-To: <00d501c19968$64117a00$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > How about this .. we roll the code up to production > without the caching on for the time being. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< whatever. i don't really care either way. i was just trying to improve the performance of the site. if everyone is happy with the speed of it then no worries. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Give us a chance to test the performance of the new > code, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< which really isn't all that new. there's not much different that'll actually improve the performance. if anything it'll degrade further with this iteration. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Run some performance tests over the next few weeks, then > we can discuss if its a good idea to cache the homepage > or not? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< there's no solid argument against caching since there are solutions for the one concern that'll be brought up. the difficult part is the time it takes to implement those solutions. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 9 23:35:26 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 9 23:35:26 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Article] Draft - Changes to the evolt.org web site In-Reply-To: <012601c19975$24974000$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/art_updates_jan02.htm ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< - the author's average rating received (based on all articles which have been rated); Jeff, confirm correct. looks good. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From dmah at shaw.ca Thu Jan 10 10:18:44 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Thu Jan 10 10:18:44 2002 Subject: [thesite] Let's rock and roll .. teo --> weo In-Reply-To: <012701c19975$2de21860$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> from "Michele Foster" at Jan 09, 2002 08:21:48 PM Message-ID: <200201101619.JAA01488@alice.monkeyland.ca> No changes to the CF code need to be made. This was all database related. The RATING table had a foreign key relationship with the CONTENT table. I had to re-create that relationship on the new CONTENT table that I created. Dean Michele Foster writes: > (6) I think Jeff had the right idea about not changing the DB on weo > yet, to reflect the changes Dean made, long to clob (or whatever it > was ;). That said, there weren't any objections from the DB gurus > that I saw ... However, Dean said .. "This is a side-effect of the > table changes that I made. The RATING table still has a foreign key > relationship on the original contenttable. I'll move that now." > Does the code on teo need to be changed (briefly) so that we can > roll it up to weo? (Someone check this please .. I have no clue.) From djc at starkmedia.com Thu Jan 10 13:04:40 2002 From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Thu Jan 10 13:04:40 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Article] Draft - Changes to the evolt.org web site References: <012601c19975$24974000$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C3DE4AD.4060500@starkmedia.com> mich, looks good. as for the question of me, the link is http://thecode.sf.net maybe you should use this article to explain a bit about the image size specifications too? Michele Foster wrote: > Hey Folks... > > Here's a draft article for posting to community news when we roll teo to > weo. > > http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/art_updates_jan02.htm > > Comments appreciated. And a new title would be great .. I'm drawing a blank > on something witty. One note each for Dan and Jeff to provide > clarification. > > Anything I've forgotten, let me know. From djc at starkmedia.com Thu Jan 10 13:18:38 2002 From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Thu Jan 10 13:18:38 2002 Subject: [thesite] Let's rock and roll .. teo --> weo References: <012701c19975$2de21860$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C3DE7F4.6030008@starkmedia.com> Michele Foster wrote: > (2) Dan, Jeff, make changes to changelog as mentioned in an earlier email I > sent out today. done > (4) Rudy, Dean or Dan .. add a column to the live DB for the author's bio. > (I've forgotten the details .. sorry, ask Jeff or check teo) done From gnarly at gmx.co.uk Thu Jan 10 13:21:23 2002 From: gnarly at gmx.co.uk (Olly Hodgson) Date: Thu Jan 10 13:21:23 2002 Subject: [thesite] Amiga Browsers - Just out of interest... Message-ID: <003701c19a0c$c38da6d0$0100a8c0@olly> The Amiga thread on thechat got me thinking. How would evolt.org look on an Amiga browser? So I launched WinUAE and then Voyager 3.2, and then voila! http://members.evolt.org/gnarly/evolt_bits/voyager_screenshot_weo.gif http://members.evolt.org/gnarly/evolt_bits/voyager_screenshot_deo.gif The browser doesnt support CSS AFAIK. And the site degrades pretty darn well IMHO, apart from the slight wobbliness of the header (not sure if thats a browser specific quirk or not). Anybody got any other browsers that are out of the mainstream they'd like to show off? Atari? Acorn? Psion? Olly - Yes, I'm the random Amiga user that'll pop up in this months stats :-) From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 10 13:45:35 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 10 13:45:35 2002 Subject: [thesite] Amiga Browsers - Just out of interest... References: <003701c19a0c$c38da6d0$0100a8c0@olly> Message-ID: <001201c19a0f$7cc72f20$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hmm.. not too bad. Not sure why the nav is broken a bit. Here's Adrian's article with a bunch of screen shots of different browsers. http://evolt.org/article/rating/20/5816/index.html Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Olly Hodgson" | The Amiga thread on thechat got me thinking. How would evolt.org look on an | Amiga browser? | So I launched WinUAE and then Voyager 3.2, and then voila! | | http://members.evolt.org/gnarly/evolt_bits/voyager_screenshot_weo.gif | http://members.evolt.org/gnarly/evolt_bits/voyager_screenshot_deo.gif | From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 10 17:48:22 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 10 17:48:22 2002 Subject: [thesite] Sourceforge page .. attn. Isaac Message-ID: <008a01c19a31$67da0160$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Isaac Do you have the text for updating this page? http://thecode.sf.net A long time ago you were working on it .. did you get it done? I didn't happen to keep any of the conversations surrounding it .. but I think all your technical questions were answered. If you can, can you update it .. or send me the emails (or link in the archives) and I'll massage all the information together and get that updated. Thanks, Mich From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 10 20:32:36 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 10 20:32:36 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Article] Revised ... The baby is growing ... a community feeling Message-ID: <00d701c19a48$5cbe9040$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hi folks, Revised article for review please. I've incorporated comments and suggestions provided on thesite mailing list, added many of Amanda's suggestions that she sent me off list, brainstormed in IRC and I think it was Elfur that came up with the final title. http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/art_updates_jan02.htm Final review. I'm waiting on approval from Adrian to use him as an example. That link doesn't work yet. Any further comments, suggestions, let me know. Mich From djc at starkmedia.com Thu Jan 10 23:03:58 2002 From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Thu Jan 10 23:03:58 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Article] Revised ... The baby is growing ... a community feeling References: <00d701c19a48$5cbe9040$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C3E73BB.7020300@starkmedia.com> maybe link to the tips search in the 'other mods' section and maybe a (when logged in) behind the features thta require that to work .djc. Michele Foster wrote: > Hi folks, > > Revised article for review please. I've incorporated comments and > suggestions provided on thesite mailing list, added many of Amanda's > suggestions that she sent me off list, brainstormed in IRC and I think it > was Elfur that came up with the final title. > > http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/art_updates_jan02.htm > > Final review. > > I'm waiting on approval from Adrian to use him as an example. That link > doesn't work yet. > > Any further comments, suggestions, let me know. > > Mich > > > > _______________________________________________ > For unsubscribe, archive, and options, go to: > http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thesite > From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 10 23:16:44 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 10 23:16:44 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Article] Revised ... The baby is growing ... a community feeling References: <00d701c19a48$5cbe9040$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <3C3E73BB.7020300@starkmedia.com> Message-ID: <013401c19a5f$4c5cb800$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Dan, ----- Original Message ----- From: "Daniel J. Cody" | maybe link to the tips search in the 'other mods' section umm.. do you mean to link to the user page, which now contains a link to the user's tips on leo? Which user should I link to? Can that be done programmatically if the user is logged in? Or maybe that part is confusing? on the user's page a link has been added to the search; and, and maybe a | (when logged in) behind the features thta require that to work I don't believe there are new features that depend on log in status. I didn't include in this article the new Admin (and God) features, should I? Mich | > http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/art_updates_jan02.htm | > From djc at starkmedia.com Thu Jan 10 23:22:05 2002 From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Thu Jan 10 23:22:05 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Article] Revised ... The baby is growing ... a community feeling References: <00d701c19a48$5cbe9040$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <3C3E73BB.7020300@starkmedia.com> <013401c19a5f$4c5cb800$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C3E77FB.2050504@starkmedia.com> Michele Foster wrote: > Or maybe that part is confusing? > > > on the user's page a link has been added to the search; and, > just a link to the tips search, thats a new feature, nice to showcase it > and maybe a > | (when logged in) behind the features thta require that to work > > > I don't believe there are new features that depend on log in status. I > didn't include in this article the new Admin (and God) features, should I? maybe it got removed, but one or two(me mostly) lobbied to have the comment search be available to regular users .djc. From isaac at triplezero.com.au Thu Jan 10 23:28:00 2002 From: isaac at triplezero.com.au (Isaac Forman) Date: Thu Jan 10 23:28:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] User page changes on TEO Message-ID: Everyone, I've updated the user page (user/dsp_user.cfm) to include the author photo and bio. The other change is to shift the user's full name out of the "stat" table to give it more prominence. You can see the changes for someone with a pic uploaded and bio entered here: http://test.evolt.org/user/isaac/79 Longer bio: http://test.evolt.org/user/jeff/15/ Neither pic, nor bio: http://test.evolt.org/user/matt/65/ Before the announcement of these new things on WEO/thelist/etc, we should ensure that the authors mentioned in Michele's announcement article have also uploaded their pics to WEO. Also, we may like to consider a page (however temporary) which lists people who have uploaded their pic and bio, so that members can browse around and start to get an idea of the faces that make up evolt.org, and read some info on who they are. Thoughts? isaac -------------------------------------------------------------- triple zero digital | upstairs at 200 the parade, norwood 5067 (08)83320545 | www.triplezero.com.au | isaac at triplezero.com.au From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 10 23:28:59 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 10 23:28:59 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Article] Revised ... The baby is growing ... a community feeling References: <00d701c19a48$5cbe9040$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <3C3E73BB.7020300@starkmedia.com> <013401c19a5f$4c5cb800$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <3C3E77FB.2050504@starkmedia.com> Message-ID: <013d01c19a61$01e0cee0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> it is now .. available to all users regardless of logged in status. Mich | | maybe it got removed, but one or two(me mostly) lobbied to have the | comment search be available to regular users | From michele at wordpro.on.ca Thu Jan 10 23:42:14 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Thu Jan 10 23:42:14 2002 Subject: [thesite] User page changes on TEO References: Message-ID: <014601c19a62$dc7aea80$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Isaac, ----- Original Message ----- From: "Isaac Forman" Looks good to me .. just what we needed .. an interim user's page before we get to work on the full membership pages. (yeah!!) | | Before the announcement of these new things on WEO/thelist/etc, we should | ensure that the authors mentioned in Michele's announcement article have | also uploaded their pics to WEO. Yes and no ...the photos will move with teo --> weo. However, the bio's won't. But we'll coordinate that in real time, i.e. get Jeff and Aard to add their bio's to their profile at the same time. (Or anyone with God can do that directly.) | | Also, we may like to consider a page (however temporary) which lists people | who have uploaded their pic and bio, so that members can browse around and | start to get an idea of the faces that make up evolt.org, and read some info | on who they are. I like the idea .. I don't know how to do it tho. (The bio is easy, we can select all where bio exists .. not sure how to do that for the pic tho.) Michele P.S. (I'll add these changes to the article too) From isaac at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 10 23:48:20 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Thu Jan 10 23:48:20 2002 Subject: [thesite] User page changes on TEO In-Reply-To: <014601c19a62$dc7aea80$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: > get to work on the full membership pages. (yeah!!) Heh. > However, the bio's won't. But we'll coordinate that in real > time, i.e. get > Jeff and Aard to add their bio's to their profile at the same time. (Or > anyone with God can do that directly.) OK, as long as you're aware of that. > I like the idea .. I don't know how to do it tho. (The bio is easy, we can > select all where bio exists .. not sure how to do that for the pic tho.) Jeff? i From michele at wordpro.on.ca Fri Jan 11 00:22:09 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Fri Jan 11 00:22:09 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Article] Draft 3 ... The baby is growing ... a community feeling References: <00d701c19a48$5cbe9040$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <3C3E73BB.7020300@starkmedia.com> <013401c19a5f$4c5cb800$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <3C3E77FB.2050504@starkmedia.com> Message-ID: <015501c19a68$7039d880$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Dan, I think what I wrote was confusing .. so .... I added some more info ... recent changes to both leo and deo. (Dean and Simon, any comments). I added info that the bio and pic are available on the user page. Any additional comments, let me know. http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/art_updates_jan02.htm Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Daniel J. Cody" | > Or maybe that part is confusing? | > | > | > on the user's page a link has been added to the search; and, | > | | | just a link to the tips search, thats a new feature, nice to showcase it | | From dmah at shaw.ca Fri Jan 11 00:47:37 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Fri Jan 11 00:47:37 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Article] Draft 3 ... The baby is growing ... a community In-Reply-To: <015501c19a68$7039d880$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> from "Michele Foster" at Jan 11, 2002 01:23:08 AM Message-ID: <200201110648.XAA08208@alice.monkeyland.ca> The tip stuff looks fine to me. Dean Michele Foster writes: > I added some more info ... recent changes to both leo and deo. > (Dean and Simon, any comments). From ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk Fri Jan 11 08:27:01 2002 From: ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk (Simon Coggins) Date: Fri Jan 11 08:27:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Article] Draft 3 ... The baby is growing ... a community feeling In-Reply-To: <015501c19a68$7039d880$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: > I added some more info ... recent changes to both leo and deo. (Dean and > Simon, any comments). Looks good. I'll try to finish that community news article on the changes to deo over the weekend so maybe you can link to that too. Simon From michele at wordpro.on.ca Fri Jan 11 10:14:53 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Fri Jan 11 10:14:53 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Article] Draft 3 ... The baby is growing ... a community feeling References: Message-ID: <01d701c19abb$4211a8e0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Simon, Don't bother ... we'll just include the info in the one article, highlighting all of the changes at once. I don't see a need to have another article. But feel free to make modifications to what I wrote for deo. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Coggins" | | > I added some more info ... recent changes to both leo and deo. (Dean and | > Simon, any comments). | | Looks good. I'll try to finish that community news article on the changes | to deo over the weekend so maybe you can link to that too. | | Simon From ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk Fri Jan 11 10:50:53 2002 From: ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk (Simon Coggins) Date: Fri Jan 11 10:50:53 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Article] Draft 3 ... The baby is growing ... a community feeling In-Reply-To: <01d701c19abb$4211a8e0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: > Don't bother ... we'll just include the info in the one article, > highlighting all of the changes at once. I don't see a need to have another > article. But feel free to make modifications to what I wrote for deo. Okay, I'll email you over the weekend with changes. Simon From seb at members.evolt.org Fri Jan 11 11:25:04 2002 From: seb at members.evolt.org (Seb) Date: Fri Jan 11 11:25:04 2002 Subject: [thesite] User page changes on TEO In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020111171824.04998ff8@members.evolt.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Sometime around 05:30 11/01/2002, Isaac Forman did verily sayeth: >You can see the changes for someone with a pic uploaded and bio entered >here: >http://test.evolt.org/user/isaac/79 > >Longer bio: >http://test.evolt.org/user/jeff/15/ > >Neither pic, nor bio: >http://test.evolt.org/user/matt/65/ Just out of interest, and not wanting to rehash old arguments that I might not be aware of, has anyone had the discussion that this page immediately suggests? http://test.evolt.org/user/Seb/19/index.html >Also, we may like to consider a page (however temporary) which lists people >who have uploaded their pic and bio, so that members can browse around and >start to get an idea of the faces that make up evolt.org, and read some info >on who they are. > >Thoughts? +1 I'd also suggest adding small icons to the user search results indicating those users that have pics and bios posted. Seb. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPfreeware 7.0.3 for non-commercial use iQA/AwUBPD8gHr2V451Vxr52EQKkuACg0Xye9tJd9JA5+Pth7Pi4GlgKL+4AmwTg LzXZe+KHlQbvQ8K4+KOhG9k8 =lW9U -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From michele at wordpro.on.ca Fri Jan 11 11:35:11 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Fri Jan 11 11:35:11 2002 Subject: [thesite] User page changes on TEO References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020111171824.04998ff8@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <023f01c19ac6$780e74e0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Seb, ----- Original Message ----- From: "Seb" | | Just out of interest, and not wanting to rehash old arguments that I might | not be aware of, has anyone had the discussion that this page immediately | suggests? | | http://test.evolt.org/user/Seb/19/index.html You mean someone posting "inappropriate" material? i.e. have the photos and bio been reviewed/approved by Admin or some other body? No .. hasn't been discussed .. not that I remember anyway. The thought had crossed my mind briefly .. and I think Jeff and I may have briefly discussed if Bio text needs to be "approved" prior to submission. But nothing concrete and no decisions made. It's sort of like comments .. where that material isn't approved before being posted. There is a mechanism in place to "grr" comments tho. If memory serves .. and it may not .. those with "God" status can edit a user's bio and/or photo. Maybe that's not enough. Maybe we should consider some sort of "grr" and/or approval process. Or we take the approach and see if its abused, then deal with the situation as needed? If I'm totally off base here, please let me know. :) | | >Also, we may like to consider a page (however temporary) which lists people | >who have uploaded their pic and bio, so that members can browse around and | >start to get an idea of the faces that make up evolt.org, and read some info | >on who they are. | > | >Thoughts? | | +1 | | I'd also suggest adding small icons to the user search results indicating | those users that have pics and bios posted. Good idea .. Mich (p.s. do I have permission to delete that photo of yours prior to rolling the code to production? ;) From seb at members.evolt.org Fri Jan 11 11:39:59 2002 From: seb at members.evolt.org (Seb) Date: Fri Jan 11 11:39:59 2002 Subject: [thesite] User page changes on TEO In-Reply-To: <023f01c19ac6$780e74e0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020111171824.04998ff8@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020111173908.04c5a3f0@members.evolt.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 >You mean someone posting "inappropriate" material? i.e. have the photos and >bio been reviewed/approved by Admin or some other body? > >No .. hasn't been discussed .. not that I remember anyway. The thought had >crossed my mind briefly .. and I think Jeff and I may have briefly discussed >if Bio text needs to be "approved" prior to submission. But nothing >concrete and no decisions made. > >(p.s. do I have permission to delete that photo of yours prior to rolling >the code to production? ;) Done it already. For those coming to this conversation after I've deleted the photo, it was simply a gif image with some abusive text. Seb. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPfreeware 7.0.3 for non-commercial use iQA/AwUBPD8jnr2V451Vxr52EQKHEgCg1FR0iEXmlO2KLgoho2RDo4zWFTYAoMXP E5RPgdspow3LYBnZJRPosFTf =2xxC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From michele at wordpro.on.ca Fri Jan 11 13:56:07 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Fri Jan 11 13:56:07 2002 Subject: [thesite] Final changes to change log References: <009e01c1994f$1a9011c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <029a01c19ada$29356e00$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Updated changelog. Jeff modify when you have time, as necessary. :) Ratings bar added but deferred to next release. Michele ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michele Foster" | (2) Author recognition features added. A floating table which appears on | each article page which displays author-specific information, including, | email address, links to user's page and bio, user since, last login, # of | articles written, average rating received, and total number of ratings. | (Note some additional queries exist that are not currently being used, they | have been commented out.) User's page has been modified to allow uploading | of author's photos. .jeff, isaac, Michele (Jeff, verify or add yourself ;) | | (3) Added a new column to the user's table to store author's bio | information. Modified user page to allow submission and editing of author's | bio. Author's bio is shown on each article page at the end of the article. | Also included is "additional articles by this author" if they exist. .jeff | (Jeff, want to expand upon this?) | | (4) Added graphical representation of article ratings. Article ratings | changed from "1 - bad, 2 - poor, 3 - okay, 4 - good, 5 great!!" -- to -- | "1 - poor, 2 - average, 3 - good, 4 - great, 5 - excellent". (Jeff please | expand) From michele at wordpro.on.ca Fri Jan 11 14:00:28 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Fri Jan 11 14:00:28 2002 Subject: [thesite] Let's Do It (teo --> weo) Message-ID: <02a201c19ada$c3d44120$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hi Everyone .... Dan's going to be rolling the code from teo to weo very shortly. You may see some oddities during this transition. Once Dan's done, we'll do a final double-check that nothing got broken, then post the article I wrote to Community News and parts of it to thelist. All photos uploaded will be rolled over automatically. Anyone that entered a bio will need to re-enter it on weo (or copy it to weo). I'll be adding, Jeff and Adrian's. Jeff, the ratings bar, we've commented out the new version for now. Let's save it for the next iteration. (Which hopefully won't be 4 months in preparing ;) Thanks, Mich From michele at wordpro.on.ca Fri Jan 11 15:06:21 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Fri Jan 11 15:06:21 2002 Subject: [thesite] Friday Freebie!!! Message-ID: <02b601c19ae3$fbdb6e00$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Happy Friday Afternoon Everyone!!! After several months worth of work, we've rolled up a new version of the evolt.org main web site. We've added the ability for each user/author to have a photo and a bio appear on each of his/her articles. Plus many other changes. All the details and links to examples can be found in this new article: http://evolt.org/baby_steps/ Hope to see many photos and bios entered soon. Enjoy!!! Michele (Sorry for the cross-posting .. I wanted to make sure *everyone* heard about this at the same time.) From djc at starkmedia.com Fri Jan 11 15:08:06 2002 From: djc at starkmedia.com (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Fri Jan 11 15:08:06 2002 Subject: [thesite] Let's Do It (teo --> weo) References: <02a201c19ada$c3d44120$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C3F531D.5090805@starkmedia.com> everything is up and looking good(except for a few minor things in NN4) thanks mich for putting so much time into this :) Michele Foster wrote: > Hi Everyone .... > > Dan's going to be rolling the code from teo to weo very shortly. You may > see some oddities during this transition. Once Dan's done, we'll do a final > double-check that nothing got broken, then post the article I wrote to > Community News and parts of it to thelist. > > All photos uploaded will be rolled over automatically. Anyone that entered > a bio will need to re-enter it on weo (or copy it to weo). I'll be adding, > Jeff and Adrian's. > > Jeff, the ratings bar, we've commented out the new version for now. Let's > save it for the next iteration. (Which hopefully won't be 4 months in > preparing ;) From mccreath at ak.net Fri Jan 11 15:21:53 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Fri Jan 11 15:21:53 2002 Subject: [thesite] BUG on user page? Message-ID: <3C3F5774.9070800@ak.net> I just tried to delete my picture without replacing it and got this message after spinning for several seconds: ### Error Occurred While Processing Request Error Diagnostic Information An error occurred while evaluating the expression: "#form.authorbio#" Error near line 15, column 26. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Error resolving parameter FORM.AUTHORBIO The specified form field cannot be found. This problem is very likely due to the fact that you have misspelled the form field name. The error occurred while processing an element with a general identifier of (CF_TAGSTRIPPER), occupying document position (15:1) to (15:144) in the template file /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/user/act_process.cfm. Date/Time: Fri Jan 11 15:20:13 2002 Browser: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.5; Windows NT 5.0; T312461) Remote Address: 209.165.177.133 HTTP Referrer: http://www.evolt.org/user/index.html?action=edit Query String: section=user&action=process ### David From jeff at members.evolt.org Fri Jan 11 16:16:24 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Fri Jan 11 16:16:24 2002 Subject: [thesite] BUG on user page? In-Reply-To: <3C3F5774.9070800@ak.net> Message-ID: david, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: David McCreath > > I just tried to delete my picture without replacing it > and got this message after spinning for several > seconds: > > ### > > Error Occurred While Processing Request > Error Diagnostic Information > > An error occurred while evaluating the expression: > > > "#form.authorbio#" > > > > Error near line 15, column 26. > -------------------------------------------------------- > > Error resolving parameter FORM.AUTHORBIO ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i think i got it fixed. can you try again and let me know if you still get the same error? thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From mccreath at ak.net Fri Jan 11 16:34:03 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Fri Jan 11 16:34:03 2002 Subject: [thesite] BUG on user page? References: Message-ID: <3C3F6862.4050404@ak.net> Fixed! Thanks, jeff. .jeff wrote: > david, > > i think i got it fixed. can you try again and let me know if you still get > the same error? > > thanks, > From r937 at interlog.com Sat Jan 12 11:30:41 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Sat Jan 12 11:30:41 2002 Subject: [thesite] the new author box Message-ID: <01c19b8e$f4b2bba0$7f4e149a@rudy> hi coders madhu alerted me to a problem with one of my articles -- http://evolt.org/article/TopTenSQL/18/131/evolt.org i don't really feel like going in and editing a sleeping article that was perfectly good until this last quote unquote design enhancement, so i may just leave it seems to me that preventing this type of thing should be covered in the code style guide, but i also realize the diminishing returns in trying to anticipate everything -- besides, i don't even know if my article meets the code style guide (i think it came before) but anyhow, i have another question in the bio under the article are listed 5 of my articles -- what is the sort order on those five articles? obviously it isn't date the 5 that are chosen are not really the most representative of my articles, in fact, one of them is so lame i feel like deleting it rudy From michele at wordpro.on.ca Sat Jan 12 11:44:25 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Sat Jan 12 11:44:25 2002 Subject: [thesite] the new author box References: <01c19b8e$f4b2bba0$7f4e149a@rudy> Message-ID: <00db01c19b90$ebf23700$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Rudy, ----- Original Message ----- From: "rudy" | hi coders | | madhu alerted me to a problem with one of my articles -- | | http://evolt.org/article/TopTenSQL/18/131/evolt.org | ouch .. :( Possible solutions ?? | in the bio under the article are listed 5 of my articles -- what is the | sort order on those five articles? obviously it isn't date | | the 5 that are chosen are not really the most representative of my | articles, in fact, one of them is so lame i feel like deleting it I'm not sure of this either .. however, I'm going to create a page that has all of this information on it. Whether it becomes an FAQ article or not, I'm not sure. I just find us always wondering, what's that "query" based on ... so, a list of all of them will prove useful in the future. Mich (who isn't really saying much important, but is avoiding looking at the mess in the other room ;) From r937 at interlog.com Sat Jan 12 11:52:41 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Sat Jan 12 11:52:41 2002 Subject: [thesite] the new author box Message-ID: <01c19b92$0868c920$7f4e149a@rudy> replying to my own posting... i just read the baby article and have an additional comments "date the user registered his/her evolt.org account" this could be most confusing -- the user account? the m.e.o. account? the subscription to thelist? the registration to the web site? furthermore, "User since:" is unfortunate for those of us who have been here since december 1998, because it seems the earliest dates are april 1999 (when the evolt 1.0 site went up) pity the poor user who changes jobs and needs a new user id -- all those lovely stats will be lost when, oh, when will we be ready to work on the member pages? rudy p.s. "Have fun creating your photo. Be creative. Express your personality." heh watch out From jeff at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 12 11:54:55 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sat Jan 12 11:54:55 2002 Subject: [thesite] the new author box In-Reply-To: <01c19b8e$f4b2bba0$7f4e149a@rudy> Message-ID: rudy, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: rudy > > in the bio under the article are listed 5 of my > articles -- what is the sort order on those five > articles? obviously it isn't date ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< SELECT 1 AS rank , content.contentid , content.contentname , content.synopsis , content.ratings , content.rating , content.replies , content.categoryid , content.datemod , (SELECT category FROM categorys WHERE categorys.categoryid = content.categoryid ) AS category FROM content WHERE content.userid = #userid# AND content.categoryid NOT IN (1, 23, 26, 9741) AND content.contentid <> #contentid# AND content.signoff = 1 UNION ALL SELECT 2 , content.contentid , content.contentname , content.synopsis , content.ratings , content.rating , content.replies , content.categoryid , content.datemod , (SELECT category FROM categorys WHERE categorys.categoryid = content.categoryid ) FROM content WHERE content.userid = #userid# AND content.categoryid IN (1, 23, 26, 9741) AND content.contentid <> #contentid# AND content.signoff = 1 ORDER BY rank , rating DESC , ratings DESC , datemod ASC ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > the 5 that are chosen are not really the most > representative of my articles, in fact, one of them > is so lame i feel like deleting it ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i fixed that by changing my rating on the "lame" article. it now no longer shows up in the list of articles in your bio section. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 12 12:00:10 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sat Jan 12 12:00:10 2002 Subject: [thesite] the new author box In-Reply-To: <01c19b92$0868c920$7f4e149a@rudy> Message-ID: rudy, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: rudy > > pity the poor user who changes jobs and needs a new > user id -- all those lovely stats will be lost ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< that doesn't need to happen though. it's as simple as logging in and changing your email address, eh? .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Sat Jan 12 12:09:13 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Sat Jan 12 12:09:13 2002 Subject: [thesite] the new author box References: <01c19b92$0868c920$7f4e149a@rudy> Message-ID: <00e801c19b94$621b35a0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Rudy, ----- Original Message ----- From: "rudy" | replying to my own posting... you're allowed .. once ;) | | i just read the baby article and have an additional comments | | | "date the user registered his/her evolt.org account" | | this could be most confusing -- the user account? the m.e.o. account? the | subscription to thelist? the registration to the web site? How can I make it more clear? I struggled trying to come up with the right words .. and bailed and just used "evolt.org account" .. Any ideas? Is "date the user registered his/her user id" more accurate/clear/comprehensive? | | furthermore, "User since:" is unfortunate for those of us who have been | here since december 1998, because it seems the earliest dates are april | 1999 (when the evolt 1.0 site went up) Good point .. can you grab a list of those with a date in April 1999 and do an update on the records that should be back-dated? If you have a list of those in April 1999, I think there are several people here that can verify which ones should be back dated to a more accurate date. (just guessing .. since I wouldn't be able to verify the info myself) | | pity the poor user who changes jobs and needs a new user id -- all those | lovely stats will be lost hehehe .. you're the DB guru .. you solve it ;) Seriously, not sure what the solution is .. except to go through each userid and try to match up old ones and new ones. It's only when a user asks that an old ID be changed, that it gets done. | | when, oh, when will we be ready to work on the member pages? | NOW!!!! :) Seriously .. can we work on them while the redesign is being done? I think so... as there's quite a bit of backend stuff to be done. Jeff's got a few things he wants to finish up on the latest code push .. affecting user pages and article views .. once he's done that, we should put teo back to "draft" stage, i.e. de-comment out the member page stuff that Dan started, and continue working on that. Mich (hopes "de-comment out" is clear ;) From jeff at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 12 13:33:07 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sat Jan 12 13:33:07 2002 Subject: [thesite] the new author box In-Reply-To: <01c19b8e$f4b2bba0$7f4e149a@rudy> Message-ID: rudy, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: rudy > > madhu alerted me to a problem with one of my articles -- > > http://evolt.org/article/TopTenSQL/18/131/evolt.org > > i don't really feel like going in and editing a sleeping > article that was perfectly good until this last quote > unquote design enhancement, so i may just leave it ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i think it's good enough article to warrant the effort. so, i went ahead and updated it on t.e.o. there were a number of other small things that needed to be addressed in the html as well. http://test.evolt.org/article/TopTenSQL/18/131/ is that satisfactory? it solves the problem, for sure. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > seems to me that preventing this type of thing should be > covered in the code style guide, [...] ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< agreed. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > but i also realize the diminishing returns in trying to > anticipate everything -- besides, i don't even know if > my article meets the code style guide (i think it came > before) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< it failed some basic html validation requirements like closing tags, block level elements being nested, use of tags, etc. i'd like feedback on the changes i made to the article. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From r937 at interlog.com Sat Jan 12 13:37:54 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Sat Jan 12 13:37:54 2002 Subject: [thesite] the new author box Message-ID: <01c19ba0$bb2ac6e0$7f4e149a@rudy> thanks for the sql, jeff, it shore looks familiar so, sequenced by rating, with "real" articles ahead of all "other" ones, and in case of tied ratings, most often rated articles first, and if rated equally often, oldest articles to latest don't go around changing your ratings, though -- people will come to expect it of you, and will forever chase after you, to change this one, or that one, or the other one please... maybe you don't have an article near the top five overall evolt highest rated articles, but i do ;o) From jeff at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 12 13:58:42 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sat Jan 12 13:58:42 2002 Subject: [thesite] the new author box In-Reply-To: <01c19ba0$bb2ac6e0$7f4e149a@rudy> Message-ID: rudy, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: rudy > > thanks for the sql, jeff, it shore looks familiar ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< yup, you helped me on it. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > so, sequenced by rating, with "real" articles ahead of > all "other" ones, and in case of tied ratings, most > often rated articles first, and if rated equally often, > oldest articles to latest ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< precisely. thank you for translating into english for those that don't understand what the query is doing. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > don't go around changing your ratings, though -- people > will come to expect it of you, and will forever chase > after you, to change this one, or that one, or the other > one please... ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i didn't say i did it to bump your "lame" article out of that list did i? if that was inferred, it wasn't intended. i took a look at the article, a look at my rating, and decided i'd rated it too high. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > maybe you don't have an article near the top five > overall evolt highest rated articles, but i do ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i'm close (27 and 31 actually, so not *that* close). thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From r937 at interlog.com Sat Jan 12 14:17:41 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Sat Jan 12 14:17:41 2002 Subject: [thesite] the new author box Message-ID: <01c19ba6$4a21f3a0$7f4e149a@rudy> >| when, oh, when will we be ready to work on the member pages? > >NOW!!!! :) > >Seriously .. can we work on them while the redesign is being done? sure we can here, i'll start the ball rolling (and i'll gladly take ownership and track the details on this one) we should first establish ~ what's the difference between a user and a member ~ how would current user data map onto a member-user structure as a bit of background (but only a bit, since we shouldn't have to dig into the archives, we know this stuff, anybody on this list does), we are dealing with the likelihood, nay, the reality, of multiple "userids" per actual real person -- e.g. home and work email ids a person with both home and work ids, who posts to thelist regularly from either of them, has two identities in the list archives if the archive data were ever integrated with other user data.... wait a second! they already are, in the tip harvester! -- then it would be nice if both email ids were associated with the same "person" in the database viewed in the other direction, you would not want authors to have to fill out more than one of those new author bios we just introduced (never mind for the moment that it is site loginid and not list emailid that identifies article authors) jeff, i'm afraid i have to disagree with another comment of yours -- > it's as simple as logging in and changing your email address, eh? would that it were that simple, but this assumes only one email id per person okay, so big deal (i can almost hear the rebuttal now), what if we had an adjunct "alternate/additional email id" table to hold the spillover -- after all, most users have only one email id and so the number of extra rows in the adjunct table would be very low, and of course you'd need outer joins, but then you'd also need an admin script to manage the adjunct email ids.... as you can see, the implications are interesting, and tempting to think about now (especially for the predominantly left-brained among us), but the particular implementation strategy is immaterial until after a couple of basic agreements are reached -- ~ what's the difference between a user and a member ~ how would current user data map onto a member-user structure "member" in this context should now be taken to mean all that good data that we maintain about the "real person" that i talked about unfortunately, common parlance all too often associates the word "user" with the word "person" the word "member" was chosen to make a stronger cognitive association to actual people, allowing "user" to remain associated with "userid" at the same level as "emailid" if this terminology confuses, we need to clear this up before anything else rudy From r937 at interlog.com Sat Jan 12 14:23:41 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Sat Jan 12 14:23:41 2002 Subject: [thesite] the new author box Message-ID: <01c19ba7$1fe17ec0$7f4e149a@rudy> >i'd like feedback on the changes i made to the article. i hate you! i hate you! i *hate* those textareas and i hate YOU!! oh, all right, fine -- keep them thanks for fixing the table overflow, jeff go ahead and copy the article to weo ;o) rudy From jeff at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 12 14:30:37 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sat Jan 12 14:30:37 2002 Subject: [thesite] the new author box In-Reply-To: <01c19ba7$1fe17ec0$7f4e149a@rudy> Message-ID: rudy, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: rudy > > > i'd like feedback on the changes i made to the > > article. > > i hate you! i hate you! i *hate* those textareas > and i hate YOU!! ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< yes, and you hate the "quote unquote design enhancements" too, which i suspect is why you didn't wanna make your article work again. ;p ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > oh, all right, fine -- keep them ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< cool. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > thanks for fixing the table overflow, jeff ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< no problem. mostly just wanted to see if i could do it. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > go ahead and copy the article to weo ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< right on, i was just about to ask if i could. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Sat Jan 12 14:37:54 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Sat Jan 12 14:37:54 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Overlap Problems Message-ID: <011801c19ba9$2965cbc0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hi folks .. Just a small bug .. short articles are ending up with the bio overlapping the author block. http://evolt.org/article/Festive_Beervolts/27/18958/index.html I have a few ideas to try to fix this .. unless someone else gets to it first. :) Mich From roselli at earthlink.net Sat Jan 12 16:44:51 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Sat Jan 12 16:44:51 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Overlap Problems In-Reply-To: <011801c19ba9$2965cbc0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C4075C4.25046.A4CD6FF@localhost> > From: "Michele Foster" > > Just a small bug .. short articles are ending up with the bio > overlapping the author block. > > http://evolt.org/article/Festive_Beervolts/27/18958/index.html > > I have a few ideas to try to fix this .. unless someone else gets to > it first. :)
before the bio block? From michele at wordpro.on.ca Sat Jan 12 17:32:55 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Sat Jan 12 17:32:55 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Overlap Problems References: <3C4075C4.25046.A4CD6FF@localhost> Message-ID: <012b01c19bc1$9d4ac140$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Seems to have worked just fine... thanks Aard .. that was one of the things I was going to try. :) Someone with access to the live server, can you make a couple of changes please. in /article/dsp_article.cfm lines 285 and 286 look like this


change that first
to
leave the last two

So, lines 285 and 286 will now be


Might be easier to fine by knowing what Line 287 is: NOTE: Don't update the file from teo to weo .. the file on teo was restored to its "test" stage where Jeff still needs to modify the ratings bar. This was done intentionally. So, to fix the overlap problem, please do the above. :) Also, I made some textual changes to the /user/dsp_signup.cfm file. Added a sentence that the black border is included automatically. That file can be updated directly from teo --> weo. TIA, Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "aardvark" | > From: "Michele Foster" | > | > Just a small bug .. short articles are ending up with the bio | > overlapping the author block. | > | > http://evolt.org/article/Festive_Beervolts/27/18958/index.html | > | > I have a few ideas to try to fix this .. unless someone else gets to | > it first. :) | |
before the bio block? From dmah at shaw.ca Sat Jan 12 21:08:24 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Sat Jan 12 21:08:24 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Overlap Problems In-Reply-To: <012b01c19bc1$9d4ac140$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> from "Michele Foster" at Jan 12, 2002 06:34:00 PM Message-ID: <200201130309.UAA07040@alice.monkeyland.ca> Changed dsp_article.cfm and copied over dsp_signup.cfm. Dean Michele Foster writes: > in /article/dsp_article.cfm > > lines 285 and 286 look like this > >
>

> > change that first
> > to > >
> > Also, I made some textual changes to the /user/dsp_signup.cfm file. > Added a sentence that the black border is included automatically. > That file can be updated directly from teo --> weo. From michele at wordpro.on.ca Sun Jan 13 00:47:17 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Sun Jan 13 00:47:17 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Overlap Problems References: <200201130309.UAA07040@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <015e01c19bfe$4f0c7720$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Thanks Dean!! Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dean Mah" | Changed dsp_article.cfm and copied over dsp_signup.cfm. | | Dean | From richard.bennett at skynet.be Sun Jan 13 05:08:35 2002 From: richard.bennett at skynet.be (Richard Bennett) Date: Sun Jan 13 05:08:35 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Overlap Problems References: <3C4075C4.25046.A4CD6FF@localhost> Message-ID: <07a401c19c22$4b145790$0100a8c0@wwwv7zwbf035xj> That would make a great article - what

or
do, with some examples, and which browsers support it... I'd never even heard of it 'till just now :o) Richard. ----- Original Message ----- From: "aardvark" >
before the bio block? From martin at members.evolt.org Sun Jan 13 11:39:39 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Sun Jan 13 11:39:39 2002 Subject: Changing jobs/email address issues was: [thesite] the new author box In-Reply-To: <01c19b92$0868c920$7f4e149a@rudy> Message-ID: <92DE118C-084C-11D6-835C-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> On Saturday, January 12, 2002, at 05:53 pm, rudy wrote: > pity the poor user who changes jobs and needs a new user id -- all those > lovely stats will be lost Same issue re "Search for Tips by this author" - I have tips from (I think...) 6 email addresses. Because the search only searches for tips from my meo account (ie what's registered for my weo account), it only pulls back a small proportion of them. I guess this is a factor of having a 1-1 relationship between users and email addresses. For many users this'll be fine, but I guess lots of people have at least 2 (home and work). Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From martin at members.evolt.org Sun Jan 13 11:54:36 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Sun Jan 13 11:54:36 2002 Subject: [thesite] the new author box In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Saturday, January 12, 2002, at 05:56 pm, .jeff wrote: > WHERE content.userid = #userid# > AND content.categoryid IN (1, 23, 26, 9741) > AND content.contentid <> #contentid# > AND content.signoff = 1 Would it be useful to make this consistent with the sidebar 'highest rated' list - ie articles with more than 5 ratings? My list's top 3 articles have 2, 1 and 1 ratings apiece. Now I'm really happy for them to be on the list (and a couple of them maybe deserve more people ranking them), but I'm not sure that having one or two people rating an article highly gives the balance to really show an author's true best other articles. Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From roselli at earthlink.net Sun Jan 13 12:35:31 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Sun Jan 13 12:35:31 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Overlap Problems In-Reply-To: <07a401c19c22$4b145790$0100a8c0@wwwv7zwbf035xj> Message-ID: <3C418CD3.17863.E8EEB7C@localhost> > From: "Richard Bennett" > > That would make a great article - what >
>
> or >
> > do, with some examples, and which browsers support it... wouldn't that be a short article? maybe tip-worthy... hmm... From martin at members.evolt.org Sun Jan 13 12:35:52 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Sun Jan 13 12:35:52 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Author pic deleting? Message-ID: <6D715D84-0854-11D6-835C-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Hi folks It seems that whenever I update my bio, the pic gets deleted. Is this because the pic upload text field is empty? Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From michele at wordpro.on.ca Sun Jan 13 12:53:49 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Sun Jan 13 12:53:49 2002 Subject: [thesite] weo down ? Message-ID: <018801c19c63$d05c74a0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Anyone else having problems with weo? I can't get it to load .. not sure if its a cache problem on my end. Both IE and NS won't load it. Here's the error message. Mich Request timed out The time taken to process your request has exceeded the allowable limit of 45 seconds. Please notify the server administrator (using the mail link below) that this error has occurred. Note: You can override the request time limit by adding a 'RequestTimeout' parameter to the URL used to request the page (e.g. page.cfm?RequestTimeout=500). SQL = "SELECT content.contentid , content.keyphrase , content.contentname , content.synopsis , content.datemod , content.replies , content.rating , content.ratings , users.userid , users.who , categorys.category , categorys.categoryid , (SELECT Count(*) FROM replies WHERE contentid = content.contentid AND datemod > '13-Jan-02') AS newcomments FROM content , users , categorys WHERE content.signoff = 1 AND content.categoryid <> 23 AND content.categoryid <> 26 AND content.categoryid <> 9741 AND content.userid = users.userid AND content.categoryid = categorys.categoryid ORDER BY content.datemod DESC , content.contentid DESC" Data Source = "EVOLT" The error occurred while processing an element with a general identifier of (CFQUERY), occupying document position (3:1) to (3:62) in the template file /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/home/act_home.cfm. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- Caught an exception, type = ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- Error Occurred While Processing Request Error Diagnostic Information The time taken to process your request has exceeded the allowable limit of 45 seconds. Please notify the server administrator (using the mail link below) that this error has occurred. Note: You can override the request time limit by adding a 'RequestTimeout' parameter to the URL used to request the page (e.g. page.cfm?RequestTimeout=500). Date/Time: Sun Jan 13 12:50:36 2002 Browser: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.5; Windows 98; T312461) Remote Address: 205.207.148.254 From michele at wordpro.on.ca Sun Jan 13 12:56:18 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Sun Jan 13 12:56:18 2002 Subject: [thesite] weo down ? References: <018801c19c63$d05c74a0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <018d01c19c64$2c9e0260$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Forget it .. it's back now. Not sure what caused the problem. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michele Foster" | Anyone else having problems with weo? | | I can't get it to load .. not sure if its a cache problem on my end. Both | IE and NS won't load it. Here's the error message. | From michele at wordpro.on.ca Sun Jan 13 12:59:19 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Sun Jan 13 12:59:19 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Author pic deleting? References: <6D715D84-0854-11D6-835C-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <019401c19c64$987d5da0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Martin, What browser/OS are you using? I can't duplicate this on teo nor weo. Anyone else noticing a problem? You're not accidentally checking to delete this pic are you? (Or is it defaulted "on" perhaps in your browser?) Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin" | Hi folks | | It seems that whenever I update my bio, the pic gets | deleted. | | Is this because the pic upload text field is empty? | From martin at members.evolt.org Sun Jan 13 13:31:52 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Sun Jan 13 13:31:52 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Author pic deleting? In-Reply-To: <019401c19c64$987d5da0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3EDC6CE7-085C-11D6-835C-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> On Sunday, January 13, 2002, at 07:00 pm, Michele Foster wrote: > What browser/OS are you using? IE5.1/OS X > I can't duplicate this on teo nor weo. Tried it a few times - happens every time > You're not accidentally checking to delete this pic are you? (Or is it > defaulted "on" perhaps in your browser?) Nope - it's unchecked. Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From michele at wordpro.on.ca Sun Jan 13 13:36:19 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Sun Jan 13 13:36:19 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Author pic deleting? References: <3EDC6CE7-085C-11D6-835C-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <020f01c19c69$c38113c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> hmm.. ok .. I'll do some more testing then. Only thing I can think of off the top is a file permission problem (difference) between teo/weo. I'll play with my test id and see if I can duplicate it. If you have a chance, can you see if you get the same problem on teo. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin" | | On Sunday, January 13, 2002, at 07:00 pm, Michele Foster wrote: | | > What browser/OS are you using? | | IE5.1/OS X | | > I can't duplicate this on teo nor weo. | | Tried it a few times - happens every time | | > You're not accidentally checking to delete this pic are you? (Or is it | > defaulted "on" perhaps in your browser?) | | Nope - it's unchecked. | From martin at members.evolt.org Sun Jan 13 13:38:19 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Sun Jan 13 13:38:19 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] CSS for author pic Message-ID: <24CE5F90-085D-11D6-835C-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Text says black border (which I think is the best choice anyway). Border is white on article pages (it's black on the member info page): http://evolt.org/article/rating/20/5127/index.html And the image tag is the same... MartinB (nice alt attribute - dropping the user ID in - btw) Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From webguru at vsnl.net Sun Jan 13 13:40:27 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Sun Jan 13 13:40:27 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] CSS for author pic In-Reply-To: <24CE5F90-085D-11D6-835C-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020114010847.04d33e48@203.197.12.4> At 01:08 AM 1/14/2002, Martin typed these words: >(nice alt attribute - dropping the user ID in - btw) Methinks the author's name would be a better choice, unless you *want* to remain anonymous of course. Opinions? Madhu <<< * >>> Madhu Menon madhu at members.evolt.org Blog: http://madman.weblogs.com From roselli at earthlink.net Sun Jan 13 13:42:44 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Sun Jan 13 13:42:44 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] CSS for author pic In-Reply-To: <24CE5F90-085D-11D6-835C-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <3C419C97.27922.ECC8179@localhost> > From: Martin > > Text says black border (which I think is the best choice anyway). > > Border is white on article pages (it's black on the member info > page): > http://evolt.org/article/rating/20/5127/index.html it's black in IE5/win but white in N6/win whomever coded the CSS/HTML changes needs to look that over.. From roselli at earthlink.net Sun Jan 13 13:42:54 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Sun Jan 13 13:42:54 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] CSS for author pic In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020114010847.04d33e48@203.197.12.4> References: <24CE5F90-085D-11D6-835C-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <3C419CA1.3976.ECCA8A2@localhost> > From: Madhu Menon > > >(nice alt attribute - dropping the user ID in - btw) > > Methinks the author's name would be a better choice, unless you *want* > to remain anonymous of course. > > Opinions? the author's name appears above... no reason to do it in the photo... i like the UserID better... From webguru at vsnl.net Sun Jan 13 13:47:25 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Sun Jan 13 13:47:25 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] CSS for author pic In-Reply-To: <3C419CA1.3976.ECCA8A2@localhost> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020114010847.04d33e48@203.197.12.4> <24CE5F90-085D-11D6-835C-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020114011428.01c30cb0@203.197.12.4> At 01:11 AM 1/14/2002, aardvark typed these words: >the author's name appears above... no reason to do it in the >photo... So does the username, for that matter. Right next to the author's name :P If we include the ALT text for accessibility purposes too, then something like "photo of [author]" might be a better choice, no? Madhu From roselli at earthlink.net Sun Jan 13 13:50:27 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Sun Jan 13 13:50:27 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] CSS for author pic In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020114011428.01c30cb0@203.197.12.4> References: <3C419CA1.3976.ECCA8A2@localhost> Message-ID: <3C419E66.22217.ED3922B@localhost> > From: Madhu Menon > > >the author's name appears above... no reason to do it in the > >photo... > > So does the username, for that matter. Right next to the author's name > :P > > If we include the ALT text for accessibility purposes too, then > something like "photo of [author]" might be a better choice, no? +1... so, what goes in the title attribute? From michele at wordpro.on.ca Sun Jan 13 14:20:19 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Sun Jan 13 14:20:19 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] CSS for author pic References: <24CE5F90-085D-11D6-835C-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <022001c19c6f$e9f169a0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Fixed on t.e.o. Changed: user/dsp_signup.cfm user/dsp_user.cfm article/dsp_article.cfm Added class="borderblack" and deleted border="1" to the images. Appeared to me to be an inheritance issue, tho, which browsers were behaving "properly", I'm not sure. :) Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin" | Text says black border (which I think is the best choice anyway). | | Border is white on article pages (it's black on the member info | page): | http://evolt.org/article/rating/20/5127/index.html | | And the image tag is the same... | MartinB | (nice alt attribute - dropping the user ID in - btw) From martin at members.evolt.org Sun Jan 13 15:47:12 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Sun Jan 13 15:47:12 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Author pic deleting? In-Reply-To: <020f01c19c69$c38113c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <2879B1B6-086F-11D6-A640-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> On Sunday, January 13, 2002, at 07:37 pm, Michele Foster wrote: > hmm.. ok .. I'll do some more testing then. Only thing I can think of > off > the top is a file permission problem (difference) between teo/weo. I'll > play with my test id and see if I can duplicate it. > > If you have a chance, can you see if you get the same problem on teo. Happens on teo too. Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From mccreath at ak.net Sun Jan 13 17:02:11 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Sun Jan 13 17:02:11 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Author pic deleting? References: <2879B1B6-086F-11D6-A640-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <3C421206.4070600@ak.net> FYI, it happens with IE 5.0 and IE 5.1 on MacOS 8.6, as well. It *doesn't* happen with IE 4.5 on MacOS 8.6. This is on weo. I haven't tested it on teo, since Martin said he was experiencing the same issue. David Martin wrote: > > On Sunday, January 13, 2002, at 07:37 pm, Michele Foster wrote: > >> hmm.. ok .. I'll do some more testing then. Only thing I can think of >> off >> the top is a file permission problem (difference) between teo/weo. I'll >> play with my test id and see if I can duplicate it. >> >> If you have a chance, can you see if you get the same problem on teo. > > > Happens on teo too. > > Cheers > Martin From mccreath at ak.net Sun Jan 13 17:14:11 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Sun Jan 13 17:14:11 2002 Subject: alt/title attributes on author pic (was Re: [thesite] [BUG] CSS for author pic) References: <3C419CA1.3976.ECCA8A2@localhost> <3C419E66.22217.ED3922B@localhost> Message-ID: <3C4214D4.1050705@ak.net> aardvark wrote: >>From: Madhu Menon >>>the author's name appears above... no reason to do it in the >>>photo... >>> >>So does the username, for that matter. Right next to the author's name >>:P >> >>If we include the ALT text for accessibility purposes too, then >>something like "photo of [author]" might be a better choice, no? > > +1... +1. "alt" tells you what the picture is, "title" describes it. Using "alt" instead of "title" is an old habit (I have *so* many tags to go change ...), but now that more browsers are supporting "title", we should use it. > so, what goes in the title attribute? I say let's stick with username for now. Maybe in the redesign we can offer a choice. David From michele at wordpro.on.ca Sun Jan 13 17:49:30 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Sun Jan 13 17:49:30 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Author pic deleting? References: <2879B1B6-086F-11D6-A640-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> <3C421206.4070600@ak.net> Message-ID: <025301c19c8d$248b1120$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Thanks Martin and David .. The only other thing I can add is that on teo, Martin's author file is missing an extension. So, now it can't be found. I'll defer to Jeff on why this is happening... and how to fix it. :) Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "David McCreath" | FYI, it happens with IE 5.0 and IE 5.1 on MacOS 8.6, as well. It | *doesn't* happen with IE 4.5 on MacOS 8.6. This is on weo. I haven't | tested it on teo, since Martin said he was experiencing the same issue. | From martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com Mon Jan 14 05:14:25 2002 From: martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com (martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com) Date: Mon Jan 14 05:14:25 2002 Subject: [thesite] [thelist] [BUG] weo cfm error Message-ID: Memo from Martin P Burns of PricewaterhouseCoopers -------------------- Start of message text -------------------- oops - slip of the key. Should have gone here instead. Sorry Martin ---------------------- Forwarded by Martin P Burns/UK/MCS/PwC on 14/01/2002 00:47 --------------------------- Martin @lists.evolt.org on 13/01/2002 18:54:02 Please respond to thelist at lists.evolt.org Sent by: thelist-admin at lists.evolt.org To: thelist at lists.evolt.org cc: Subject: [thelist] [BUG] weo cfm error http://evolt.org/user/MartinB/32/index.html Oracle Error Code = 0 Timeout while obtaining an Oracle statement lock SQL = "SELECT * FROM users WHERE userid = 32" Data Source = "EVOLT" ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Caught an exception, type = DATABASE The contents of the tag stack are: 1. CFTRY (24,1) /home/evolt/public_html/alphaboxcontroller.cfm 2. CFINCLUDE (26,3) /home/evolt/public_html/alphaboxcontroller.cfm 3. CFSWITCH (3,1) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/index.cfm 4. CFDEFAULTCASE (19,3) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/index.cfm 5. CFINCLUDE (20,5) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/index.cfm 6. CFINCLUDE (50,4) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/home_design.cfm 7. CFSWITCH (3,1) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_chooser.cfm 8. CFCASE (22,2) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_chooser.cfm 9. CFINCLUDE (24,3) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_chooser.cfm 10. CFSWITCH (3,1) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_user.cfm 11. CFCASE (8,3) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_user.cfm 12. CFINCLUDE (9,5) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_user.cfm 13. CFQUERY (7,1) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/user/act_signup.cfm Debugging: APP,CFCATCH,CGI,FORM,SESSION,URL Structure: 6 keys APP Structure: 7 keys PRIV Structure: 5 keys 0 "None" 1 "User" 2 "Member" 3 "Admin" 4 "Godmin" RATING Structure: 6 keys 0 "Unrated" 1 "Poor" 2 "Average" 3 "Good" 4 "Very?good" 5 "Excellent" SESSION Structure: 7 keys CFID "549583" CFTOKEN "39791262" PAGETITLE "" SESSIONID "EVOLT_549583_39791262" SIDEBAR Structure: 6 keys ADMIN Structure: 4 keys ARTICLES Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" COMMENTS Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" RATINGS Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" VISIBLE "1" JOBS Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" LOGIN Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" SEARCH Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" THELIST Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" VISIBLE "1" URLTOKEN "CFID=549583&CFTOKEN=39791262" USER Structure: 9 keys DATE_FORMAT "mm/dd/yyyy" EMAIL "martin at members.evolt.org" ID "32" LASTLOGIN "12-JAN-02" MID "2748" NAME "MartinB" PRIV "3" SCHEME "isaac.css" TIME_FORMAT "h:mm?tt" SIGNOFF Structure: 4 keys 0 "New" 1 "Approved" 2 "Denied" 3 "Pending" STARTING_DISK_PATH "/home/evolt/public_html" USERPRIV Structure: 5 keys ADMIN "3" GODMIN "4" GUEST "0" MEMBER "2" USER "1" VALID_DATA "1" CFCATCH Structure: 8 keys Type Caught an exception, type DATABASE TagContext Array: 13 elements CFQUERY 7 1 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/user/act_signup.cfm CFINCLUDE 9 5 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_user.cfm CFCASE 8 3 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_user.cfm CFSWITCH 3 1 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_user.cfm CFINCLUDE 24 3 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_chooser.cfm CFCASE 22 2 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_chooser.cfm CFSWITCH 3 1 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_chooser.cfm CFINCLUDE 50 4 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/home_design.cfm CFINCLUDE 20 5 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/index.cfm CFDEFAULTCASE 19 3 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/index.cfm CFSWITCH 3 1 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/index.cfm CFINCLUDE 26 3 /home/evolt/public_html/alphaboxcontroller.cfm CFTRY 24 1 /home/evolt/public_html/alphaboxcontroller.cfm Message Oracle Error Code = 0 Timeout while obtaining an Oracle statement lock Detail SQL = "SELECT * FROM users WHERE userid = 32" Data Source = "EVOLT" NativeErrorCode 0 SQLState CGI Structure: 30 keys AUTH_TYPE "" CF_TEMPLATE_PATH "/home/evolt/public_html/alphaboxcontroller.cfm" CONTENT_LENGTH "" CONTENT_TYPE "" HTTP_ACCEPT "*/*" HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE "en" HTTP_CONNECTION "keep-alive" HTTP_COOKIE "CFID=549583;?CFTOKEN=39791262;?EVOLT_LOGIN=00035C4F%2DA0B4%2D1A38%2D950A569BD15384F2" HTTP_EXTENSION "Security/Remote-Passphrase" HTTP_HOST "evolt.org" HTTP_IF_MODIFIED_SINCE "Sun,?13?Jan?2002?18:32:45?GMT" HTTP_REFERER "http://evolt.org/user/MartinB/32/index.html" HTTP_UA_CPU "PPC" HTTP_UA_OS "MacOS" HTTP_USER_AGENT "Mozilla/4.0?(compatible;?MSIE?5.12;?Mac_PowerPC)" HTTP_VIA "1.0?cache-bas?(NetCache?NetApp/5.1R2D14)" HTTP_X_FORWARDED_FOR "80.195.50.226" PATH_INFO "" PATH_TRANSLATED "" QUERY_STRING "" REMOTE_ADDR "62.31.224.1" REMOTE_HOST "" REMOTE_USER "" REQUEST_METHOD "GET" REQUEST_URI "/user/index.html?action=edit" SCRIPT_NAME "/alphaboxcontroller.cfm" SERVER_NAME "evolt.org" SERVER_PORT "80" SERVER_PROTOCOL "HTTP/1.1" SERVER_SOFTWARE "Apache/1.3.20?(Unix)" FORM Structure: 1 keys SUBMIT "" SESSION Structure: 7 keys CFID "549583" CFTOKEN "39791262" PAGETITLE "" SESSIONID "EVOLT_549583_39791262" SIDEBAR Structure: 6 keys ADMIN Structure: 4 keys ARTICLES Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" COMMENTS Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" RATINGS Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" VISIBLE "1" JOBS Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" LOGIN Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" SEARCH Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" THELIST Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" VISIBLE "1" URLTOKEN "CFID=549583&CFTOKEN=39791262" USER Structure: 9 keys DATE_FORMAT "mm/dd/yyyy" EMAIL "martin at members.evolt.org" ID "32" LASTLOGIN "12-JAN-02" MID "2748" NAME "MartinB" PRIV "3" SCHEME "isaac.css" TIME_FORMAT "h:mm?tt" URL Structure: 25 keys ACTION "edit" ADMIN "" AID "0" BID "0" CATID "0" CFID "" CFTOKEN "" CID "0" COMMENTS "true" DEBUG "0" DEBUGLIST "" EVOLT "" FORMAT "" KEYWORDS "" MENU "0" MID "0" PARAMS "" RATING "true" SEARCHPANE "0" SECTION "user" SID "" SIDEBAR "" SUBSECTION "" TID "0" UID "32" _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland -- For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester and archive of TheList go to: http://lists.evolt.org Workers of the Web, evolt ! --------------------- End of message text -------------------- This e-mail is sent by the above named in their individual, non-business capacity and is not on behalf of PricewaterhouseCoopers. PricewaterhouseCoopers may monitor outgoing and incoming e-mails and other telecommunications on its e-mail and telecommunications systems. ---------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. ---------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. From martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com Mon Jan 14 06:31:07 2002 From: martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com (martin.p.burns at uk.pwcglobal.com) Date: Mon Jan 14 06:31:07 2002 Subject: [thesite] [thelist] [BUG] weo cfm error Message-ID: Memo from Martin P Burns of PricewaterhouseCoopers -------------------- Start of message text -------------------- oops - slip of the key. Should have gone here instead. Sorry Martin ---------------------- Forwarded by Martin P Burns/UK/MCS/PwC on 14/01/2002 00:47 --------------------------- Martin @lists.evolt.org on 13/01/2002 18:54:02 Please respond to thelist at lists.evolt.org Sent by: thelist-admin at lists.evolt.org To: thelist at lists.evolt.org cc: Subject: [thelist] [BUG] weo cfm error http://evolt.org/user/MartinB/32/index.html Oracle Error Code = 0 Timeout while obtaining an Oracle statement lock SQL = "SELECT * FROM users WHERE userid = 32" Data Source = "EVOLT" ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Caught an exception, type = DATABASE The contents of the tag stack are: 1. CFTRY (24,1) /home/evolt/public_html/alphaboxcontroller.cfm 2. CFINCLUDE (26,3) /home/evolt/public_html/alphaboxcontroller.cfm 3. CFSWITCH (3,1) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/index.cfm 4. CFDEFAULTCASE (19,3) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/index.cfm 5. CFINCLUDE (20,5) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/index.cfm 6. CFINCLUDE (50,4) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/home_design.cfm 7. CFSWITCH (3,1) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_chooser.cfm 8. CFCASE (22,2) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_chooser.cfm 9. CFINCLUDE (24,3) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_chooser.cfm 10. CFSWITCH (3,1) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_user.cfm 11. CFCASE (8,3) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_user.cfm 12. CFINCLUDE (9,5) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_user.cfm 13. CFQUERY (7,1) /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/user/act_signup.cfm Debugging: APP,CFCATCH,CGI,FORM,SESSION,URL Structure: 6 keys APP Structure: 7 keys PRIV Structure: 5 keys 0 "None" 1 "User" 2 "Member" 3 "Admin" 4 "Godmin" RATING Structure: 6 keys 0 "Unrated" 1 "Poor" 2 "Average" 3 "Good" 4 "Very?good" 5 "Excellent" SESSION Structure: 7 keys CFID "549583" CFTOKEN "39791262" PAGETITLE "" SESSIONID "EVOLT_549583_39791262" SIDEBAR Structure: 6 keys ADMIN Structure: 4 keys ARTICLES Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" COMMENTS Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" RATINGS Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" VISIBLE "1" JOBS Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" LOGIN Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" SEARCH Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" THELIST Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" VISIBLE "1" URLTOKEN "CFID=549583&CFTOKEN=39791262" USER Structure: 9 keys DATE_FORMAT "mm/dd/yyyy" EMAIL "martin at members.evolt.org" ID "32" LASTLOGIN "12-JAN-02" MID "2748" NAME "MartinB" PRIV "3" SCHEME "isaac.css" TIME_FORMAT "h:mm?tt" SIGNOFF Structure: 4 keys 0 "New" 1 "Approved" 2 "Denied" 3 "Pending" STARTING_DISK_PATH "/home/evolt/public_html" USERPRIV Structure: 5 keys ADMIN "3" GODMIN "4" GUEST "0" MEMBER "2" USER "1" VALID_DATA "1" CFCATCH Structure: 8 keys Type Caught an exception, type DATABASE TagContext Array: 13 elements CFQUERY 7 1 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/user/act_signup.cfm CFINCLUDE 9 5 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_user.cfm CFCASE 8 3 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_user.cfm CFSWITCH 3 1 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_user.cfm CFINCLUDE 24 3 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_chooser.cfm CFCASE 22 2 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_chooser.cfm CFSWITCH 3 1 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/app_chooser.cfm CFINCLUDE 50 4 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/home_design.cfm CFINCLUDE 20 5 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/index.cfm CFDEFAULTCASE 19 3 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/index.cfm CFSWITCH 3 1 /home/evolt/public_html/evolt/index.cfm CFINCLUDE 26 3 /home/evolt/public_html/alphaboxcontroller.cfm CFTRY 24 1 /home/evolt/public_html/alphaboxcontroller.cfm Message Oracle Error Code = 0 Timeout while obtaining an Oracle statement lock Detail SQL = "SELECT * FROM users WHERE userid = 32" Data Source = "EVOLT" NativeErrorCode 0 SQLState CGI Structure: 30 keys AUTH_TYPE "" CF_TEMPLATE_PATH "/home/evolt/public_html/alphaboxcontroller.cfm" CONTENT_LENGTH "" CONTENT_TYPE "" HTTP_ACCEPT "*/*" HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE "en" HTTP_CONNECTION "keep-alive" HTTP_COOKIE "CFID=549583;?CFTOKEN=39791262;?EVOLT_LOGIN=00035C4F%2DA0B4%2D1A38%2D950A569BD15384F2" HTTP_EXTENSION "Security/Remote-Passphrase" HTTP_HOST "evolt.org" HTTP_IF_MODIFIED_SINCE "Sun,?13?Jan?2002?18:32:45?GMT" HTTP_REFERER "http://evolt.org/user/MartinB/32/index.html" HTTP_UA_CPU "PPC" HTTP_UA_OS "MacOS" HTTP_USER_AGENT "Mozilla/4.0?(compatible;?MSIE?5.12;?Mac_PowerPC)" HTTP_VIA "1.0?cache-bas?(NetCache?NetApp/5.1R2D14)" HTTP_X_FORWARDED_FOR "80.195.50.226" PATH_INFO "" PATH_TRANSLATED "" QUERY_STRING "" REMOTE_ADDR "62.31.224.1" REMOTE_HOST "" REMOTE_USER "" REQUEST_METHOD "GET" REQUEST_URI "/user/index.html?action=edit" SCRIPT_NAME "/alphaboxcontroller.cfm" SERVER_NAME "evolt.org" SERVER_PORT "80" SERVER_PROTOCOL "HTTP/1.1" SERVER_SOFTWARE "Apache/1.3.20?(Unix)" FORM Structure: 1 keys SUBMIT "" SESSION Structure: 7 keys CFID "549583" CFTOKEN "39791262" PAGETITLE "" SESSIONID "EVOLT_549583_39791262" SIDEBAR Structure: 6 keys ADMIN Structure: 4 keys ARTICLES Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" COMMENTS Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" RATINGS Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" VISIBLE "1" JOBS Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" LOGIN Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" SEARCH Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" THELIST Structure: 1 keys VISIBLE "1" VISIBLE "1" URLTOKEN "CFID=549583&CFTOKEN=39791262" USER Structure: 9 keys DATE_FORMAT "mm/dd/yyyy" EMAIL "martin at members.evolt.org" ID "32" LASTLOGIN "12-JAN-02" MID "2748" NAME "MartinB" PRIV "3" SCHEME "isaac.css" TIME_FORMAT "h:mm?tt" URL Structure: 25 keys ACTION "edit" ADMIN "" AID "0" BID "0" CATID "0" CFID "" CFTOKEN "" CID "0" COMMENTS "true" DEBUG "0" DEBUGLIST "" EVOLT "" FORMAT "" KEYWORDS "" MENU "0" MID "0" PARAMS "" RATING "true" SEARCHPANE "0" SECTION "user" SID "" SIDEBAR "" SUBSECTION "" TID "0" UID "32" _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland -- For unsubscribe and other options, including the Tip Harvester and archive of TheList go to: http://lists.evolt.org Workers of the Web, evolt ! --------------------- End of message text -------------------- This e-mail is sent by the above named in their individual, non-business capacity and is not on behalf of PricewaterhouseCoopers. PricewaterhouseCoopers may monitor outgoing and incoming e-mails and other telecommunications on its e-mail and telecommunications systems. ---------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. From matthew.garrett at snet.net Mon Jan 14 07:52:36 2002 From: matthew.garrett at snet.net (matthew garrett) Date: Mon Jan 14 07:52:36 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Author pic deleting? In-Reply-To: <3EDC6CE7-085C-11D6-835C-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: > From: Martin > On Sunday, January 13, 2002, at 07:00 pm, Michele Foster wrote: > >> What browser/OS are you using? > > IE5.1/OS X > I've had large problems with CF file uploads from users with that browser/OS in the past. Do you have problems with file upload on any other sites? My question is, what does the code look like for deciding whether to attempt the file upload? I believe that IE associates a temp file with the input file tag even if you have not specified a file. So if the cffile tag tries to upload that file, and there's actually nothing really there... then it could delete the existing file to replace it with... nothing. is that part of it? I was actually never able to solve it, just thought it was worth mentioning. has anyone with that combo had better success? matt g From jeff at members.evolt.org Mon Jan 14 11:47:08 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Mon Jan 14 11:47:08 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Author pic deleting? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: matt, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: matthew garrett > > I've had large problems with CF file uploads from users > with that browser/OS in the past. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< same here -- constantly. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > My question is, what does the code look like for > deciding whether to attempt the file upload? I believe > that IE associates a temp file with the input file tag > even if you have not specified a file. So if the cffile > tag tries to upload that file, and there's actually > nothing really there... then it could delete the > existing file to replace it with... nothing. is that > part of it? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< in order to know that something needs to be uploaded, i'm simply checking the trimmed length of the file upload field's value. if it's greater than 0 i delete the existing pic and upload the new one (or try, it seems). ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > I was actually never able to solve it, just thought it > was worth mentioning. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i've never been able to solve it either. it's very frustrating. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From seb at members.evolt.org Mon Jan 14 12:00:27 2002 From: seb at members.evolt.org (Seb) Date: Mon Jan 14 12:00:27 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Author pic deleting? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020114175654.00aa3878@members.evolt.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 >in order to know that something needs to be uploaded, i'm simply checking >the trimmed length of the file upload field's value. if it's greater than 0 >i delete the existing pic and upload the new one (or try, it seems). > > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > I was actually never able to solve it, just thought it > > was worth mentioning. > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > >i've never been able to solve it either. it's very frustrating. Some suggestions: 1) Checkbox to say a new image is present 2) An onchange() event for the file input box that sets a hidden field variable, then check for that value 3) Dunno if CF allows this, or if it's already in place, but catch the file upload and check for length > 0 of the actual file, and only update the DB when true (take the file upload event out of the workflow for the profile update if necessary) The CMS system that I work with (BroadVision) consistently has the same problem, and I generally employ of the hacks above to get around it, depending on what the customer is willing to allow. Seb. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPfreeware 7.0.3 for non-commercial use iQA/AwUBPEMdAL2V451Vxr52EQKa5wCeMhdP46Ktix+EP2jF8SON0ll4sx8AniOX bEoRY1udcNgOWYGeRC457RSV =cMfD -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From michele at wordpro.on.ca Mon Jan 14 12:04:22 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Mon Jan 14 12:04:22 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Author pic deleting? References: Message-ID: <003001c19d26$1c791560$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> hmm.. should we look at approaching it in a different manner then? suggestion ... if pic exists .. do not show upload box (still show pic tho). Instead, have a link/checkbox that says [modify photo] which when clicked (or selected) redraws the page and shows the upload box? i.e. negating the if pic exists .. if modify photo selected show upload box elseif pic does not exist show upload box else show [modify photo] link only endif or something like that. ;) Or we do all the upload photo logic on a separate page all together. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: ".jeff" | | i've never been able to solve it either. it's very frustrating. | From mrg at members.evolt.org Mon Jan 14 12:05:00 2002 From: mrg at members.evolt.org (mrg) Date: Mon Jan 14 12:05:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] [BUG] Author pic deleting? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi, > From: ".jeff" > same here -- constantly. Thanks for confirming that it's not just me. > i'm simply checking > the trimmed length of the file upload field's value. if it's greater than 0 > i delete the existing pic and upload the new one (or try, it seems). Yep, there's the problem i think - since IE still gives that field some value like "c:\windows\temp" when the form is submitted without a file. It's got a length > 0 regardless. What occurs to me is the possibility of uploading the "file" to the server with a different/temporary name, then testing the filesize of the uploaded file. If that file is larger than x (some piddly little number), then rename the file to replace the old one. Don't know if that can be done on one page, or if it's a 2-step thing. anyway, it's worth thinking about. i might have a look at that with one of my sites in the next couple of days. i'll let you know if i come up with anything. matt g. From elfur at elfur.is Mon Jan 14 17:36:21 2002 From: elfur at elfur.is (Elfur Logadottir) Date: Mon Jan 14 17:36:21 2002 Subject: [thesite] Listing of Work in Progress ... with a permanent url ... Message-ID: <013601c19d54$a580cd20$0100a8c0@DWARFS> http://members.evolt.org/elfur/evolt/ ... until the ultimate project system will be brought to use, i'm offering (and starting) to collect all the projects, that are Work in Progress to one permanent url. We need one place where we can turn to for the key things such as: active projects importance of active projects persons involved in projects pending projects ideas that no one has caught feature requests ... etc. etc. i've started collecting, but it's still extremely raw. please send me (either directly at evolt at elfur.is or to either list), any and all alterations you have for the page ... thanks *the evolting one* http://members.evolt.org/elfur/evolt/ From r937 at interlog.com Mon Jan 14 18:50:33 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Mon Jan 14 18:50:33 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [Theforum] Listing of Work in Progress ... with a permanent url ... Message-ID: <01c19d5e$c6ad0900$f251149a@rudy> hi elfur thanks for taking the intitiative looks like we are starting to get organized again that's a good thing > please send me (either directly at evolt at elfur.is or to either list), > any and all alterations you have for the page ... can i suggest we keep it on just one list? this one if there's anybody on thesite who isn't on theforum, it means either (1) they don't know our lists well enough to decide where they want to be, or (2) they want to partipate in site building but not the more esoteric discussions concerning evolt direction and strategy i don't think we should cater to those in category 1 by cross-posting, and i don't think we should bother those people in category 2 who don't care about the nfp, the survey, irc policy, etc. that being said.... > Replying to individuals that asked to be contacted > description of status and how/when it is going to be > reported to theforum. listing of who's involved the responses to individuals all went out in december there were over a hundred, we parcelled them out to about five of us who volunteered the individual responses should not really need further discussion under your heading of "thesite" please add ~ members versus users -- terminology, standards, direction i am hoping we can get back to my questions of the other day this terminology conundrum is surely going to come back and bite us on the ass if we don't resolve it rudy From r937 at interlog.com Mon Jan 14 19:03:19 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Mon Jan 14 19:03:19 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [aaaargh] Listing of Work in Progress ... with a permanent url ... Message-ID: <01c19d60$7fa92fa0$f251149a@rudy> >can i suggest we keep it on just one list? this one sorry, no, i meant *that* one -- theforum [ measure twice, cut once ] okay, so if there's anybody here on thesite who is interested in the issues that elfur posted, please sign up for theforum rudy From roselli at earthlink.net Mon Jan 14 23:35:27 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Mon Jan 14 23:35:27 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? Message-ID: <3C4378F6.23819.16115429@localhost> i thought an article needed 5 ratings to even have a shot at appearing in the highest rated articles sidebar... but i've found an article (yes, one of mine, i'm a whore) that has a rating of 5 after 5 ratings... how many does an article need? From r937 at interlog.com Mon Jan 14 23:42:05 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Mon Jan 14 23:42:05 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? Message-ID: <01c19d87$81389780$1750149a@rudy> > but i've found an article (yes, one of mine, i'm a whore) > that has a rating of 5 after 5 ratings... where? home page right now shows Highest Rated Articles Inside the evolt.org 4.62 after 45 ratings Usable Forms (for an 4.62 after 13 ratings Writing Smart Web-ba 4.58 after 25 ratings Your clients need a 4.57 after 44 ratings To Hell With Bad Edi 4.55 after 31 ratings i don't see no "5" article there, adrian From isaac at members.evolt.org Mon Jan 14 23:44:19 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Mon Jan 14 23:44:19 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: <3C4378F6.23819.16115429@localhost> Message-ID: > how many does an article need? 6? From jeff at members.evolt.org Mon Jan 14 23:50:29 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Mon Jan 14 23:50:29 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: <3C4378F6.23819.16115429@localhost> Message-ID: adrian, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: aardvark > > i thought an article needed 5 ratings to even have a > shot at appearing in the highest rated articles > sidebar... ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< WHERE ratings > 5 not WHERE ratings >= 5 ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > but i've found an article (yes, one of mine, i'm a > whore) that has a rating of 5 after 5 ratings... ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< you only need 1 more. which article so i can rate it a 1? *evil grin* ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > how many does an article need? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< 6 minimum. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From roselli at earthlink.net Mon Jan 14 23:51:58 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Mon Jan 14 23:51:58 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: <01c19d87$81389780$1750149a@rudy> Message-ID: <3C437CE5.21915.1620B129@localhost> > From: "rudy" > > > but i've found an article (yes, one of mine, i'm a whore) > > that has a rating of 5 after 5 ratings... > > where? > > home page right now shows [...] > i don't see no "5" article there, adrian that's my point... er, if it's a 5 after 5, i thought it *should* be there... anyway: http://evolt.org/article/redme_rudy/20/2297/ From roselli at earthlink.net Mon Jan 14 23:53:43 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Mon Jan 14 23:53:43 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: References: <3C4378F6.23819.16115429@localhost> Message-ID: <3C437D4F.30542.16224DF1@localhost> > From: ".jeff" [...] > WHERE ratings > 5 > > not > > WHERE ratings >= 5 D'OH! > you only need 1 more. never happen... too old... oh well... > which article so i can rate it a 1? *evil grin* oh, i had rudy exclude all rating results from your userid... From r937 at interlog.com Tue Jan 15 01:05:14 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Tue Jan 15 01:05:14 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? Message-ID: <01c19d93$1f844500$1750149a@rudy> > oh, i had rudy exclude all rating results from your userid... you wish actually, *i* wish -- i wish i knew the code a lot better than i do rudy p.s. it was isaac that added the 6th rating you are now number 1 From richard.bennett at skynet.be Tue Jan 15 02:34:06 2002 From: richard.bennett at skynet.be (Richard Bennett) Date: Tue Jan 15 02:34:06 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? References: <01c19d93$1f844500$1750149a@rudy> Message-ID: <020601c19d9e$f5df24c0$0100a8c0@wwwv7zwbf035xj> > p.s. it was isaac that added the 6th rating > > you are now number 1 Which immediately shows up the complete redundancy of ANY internet voting systems - they are corrupt before the first vote is even made, and can seriously skew opinion, because the amount of votes is not used in a mathematical sense to achieve the final result, and the potential amount of voters (which could be found using the average amount of votes for all articles) is not used to reflect peoples interest in the article. Now this all doesn't sound like a big deal, until someone puts on their resume that their articles on evolt.org have consequently been voted "Highest Rated article" over the years, and it turns out they made 20 logins to vote for their own articles, to show nicely on their resume. And when someone else starts getting a well-rated article, this person can use his 20 logins to "rate it a 1" . Tying articles so blatantly to the author, with bio and picture, and then displaying a top 10 of (essentially) authors, carries a serious responsibility. Cheers, Richard. From r937 at interlog.com Tue Jan 15 05:53:38 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Tue Jan 15 05:53:38 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? Message-ID: <01c19dbb$69f69f20$1750149a@rudy> >... and it turns out they made 20 logins to vote for their own articles whew, good thing this isn't possible on our system, eh? 'o) From mwarden at mattwarden.com Tue Jan 15 06:03:07 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Tue Jan 15 06:03:07 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: <01c19dbb$69f69f20$1750149a@rudy> Message-ID: On Jan 15, rudy had something to say about Re: [thesite] how many ratings... >>... and it turns out they made 20 logins to vote for their own articles > >whew, good thing this isn't possible on our system, eh? i think by 'logins', he meant separate accounts. thanks, -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From r937 at interlog.com Tue Jan 15 06:08:47 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Tue Jan 15 06:08:47 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? Message-ID: <01c19dbd$87f143c0$1750149a@rudy> >i think by 'logins', he meant separate accounts. > >thanks, you are most welcome we'd still catch it, but then we'd be pissed rudy From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Jan 15 06:53:40 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Jan 15 06:53:40 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: <01c19d93$1f844500$1750149a@rudy> Message-ID: <3C43DFBC.1894.17A2C8AB@localhost> > From: "rudy" > > p.s. it was isaac that added the 6th rating > > you are now number 1 thanks isaac, although i wasn't trolling for a new rating... From michele at wordpro.on.ca Tue Jan 15 14:29:10 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Tue Jan 15 14:29:10 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [Theforum] why join? References: Message-ID: <00d201c19e03$85871ec0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Marlene .. hmm, yeah .. it used to be there. Not sure where it ended up. I'll see if I can dig through some old material later this week and find it. (might just be commented out). btw, this belongs on thesite please .. actions and stuff to do should go over there. Really helps those of us that are working on thesite to keep our action task lists in order. Your messages for the tips layout and user name title tag, should go over there too. (Yeah, I know there's a lot of cross-over members .. it seriously makes it easier knowing its an action to do ;) I cc'd this over there, so I'll remember to do it. :) Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marlene Bruce" | Hey all, | | http://evolt.org/user/index.html?action=signup | | I believe in some former incarnation, this page answered the | question, "Why join?" | | We need to put that info back in, and at the top above the form | fields. If I were a new visitor who happened to click the "Join" link | and got this page, I wouldn't have any idea why joining would be of | benefit to me. | From dmah at shaw.ca Tue Jan 15 14:36:56 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Tue Jan 15 14:36:56 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page layout breaks Message-ID: <200201152038.NAA02623@alice.monkeyland.ca> I agree, "digest" isn't the right word. We were trying to come up with icons for those links. Take a look at: http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/dean/dean.cfm and let me know if we want to use this presentation instead. Dean rudy writes: > >http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/ > > > >...in IE 5 on the Mac, at 640x480, pukes its sidebar contents > > outside of the normal area. > > yeah, that'll happen in any browser, and it's because of the five > side-by-side hardcoded table cells with nowrap -- > > Dec 31 [digest] Dec 24 [digest] Dec 17 [digest] Dec 10 [digest] Dec 3 > [digest] > > see, it even wraps in email > > if i recall, dean tried to use an icon for the digest links... > > any ideas on how to reformulate this? > > i don't think "digest" is the right word, either > > how about > > Links to Individual Tips All Tips for the Week > > December December > 31 24 17 10 3 31 24 17 10 3 > > November November > 26 19 12 5 26 19 12 5 From r937 at interlog.com Tue Jan 15 17:02:38 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Tue Jan 15 17:02:38 2002 Subject: [thesite] user query timeout Message-ID: <01c19e18$e1961e40$5b4d149a@rudy> f.y.i. jeff, not sure if you want to bother adding a check and an error message for this situation, but i accidentally-on-purpose ran the user search on the site by typing one space into the search field, and it died -- i didn't save the dump, you can reproduce it if you need to, right? rudy From mccreath at ak.net Tue Jan 15 17:04:26 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Tue Jan 15 17:04:26 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page layout breaks) References: <200201152038.NAA02623@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <3C44B592.9070506@ak.net> Hey, Dean -- I like that layout better than the current one. If I may offer another suggestion, I did a little work on some icons back when Javi sent his original ones. I went ahead and did a quick description page and mock-up: http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/tips/ I don't know how folks feel about using icons, but these are itty-bitty. The mockup page should really have them in a table rather than a paragraph, but I've got to get back to work (although it works down to 640x480 on my screen). :) David Dean Mah wrote: > I agree, "digest" isn't the right word. We were trying to come up > with icons for those links. > > Take a look at: > > http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/dean/dean.cfm > > and let me know if we want to use this presentation instead. > > Dean > > From dmah at shaw.ca Tue Jan 15 17:19:49 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Tue Jan 15 17:19:49 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page In-Reply-To: <3C44B592.9070506@ak.net> from "David McCreath" at Jan 15, 2002 02:04:50 PM Message-ID: <200201152321.QAA03634@alice.monkeyland.ca> Caveat: I've never been particularly good at design. I just implement. :) I'm not sure that I like the demo that you put up. The white icons seem too bright to me and the date seems to get lost. But I'll go with whatever people agree on. Dean David McCreath writes: > I like that layout better than the current one. > > If I may offer another suggestion, I did a little work on some icons > back when Javi sent his original ones. I went ahead and did a quick > description page and mock-up: > > http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/tips/ > > I don't know how folks feel about using icons, but these are itty-bitty. > The mockup page should really have them in a table rather than a > paragraph, but I've got to get back to work (although it works down to > 640x480 on my screen). :) From mccreath at ak.net Tue Jan 15 17:24:24 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Tue Jan 15 17:24:24 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page References: <200201152321.QAA03634@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <3C44BA3B.8040608@ak.net> Dean Mah wrote: > Caveat: I've never been particularly good at design. I just > implement. :) Understood. My caveat is that I did that layout in 5 minutes. > I'm not sure that I like the demo that you put up. The white icons > seem too bright to me and the date seems to get lost. I agree that the layout isn't quite right; all your points are valid, but that's easy to work on. The icons could be darkened, or we could lighten the background they're on. What do you think of the icons? Do they illustrate the concept? Or are they just window-dressing? > But I'll go with whatever people agree on. Me too. David From dmah at shaw.ca Tue Jan 15 17:29:41 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Tue Jan 15 17:29:41 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page In-Reply-To: <3C44BA3B.8040608@ak.net> from "David McCreath" at Jan 15, 2002 02:24:43 PM Message-ID: <200201152330.QAA03702@alice.monkeyland.ca> They work for me. But the thing that works for me the most is the "Key" that you've included at the top. Once people internalize the key, I think that they will work. Dean David McCreath writes: > What do you think of the icons? Do they illustrate the concept? Or > are they just window-dressing? From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Jan 15 23:37:57 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Jan 15 23:37:57 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page In-Reply-To: <200201152330.QAA03702@alice.monkeyland.ca> References: <3C44BA3B.8040608@ak.net> from "David McCreath" at Jan 15, 2002 02:24:43 PM Message-ID: <3C44CB19.5136.1B3A2CD8@localhost> > From: Dean Mah > > They work for me. But the thing that works for me the most is the > "Key" that you've included at the top. Once people internalize the > key, I think that they will work. +1, although the icons look a little stout... if they're gonna be side by side, there needs to be a bit more balance, but i like where you're going... also, can we skip

and go right to

from an

? i don't believe so... From mwarden at mattwarden.com Tue Jan 15 23:47:59 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Tue Jan 15 23:47:59 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] "new articles" on the rating sort Message-ID: ok, maybe it isn't a "bug" and yes, the subject is surely confusing. http://www.evolt.org/rating/index.html notice the text in the .pageTitle1 and .pageTitle2 sections? "new articles" but it isn't a sort by date, it's a sort by rating. any chance we can fix that to say simply "articles" or, if we must use two words, something like "quality articles" huh? you say that "quality" doesn't work because only the higher in the sort are high quality articles? well, of course, only the higher in the date sort are the "new" articles. but, like i said, i'd rather it be something else or just "articles". -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 16 00:00:41 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 16 00:00:41 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] "new articles" on the rating sort References: Message-ID: <01d501c19e53$6035d760$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> What about "rated" instead of "new" ? I'd prefer that than the subjective use of "quality". Even though "rated" isn't 100% accurate either cos that only covers off articles with more than 5 ratings to appear in that list .. me thinks :) (And articles of X categories ?) If we put highest rated articles that will be too large for that block .. ahh or we flip it around. Put "articles" in the left side, and "highest ratings" or "highest rated" in the right column. (One day, when we get that FAQ article that explains in better detail what each query/section takes into consideration, we can even have a link to it ;) I actually noticed something odd with the "[more]" comments too, it's leading to the comment search .. which I don't think is the intention. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Warden, Matt" | | http://www.evolt.org/rating/index.html | | notice the text in the .pageTitle1 and .pageTitle2 sections? "new | articles" | | but it isn't a sort by date, it's a sort by rating. any chance we can fix | that to say simply "articles" or, if we must use two words, something like | "quality articles" From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Jan 16 00:02:51 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Jan 16 00:02:51 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] "new articles" on the rating sort In-Reply-To: <01d501c19e53$6035d760$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: On Jan 16, Michele Foster had something to say about Re: [thesite] [bug]... >I actually noticed something odd with the "[more]" comments too, it's >leading to the comment search .. which I don't think is the intention. that's how it's always been as far as i can remember. maybe it was more of a placeholder for when the "more" functionality would be done. -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 16 00:05:25 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 16 00:05:25 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: icons for the tip harvester References: <3C44BA3B.8040608@ak.net> from "David McCreath" at Jan 15, 2002 02:24:43 PM <3C44CB19.5136.1B3A2CD8@localhost> Message-ID: <01d801c19e54$08d060c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Code Nazi .. :) But yeah you are correct. Couple other suggestions ... I think the icons should be "bigger" and/or in colour. How about something like this ... December 2001 Week ending: 31 24 17 10 3 icons icons icons icons icons With correct title tags for each icon (as identified in the Key, which is nice btw). I found myself thinking that the numbers reflected the number of tips .. ok, so, I'm sleepy.. give me a break ;) My two cents, Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "aardvark" | | +1, although the icons look a little stout... if they're gonna be side | by side, there needs to be a bit more balance, but i like where | you're going... | | also, can we skip

and go right to

from an

? i don't | believe so... From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 16 00:07:15 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 16 00:07:15 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] "new articles" on the rating sort References: Message-ID: <01dd01c19e54$4ca4e140$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Oh, I thought it meant that I had more "new" comments that *I* hadn't read yet. (a) fix it (b) delete it (we have a comment search box :) Mich p.s. Whatcha doing up so late ?? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Warden, Matt" | On Jan 16, Michele Foster had something to say about Re: [thesite] [bug]... | | >I actually noticed something odd with the "[more]" comments too, it's | >leading to the comment search .. which I don't think is the intention. | | that's how it's always been as far as i can remember. maybe it was more of | a placeholder for when the "more" functionality would be done. From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 16 00:16:45 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 16 00:16:45 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] "new articles" on the rating sort In-Reply-To: <01dd01c19e54$4ca4e140$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > Oh, I thought it meant that I had more "new" comments > that *I* hadn't read yet. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< it does. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > (a) fix it ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< done -- please test on t.e.o. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 16 00:27:11 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 16 00:27:11 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] "new articles" on the rating sort References: Message-ID: <01fe01c19e57$141be3c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Seems fine to me ... Thanks :) Michele ----- Original Message ----- From: ".jeff" | michele, | | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | > From: Michele Foster | > | > Oh, I thought it meant that I had more "new" comments | > that *I* hadn't read yet. | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | it does. | | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | > (a) fix it | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | done -- please test on t.e.o. | From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 16 00:42:17 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 16 00:42:17 2002 Subject: [thesite] user query timeout In-Reply-To: <01c19e18$e1961e40$5b4d149a@rudy> Message-ID: rudy, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: rudy > > f.y.i. jeff, not sure if you want to bother adding a > check and an error message for this situation, but i > accidentally-on-purpose ran the user search on the site > by typing one space into the search field, and it died > -- i didn't save the dump, you can reproduce it if you > need to, right? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< fixed. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 16 00:47:23 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 16 00:47:23 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] "new articles" on the rating sort In-Reply-To: Message-ID: matt, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Warden, Matt > > http://www.evolt.org/rating/index.html > > notice the text in the .pageTitle1 and .pageTitle2 > sections? "new articles" ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< fixed. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From r937 at interlog.com Wed Jan 16 11:20:55 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Wed Jan 16 11:20:55 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page Message-ID: <01c19eb2$52f15700$fd51149a@rudy> > also, can we skip

and go right to

from an

? can we? absolutely should we? that's arguable the pros/cons of the argument might make for a good article, eh? i have yet to find a definitive resource on the web that explains to me clearly why skipping a level is "bad" rudy From mccreath at ak.net Wed Jan 16 11:36:34 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Wed Jan 16 11:36:34 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page References: <3C44BA3B.8040608@ak.net> from "David McCreath" at Jan 15, 2002 02:24:43 PM <3C44CB19.5136.1B3A2CD8@localhost> Message-ID: <3C45BA49.8080704@ak.net> aardvark wrote: >>From: Dean Mah >> >>They work for me. But the thing that works for me the most is the >>"Key" that you've included at the top. Once people internalize the >>key, I think that they will work. > > +1, although the icons look a little stout... Can you be more specific? When I read "stout", I read "fat" or "heavy" or "big". "Heavy" I can see. They're black and white, therefore not very subtle, especially in reference to the rest of the page. > if they're gonna be side > by side, there needs to be a bit more balance, Again, I'm not quite sure what you mean. Balance between the week groupings (week/icon/icon | week/icon/icon)? Or between the icons? Is it an alignment thing? > but i like where you're going... Cool. Just didn't want this to be an excercise between me and Dean. :) > also, can we skip

and go right to

from an

? i don't > believe so... Bad coding on my part. I was thinking that the section header was an

, and didn't verify it in the code before writing my stuff. The example we're discussing was an attempt to create the listing entirely without tables, and it should be an

if we're going to use that approach. However, I'm not convinced that table-less is necessarily the best way. I'll play around with it more later. thanks for the input. David From mccreath at ak.net Wed Jan 16 11:41:12 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Wed Jan 16 11:41:12 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: icons for the tip harvester References: <3C44BA3B.8040608@ak.net> from "David McCreath" at Jan 15, 2002 02:24:43 PM <3C44CB19.5136.1B3A2CD8@localhost> <01d801c19e54$08d060c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C45BB5F.10304@ak.net> Michele Foster wrote: > Couple other suggestions ... I think the icons should be "bigger" and/or in > colour. Bigger than the larger sample? Or do you want to see a mock up with the the larger icons that are on my explanation page? > How about something like this ... > > December 2001 > > Week ending: > 31 24 17 10 3 > icons icons icons icons icons That's where the

was supposed to be! Doh! The year! I completely forgot about that. > With correct title tags for each icon (as identified in the Key, which is > nice btw). They're already titled. Hover over one of them and tell me what you think of it. > I found myself thinking that the numbers reflected the number of tips .. ok, > so, I'm sleepy.. give me a break ;) Good point. The number needs to more clearly identified as a date. > My two cents, > > Mich Thankee, missy. David From mccreath at ak.net Wed Jan 16 11:50:50 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Wed Jan 16 11:50:50 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page References: <01c19eb2$52f15700$fd51149a@rudy> Message-ID: <3C45BD9A.2020207@ak.net> Just to make sure everyone sees it: I flubbed the code on my mock up, and in my explanation to aardvark.

*is* the correct designation for the month, because the

was supposed to be the year. I just forgot to put it in, then forgot my reasoning when I was explaining it in my response to to aard. rudy wrote: >aardvark wrote: >>also, can we skip

and go right to

from an

? >> > > can we? absolutely Well of course. People do it all the time. > should we? that's arguable Not if we're going to set a good example. We need to maintain the hierarchy. > the pros/cons of the argument might make for a good article, eh? Using evolt.org as a good example of why you always should. :) > i have yet to find a definitive resource on the web that explains to me > clearly why skipping a level is "bad" If you find yourself wanting to skip from

to

, then you need to examine your writing. There's probably an

that should be put between the two, even if it's just one sentence, or in the case of what I'm doing on the mock up, just the header itself. Alternatively, your orphaned

section could be moved up in the hierarchy. Of course, that's a very strict interpretation, both in terms of writing and layout, but since HTML was intended to mark up written documentation, I stand by that interpretation. YOMV (your opinion may vary). David From mccreath at ak.net Wed Jan 16 12:07:10 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (David McCreath) Date: Wed Jan 16 12:07:10 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page References: <01c19eb2$52f15700$fd51149a@rudy> Message-ID: <3C45C175.3080602@ak.net> [ I'm sending this again, because the copy that came back to me had the correct subject line, but the text of a message from Javier. Is it just my client or does anyone else see that? ] Just to make sure everyone sees it: I flubbed the code on my mock up, and in my explanation to aardvark.

*is* the correct designation for the month, because the

was supposed to be the year. I just forgot to put it in, then forgot my reasoning when I was explaining it in my response to to aard. rudy wrote: >aardvark wrote: >>also, can we skip

and go right to

from an

? > > can we? absolutely Well of course. People do it all the time. > should we? that's arguable Not if we're going to set a good example. We need to maintain the document's hierarchy. > the pros/cons of the argument might make for a good article, eh? Using evolt.org as a good example of why it's a Good Thing (TM). :) > i have yet to find a definitive resource on the web that explains to me > clearly why skipping a level is "bad" If you find yourself wanting to skip from

to

, then you need to examine your writing. There's probably an

that should be put between the two, even if it's just one sentence, or in the case of what I'm doing on the mock up, just the header itself. Alternatively, your orphaned

section could be moved up in the hierarchy. Of course, that's a very strict interpretation, both in terms of writing and layout, but since HTML was intended to mark up written documentation, I stand by that interpretation. YOMV (your opinion may vary). David From r937 at interlog.com Wed Jan 16 12:11:55 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Wed Jan 16 12:11:55 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page Message-ID: <01c19eb9$726bf2a0$fd51149a@rudy> > Of course, that's a very strict interpretation... perhaps not strict enough > ... both in terms of writing and layout, but since HTML > was intended to mark up written documentation, I stand > by that interpretation. YOMV (your opinion may vary). indeed lemme ask you, does your interpretation allow P text inserted "in between" these heading levels, like an introductory paragraph?

stooges

introductory comments, a page and a half

curly

stuff about curly

larry

stuff about larry

moe

stuff about moe

wrapup comments

since you are a markup fanatic, tell me where that last paragraph gets parsed in the document hierarchy now tell me how to fix it so that it's as "pure and semantically correct" as not skipping an H level YOMNCM (your opinion may never convince me) ;o) rudy From lists at mantruc.com Wed Jan 16 12:19:13 2002 From: lists at mantruc.com (javier velasco) Date: Wed Jan 16 12:19:13 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page layout breaks) References: <200201152038.NAA02623@alice.monkeyland.ca> <3C44B592.9070506@ak.net> Message-ID: <3C45C427.61E1614E@mantruc.com> David McCreath wrote: > If I may offer another suggestion, I did a little work on some icons > back when Javi sent his original ones. I went ahead and did a quick > description page and mock-up: > > http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/tips/ (waking up) hey, i like the solution! (sorry i took so long to reply) i undestand what aardvark means by balance, will fix it colors, you want them to be more in tone with the page? i'll try to adress that too, thanks! -- Javier Velasco Information Architect @ Chile Work - http://www.nurun.cl Me - http://mantruc.com Family - http://evolt.org From evolt at spinhead.com Wed Jan 16 12:24:57 2002 From: evolt at spinhead.com (spinhead) Date: Wed Jan 16 12:24:57 2002 Subject: skipping hx levels (was Re: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page) References: <01c19eb9$726bf2a0$fd51149a@rudy> Message-ID: <00cf01c19eba$c8f9e310$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> >

stooges

>

introductory comments, a page and a half

>

curly

>

stuff about curly

>

larry

>

stuff about larry

>

moe

>

stuff about moe

>

wrapup comments

> > since you are a markup fanatic, tell me where that last paragraph gets > parsed in the document hierarchy It is the first paragraph at the 'root' one level above h1. But you shouldn't have anything there; if we're following the hx format strictly (which I realize you didn't say you were) the conclusion would be either another h2 or the last h1; probably the latter. (pssst; wanna talk about this over on thelist?) > > now tell me how to fix it so that it's as "pure and semantically correct" > as not skipping an H level > > > YOMNCM (your opinion may never convince me) You rebel! (That's a pejorative, pronounced 'REB-ul' not a command, pronounced 'ruh-BEL') joel > > ;o) > > > rudy > > From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 16 12:26:59 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 16 12:26:59 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: icons for the tip harvester References: <3C44BA3B.8040608@ak.net> from "David McCreath" at Jan 15, 2002 02:24:43 PM <3C44CB19.5136.1B3A2CD8@localhost> <01d801c19e54$08d060c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <3C45BB5F.10304@ak.net> Message-ID: <000a01c19ebb$9e9c4940$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> David, I like the larger interpretation that you have posted here .. http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/tips/ As opposed to the sample page where you use the smaller ones. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "David McCreath" | Michele Foster wrote: | | > Couple other suggestions ... I think the icons should be "bigger" and/or in | > colour. | | | Bigger than the larger sample? Or do you want to see a mock up with the | the larger icons that are on my explanation page? | | From roselli at earthlink.net Wed Jan 16 12:59:18 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Wed Jan 16 12:59:18 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page In-Reply-To: <01c19eb9$726bf2a0$fd51149a@rudy> Message-ID: <200201161859.g0GIxGhQ000467@leo.evolt.org> ok, just got back, replying to this without reading the rest of the thread... > From: "rudy" [...] > lemme ask you, does your interpretation allow P text inserted "in > between" these heading levels, like an introductory paragraph? there is no in-between... it falls under the heading immediately preceeding it... >

stooges

>

introductory comments, a page and a half

>

curly

>

stuff about curly

>

larry

>

stuff about larry

>

moe

>

stuff about moe

>

wrapup comments

> > since you are a markup fanatic, tell me where that last paragraph gets > parsed in the document hierarchy under

moe

... by your argument, the second paragraph (and so on) under every heading would fall out of the hierarchy... imagine what that would do to a page... you only delimit the closing text by not indenting it, which doesn't matter to a renderer... in short, your code example is wrong if you want that last

to be its own section... > now tell me how to fix it so that it's as "pure and semantically > correct" as not skipping an H level

wrapup

wrapup comments

> YOMNCM (your opinion may never convince me) glad you're not talking to me on that one... From roselli at earthlink.net Wed Jan 16 12:59:25 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Wed Jan 16 12:59:25 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page In-Reply-To: <3C45BD9A.2020207@ak.net> Message-ID: <200201161859.g0GIxHhQ000469@leo.evolt.org> > From: David McCreath [...] > If you find yourself wanting to skip from

to

, then you need > to examine your writing. There's probably an

that should be put > between the two, even if it's just one sentence, or in the case of > what I'm doing on the mock up, just the header itself. usually if you think about *why* you want to skip an level, it's because you want it to *look* a certain way... well, that's too bad... if it's your own site, style your

s differently, or even embed an inline style (which, IMO, is the wrong thing to do) if it's that important to you... > Alternatively, your orphaned

section could be moved up in the > hierarchy. [...] and that's usually the best solution... From roselli at earthlink.net Wed Jan 16 12:59:27 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Wed Jan 16 12:59:27 2002 Subject: icons for the tip harvester (was Re: [thesite] Re: [***forum] page In-Reply-To: <3C45BA49.8080704@ak.net> Message-ID: <200201161859.g0GIxHhQ000468@leo.evolt.org> > From: David McCreath > >> > >>They work for me. But the thing that works for me the most is the > >>"Key" that you've included at the top. Once people internalize the > >>key, I think that they will work. > > > > +1, although the icons look a little stout... > > Can you be more specific? When I read "stout", I read "fat" or "heavy" > or "big". erm, ok... that was a 'gut' response, since i didn't have time to examine *why* i thought that way... they just look too short and wide... the pairing doesn't feel right, either... somehow it looks mismatched... > "Heavy" I can see. They're black and white, therefore not very subtle, > especially in reference to the rest of the page. nah, that didn't bother me... > > if they're gonna be side > > by side, there needs to be a bit more balance, > > Again, I'm not quite sure what you mean. Balance between the week > groupings (week/icon/icon | week/icon/icon)? Or between the icons? Is > it an alignment thing? valignment.. > > but i like where you're going... > > Cool. Just didn't want this to be an excercise between me and Dean. :) [...] feh... From lists at mantruc.com Wed Jan 16 13:07:08 2002 From: lists at mantruc.com (javier velasco) Date: Wed Jan 16 13:07:08 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: icons for the tip harvester References: <3C44BA3B.8040608@ak.net> from "David McCreath" at Jan 15, 2002 02:24:43 PM <3C44CB19.5136.1B3A2CD8@localhost> <01d801c19e54$08d060c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> <3C45BB5F.10304@ak.net> <000a01c19ebb$9e9c4940$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C45CF61.438DD03C@mantruc.com> Michele Foster wrote: > > David, > > I like the larger interpretation that you have posted here .. > http://members.evolt.org/mccreath/evolt/tips/ > > As opposed to the sample page where you use the smaller ones. oh bummer, i missed that comment and supposed you (all) were liking the smaller variant (i liked the big one too) went and did a quick&dirty gif it also keeps the code-sharks away http://members.evolt.org/mantruc/evolt/harvester_icons.gif let me know how you like the layout and colors, now i have to get back to work -- Javier Velasco Information Architect @ Chile Work - http://www.nurun.cl Me - http://mantruc.com Family - http://evolt.org From roselli at earthlink.net Wed Jan 16 13:15:46 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Wed Jan 16 13:15:46 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: icons for the tip harvester In-Reply-To: <3C45CF61.438DD03C@mantruc.com> Message-ID: <200201161915.g0GJFihQ001619@leo.evolt.org> > From: javier velasco [...] > went and did a quick&dirty gif > it also keeps the code-sharks away hmmm.... me? > http://members.evolt.org/mantruc/evolt/harvester_icons.gif > > let me know how you like the layout and colors, now i have to get back > to work erm, what if we change the colors on the site? or the user does? right now you've pulled those colors from the page, so it could look odd in different colors... i'd actually rather see black&white since i think we'll be safer overall for all color schemes... i think i want to see the icons take up the same space on-screen (you know, like 12x12, or whatever, so that they both occupy the same area, even if they have negative space)... right now it doesn't feel like that... crap, i need more time to just try some of these.. From lists at mantruc.com Wed Jan 16 13:27:15 2002 From: lists at mantruc.com (javier velasco) Date: Wed Jan 16 13:27:15 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: icons for the tip harvester References: <200201161915.g0GJFihQ001619@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <3C45D418.68D35AB3@mantruc.com> aardvark wrote: > erm, what if we change the colors on the site? or the user does? > right now you've pulled those colors from the page, so it could look > odd in different colors... > > i'd actually rather see black&white since i think we'll be safer > overall for all color schemes... just the moment i used the 'eyedropper' to pick the color from the site, i remembered about user defines styles. went ahead anyway to see how it looked like anyway, i agree, it's best to leave them in black and white > i think i want to see the icons take up the same space on-screen > (you know, like 12x12, or whatever, so that they both occupy the > same area, even if they have negative space)... right now it doesn't > feel like that... makes sense. i did try to make them as regular as possible currently they're 10 x 11 and 11 x 12 you must have one 'helluvan eye' to catch _that_ difference (but that's what we're paid for, not?) do we want to go back to dave's bigger icons? (instead of these small ones) > crap, i need more time to just try some of these.. don't know how to tie that to the rest, shrug -- Javier Velasco Information Architect @ Chile Work - http://www.nurun.cl Me - http://mantruc.com Family - http://evolt.org From mrg at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 16 14:08:08 2002 From: mrg at members.evolt.org (mrg) Date: Wed Jan 16 14:08:08 2002 Subject: [thesite] an actual article? Message-ID: Wishing I could contribute more, so i'm thinking i could do this: write an article on "Good, Basic, Cold Fusion". Something which outlines a good way of doing things, for those who haven't tackled CF yet, or have just begun to tinker. Spell out the basics of cfswitch, multi-purpose re-usable forms, code re-use, and some other stuff which will put the beginners a few days ahead in the reading. Stopping short of sessions, tokens, etc. I'm not the expert on all of this, but i've figured a few things out. I would consult the wizards here behind the scenes to help make sure that it's thorough and true - with links to the appropriate articles on SQL, forms, etc for more detailed information. It may take me a while, but i'd like to do it if it sounds worth doing, oh, and is this the right list for this kind of thing... matt g. From webguru at vsnl.net Wed Jan 16 14:12:08 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Wed Jan 16 14:12:08 2002 Subject: [thesite] an actual article? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020117013923.01b41b58@203.197.12.4> At 01:47 AM 1/17/2002, mrg typed these words: >It may take me a while, but i'd like to do it if it sounds worth doing, > >oh, and is this the right list for this kind of thing... Go for it! There are several people who could help you in both technical and editorial matters. Is this the right list? Hmmm... I guess so. theforum is more for strategy, isn't it? (any dissenters?) Regards, Madhu <<< * >>> Madhu Menon User Experience Consultant e-mail: webguru at vsnl.net From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Jan 16 14:13:05 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Jan 16 14:13:05 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: icons for the tip harvester In-Reply-To: <01d801c19e54$08d060c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: On Jan 16, Michele Foster had something to say about [thesite] Re: icons... >December 2001 > >Week ending: >31 24 17 10 3 >icons icons icons icons icons > >With correct title tags for each icon (as identified in the Key, which is >nice btw). > >I found myself thinking that the numbers reflected the number of tips .. ok, >so, I'm sleepy.. give me a break ;) no, i thought the same thing. when something is linked, you look at that... maybe before the "week ending" text. i think we ought to change each to 12/31, 12/24, etc. so it can be compact, but still recognized as a date. -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 16 14:13:14 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 16 14:13:14 2002 Subject: [thesite] an actual article? References: Message-ID: <002401c19eca$7a21c360$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Matt, Sounds like an awesome article, one I'd greatly appreciate. I'm sure Jeff will pore over it line by line .. which will make for an excellent peer review in the process. This list is fine for article ideas .. I think. It's a tough call between this one or theforum. Regardless, write away!! :) Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "mrg" | Wishing I could contribute more, so i'm thinking i could do this: | | write an article on "Good, Basic, Cold Fusion". | Something which outlines a good way of doing things, for those who haven't | tackled CF yet, or have just begun to tinker. Spell out the basics of | cfswitch, multi-purpose re-usable forms, code re-use, and some other stuff | which will put the beginners a few days ahead in the reading. Stopping short | of sessions, tokens, etc. | From lists at mantruc.com Wed Jan 16 14:17:46 2002 From: lists at mantruc.com (javier velasco) Date: Wed Jan 16 14:17:46 2002 Subject: [thesite] an actual article? References: Message-ID: <3C45DFF0.D37F47CB@mantruc.com> mrg wrote: > > Wishing I could contribute more, so i'm thinking i could do this: > > write an article on "Good, Basic, Cold Fusion". > Something which outlines a good way of doing things, for those who haven't > tackled CF yet, or have just begun to tinker. Spell out the basics of > cfswitch, multi-purpose re-usable forms, code re-use, and some other stuff > which will put the beginners a few days ahead in the reading. Stopping short > of sessions, tokens, etc. I'd love to learn the basic CF stuff! we do need more basic level articles, go ahead thanks matt -- Javier Velasco Information Architect @ Chile Work - http://www.nurun.cl Me - http://mantruc.com Family - http://evolt.org From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Jan 16 14:22:31 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Jan 16 14:22:31 2002 Subject: [thesite] an actual article? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Jan 16, mrg had something to say about [thesite] an actual article? >I'm not the expert on all of this, but i've figured a few things out. I >would consult the wizards here behind the scenes to help make sure that it's >thorough and true - with links to the appropriate articles on SQL, forms, >etc for more detailed information. no wizards. no behind-the-scenes (anymore). http://lists.evolt.org/adminarchive/ open to the public. >It may take me a while, but i'd like to do it if it sounds worth doing, sounds like a good idea. we dont' have enough beginner articles. >oh, and is this the right list for this kind of thing... not really. it probably should have been sent as a question to admin at lists.evolt.org. But, since that isn't documented anywhere, i dont think you're going to get slapped. ;-) -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 16 14:42:58 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 16 14:42:58 2002 Subject: [thesite] an actual article? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: matt, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Warden, Matt > > no wizards. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< no? how about gurus then? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > no behind-the-scenes (anymore). ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< with irc being the exception it seems. ;p ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > http://lists.evolt.org/adminarchive/ > > open to the public. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< and nothing all that interesting being discussed either. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > sounds like a good idea. we dont' have enough beginner > articles. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ditto thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From rwd at csi1st.net Wed Jan 16 15:45:29 2002 From: rwd at csi1st.net (Ron Dorman) Date: Wed Jan 16 15:45:29 2002 Subject: [thesite] an actual article? References: Message-ID: <3C45F5E6.E8A3EA46@csi1st.net> mrg wrote: > Wishing I could contribute more, so i'm thinking i could do this: > > write an article on "Good, Basic, Cold Fusion". something I would read. go for it. From evolt at spinhead.com Wed Jan 16 16:14:18 2002 From: evolt at spinhead.com (spinhead) Date: Wed Jan 16 16:14:18 2002 Subject: [thesite] an actual article? References: Message-ID: <004301c19edb$2d3fb1e0$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> > >oh, and is this the right list for this kind of thing... > > not really. it probably should have been sent as a question to > admin at lists.evolt.org. But, since that isn't documented anywhere, i dont > think you're going to get slapped. ;-) > > -- > mattwarden > mattwarden.com In amanda's 'writer's guidelines' she directs this question to the online form. Where does that go? Does that make it a de facto standard, or something like that? From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 16 16:38:55 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 16 16:38:55 2002 Subject: [thesite] A bunch of changes .. teo Message-ID: <00ac01c19ede$d56b6c80$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hey everyone .... A bunch of small changes, bug fixes, etc. added to teo. Many in response to bug reports or feature requests on thesite list (and theforum). I've added the information below to the changelog file (which I added an extension of .txt to so that I can get it to launch properly ;). Also, the article view, I've commented out the ratings stuff that jeff still needs to program. Right now it only shows the "old" version. This way this page can be rolled up to weo without any problems. IMHO, none of the changes below need to be documented in a Community News article... too small. Couple of notes at the bottom .. Dean a prob with the sidebar .. holler if ya need more info. -------------------- + Updated page titles for highest rated articles. - .jeff + Added feature to view of highest rated articles, can filter by category, by selecting the category link on the left side bar. - .jeff + Fixed [More] link under new comments. - .jeff + Added class="borderblack" and deleted border="1" to the author's images on all pages where required. - Mishka + Added "added #who# : evolt.org" to user's display page title. - .jeff + Fixed anchors in preview article view. - .jeff + Added
before bio box, to stop it overlapping the author block. - Mishka + Fixed user search for "space"; redirects to advanced user search instead of timing out. - .jeff (Jeff, doesn't fix the time out problem tho?) + Added revived articles to article category view pages (except for FAQ, News, Jobs, Community News and Suggestions categories). Revived article is filtered based on the category being viewed. - .jeff + Added floating table to the article preview page. = .jeff +Updated xml_articles.cfm to search for articles in the past month not past week. - .jeff -------------- (Dean, double check that the sidebar is now working properly in NS/Moz .. why is it being referenced to a file in deo's directory???) One final thing .. can someone check the system clock on test.oreo box? Seems to be a day and a 1/2 ahead of time (depending on your time of course)... but its definitely off a day. See the new comments Jeff and I added to teo last night, are listed as Jan. 17th. GC checked t.e.o. box and its correct. Opps, one more final thing ... Dan/Dean what's up with t.e.o. thinking Community News = ID 2 when on w.e.o. it's ID 27 .. for consistency, can it be "ID = 27" on t.e.o. .. as that's what was "agreed" upon. ;) Jeff, did I miss anything??? Mich From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Jan 16 17:20:28 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Jan 16 17:20:28 2002 Subject: [thesite] an actual article? In-Reply-To: <004301c19edb$2d3fb1e0$3b0a000a@HEISENBERG> Message-ID: On Jan 16, spinhead had something to say about Re: [thesite] an actual article? >> >oh, and is this the right list for this kind of thing... >> >> not really. it probably should have been sent as a question to >> admin at lists.evolt.org. But, since that isn't documented anywhere, i dont >> think you're going to get slapped. ;-) >> >> -- >> mattwarden >> mattwarden.com > >In amanda's 'writer's guidelines' she directs this question to the online >form. Where does that go? Does that make it a de facto standard, or >something like that? it goes to admin at lists.evolt.org ;-) -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Jan 16 17:30:36 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Jan 16 17:30:36 2002 Subject: [thesite] A bunch of changes .. teo In-Reply-To: <00ac01c19ede$d56b6c80$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: On Jan 16, Michele Foster had something to say about [thesite] A bunch of... >One final thing .. can someone check the system clock on test.oreo box? >Seems to be a day and a 1/2 ahead of time (depending on your time of >course)... but its definitely off a day. See the new comments Jeff and I >added to teo last night, are listed as Jan. 17th. GC checked t.e.o. box and >its correct. [oracle at ora oracle]$ date Thu Jan 17 19:11:12 CST 2002 yup. >Opps, one more final thing ... Dan/Dean what's up with t.e.o. thinking >Community News = ID 2 when on w.e.o. it's ID 27 .. for consistency, can it >be "ID = 27" on t.e.o. .. as that's what was "agreed" upon. ;) done are we planning on rolling the bugfixes up to weo soon? we probably need a list of changed files if so, because im not crafty enough to grep lastmod dates... -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From martin at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 16 17:43:24 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Wed Jan 16 17:43:24 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] "new articles" on the rating sort In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wednesday, January 16, 2002, at 06:03 am, Warden, Matt wrote: > On Jan 16, Michele Foster had something to say about Re: [thesite] > [bug]... > >> I actually noticed something odd with the "[more]" comments too, it's >> leading to the comment search .. which I don't think is the intention. > > that's how it's always been as far as i can remember. maybe it was more > of > a placeholder for when the "more" functionality would be done. IIRC it used to go to the next comments, just like the [more] link on Highest Rated Articles. And if I don't remember correctly, that's the expectation that [more] sets for me, which is probably *why* I think it used to work that way. Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 16 17:55:12 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 16 17:55:12 2002 Subject: [thesite] A bunch of changes .. teo References: Message-ID: <00e101c19ee9$7d756a20$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> hmm.. according to memory and FTP file dates .. the list is .. /app_comment.cfm /article/dsp_article.cfm /article/dsp_preview.cfm /article/act_process.cfm /comment/act_comments.cfm /home/act_home.cfm /home/dsp_home.cfm /sidebar/act_averagerating.cfm /sidebar/act_comments.cfm /user/act_users.cfm /user/dsp_users.cfm /user/dsp_signup.cfm /user/dsp_act_process.cfm /xml/xml_articles.cfm Good to go .. I think. :) Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Warden, Matt" | | are we planning on rolling the bugfixes up to weo soon? we probably need a | list of changed files if so, because im not crafty enough to grep lastmod | dates... From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 16 17:59:19 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 16 17:59:19 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] "new articles" on the rating sort In-Reply-To: Message-ID: martin, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Martin > > IIRC it used to go to the next comments, just like the > [more] link on Highest Rated Articles. > > And if I don't remember correctly, that's the > expectation that [more] sets for me, which is probably > *why* I think it used to work that way. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< yes, and hopefully i've got it fixed now. hard to tell without a ton of new comments in the system since my last login though. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From dmah at shaw.ca Wed Jan 16 18:04:01 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Wed Jan 16 18:04:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] A bunch of changes .. teo In-Reply-To: <00e101c19ee9$7d756a20$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> from "Michele Foster" at Jan 16, 2002 06:56:59 PM Message-ID: <200201170005.RAA03371@alice.monkeyland.ca> But don't push /article/dsp_article.cfm since it still has the broken rating bar, is that correct? Changes need to made manually. Dean Michele Foster writes: > hmm.. according to memory and FTP file dates .. the list is .. > > /app_comment.cfm > /article/dsp_article.cfm > /article/dsp_preview.cfm > /article/act_process.cfm > /comment/act_comments.cfm > /home/act_home.cfm > /home/dsp_home.cfm > /sidebar/act_averagerating.cfm > /sidebar/act_comments.cfm > /user/act_users.cfm > /user/dsp_users.cfm > /user/dsp_signup.cfm > /user/dsp_act_process.cfm > /xml/xml_articles.cfm > > Good to go .. I think. :) > > Mich From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 16 18:06:50 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 16 18:06:50 2002 Subject: [thesite] A bunch of changes .. teo References: <200201170005.RAA03371@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <00ee01c19eeb$1e81a2c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> No .. I commented it out so it could be pushed directly. When Jeff has time to work on the ratings bar, he can take out the comments I added and still have his working code. So, yes, it can be pushed up directly. Mich . ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dean Mah" | But don't push /article/dsp_article.cfm since it still has the broken | rating bar, is that correct? Changes need to made manually. | From isaac at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 16 18:33:08 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Wed Jan 16 18:33:08 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: <3C43DFBC.1894.17A2C8AB@localhost> Message-ID: > > p.s. it was isaac that added the 6th rating > > > > you are now number 1 > > thanks isaac, although i wasn't trolling for a new rating... don't thank me. i gave you a 4 to end this thread. ;) (actually gave it a 4 because that's what i think it is (mostly stat tables, etc) -- but ending the thread would be a bonus). must've been someone else. (a couple more 4's and 5's since i last looked). i've finally got one of my articles in there -- you think i'm gonna let some stat write-up junk push me back out? ... i From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 16 20:45:36 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 16 20:45:36 2002 Subject: [thesite] A bunch of changes .. teo References: Message-ID: <001601c19f01$47bc7000$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Warden, Matt" | On Jan 16, Michele Foster had something to say about [thesite] A bunch of... | | >One final thing .. can someone check the system clock on test.oreo box? | >Seems to be a day and a 1/2 ahead of time (depending on your time of | >course)... but its definitely off a day. See the new comments Jeff and I | >added to teo last night, are listed as Jan. 17th. GC checked t.e.o. box and | >its correct. | | [oracle at ora oracle]$ date | Thu Jan 17 19:11:12 CST 2002 | | yup. Did you change it then ? or were you just agreeing that its a day off? | | >Opps, one more final thing ... Dan/Dean what's up with t.e.o. thinking | >Community News = ID 2 when on w.e.o. it's ID 27 .. for consistency, can it | >be "ID = 27" on t.e.o. .. as that's what was "agreed" upon. ;) | | done How do we get this to show up? Does something need to be restarted or umm... I dunno. Mich From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 16 20:52:08 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 16 20:52:08 2002 Subject: [thesite] A bunch of changes .. teo In-Reply-To: <001601c19f01$47bc7000$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > | > Opps, one more final thing ... Dan/Dean what's up > | > with t.e.o. thinking Community News = ID 2 when on > | > w.e.o. it's ID 27 .. for consistency, can it be > | > "ID = 27" on t.e.o. .. as that's what was "agreed" > | > upon. ;) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< more like forced upon without any legitimate reasoning, but anyway. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > | done ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< thanks matt. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > How do we get this to show up? Does something need to > be restarted or umm... I dunno. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ok, i've explained this several times before, but here it is again. it's *very* simple. open application.cfm. go to the bottom where the application scoped query is (currently lines 239-248). find the line that's commented out and read the comment immediately above it. follow those directions. be sure to comment that line out again. you're done. no worries, i've taken care of it. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From dmah at shaw.ca Wed Jan 16 22:19:07 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Wed Jan 16 22:19:07 2002 Subject: [thesite] A bunch of changes .. teo In-Reply-To: <00e101c19ee9$7d756a20$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> from "Michele Foster" at Jan 16, 2002 06:56:59 PM Message-ID: <200201170420.VAA04273@alice.monkeyland.ca> They should be on weo now. Take a look and let me know if there is a problem. Dean Michele Foster writes: > hmm.. according to memory and FTP file dates .. the list is .. > > /app_comment.cfm > /article/dsp_article.cfm > /article/dsp_preview.cfm > /article/act_process.cfm > /comment/act_comments.cfm > /home/act_home.cfm > /home/dsp_home.cfm > /sidebar/act_averagerating.cfm > /sidebar/act_comments.cfm > /user/act_users.cfm > /user/dsp_users.cfm > /user/dsp_signup.cfm > /user/dsp_act_process.cfm > /xml/xml_articles.cfm > > Good to go .. I think. :) > > Mich > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Warden, Matt" > > | > | are we planning on rolling the bugfixes up to weo soon? we probably need a > | list of changed files if so, because im not crafty enough to grep lastmod > | dates... From dmah at shaw.ca Wed Jan 16 22:24:46 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Wed Jan 16 22:24:46 2002 Subject: [thesite] A bunch of changes .. teo In-Reply-To: <00ac01c19ede$d56b6c80$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> from "Michele Foster" at Jan 16, 2002 05:40:42 PM Message-ID: <200201170426.VAA04303@alice.monkeyland.ca> Michele Foster writes: > (Dean, double check that the sidebar is now working properly in > NS/Moz .. why is it being referenced to a file in deo's > directory???) Yes, the sidebar is working properly. It was working properly before, i.e., as designed. It's just that there haven't been enough articles in the past week. Don't know why it sits in deo's directory. That's where Dan wanted it stored. Dean From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 16 22:29:38 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 16 22:29:38 2002 Subject: [thesite] A bunch of changes .. teo References: <200201170420.VAA04273@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <003c01c19f0f$d15f63e0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> All looks good to me .. Thanks guys .. as always!! I love the way this team works together... :) Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dean Mah" | They should be on weo now. Take a look and let me know if there is a | problem. | | Dean From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 16 22:31:37 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 16 22:31:37 2002 Subject: [thesite] A bunch of changes .. teo References: <200201170426.VAA04303@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <004101c19f10$1b86d980$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> That's just whacked ... hehehe (technically speaking of course ;) Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dean Mah" | Michele Foster writes: | | > (Dean, double check that the sidebar is now working properly in | > NS/Moz .. why is it being referenced to a file in deo's | > directory???) | | Yes, the sidebar is working properly. It was working properly before, | i.e., as designed. It's just that there haven't been enough articles | in the past week. | | Don't know why it sits in deo's directory. That's where Dan wanted it | stored. From tiedefenderdelta6 at yahoo.com Thu Jan 17 00:01:49 2002 From: tiedefenderdelta6 at yahoo.com (Lachlan Cannon) Date: Thu Jan 17 00:01:49 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: icons for the tip harvester In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020117060237.36118.qmail@web12305.mail.yahoo.com> --- "Warden, Matt" wrote: > no, i thought the same thing. when something is linked, > you look at > that... maybe before the "week ending" text. i think we > ought to change > each to 12/31, 12/24, etc. so it can be compact, but > still recognized as a > date. Or maybe 31 Dec, 24 Dec to not confuse people who use the date formats the other way? Dunno what evolt's strategy for that is... Lach __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ From isaac at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 17 00:05:19 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Thu Jan 17 00:05:19 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: icons for the tip harvester In-Reply-To: <20020117060237.36118.qmail@web12305.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: > Or maybe 31 Dec, 24 Dec to not confuse people who use the > date formats the other way? > Dunno what evolt's strategy for that is... Generally to avoid confusing people... Was going to point this out myself, but you've beaten me to it. isaac -------------------------------------------------------------- triple zero digital | upstairs at 200 the parade, norwood 5067 (08)83320545 | www.triplezero.com.au | isaac at triplezero.com.au From roselli at earthlink.net Thu Jan 17 08:46:33 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Thu Jan 17 08:46:33 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: References: <3C43DFBC.1894.17A2C8AB@localhost> Message-ID: <200201171446.g0HEkWhQ003828@leo.evolt.org> > From: "isaac" [...] > > thanks isaac, although i wasn't trolling for a new rating... > > don't thank me. i gave you a 4 to end this thread. ;) oh, thank god it wasn't altruism... i'd be worried about you... > (actually gave it a 4 because that's what i think it is (mostly stat > tables, etc) -- but ending the thread would be a bonus). dig... i tend to agree that it's by no means a 5 -- there's no meat to it (it's all in the previous article)... > must've been someone else. (a couple more 4's and 5's since i last > looked). can you do me a favor? that article languished at 4 ratings forever... and then it makes it into the top ratings list and gets another 4 ratings in a couple days... can you send me a screen shot (with names blocked out) of the admin sidebar with the rating dates? i think this is an interesting example of how the articles list is a self- perpetuating model, and i'm intrigued by the effect of the UI element we've created that elevates those articles... > i've finally got one of my articles in there -- you think i'm gonna > let some stat write-up junk push me back out? ... bring it From martin at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 19 18:25:25 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Sat Jan 19 18:25:25 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: <200201171446.g0HEkWhQ003828@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <59D86E74-0D3C-11D6-8AA0-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> On Thursday, January 17, 2002, at 02:47 pm, aardvark wrote: >> must've been someone else. (a couple more 4's and 5's since i last >> looked). > > can you do me a favor? > > that article languished at 4 ratings forever... and then it makes it > into the top ratings list and gets another 4 ratings in a couple > days... > > can you send me a screen shot (with names blocked out) of the > admin sidebar with the rating dates? hmm - I wonder if there's a case for enabling authors to see the ratings given to them with names removed, so they can get the feedback of "Oh, most people think my article is fantastic, but I got one outlying point which skewed the mean rating" Or even to disregard outliers when calculating the mean (it's a common statistical methodology) > i think this is an interesting example of how the articles list is a > self- > perpetuating model, and i'm intrigued by the effect of the UI > element we've created that elevates those articles... Also as those articles have fantastic Google rankings, they get traffic into the site, which means more visitors, which means more ratings etc. The more ratings an article has, though, the harder it is to knock off long-term, as each new rating has less effect. >> i've finally got one of my articles in there -- you think i'm gonna >> let some stat write-up junk push me back out? ... > > bring it Which is another thing - getting mentioned on thelist gets traffic to the article, and more ratings. Naturally, only good articles tend to get mentioned, so new ratings will tend to be good ones, although there's always someone who will violently disagree with the points and/or want to make a bitchy point by low-rating an article. Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From jeff at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 19 18:39:06 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sat Jan 19 18:39:06 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: <59D86E74-0D3C-11D6-8AA0-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: martin, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Martin > > > can you send me a screen shot (with names blocked out) > > of the admin sidebar with the rating dates? > > hmm - I wonder if there's a case for enabling authors to > see the ratings given to them with names removed, so > they can get the feedback of "Oh, most people think my > article is fantastic, but I got one outlying point which > skewed the mean rating" ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< interesting idea. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Or even to disregard outliers when calculating the mean > (it's a common statistical methodology) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i like that idea as well though that calculation will be much more difficult to perform. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From roselli at earthlink.net Sat Jan 19 18:41:42 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Sat Jan 19 18:41:42 2002 Subject: [thesite] meta description Message-ID: <3C49CBF2.4636.2EC48E5A@localhost> consider the following search (which appeared in my logs): http://ixquick.com/do/metasearch.pl?cat=web&cat=web&cmd=proc ess_search&language=english&query=liquid+design the same article exists on three different sites... my personal site doesn't make it in at all (well, not in the first two screens), but the following two entries appear: Liquid Design for the Web - Algonquin Studios - Web & Enterprise Software Solution... With so many users and so many variables that control window size, you've got an infinite number of possible dimensions in users' browser windows. This article will address screen resolution by offering some tips and caveats for liquid design. http://algonquinstudios.com/article_177.html Highlighted Result (new!) alltheweb (2), Lycos (5) Liquid Design for the Web : evolt.org, Site Development A world community for web developers, evolt.org promotes the mutual free exchange of ideas, skills and experiences. http://www.evolt.org/article/Liquid_Design_for_the_Web/20/15177 Highlighted Result (new!) AOL (2), MSN (6) interestingly, it pulls the meta description from the page as the abstract for the search results... perhaps we could do the same for our articles? use the abstract from the article as the meta description? does anyone have any interest in that? or see any value in it? From martin at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 19 18:49:01 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Sat Jan 19 18:49:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sunday, January 20, 2002, at 12:41 am, .jeff wrote: >> <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >> Or even to disregard outliers when calculating the mean >> (it's a common statistical methodology) >> <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > i like that idea as well though that calculation will be much more > difficult > to perform. Somewhere I've got a method for working out which data items are outliers to a normal distribution. If calculation happened at the time of adding a new rating rather than on display, then the effort involved would be less I think. (does it happen that way now?) Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From martin at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 19 18:51:02 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Sat Jan 19 18:51:02 2002 Subject: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: <3C49CBF2.4636.2EC48E5A@localhost> Message-ID: On Sunday, January 20, 2002, at 12:41 am, aardvark wrote: > > perhaps we could do the same for our articles? use the abstract > from the article as the meta description? > > does anyone have any interest in that? or see any value in it? Yes - sounds like the sensible thing to do (and also the right thing as the meta-data would reflect the page content more accurately). A thought - in the next redesign, do you think we should move towards Dublin Core metadata? And feeding it into the Search? Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From r937 at interlog.com Sat Jan 19 19:04:12 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Sat Jan 19 19:04:12 2002 Subject: [thesite] meta description Message-ID: <01c1a14e$977f2de0$114d149a@rudy> >> perhaps we could do the same for our articles? use the abstract >> from the article as the meta description? +1 >Yes - sounds like the sensible thing to do (and also the right >thing as the meta-data would reflect the page content more >accurately). +1 >A thought - in the next redesign, do you think we should move >towards Dublin Core metadata? can you give a pr?cis of why? do search engines care? google? > And feeding it into the Search? feed what into which search? does our article search search both synopsis and contents? rudy From jeff at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 19 19:55:43 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sat Jan 19 19:55:43 2002 Subject: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: <3C49CBF2.4636.2EC48E5A@localhost> Message-ID: aardvark, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: aardvark > > interestingly, it pulls the meta description from the > page as the abstract for the search results... > > perhaps we could do the same for our articles? use the > abstract from the article as the meta description? > > does anyone have any interest in that? or see any value > in it? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< on the drawing board for v3.0 actually. an author will be able to define keywords and descriptions for each of their articles. this functionality could be added now, but would be costly to implement with little return. imo, the return will be much greater in the redesign. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 19 20:18:39 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sat Jan 19 20:18:39 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: martin, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Martin > > > i like that idea as well though that calculation will > > be much more difficult to perform. > > Somewhere I've got a method for working out which data > items are outliers to a normal distribution. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< be glad to take a look at it when/if you find it. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > If calculation happened at the time of adding a new > rating rather than on display, then the effort involved > would be less I think. (does it happen that way now?) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< the calculation currently happens at the time the new rating is inserted, therefore occurring only once and not for every page view that displays ratings/averages (that's the only smart way). the only thing is now, the rating is done via a simple aggregate function, whereas doing something more complicated will require some coldfusion logic and two trips to the database. just some thoughts, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 19 20:26:17 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sat Jan 19 20:26:17 2002 Subject: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: Message-ID: martin, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Martin > > A thought - in the next redesign, do you think we should > move towards Dublin Core metadata? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< from what i've read, i don't see the point of dublin core metadata. it would be one thing if anybody out there supported it, but that's just not the case. seems like work for zero return. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > And feeding it into the Search? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< explain. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 19 20:27:44 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sat Jan 19 20:27:44 2002 Subject: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: <01c1a14e$977f2de0$114d149a@rudy> Message-ID: rudy, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: rudy > > does our article search search both synopsis and > contents? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< no, it currently only searches the synopsis because you can't perform a LIKE on a long datatype. hopefully moving towards a clob will solve this shortfall. either way it doesn't really matter because i have some ideas regarding search for v3.0 anyway. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Sat Jan 19 20:39:44 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Sat Jan 19 20:39:44 2002 Subject: Searching .. Re: [thesite] meta description References: Message-ID: <012901c1a15c$11dddb60$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Brings up a point .. are we going to work towards searching the clobs now that Dean's done the main content table as a test on t.e.o. What needs to be done to now search this field? Indexing via IntermediaText (or whatever it was called, Dean?)? How many queries need to change? To what extent? Does the amount of effort required outweigh the benefits? What other testing/debugging should be done on t.e.o. before we say we are comfortable with the changeover from long to clob field? I don't think we've stumbled across any bugs, aside from one that Dean fixed already (and that wasn't really a bug but a missing PK (or FK) on the new content table). Should we consider also changing comments to clobs so that the content can be searched as well? Is this something we want to pursue in the interim before v.3? (Personally, I think so, but I don't know exactly what we need to do to make it work.) Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: ".jeff" | no, it currently only searches the synopsis because you can't perform a LIKE | on a long datatype. hopefully moving towards a clob will solve this | shortfall. either way it doesn't really matter because i have some ideas | regarding search for v3.0 anyway. | From jeff at members.evolt.org Sat Jan 19 20:59:39 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sat Jan 19 20:59:39 2002 Subject: Searching .. Re: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: <012901c1a15c$11dddb60$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > Brings up a point .. are we going to work towards > searching the clobs now that Dean's done the main > content table as a test on t.e.o. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i see no reason not to. it solves problems now without causing problems later. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > What needs to be done to now search this field? Indexing > via IntermediaText (or whatever it was called, Dean?)? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< not sure, dean? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > How many queries need to change? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< ostensibly only the article search and comment search queries. the more i think about it though the more i'd like to just integrate the two into a single search, but that's a different discussion altogether. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > To what extent? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< supposedly just by referencing those columns with a CONTAINS clause. dean? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Does the amount of effort required outweigh the > benefits? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< well, it'd make our searches 1000% more accurate so i think it's worth it. here's a question though, what's the performance like? dean? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > What other testing/debugging should be done on t.e.o. > before we say we are comfortable with the changeover > from long to clob field? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< well, the most important would be whether or not it actually improves our searchability or not. if it doesn't then i see no point in putting in the effort to make that change. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Should we consider also changing comments to clobs so > that the content can be searched as well? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< if it makes articles searchable, then yes. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Is this something we want to pursue in the interim > before v.3? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i think so. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From mwarden at mattwarden.com Sun Jan 20 01:51:19 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Sun Jan 20 01:51:19 2002 Subject: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Jan 19, .jeff had something to say about RE: [thesite] meta description >rudy, > >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >> From: rudy >> >> does our article search search both synopsis and >> contents? >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > >no, it currently only searches the synopsis because you can't perform a LIKE >on a long datatype. hopefully moving towards a clob will solve this >shortfall. either way it doesn't really matter because i have some ideas >regarding search for v3.0 anyway. you can't perform a LIKE on a CLOB either. In fact, as i understand it, there is more support for searching LONGs than there is for searching LOBs. To search a LOB, you need a package called DBMS_LOB (not 100% sure on the name, but it's something like that). -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From mwarden at mattwarden.com Sun Jan 20 02:01:05 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Sun Jan 20 02:01:05 2002 Subject: Searching .. Re: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Jan 19, .jeff had something to say about RE: Searching .. Re: [thesite]... >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >> To what extent? >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > >supposedly just by referencing those columns with a CONTAINS clause. dean? i was under the impression CONTAINS was for text columns: http://info-it.umsystem.edu/oradocs/doc/server/doc/CO20APP/ch02.htm#use1step http://info-it.umsystem.edu/oradocs/doc/server/doc/CO20APP/ch10.htm#fnccntn -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From richard.b at gritechnologies.com Mon Jan 21 07:26:12 2002 From: richard.b at gritechnologies.com (Richard Bennett) Date: Mon Jan 21 07:26:12 2002 Subject: [thesite] a few articles comments Message-ID: <0e7a01c1a27e$c3e22000$0100a8c0@wwwv7zwbf035xj> Hi all, while reading evolt articles, and sending the URL's to a friend for reference, I noticed a few things: Firstly, it would be really nice if the font-size could be increased in IE5+, preferably using the browser-option, or with a link on the page. I'm not blind - but on a smaller screen, running a high resolution, it's hardly readable. As usability is always promoted fervently on theList, I was surprised to find font-size had been fixed. Using Mozilla font-size can be increased, and the layout looked great, so I guess points have been used instead of pixels. Why not use ems, and let all browsers resize? secondly, URLs: This is one article: http://evolt.org/project_management_glossary/ and this is another: http://evolt.org/article/The_Tao_of_Testing/20/4142/index.html So I thought, this would also work: http://evolt.org/The_Tao_of_Testing/ but it doesn't, and the strange thing is, in the search page it shows, the article in question is not found by the search. Just a few comments. Richard. From ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk Mon Jan 21 08:11:48 2002 From: ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk (Simon Coggins) Date: Mon Jan 21 08:11:48 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory Message-ID: Hi evolters, As many of you will know, I've been responsible for looking after the evolt.org directory subsite. Lately I have been thinking about the direction it should be taken in the future. This project has really been "my baby" up until now, in that I've retained control over the code and approving links in the database. While I would be happy to continue to do this, I don't feel that it really takes advantage of one of evolt's greatest strengths - the fact that we have a community of web developers with a wide range of different skills and ideas. With that thought in mind, I have produced an outline document designed to sketch out some improvements that I think are important for the next version of the directory. The planned changes should allow many evolt members to assist in the care and expansion of the directory in their own particular field of interest/expertise. I hope that this policy of collaboration will be reflected in the way that the new version is built - so all you PHP/MySQL junkies out there, please get in touch if you're interested in helping. The production guide can be found at: http://members.evolt.org/directory/docs/guide.html It's already fairly long I'm afraid, but just skimming the Introduction and Production Aims sections should give you an idea what I have in mind. What I'm looking for now is feedback. If you can find the time to have a look at the guide and let me know what you think I would appreciate it. If you're interested in getting involved with some of the coding - that's fantastic. Just post to thesite or email me offlist and I'll make a note of your email address and what you're interested in doing. All comments are welcome, but if you can start with general comments rather than suggestions on some of the specific issues that are discussed in the guide that would be great. I plan to pose the more specific questions to thesite over the next couple of weeks to allow each of them to be discussed in more detail. Finally, on a more personal note, I should say that this is the first time I've attempted to initiate a collaborative effort like this over the internet and I'm not doubting that I'm going to make a few mistakes. Any suggestions or advice about the whole process would be greatly appreciated. Simon From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Jan 21 10:00:20 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Jan 21 10:00:20 2002 Subject: Searching .. Re: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: from "Warden, Matt" at Jan 20, 2002 03:02:14 AM Message-ID: <200201211602.JAA01453@alice.monkeyland.ca> You're reading old documentation for Oracle7's ConText option. In Oracle8i things have changed. The option is now called interMedia Text. LONG datatypes are deprecated and will be phased out of future Oracle releases, at least that's the threat. In general, Oracle doesn't have a TEXT datatype. Any field text-like column can be indexed by interMedia Text, i.e. VARCHAR, CHAR, CLOB, and for backward-compatibility, LONG. Dean Warden, Matt writes: > >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > >> To what extent? > >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > > >supposedly just by referencing those columns with a CONTAINS clause. dean? > > i was under the impression CONTAINS was for text columns: > > > http://info-it.umsystem.edu/oradocs/doc/server/doc/CO20APP/ch02.htm#use1step > http://info-it.umsystem.edu/oradocs/doc/server/doc/CO20APP/ch10.htm#fnccntn > From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Jan 21 10:03:25 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Jan 21 10:03:25 2002 Subject: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: from "Warden, Matt" at Jan 20, 2002 02:52:27 AM Message-ID: <200201211605.JAA01468@alice.monkeyland.ca> DBMS_LOB is a standard Oracle package. I use it currently to search the tip bodies. It's as simple as adding: DBMS_LOB.INSTR(column, search_string) <> 0 to your queries. Unforuntately, this is a case-sensitive search. You can't search LONGs, as far as I know, without creating your own PL/SQL stored procedure or using either Oracle7's ConText option or Oracle8+'s interMedia Text. Dean Warden, Matt writes: > On Jan 19, .jeff had something to say about RE: [thesite] meta description > > >rudy, > > > >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > >> From: rudy > >> > >> does our article search search both synopsis and > >> contents? > >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > > >no, it currently only searches the synopsis because you can't > >perform a LIKE on a long datatype. hopefully moving towards a clob > >will solve this shortfall. either way it doesn't really matter > >because i have some ideas regarding search for v3.0 anyway. > > you can't perform a LIKE on a CLOB either. In fact, as i understand > it, there is more support for searching LONGs than there is for > searching LOBs. To search a LOB, you need a package called DBMS_LOB > (not 100% sure on the name, but it's something like that). From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Jan 21 10:05:08 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Jan 21 10:05:08 2002 Subject: Searching .. Re: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: <012901c1a15c$11dddb60$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> from "Michele Foster" at Jan 19, 2002 09:42:14 PM Message-ID: <200201211607.JAA01480@alice.monkeyland.ca> Michele Foster writes: > What needs to be done to now search this field? Indexing via > IntermediaText (or whatever it was called, Dean?)? Correct. We would need to index the fields each time they were updated or data was inserted into the CONTENT table. Don't know how long the indexing takes, I haven't done it. Dean From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Jan 21 10:10:22 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Jan 21 10:10:22 2002 Subject: Searching .. Re: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: from ".jeff" at Jan 19, 2002 07:02:02 PM Message-ID: <200201211612.JAA01500@alice.monkeyland.ca> To make this happen: 1) We need to install interMedia Text and index the content. 2) We also need to trigger a re-index when new data is added or updated and/or schedule periodic re-indexing of the table. 3) We need to change or add a CONTAINS clause to the search queries. At this point, I'm not sure what the performance will be like in either the indexing or the querying phase. Also, I'm not sure of the physical disk capacity required. Dean .jeff writes: > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > From: Michele Foster > > > > Brings up a point .. are we going to work towards > > searching the clobs now that Dean's done the main > > content table as a test on t.e.o. > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > i see no reason not to. it solves problems now without causing problems > later. > > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > What needs to be done to now search this field? Indexing > > via IntermediaText (or whatever it was called, Dean?)? > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > not sure, dean? > > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > How many queries need to change? > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > ostensibly only the article search and comment search queries. the more i > think about it though the more i'd like to just integrate the two into a > single search, but that's a different discussion altogether. > > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > To what extent? > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > supposedly just by referencing those columns with a CONTAINS clause. dean? > > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > Does the amount of effort required outweigh the > > benefits? > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > well, it'd make our searches 1000% more accurate so i think it's worth it. > > here's a question though, what's the performance like? dean? From michele at wordpro.on.ca Mon Jan 21 10:18:41 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Mon Jan 21 10:18:41 2002 Subject: Searching .. Re: [thesite] meta description References: <200201211612.JAA01500@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <002801c1a297$964d6320$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> The playground is yours ... :) Should be interesting to see the results. I hope teo can hold up. I'd prefer not a trigger, but rather a timed schedule. But that can be determined better based on how long it takes and what happens while the content is being indexed. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dean Mah" | To make this happen: | | 1) We need to install interMedia Text and index the content. | | 2) We also need to trigger a re-index when new data is added or | updated and/or schedule periodic re-indexing of the table. | | 3) We need to change or add a CONTAINS clause to the search queries. | | At this point, I'm not sure what the performance will be like in | either the indexing or the querying phase. Also, I'm not sure of the | physical disk capacity required. | | Dean From mrg at members.evolt.org Mon Jan 21 11:02:54 2002 From: mrg at members.evolt.org (matt g.) Date: Mon Jan 21 11:02:54 2002 Subject: [thesite] something about this email Message-ID: I sent this twice on Wednesday, once on Thursday, and it's never made it through.... (fingers crossed this time) Hi, on weo when you click on the submit articles link (sidebar), and are not logged-in, you get this: > error? > ?unauthorized access > ? > You must be logged in to use this resource. Please use your username in the > form on the right to log in. If you don't have a username, register today! and a bunch of empty space. It seems pretty abrupt/harsh for something which is accessible from the home page and seeks to encourage contribution/participation. It seems more natural to say 'you gotta log-in' plus offer up Amanda's article about writing articles for evolt on the *same* page. If that's do-able anyway - there could at least be a link to the article there, yes? I really like the author info blocks, by the way. matt g. From michele at wordpro.on.ca Mon Jan 21 11:10:04 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Mon Jan 21 11:10:04 2002 Subject: [thesite] something about this email References: Message-ID: <004a01c1a29e$c630bd60$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hi Matt, ----- Original Message ----- From: "matt g." | I sent this twice on Wednesday, once on Thursday, and it's never made it | through.... (fingers crossed this time) Yeah, for some reason your message was held up in the queue awaiting approval. I've no idea why tho. I know Dan's been playing with filters on thelist, maybe there's something on this list too. | | Hi, | on weo when you click on the submit articles link (sidebar), and are not | logged-in, you get this: | | > error | > unauthorized access | > | > You must be logged in to use this resource. Please use your username in the | > form on the right to log in. If you don't have a username, register today! | | and a bunch of empty space. It seems pretty abrupt/harsh for something which | is accessible from the home page and seeks to encourage | contribution/participation. hehe .. true dat. | | It seems more natural to say 'you gotta log-in' plus offer up Amanda's | article about writing articles for evolt on the *same* page. If that's | do-able anyway - there could at least be a link to the article there, yes? A link is do-able. Let's come up with some better text for that page... *thinking* Mich From michele at wordpro.on.ca Mon Jan 21 11:24:08 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Mon Jan 21 11:24:08 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory References: Message-ID: <006001c1a2a0$bc7473a0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> (this may arrive twice .. oops, trying to figure out what's up) Hi Simon, That's an awesome piece of documentation. Excellent work, very clear and concise. As far as I can tell, your biggest hurdle will be the user authentication and linking to the existing weo user table. (Hint, we need to get back on track with ueue and decide what we're going to do, what will work, etc.) I'm not sure there are plans to allow the subsites to use user-selected (or created) stylesheets. However, it is still a good idea to think that may be the case one day and plan/develop accordingly. Currently, on theforum, discussions are underway with respect to the overall evolt IA and for redesigning the evolt site and sub-sites (I presume). I bring this up as a *warning* that we all have to be sure that information flows through to thesite, so that those developing projects are aware of what's going on and that they can plan accordingly. I don't want to halt production on anything while the evolt IA and redesign are being discussed on another list, I just want to make sure everyone is aware of what's going on. One final point .. is the survey results. To the question, Do you use the directory (found at directory.evolt.org). Of 616 respondents, 434 answered this question. Of them, 24.2% (105) said Yes, while 75.8% (329) said No. In my mind, those numbers are significant. I think it might be a worthwhile exercise to come up with plans of action to make deo more usable/useful to the members. I don't want to discourage the work done, and proposed, please don't get me wrong. I just want to bring it up and make sure that we make informed decisions. So, it might be a good idea to step back a bit and discuss deo in greater detail on theforum. Assess what we have, what's proposed and then make a decision whether the project is worth keeping, expanding upon or abandoning. Again, I don't want to discourage at all.. personally, I like deo and think it is very useful. However, the numbers seem to indicate otherwise. And, its very possible the only reason for those numbers the way they are, is because people don't know it exists. But, let's discuss it and decide how to proceed. Michele ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Coggins" | The production guide can be found at: | | http://members.evolt.org/directory/docs/guide.html | From michele at wordpro.on.ca Mon Jan 21 11:33:18 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Mon Jan 21 11:33:18 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory References: Message-ID: <002f01c1a29c$c2b934c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hi Simon, That's an awesome piece of documentation. Excellent work, very clear and concise. As far as I can tell, your biggest hurdle will be the user authentication and linking to the existing weo user table. (Hint, we need to get back on track with ueue and decide what we're going to do, what will work, etc.) I'm not sure there are plans to allow the subsites to use user-selected (or created) stylesheets. However, it is still a good idea to think that may be the case one day and plan/develop accordingly. Currently, on theforum, discussions are underway with respect to the overall evolt IA and for redesigning the evolt site and sub-sites (I presume). I bring this up as a *warning* that we all have to be sure that information flows through to thesite, so that those developing projects are aware of what's going on and that they can plan accordingly. I don't want to halt production on anything while the evolt IA and redesign are being discussed on another list, I just want to make sure everyone is aware of what's going on. One final point .. is the survey results. To the question, Do you use the directory (found at directory.evolt.org). Of 616 respondents, 434 answered this question. Of them, 24.2% (105) said Yes, while 75.8% (329) said No. In my mind, those numbers are significant. I think it might be a worthwhile exercise to come up with plans of action to make deo more usable/useful to the members. I don't want to discourage the work done, and proposed, please don't get me wrong. I just want to bring it up and make sure that we make informed decisions. So, it might be a good idea to step back a bit and discuss deo in greater detail on theforum. Assess what we have, what's proposed and then make a decision whether the project is worth keeping, expanding upon or abandoning. Again, I don't want to discourage at all.. personally, I like deo and think it is very useful. However, the numbers seem to indicate otherwise. And, its very possible the only reason for those numbers the way they are, is because people don't know it exists. But, let's discuss it and decide how to proceed. Michele ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Coggins" | The production guide can be found at: | | http://members.evolt.org/directory/docs/guide.html | From ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk Mon Jan 21 11:54:08 2002 From: ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk (Simon Coggins) Date: Mon Jan 21 11:54:08 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory In-Reply-To: <002f01c1a29c$c2b934c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: > One final point .. is the survey results. To the question, Do you use the > directory (found at directory.evolt.org). Of 616 respondents, 434 answered > this question. Of them, 24.2% (105) said Yes, while 75.8% (329) said No. > > In my mind, those numbers are significant. I think it might be a worthwhile > exercise to come up with plans of action to make deo more usable/useful to > the members. I'm totally with you on this. Even personally, I have to confess that the directory is hardly an invaluable resource to me. Occasionally I'll search it for something I know exists but can't remember the url, but that's about it. I was of the opinion that perhaps the number of links/categories would need to reach a 'critical mass' (in terms of size) before things really took off. That's why I think having many admins each looking after their own category is an important step. I hope it would increase the number and improve the quality of the links. But perhaps that's not enough to make it truely useful. I'll start a thread on theforum as you suggest and see what everyone else thinks. Thanks for the feedback Michele, it's just the sort of thing I was looking for. Simon P.S. Incidently, if anyone's interested in how the directory's grow since it was created, I've made a quick graph here: http://members.evolt.org/simonc/images/deo-stats-21-01-02.gif (x-axis is slightly incorrect but you get the idea) From jeff at members.evolt.org Mon Jan 21 12:56:09 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Mon Jan 21 12:56:09 2002 Subject: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: <200201211605.JAA01468@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: dean, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Dean Mah > > DBMS_LOB is a standard Oracle package. I use it > currently to search the tip bodies. It's as simple > as adding: > > DBMS_LOB.INSTR(column, search_string) <> 0 > > to your queries. Unforuntately, this is a > case-sensitive search. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< can you force it to a case-insensitive search by wrapping the column reference with a Lower() function? for example: DBMS_LOB.INSTR(Lower(column), '#LCase(search_string)#') <> 0 thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Mon Jan 21 13:00:06 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Mon Jan 21 13:00:06 2002 Subject: Searching .. Re: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: <200201211612.JAA01500@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: dean, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Dean Mah > > 1) We need to install interMedia Text and index the > content. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< can we get that column indexed now so i can start fooling around with the search functionality? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > 2) We also need to trigger a re-index when new data is > added or updated and/or schedule periodic re-indexing > of the table. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< can we set this up as a trigger when the content column is updated? or, perhaps we can set it up as a stored procedure i can call from coldfusion whenever the content is updated. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > 3) We need to change or add a CONTAINS clause to the > search queries. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< do you have any links handy that show how to use the CONTAINS clause? thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From lists at mantruc.com Mon Jan 21 13:48:26 2002 From: lists at mantruc.com (javier velasco) Date: Mon Jan 21 13:48:26 2002 Subject: [thesite] w.e.o. down? Message-ID: <3C4C70A6.93B1EC0C@mantruc.com> l.e.o. OK m.e.o. OK t.e.o. OK -- Javier Velasco Information Architect @ Chile Work - http://www.nurun.cl Me - http://mantruc.com Family - http://evolt.org From michele at wordpro.on.ca Mon Jan 21 13:50:44 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Mon Jan 21 13:50:44 2002 Subject: [thesite] Status Updates on Various Projects Message-ID: <00b101c1a2b5$36642e80$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hi Folks .... I'd like to assess what's being worked on, what's being held pending whatever, and progress/status of the various evolt projects. We're pretty much *done* with the original CodeFest list of tasks .. most items have been completed or abandoned, and there are a few additional features for weo still to work on. Essentially, everything is done. (1) d.e.o. - See Simon's message he sent out this morning. Further discussion on the project as a whole on theforum. (2) f.e.o. - Matt's what the status of f.e.o.? Are you waiting for ueue? Can f.e.o. progress in the interim? (3) ueue - Mark .. what's up? Have you settled on a plan for this? Does it meet all of our needs/concerns? Can we proceed? Do you need help from others, if so what and who? (4) voting application - Jeff and Isaac, any progress on this? Do you guys, realistically, have time to work on this project? Would it be better to hand this off to other volunteers to work on? (5) a.e.o. - On the shelf for the time being .. the email portion works and meets our needs/requirements. All the other features are on hold pending further evaluation of what we want, need and comparing other open source software to meet our needs. (6) Member Pages - first thing to do is define a "user" vs. a "member". I dunno why Rudy thinks I should do this .. hehe, but what the heck .. I'll give it a go. (Future post soon.) I've cc'd this message to Greg S. and Jeremy S. .. did you guys come up with any design options/solutions for the member pages? Can you send me the info/urls please. What else? Not taking into account evolt IA and redesign. TIA for the updates Mich From ben_dyer at imaginuity.com Mon Jan 21 13:57:18 2002 From: ben_dyer at imaginuity.com (Ben Dyer) Date: Mon Jan 21 13:57:18 2002 Subject: [thesite] w.e.o. down? In-Reply-To: <3C4C70A6.93B1EC0C@mantruc.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020121135604.0192e3b8@mail.imaginuity.com> I'm having the same problem...I thought it was me... The last successful node on the tracert is firewall.starkmedia.com... --Ben On 01:48 PM 1/21/2002, javier velasco said to me: >l.e.o. OK >m.e.o. OK >t.e.o. OK Ben Dyer, Senior Internet Developer, Imaginuity Interactive http://www.imaginuity.com/ ----------------------------------------------------------------- http://members.evolt.org/OKolzig37/ http://www.evolt.org/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Mon Jan 21 13:58:55 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Mon Jan 21 13:58:55 2002 Subject: [thesite] w.e.o. down? References: <3C4C70A6.93B1EC0C@mantruc.com> Message-ID: <00bf01c1a2b6$5e710fa0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Yup .. that it is. Have sent messages to Dan and Dean .. we'll get it back soon. :) Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "javier velasco" From r937 at interlog.com Mon Jan 21 14:10:45 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Mon Jan 21 14:10:45 2002 Subject: [thesite] Status Updates on Various Projects Message-ID: <01c1a2b7$f369da00$114d149a@rudy> > (6) Member Pages - first thing to do is define a "user" vs. a "member". > I dunno why Rudy thinks I should do this .. hehe, but what the heck .. > I'll give it a go. (Future post soon.) hi michele the reason i wanted you to do it was because you are such a great documenter, i was hoping to get a succinct statement of the issue but since then there has been a suggestion on the oldtimers' chat list that i write up the "user since" issue and present it on theforum so hang on to your future post, and wait for mine on theforum rudy From r937 at interlog.com Mon Jan 21 15:00:07 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Mon Jan 21 15:00:07 2002 Subject: [thesite] Fw: [XX]: .html, or .htm? - or - .shtml vs .sht? Message-ID: <01c1a2be$d8ea3c40$114d149a@rudy> you know how they say when your site is down it costs you money? well, when our site is down, it costs us new members see attached post from, ahem, another list, by staunch evolt advocate matthowie -----Original Message----- From: Matthew Haughey Date: January 21, 2002 15:28 Subject: RE: [WD]: .html, or .htm? - or - .shtml vs .sht? >>Also, shorter URLs are perhaps easier to remember? (for developers, I guess) >>(while the difference here is only one letter, it really adds up when you >>see a url like: >>http://www.domain.com/index.asp?searchString=just%20testing§ion=2&pro duc >>tID=2291&sessionID=267381522636 .. >>instead of >>http://www.domain.com/index.asp?ss=just%20testing&s=2&pID=2291&sID=267381 522 >>636 .. >> >>(every character does add up.. 'especially if you hate to scroll through the >>address/url field in your browser looking for a particular variable..) > >This problem is separate from filename schemes, and I would suggest looking >into server-side rewrite tricks to shorten your urls as much as possible >(note that both examples wrapped). It's well covered here: > >http://www.alistapart.com/stories/urls/index.html > >and there is a windows/IIS port of apache's rewrite here: >http://www.pstruh.cz/help/urlrepl/library.htm > >and a different approach with php: >http://www.alistapart.com/stories/succeed/ > >There are also a bunch of articles at evolt.org (I'd include them but I >can't seem to reach the site right now), about "search engine friendly URLs" > >Matt From r937 at interlog.com Mon Jan 21 15:28:50 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Mon Jan 21 15:28:50 2002 Subject: [thesite] meta description Message-ID: <01c1a2c2$dc5e3080$114d149a@rudy> > Date: January 21, 2002 11:04 dean, what's up with your email taking 5 hours to be delivered? rudy From mwarden at mattwarden.com Mon Jan 21 15:56:57 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Mon Jan 21 15:56:57 2002 Subject: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Jan 21, .jeff had something to say about RE: [thesite] meta description >dean, > >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >> From: Dean Mah >> >> DBMS_LOB is a standard Oracle package. I use it >> currently to search the tip bodies. It's as simple >> as adding: >> >> DBMS_LOB.INSTR(column, search_string) <> 0 >> >> to your queries. Unforuntately, this is a >> case-sensitive search. >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > >can you force it to a case-insensitive search by wrapping the column >reference with a Lower() function? for example: > >DBMS_LOB.INSTR(Lower(column), '#LCase(search_string)#') <> 0 no, i tried that a few days ago when i was playing around with dbms_lob on the test db. it gives an invalid type message of some sort. I guess you can't use LOWER() on that type of field. hth, -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From mwarden at mattwarden.com Mon Jan 21 16:11:10 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Mon Jan 21 16:11:10 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: weo's down? Message-ID: we're back up -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From elfur at elfur.is Mon Jan 21 16:32:10 2002 From: elfur at elfur.is (Elfur Logadottir) Date: Mon Jan 21 16:32:10 2002 Subject: [thesite] a few articles comments References: <0e7a01c1a27e$c3e22000$0100a8c0@wwwv7zwbf035xj> Message-ID: <0f9701c1a2cb$910a80d0$0100a8c0@DWARFS> From: "Richard Bennett" hi richard, | Firstly, it would be really nice if the font-size could be increased in | IE5+, preferably using the browser-option, or with a link on the page. | I'm not blind - but on a smaller screen, running a high resolution, it's | hardly readable. | As usability is always promoted fervently on theList, I was surprised to | find font-size had been fixed. yes, this was a decision made 18 months ago, when the NN 4.X numbers where higher and degradability therefor more important than it might be today. as you probably know, there is a version 3 in the works (still working on the blueprint though) and this is one of the things that will be tackled there. | secondly, URLs: | This is one article: | http://evolt.org/project_management_glossary/ | | and this is another: | http://evolt.org/article/The_Tao_of_Testing/20/4142/index.html | | So I thought, this would also work: | http://evolt.org/The_Tao_of_Testing/ | | but it doesn't, and the strange thing is, in the search page it shows, the | article in question is not found by the search. the difference between the two articles and the reason this short version works with one and not the other is simple: key phrase. we implemented the key phrase concept some months back, and with that, the administrators of submitted articles can apply key phrases to articles. Sometimes the key phrase is the same as the title (as is with the project management glossary) but sometimes it isn't (as with the tao of testing) so the 'shortcut' to the tao of testing is actually http://evolt.org/testing/ all the same, i agree with you that the article should of course be found in the search part of the url system. and that's where someone with higher technical knowledge of our site has to step in and explain to you. thanks elfur From elfur at elfur.is Mon Jan 21 16:37:45 2002 From: elfur at elfur.is (Elfur Logadottir) Date: Mon Jan 21 16:37:45 2002 Subject: [thesite] a few articles comments References: <0e7a01c1a27e$c3e22000$0100a8c0@wwwv7zwbf035xj> <0f9701c1a2cb$910a80d0$0100a8c0@DWARFS> Message-ID: <0f9d01c1a2cc$a087ffa0$0100a8c0@DWARFS> From: "Elfur Logadottir" | all the same, i agree with you that the article should of course be found in the | search part of the url system. and that's where someone with higher technical | knowledge of our site has to step in and explain to you. adding to my own reply ... the tao of testing is found in the search, but it's no. 166 (http://evolt.org/search/index.html?keywords=The%20Tao%20of%20Testing&option=any &tid=0&synopsis=0&startrow=161&maxrows=10) which is of course because the default search setting is 'any word' and a lot of articles probably include the words 'the', 'of' and 'testing', even if few include tao. makes me wonder if we maybe should first try 'all words' and if not found then 'any words' ... but then, that slows things down .... hmm ... again, this is for someone with a little more technical knowledge of the structure we're using ... jeff, over to you. thanks elfur From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Jan 21 21:06:05 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Jan 21 21:06:05 2002 Subject: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: from "Warden, Matt" at Jan 21, 2002 04:58:16 PM Message-ID: <200201220308.UAA04141@alice.monkeyland.ca> Correct. You can't do functions on LONG datatypes. One of the many restrictions. Dean Warden, Matt writes: > >can you force it to a case-insensitive search by wrapping the column > >reference with a Lower() function? for example: > > > >DBMS_LOB.INSTR(Lower(column), '#LCase(search_string)#') <> 0 > > no, i tried that a few days ago when i was playing around with > dbms_lob on the test db. it gives an invalid type message of some > sort. I guess you can't use LOWER() on that type of field. From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Jan 21 21:07:49 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Jan 21 21:07:49 2002 Subject: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: <01c1a2c2$dc5e3080$114d149a@rudy> from "rudy" at Jan 21, 2002 04:30:34 PM Message-ID: <200201220309.UAA04152@alice.monkeyland.ca> Ummm... not sure what you mean. I saw my posts right away. Or do you mean why am I posting at such a late time? I've been a little behind lately. Celebrated 3 year anniversary on the weekend and am slowly catching up with everything. Dean rudy writes: > > Date: January 21, 2002 11:04 > > dean, what's up with your email taking 5 hours to be delivered? > > rudy From tiedefenderdelta6 at yahoo.com Mon Jan 21 21:44:18 2002 From: tiedefenderdelta6 at yahoo.com (Lachlan Cannon) Date: Mon Jan 21 21:44:18 2002 Subject: [thesite] something about this email In-Reply-To: <004a01c1a29e$c630bd60$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <20020122034538.23792.qmail@web12301.mail.yahoo.com> --- Michele Foster wrote: > | Hi, > | on weo when you click on the submit articles link > (sidebar), and are not > | logged-in, you get this: > | > | > error > | > unauthorized access > | > > | > You must be logged in to use this resource. Please > use your username in > the > | > form on the right to log in. If you don't have a > username, register > today! > | > | and a bunch of empty space. It seems pretty > abrupt/harsh for something > which > | is accessible from the home page and seeks to encourage > | contribution/participation. > > hehe .. true dat. > > > | > | It seems more natural to say 'you gotta log-in' plus > offer up Amanda's > | article about writing articles for evolt on the *same* > page. If that's > | do-able anyway - there could at least be a link to the > article there, yes? > > A link is do-able. Let's come up with some better text > for that page... > *thinking* How about something like "Sorry, only registered evolt members are able to submit articles. If you are a member, remember to log in via the form on the right. If you aren't a member yet, why not sign up now?" then list reasons why signing up would be good "Thankyou for coming to write an article. The evolt community thrives thanks to people like you! While you're signing in, why not read the " link to writing style " and "link to acceptable code use "guidelines?" ??? Lach __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ From tiedefenderdelta6 at yahoo.com Mon Jan 21 21:48:09 2002 From: tiedefenderdelta6 at yahoo.com (Lachlan Cannon) Date: Mon Jan 21 21:48:09 2002 Subject: [thesite] a few articles comments In-Reply-To: <0f9d01c1a2cc$a087ffa0$0100a8c0@DWARFS> Message-ID: <20020122034930.36851.qmail@web12305.mail.yahoo.com> > which is of course because the default search setting is > 'any word' and a lot of > articles probably include the words 'the', 'of' and > 'testing', even if few > include tao. > > makes me wonder if we maybe should first try 'all words' > and if not found then > 'any words' Or why not do google's thing and cut out commonly used words such as the and of and a from the search? I'm sure testing and tao alone searched would provide much more relevant results.. Lach __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Jan 21 22:56:23 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Jan 21 22:56:23 2002 Subject: Searching .. Re: [thesite] meta description In-Reply-To: from ".jeff" at Jan 21, 2002 11:02:35 AM Message-ID: <200201220458.VAA04549@alice.monkeyland.ca> I have installed IMT and have indexed the BODY column of the CONTENT table. Building the index took about a minute and a half. It'll probably be shorter to re-index since the entire thing will not be re-created. You can also create indexes online so the table can be queried while index building is taking place. We can set up a trigger or a stored proc. to do the re-indexing. Take a look at: http://www.orafaq.org/faqctx.htm http://desktop.msfc.nasa.gov/oracle815doc/inter.815/a67843/toc.htm Dean .jeff writes: > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > From: Dean Mah > > > > 1) We need to install interMedia Text and index the > > content. > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > can we get that column indexed now so i can start fooling around with the > search functionality? > > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > 2) We also need to trigger a re-index when new data is > > added or updated and/or schedule periodic re-indexing > > of the table. > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > can we set this up as a trigger when the content column is updated? or, > perhaps we can set it up as a stored procedure i can call from coldfusion > whenever the content is updated. > > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > 3) We need to change or add a CONTAINS clause to the > > search queries. > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > do you have any links handy that show how to use the CONTAINS clause? From Ron.Luther at compaq.com Tue Jan 22 09:19:48 2002 From: Ron.Luther at compaq.com (Luther, Ron) Date: Tue Jan 22 09:19:48 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? Message-ID: <8958135993102D479F1CA2351F370A060145F46C@cceexc17.americas.cpqcorp.net> Hi folks, Just a quick note ... If you do a 'trim mean' ... just be sure that you trim both tails ... E.g. For a "10% trim mean" you throw out the 5% lowest scores *and* the 5% highest scores ... it's a 'balance' thing. RonL. (Yup - The arithmatic mean is just one "measure of centrality" ... there are many others ... median and mode to name two that may be readily available in many standard packages of math/stat functions. {Sorry - don't have any documentation handy - Is median a standard CF function? - that would probably take care of this pretty simply.}) -----Original Message----- ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Martin > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Or even to disregard outliers when calculating the mean > (it's a common statistical methodology) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i like that idea as well though that calculation will be much more difficult to perform. .jeff From r937 at interlog.com Tue Jan 22 10:36:33 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Tue Jan 22 10:36:33 2002 Subject: [thesite] Fw: [XX]: .html, or .htm? - or - .shtml vs .sht? Message-ID: <01c1a363$36997140$7b50149a@rudy> dunno why this didn't go through yesterday resending gives me the opportunity to correct the spelling of "mathowie" -----Original Message----- From: rudy To: thesite at lists.evolt.org Date: January 21, 2002 16:01 Subject: Fw: [XX]: .html, or .htm? - or - .shtml vs .sht? >you know how they say when your site is down it costs you money? > >well, when our site is down, it costs us new members > >see attached post from, ahem, another list, by staunch evolt advocate >matthowie > > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Matthew Haughey >Date: January 21, 2002 15:28 >Subject: RE: [WD]: .html, or .htm? - or - .shtml vs .sht? > >>>Also, shorter URLs are perhaps easier to remember? (for developers, I >guess) >>>(while the difference here is only one letter, it really adds up when you >>>see a url like: >>>http://www.domain.com/index.asp?searchString=just%20testing§ion=2&pr o >duc >>>tID=2291&sessionID=267381522636 .. >>>instead of >>>http://www.domain.com/index.asp?ss=just%20testing&s=2&pID=2291&sID=26738 1 >522 >>>636 .. >>> >>>(every character does add up.. 'especially if you hate to scroll through >the >>>address/url field in your browser looking for a particular variable..) >> >>This problem is separate from filename schemes, and I would suggest >looking >>into server-side rewrite tricks to shorten your urls as much as possible >>(note that both examples wrapped). It's well covered here: >> >>http://www.alistapart.com/stories/urls/index.html >> >>and there is a windows/IIS port of apache's rewrite here: >>http://www.pstruh.cz/help/urlrepl/library.htm >> >>and a different approach with php: >>http://www.alistapart.com/stories/succeed/ >> >>There are also a bunch of articles at evolt.org (I'd include them but I >>can't seem to reach the site right now), about "search engine friendly >URLs" >> >>Matt > > From mccreath at ak.net Tue Jan 22 10:58:48 2002 From: mccreath at ak.net (mccreath) Date: Tue Jan 22 10:58:48 2002 Subject: [thesite] Fw: [XX]: .html, or .htm? - or - .shtml vs .sht? In-Reply-To: <01c1a363$36997140$7b50149a@rudy> Message-ID: It did come through yesterday, rudy. You got ghosts in your machine eating your email or something. http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/2002-January/1565205.html Well, I got it anyway. David > -----Original Message----- > From: rudy > > dunno why this didn't go through yesterday > > resending gives me the opportunity to correct the spelling of "mathowie" From webguru at vsnl.net Tue Jan 22 11:16:37 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Tue Jan 22 11:16:37 2002 Subject: [thesite] Fw: [XX]: .html, or .htm? - or - .shtml vs .sht? In-Reply-To: <01c1a363$36997140$7b50149a@rudy> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020122224455.062a4970@203.197.12.4> At 10:08 PM 1/22/2002, rudy wrote: >dunno why this didn't go through yesterday > >resending gives me the opportunity to correct the spelling of "mathowie" fwiw, I sent a note to that list informing them that our site was back online and where they could find the articles :) Madhu <<< * >>> Madhu Menon User Experience Consultant e-mail: webguru at vsnl.net From webguru at vsnl.net Tue Jan 22 11:16:43 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Tue Jan 22 11:16:43 2002 Subject: [thesite] Fw: [XX]: .html, or .htm? - or - .shtml vs .sht? In-Reply-To: References: <01c1a363$36997140$7b50149a@rudy> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020122224557.06282d70@203.197.12.4> At 10:28 PM 1/22/2002, mccreath wrote: >It did come through yesterday, rudy. You got ghosts in your machine eating >your email or something. > >http://lists.evolt.org/thesitearchive/2002-January/1565205.html > >Well, I got it anyway. Yeah, me too. M From dmah at shaw.ca Tue Jan 22 14:39:06 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Tue Jan 22 14:39:06 2002 Subject: [thesite] WEO Oracle DB Problem Message-ID: <200201222041.NAA02513@alice.monkeyland.ca> Technical junk aimed mainly at Dan, skip if desired. I've been trying to install interMedia Text on the production database. Unfortunately, this has not been going well. Since the prod db is using Oracle 8.1.6 we need to set up Net8 to run external procedures. (This isn't a problem in 8.1.7 which is the test db.) In trying to run the bin/extproc binary, I get: ./extproc: error while loading shared libraries: lib/libagtsh.so: undefined symbol: stat64 which would indicate a linking problem when the executable was created. stat64 is in /usr/lib/libc_nonshared.a, or appears to be. We might want to try re-linking the executables and make sure that libc_nonshared.a is linked. Dan, you mentioned that you needed to hack the Oracle installation, anything related to this? Dean From martin at members.evolt.org Tue Jan 22 15:40:19 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Tue Jan 22 15:40:19 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory In-Reply-To: <002f01c1a29c$c2b934c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <5D891AA2-0F70-11D6-BF37-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> On Monday, January 21, 2002, at 04:57 pm, Michele Foster wrote: > In my mind, those numbers are significant. I think it might be a > worthwhile > exercise to come up with plans of action to make deo more usable/useful > to > the members. I think you're right, but is this a question of "more useful" or "more findable"? Not that they're mutually exclusive. Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From skaiser at skdesigns.com Tue Jan 22 18:08:01 2002 From: skaiser at skdesigns.com (Shirley Kaiser, SKDesigns) Date: Tue Jan 22 18:08:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] evolt.org siting Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020122160837.02a8ea40@pop3.midtown.net> Hey, how's this?! :-) Warmly, Shirley -- Shirley E. Kaiser, M.A. SKDesigns mailto:skaiser at skdesigns.com Website Design, Development http://www.skdesigns.com/ Pianist, Composer http://www.shirleykaiser.com/ Brainstorms and Raves http://www.brainstormsandraves.com/ From djc at members.evolt.org Tue Jan 22 21:58:50 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Tue Jan 22 21:58:50 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: WEO Oracle DB Problem In-Reply-To: <200201222041.NAA02513@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: On Tue, 22 Jan 2002, Dean Mah wrote: > We might want to try re-linking the executables and make sure that > libc_nonshared.a is linked. ya. see below > Dan, you mentioned that you needed to hack the Oracle installation, > anything related to this? ya, versions of 8i have issues with the 2.4 kernels and the glibc versions they usually acoompany. technet.oracle.com provides better answers than i will, but i recall only linking specific binarys, not the whole bunch, so relinking intermedia shoud do the trick. if you want more input, lemme know... (the reason test.e.o works is because the oracle box behind that site is the 2.2.19 kernel, hence no issues with oracle 8.1.7(which *was* our old production DB a couple months ago). if this is a huge issue(intermedia), just lemme know and i'll sacrifice my first child and update oreo to the latest greatest version of 8i :) .djc. From dmah at shaw.ca Tue Jan 22 22:43:04 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Tue Jan 22 22:43:04 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: WEO Oracle DB Problem In-Reply-To: from "Daniel J. Cody" at Jan 22, 2002 09:58:49 PM Message-ID: <200201230445.VAA04443@alice.monkeyland.ca> Daniel J. Cody writes: > ya, versions of 8i have issues with the 2.4 kernels and the glibc > versions they usually acoompany. technet.oracle.com provides better > answers than i will, but i recall only linking specific binarys, not > the whole bunch, so relinking intermedia shoud do the trick. if you > want more input, lemme know... Ummm... I think that you need to do it. I believe that you need access to the install CD or media to relink the binaries. > (the reason test.e.o works is because the oracle box behind that > site is the 2.2.19 kernel, hence no issues with oracle 8.1.7 Actually, Oracle 8.1.7 doesn't require the configuration of Net8 to handle external procedure calls. That version uses an Oracle 'shadow process' to do the indexing. > (which *was* our old production DB a couple months ago). if this is > a huge issue(intermedia), just lemme know and i'll sacrifice my > first child and update oreo to the latest greatest version of 8i :) If we don't use interMedia Text to search the CLOB files, I could investigate writing a stored proc. to do the job. It'd be a lot better to use IMT as it has a lot of features other than just simple searching, e.g., ranking results, grammatical stemming, etc. Dean From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 23 00:40:24 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 23 00:40:24 2002 Subject: [thesite] RE: [admin] RE: Your email to evolt.org 20314 In-Reply-To: <200201230426.g0N4QYhR023525@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: matt, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: mwarden at members.evolt.org > > And I'll have someone look into that grrr-shitting right > away. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< fixed. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk Wed Jan 23 06:08:12 2002 From: ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk (Simon Coggins) Date: Wed Jan 23 06:08:12 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory In-Reply-To: <5D891AA2-0F70-11D6-BF37-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: > > In my mind, those numbers are significant. I think it might be a > > worthwhile exercise to come up with plans of action to make deo more > > usable/useful to the members. > > I think you're right, but is this a question of "more useful" or "more > findable"? Not that they're mutually exclusive. If the directory can be made more useful I think it will get linked to more on thelist in response to certain questions, and therefore will become more findable to some extent. As for making it more useful, I really think the critical thing is for each category to contain plenty of links with good descriptions explaining what the link is about. To back that up here's a quote from someone on theforum: "I don't know about other people, but I don't use the directory because the links are not useful for me. For example, I went there to try and find links for PHP resources. There's 10 links, and of them, I already knew of half, and the other half weren't useful." That, in my mind is the problem. I think the solution is to have editors for each category, which is why I'm hoping to move the code in that direction. Imagine if we had an evolt member who was really into PHP running that category. It wouldn't take a great deal of time for them to come up with a kick-ass list of links on the subject (they probably have loads bookmarked anyway). Simon From miriam at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 23 06:42:58 2002 From: miriam at members.evolt.org (Miriam) Date: Wed Jan 23 06:42:58 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Simon, I think that's a great suggestion; editors as "gardeners" for each area.... growing, pruning, etc... perfect thing for distributed labor. And you're right about the bookmarks, too. I had so many requests for sources that I have a list on my site... I'm sure many others do as well. I'm raising my hand and volunteering to take care of the design, color & typography areas. Can take on more (IA, etc.) if needed. > I think the solution is to have editors > for each category, which is why I'm hoping to move the code in that > direction. Imagine if we had an evolt member who was really into PHP > running that category. It wouldn't take a great deal of time for them to > come up with a kick-ass list of links on the subject (they probably have > loads bookmarked anyway). cheers Miriam -- http://www.dynagirl.com/motherlode.shtml Shamelessly whoring my wiki since 1971 From webguru at vsnl.net Wed Jan 23 09:32:46 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Wed Jan 23 09:32:46 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020123210103.03040bf0@203.197.12.4> At 06:27 PM 1/23/2002, Miriam wrote: >Simon, I think that's a great suggestion; editors as "gardeners" for each >area.... growing, pruning, etc... perfect thing for distributed labor. And >you're right about the bookmarks, too. I had so many requests for sources Hmmm... this seems familiar. :) Oh yeah, I rambled about this on theforum a few months back. If you have the patience, you can read it at: http://lists.evolt.org/theforumarchive/Week-of-Mon-20011105/000450.html (if you're in a hurry, search for "guides" on the page) Regards, Madhu <<< * >>> Madhu "MadMan" Menon Defender of Justice, Destroyer of Evil, and Keeper of the Knowledge Blog: http://madman.weblogs.com From dmah at shaw.ca Wed Jan 23 09:49:56 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Wed Jan 23 09:49:56 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory In-Reply-To: <128901c1a424$94351810$6502a8c0@local.zensoft.net> from "William Anderson" at Jan 23, 2002 03:42:35 PM Message-ID: <200201231551.IAA01945@alice.monkeyland.ca> I've set Chris to nomail on this list. I'll check the other ones as well. Dean William Anderson writes: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mailer-Daemon" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2002 3:34 PM > Subject: NDN: Re: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory > > > > Sorry. Your message could not be delivered to: > > waaa!!!! delete user from list!!!! delete user from list!!!! From Mailer-Daemon at nxco.com Wed Jan 23 09:57:35 2002 From: Mailer-Daemon at nxco.com (Mailer-Daemon) Date: Wed Jan 23 09:57:35 2002 Subject: NDN(6): Re: Re: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory Message-ID: Sorry. Your message could not be delivered to: Chris Zelenak (Mailbox or Conference is full.) From Mailer-Daemon at nxco.com Wed Jan 23 09:57:41 2002 From: Mailer-Daemon at nxco.com (Mailer-Daemon) Date: Wed Jan 23 09:57:41 2002 Subject: NDN(13): Fwd: NDN(5): Re: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory Message-ID: Sorry. Your message could not be delivered to: Chris Zelenak (Mailbox or Conference is full.) From john at userfrenzy.com Wed Jan 23 10:00:42 2002 From: john at userfrenzy.com (John Handelaar) Date: Wed Jan 23 10:00:42 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory In-Reply-To: <128901c1a424$94351810$6502a8c0@local.zensoft.net> References: <128901c1a424$94351810$6502a8c0@local.zensoft.net> Message-ID: <1011801732.2149.0.camel@fidel> On Wed, 2002-01-23 at 15:42, William Anderson wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mailer-Daemon" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2002 3:34 PM > Subject: NDN: Re: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory > > waaa!!!! delete user from list!!!! delete user from list!!!! The user to delete is czelenak at nxco.com (found him on google). -- ------------------------------------------ John Handelaar T +44 20 8933 1494 M +44 7930 681789 F +44 870 169 7657 E john at userfrenzy.com ------------------------------------------ From djc at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 23 10:01:31 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Wed Jan 23 10:01:31 2002 Subject: [thesite] mail bombing.. Message-ID: <3C4EDD52.8020803@members.evolt.org> cleared up from the archives more or less.. thnx for the quick action deano .djc. From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 23 10:43:26 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 23 10:43:26 2002 Subject: [thesite] RE: [admin] RE: Your email to evolt.org 20314 References: Message-ID: <001e01c1a42d$674763e0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Umm.. What was fixed? "Fixed the grrs from shitting" .. is just not going to cut it in the changelog ;) Thanks, Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: ".jeff" | matt, | | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | > From: mwarden at members.evolt.org | > | > And I'll have someone look into that grrr-shitting right | > away. | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | fixed. | | thanks, | | .jeff | | From mantruc at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 23 12:17:25 2002 From: mantruc at members.evolt.org (mantruc) Date: Wed Jan 23 12:17:25 2002 Subject: [thesite] edit profile annoyance Message-ID: <3C4EFE5D.1CB8EA01@members.evolt.org> hi i just went to the edit profile page to change my picture, the box for editing the BIO appeared blank. i assummed that by leaving it untouched it would keep my current information, but it didn't. it just wiped it. i believe if there was a way to show the current bio in that box to alllow the user to refine it would be the best way. i believe it used to work that way, not sure though. TIA From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 23 12:23:55 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 23 12:23:55 2002 Subject: [thesite] edit profile annoyance References: <3C4EFE5D.1CB8EA01@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <00b001c1a43b$74948240$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> hmm.. mine shows up just fine. What browser/OS you using Javi ? I know we're having issues with mac and the photo being renamed incorrectly... but I haven't heard of any probs with the bio. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "mantruc" | hi | | i just went to the edit profile page to change my picture, the box for | editing the BIO appeared blank. i assummed that by leaving it untouched | it would keep my current information, but it didn't. it just wiped it. | | i believe if there was a way to show the current bio in that box to | alllow the user to refine it would be the best way. i believe it used to | work that way, not sure though. From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 23 12:33:52 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 23 12:33:52 2002 Subject: [thesite] RE: [admin] RE: Your email to evolt.org 20314 In-Reply-To: <001e01c1a42d$674763e0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > Umm.. > > What was fixed? > > "Fixed the grrs from shitting" .. is just not going to > cut it in the changelog ;) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< why not? that's what was fixed. ;p .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From roselli at earthlink.net Wed Jan 23 12:42:49 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Wed Jan 23 12:42:49 2002 Subject: [thesite] edit profile annoyance In-Reply-To: <3C4EFE5D.1CB8EA01@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <200201231842.g0NIglhQ030643@leo.evolt.org> > From: mantruc > > i just went to the edit profile page to change my picture, the box for > editing the BIO appeared blank. i assummed that by leaving it > untouched it would keep my current information, but it didn't. it just > wiped it. IE5.x+/wintel shows the content... what browser/platform you on? > i believe if there was a way to show the current bio in that box to > alllow the user to refine it would be the best way. i believe it used > to work that way, not sure though. still does for me... From neuro at well.com Wed Jan 23 13:56:53 2002 From: neuro at well.com (William Anderson) Date: Wed Jan 23 13:56:53 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory References: <200201231551.IAA01945@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <136901c1a430$2804c030$6502a8c0@local.zensoft.net> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dean Mah" To: Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2002 3:51 PM Subject: Re: Re: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory > I've set Chris to nomail on this list. I'll check the other ones as > well. good work that man - mailman does kinda rock -- _ __/| ___ ___ __ _________ "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned \`O_o' / _ \/ -_) // / __/ _ \ for Sega." -- Brodie, 'Mallrats' =(_ _)=/_//_/\__/\_,_/_/ \___/ @ well.com :: William Anderson U - Ack! Phttpt! Thhbbt! http://neuro.wasters.com/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 23 14:19:03 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 23 14:19:03 2002 Subject: [thesite] RE: [admin] RE: Your email to evolt.org 20314 References: Message-ID: <015201c1a44b$8bf3d5c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Smarty .. What page ? or pages ? We might be able to upload the broken page now. I'll add something to changelog now. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: ".jeff" | michele, | | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | > From: Michele Foster | > | > Umm.. | > | > What was fixed? | > | > "Fixed the grrs from shitting" .. is just not going to | > cut it in the changelog ;) | ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< | | why not? that's what was fixed. ;p | | .jeff From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 23 16:05:10 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 23 16:05:10 2002 Subject: [thesite] edit profile annoyance References: <200201231842.g0NIglhQ030643@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <005e01c1a45a$5a91c8c0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> I talked to Javi off list, and he's using WinME, IE 5.5. (He's having mail probs.) He's going to create a new bio and they edit and see if it shows up. Anyone else seeing any problems with the bio text not being displayed in the textarea, when they click to edit their profile? Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "aardvark" | IE5.x+/wintel shows the content... what browser/platform you on? | | > i believe if there was a way to show the current bio in that box to | > alllow the user to refine it would be the best way. i believe it used | > to work that way, not sure though. | | still does for me... From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 23 16:10:37 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 23 16:10:37 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory References: Message-ID: <006501c1a45b$1c614340$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Simon, I agree .. having editors/admins for each section would be very useful. I'll take ASP if no one else volunteers. ;) Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Coggins" | | That, in my mind is the problem. I think the solution is to have editors | for each category, which is why I'm hoping to move the code in that | direction. Imagine if we had an evolt member who was really into PHP | running that category. It wouldn't take a great deal of time for them to | come up with a kick-ass list of links on the subject (they probably have | loads bookmarked anyway). From r937 at interlog.com Wed Jan 23 16:18:11 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Wed Jan 23 16:18:11 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [admin] Grrr! - Comment Complaint - 23-Jan-2002 Message-ID: <01c1a45c$1f88f3a0$894e149a@rudy> from the admin list, where something is happening with grrrs... .jeff: > i think there are certain categories that the ability to rate > should be removed -- news, community news, faq, and jobs. +1 this is the "subject to rating" attribute for the article category entity: probably it will be another column in the CATTYPE table, but a few more of these, and we may need a separate table jeff, showing/hiding the rating radio buttons would be driven by this column -- don't let's hardcode the categories, okay? ;o) also, is "show articles on home page" still hardcoded? when's a good time to launch the CATTYPE project? i think it would be easy to isolate, but that's a guess, and you code jockeys would have to estimate the total impact on the code first... is this making sense? rudy From r937 at interlog.com Wed Jan 23 16:22:39 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Wed Jan 23 16:22:39 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory Message-ID: <01c1a45c$bf8fbfa0$894e149a@rudy> i'd volunteer for database, except that the sites that evolt people are going to go looking for are not the ones i'm qualified to evaluate i'll do it if nobody *cough*mattwarden*cough* volunteers i'll submit more, too rudy From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 23 16:35:18 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 23 16:35:18 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [admin] Grrr! - Comment Complaint - 23-Jan-2002 In-Reply-To: <01c1a45c$1f88f3a0$894e149a@rudy> Message-ID: rudy, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: rudy > > .jeff: > > i think there are certain categories that the ability > > to rate should be removed -- news, community news, > > faq, and jobs. > > +1 ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< before details of implementation are involved we should get signoff from theforum. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > this is the "subject to rating" attribute for the > article category entity: > > probably it will be another column in the CATTYPE > table, but a few more of these, and we may need a > separate table ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i'm open to discussing the database architecture that supports this. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > jeff, showing/hiding the rating radio buttons would be > driven by this column -- don't let's hardcode the > categories, okay? ;o) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i'd only do that in the interim, but i'm not going to do that until i get signoff from theforum. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > also, is "show articles on home page" still hardcoded? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< yes, as are a few other related queries throughout the site. it shouldn't be too difficult to track them down and fix them though. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > when's a good time to launch the CATTYPE project? i > think it would be easy to isolate, but that's a guess, > and you code jockeys would have to estimate the total > impact on the code first... ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< well, i'm fine with launching at least the theoretical discussion of the cattype project now. i think there are still some questions that need to be answered before i can estimate the impact on the code. in other words, i think there's more work to do than just mark a few categories as not supporting ratings. i think we need to discuss how categories are marked for inclusion in the category dropdowns, which ones can have ratings, and which ones don't show up on the homepage (among other things i'm sure i'm forgetting). thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 23 16:38:19 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 23 16:38:19 2002 Subject: [thesite] CatTypes ... was .. from admin References: <01c1a45c$1f88f3a0$894e149a@rudy> Message-ID: <00b701c1a45e$fc2eef60$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> I think we should look at proceeding with this sooner than later. Can one category have more than one cat type ? Probably not ? Just read Jeff's response too .. and yeah, sign off from the forum will be important. Just preparing a list of what we have now .. give me a few. Mich (will this headache ever go away?) ----- Original Message ----- From: "rudy" | when's a good time to launch the CATTYPE project? i think it would be easy | to isolate, but that's a guess, and you code jockeys would have to estimate | the total impact on the code first... | | is this making sense? From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 23 16:58:28 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 23 16:58:28 2002 Subject: [thesite] CatTypes ... was .. from admin References: <01c1a45c$1f88f3a0$894e149a@rudy> <00b701c1a45e$fc2eef60$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <00be01c1a461$cd9101e0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Very rough list .. did I forget any restrictions? (Talking current situation.) http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/Words/cattypes.htm Mich From ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk Wed Jan 23 17:00:09 2002 From: ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk (Simon Coggins) Date: Wed Jan 23 17:00:09 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory In-Reply-To: <006501c1a45b$1c614340$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: > I agree .. having editors/admins for each section would be very useful. > I'll take ASP if no one else volunteers. ;) Whoa there folks, we haven't coded it yet! It's good to hear enthusiasm for the idea though. While on the subject of multiple admins here's a couple of related unresolved issues I've been thinking about. Suggestions/thoughts would be useful. To authenticate editors my plan was to create a new editors table with two fields - the editor's w.e.o. user login ID (or username) and the CatID of the category they are admin for. Both fields would be primary keys so one editor could have several entries (and hence edit several categories). I hope that I could authenticate using the w.e.o. cookie somehow then query the editors database to see if that user has editor privilages and display the pages accordingly. I don't understand the ins and outs of the w.e.o. login system so I'm not really in a position to know if that would work. If someone could fill me in (offlist would be best I'm guessing) that would be helpful. Secondly, I've thought a bit about allowing multiple editors for a single category and/or letting editor permissions propagate down the directory tree structure. Although it sounds neat, in practice I have a hunch it might cause problems in the long run. Any thoughts on the best approach? Simon From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 23 17:08:39 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 23 17:08:39 2002 Subject: [thesite] CatTypes ... was .. from admin In-Reply-To: <00be01c1a461$cd9101e0$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/Words/cattypes.htm ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< faq id = 9741 faq category articles must have a keyphrase -- correct. "Categories that are NOT included in the Highest Rated Articles .. I guessed, someone confirm? FAQ Jobs News Community News Suggestions" correct "Categories that are NOT included in the Revived Article .. I guessed, someone confirm? FAQ Jobs Community News Suggestions" add news to the list of articles that aren't revived. "Currently all categories treated equally for ratings and total articles. (I think, Jeff confirm.) Not sure about the other articles by this author part, what's that again?" all categories are looked at for the average rating. this will be fixed if we move to a system where only some categories can have ratings because we'll blow away the existing ratings on the articles in categories that can't have ratings. all categories are looked at for the total articles. the following categories are excluded when gathering the "other articles by this author" block: - news - jobs - suggestions - faq community news should be added to this, but currently isn't part of the ones excluded. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 23 17:25:31 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 23 17:25:31 2002 Subject: [thesite] CatTypes ... was .. from admin References: Message-ID: <00cb01c1a465$91cd7d60$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Jeff, Updated the file accordingly. A couple additional questions below. ----- Original Message ----- From: ".jeff" | | all categories are looked at for the average rating. this will be fixed if | we move to a system where only some categories can have ratings because | we'll blow away the existing ratings on the articles in categories that | can't have ratings. Will add a section in a bit. Nailing down what we have currently first. | | all categories are looked at for the total articles. | | the following categories are excluded when gathering the "other articles by | this author" block: | - news | - jobs | - suggestions | - faq | | community news should be added to this, but currently isn't part of the ones | excluded. I think this is the way you originally coded this, but you changed it .. to what I'm not 100% sure. For example, my other articles do appear, even though they are FAQ or CN.. Can you double-check this one please. Also, do "suggestions" appear on the front-page? (I thought there were 3 cats that didn't .. but I might be dreaming.) Mich From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 23 17:33:03 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Jan 23 17:33:03 2002 Subject: [thesite] CatTypes ... was .. from admin In-Reply-To: <00cb01c1a465$91cd7d60$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: michele, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Michele Foster > > | all categories are looked at for the average rating. > | this will be fixed if we move to a system where only > | some categories can have ratings because we'll blow > | away the existing ratings on the articles in > | categories that can't have ratings. > > Will add a section in a bit. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< well, if we go forward with this, i *will* be blowing away the ratings on articles in non-rateable categories. otherwise the numbers will be all off. ;p ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > | the following categories are excluded when gathering > | the "other articles by this author" block: > | - news > | - jobs > | - suggestions > | - faq > | > | community news should be added to this, but currently > | isn't part of the ones excluded. > > I think this is the way you originally coded this, but > you changed it .. to what I'm not 100% sure. For > example, my other articles do appear, even though they > are FAQ or CN.. Can you double-check this one please. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< here's the query: SELECT 1 AS rank , content.contentid , content.contentname , content.synopsis , content.ratings , content.rating , content.replies , content.categoryid , content.datemod , (SELECT category FROM categorys WHERE categorys.categoryid = content.categoryid ) AS category FROM content WHERE content.userid = 4292 AND content.categoryid NOT IN (1, 23, 26, 9741) AND content.contentid <> 19901 AND content.signoff = 1 UNION ALL SELECT 2 , content.contentid , content.contentname , content.synopsis , content.ratings , content.rating , content.replies , content.categoryid , content.datemod , (SELECT category FROM categorys WHERE categorys.categoryid = content.categoryid ) FROM content WHERE content.userid = 4292 AND content.categoryid IN (1, 23, 26, 9741) AND content.contentid <> 19901 AND content.signoff = 1 ORDER BY rank , rating DESC , ratings DESC , datemod ASC it looks to me like it's trying to grab from the non-blacklisted categories first and then grabbing from the blacklisted categories and joining the two resultsets together. you have blacklisted articles show up cause you haven't written articles in any other categories. regardless, community news needs to be added to this query. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > Also, do "suggestions" appear on the front-page? (I > thought there were 3 cats that didn't .. but I might > be dreaming.) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< suggestions do not appear on the homepage. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 23 18:04:42 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 23 18:04:42 2002 Subject: [thesite] CatTypes ... was .. from admin References: Message-ID: <010a01c1a46b$0f061f80$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Ok, updated the file .. I think its complete and accurate now. http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/Words/cattypes.htm I don't see a logical way to add category types .. but then I'm not a DB guru. Too many differences .. unless we want to use the CatType only for certain queries (i.e. not what appears on the home page, as that seems to be the differing one). Would a cat_attribute system be more appropriate? Probably harder to code though. I defer to the others to come up with the best solution. :) Should we bring this up on theforum and attempt to gain consensus on the proposed change of disallowing ratings in certain categories? Mich From martin at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 23 18:07:20 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Wed Jan 23 18:07:20 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: <8958135993102D479F1CA2351F370A060145F46C@cceexc17.americas.cpqcorp.net> Message-ID: <826337DD-105E-11D6-B347-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> On Tuesday, January 22, 2002, at 03:21 pm, Luther, Ron wrote: > Just a quick note ... If you do a 'trim mean' ... just be sure that you > trim both tails ... E.g. For a "10% trim mean" you throw out the 5% > lowest scores *and* the 5% highest scores ... it's a 'balance' thing. Yup. Or more accurately, throw out anything more than 2 Standard Deviations from the mean. Which means that if you have a bunch of ratings at one end (say 4s and 5s) and there's 1 sitting at 1, that's the one that goes, as the 4s and 5s aren't outliers. But the same function should be able to cope with the opposite case, where a 5 is an outlier to ratings clustered around 1 and 2 Not had time to look up the exact calculations, sorry. Does CF provide any stats functions out of the box? Or are there custom tags/functions someone's prebuilt? Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From martin at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 23 18:10:16 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Wed Jan 23 18:10:16 2002 Subject: [thesite] CatTypes ... was .. from admin In-Reply-To: <010a01c1a46b$0f061f80$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: On Thursday, January 24, 2002, at 12:07 am, Michele Foster wrote: > Should we bring this up on theforum and attempt to gain consensus on the > proposed change of disallowing ratings in certain categories? Yes Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 23 23:39:03 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 23 23:39:03 2002 Subject: [thesite] No Mail Message-ID: <004e01c1a499$c6a15d20$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hey folks .. I'm no mail on all lists for a few weeks (give or take). Anything urgent please send direct. Merci, Mich :) From tiedefenderdelta6 at yahoo.com Wed Jan 23 23:41:39 2002 From: tiedefenderdelta6 at yahoo.com (Lachlan Cannon) Date: Wed Jan 23 23:41:39 2002 Subject: [thesite] how many ratings to appear in sidebar? In-Reply-To: <826337DD-105E-11D6-B347-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <20020124054313.71603.qmail@web12304.mail.yahoo.com> --- Martin wrote: ... > Yup. Or more accurately, throw out anything more than 2 > Standard > Deviations from the mean. ... > Not had time to look up the exact calculations, sorry. > Does > CF provide any stats functions out of the box? Or are > there > custom tags/functions someone's prebuilt? Taken from my maths books from last year. standard deviation = the square root of (the sum of((x - mean of all x values)squared)divided by(the amount of values of x - 1)) which looks more or less like this, ____________________________ / sum (x - mean of x values)? / -------------------------- \/ n - 1 (aah the beauty of ascii art) So, if you don't have any ready built functions, there's your maths. HTH Lach __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From tiedefenderdelta6 at yahoo.com Wed Jan 23 23:58:07 2002 From: tiedefenderdelta6 at yahoo.com (Lachlan Cannon) Date: Wed Jan 23 23:58:07 2002 Subject: [thesite] A new version of the evolt.org Directory In-Reply-To: <006501c1a45b$1c614340$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <20020124052450.40013.qmail@web12302.mail.yahoo.com> --- Michele Foster wrote: > > Simon, > > I agree .. having editors/admins for each section would > be very useful. > I'll take ASP if no one else volunteers. ;) > > Mich If no one else want 'em, I'll take PHP and CSS. (there is a category for CSS, right?) Additional thoughts: This would be a good way to integrate MEO sites more into the evolt site. I'm sure many of the evolt members have some great resources there that no one's aware of. Simon's idea of multiple editors, while nice, sounds a little risky. What happens if one editor is dead for something being there, and there's one other who is dead against it? An entry that appears and disappears every 5 minutes? I think it'd be best to have one editor, and on the page for that category, say who they are, and give them a contact page for that person - to discuss issues with the link,s with editors having the final choice, of course. Maybe Simon should stay on as super editor, who can change the editors choices too, in case one person gets busy and can't handle it for a few weeks. The most important thing of all, I think is to try to revive interest in the directory, which is what this redesign will be good for. Get the redesign out of the way, and give all the editors a few weeks to really get their categories in order, and all sparkly. ;) And then announce on the lists that the directory has gone under a major overhaul in order to make it a better resource for evolters.. blah blah. Hopefully that will be what's needed to get interest into it, and keep it thriving. Lach __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From djc at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 24 12:09:39 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Thu Jan 24 12:09:39 2002 Subject: [thesite] evolt mailing lists going down for a bit.. Message-ID: <3C504CDC.3050304@members.evolt.org> Bom dia evoltistas! The evolt.org mailing lists will be going down for a small period of time(1-2 hours) in a couple minutes for a major overhaul of the mailing list software that has served us well for nearly three years... There are lots of cool new features in this new release, and it should make all of our lives, as they pertain to evolt mailing lists at least, a bit easier :) I'll be letting you know more about the new features when the upgrade is complete. If you're wondering how to spend the next two hours now that the evolt mailing lists are down, I'd recommend learning more about the other fine resources evolt.org provides such like http://directory.evolt.org (searchable directory of web dev links/sites) http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/ (browse the tip archive!) And before you know it, the lists will be back up. There may be some small glitches that accompany moving 3000+ list subscriptions to a new system, but nothing *major*. Some of us may have to re-configure our mailing list options to get the MIME version of the digest instead of the plain one for example. Again, I'll have more information once the move is complete.. Thanks for your patience and understanding, feel free to contact me if you have any questions or problems :) .djc. -Running out of witty comments- p.s. - if anyone has that email of x-evolt headers that george dillon compiled a while back, please send it to me :) From djc at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 24 14:05:00 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Thu Jan 24 14:05:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] ADMIN: Mailing list upgrades complete! Message-ID: Well, strangely enough, everything worked on the first try, welcome back :) A couple of the new features you're going to notice right away about the upgraded MG mailing list softare: - List specific information(subscribing, unsubing, archives) are not included in the header of the message. Certain email clients take advantage of that extra info and provide you with an easier interface to manage your lists.evolt.org accounts. - Random x-evolt headers! Yes, now the fun doesn't have to be monotenous as well! ;) This interestingly enough took up the majority of the development time, but should prove well worth it in laughes. - Automatic HTML / Attachment stripping. This has been a huge problem for people since day one.. We've been manually stopping and approving posts that contained HTML, RTF, etc formatting or attachments for a long time now, and it hasn't been the best situation for anyone.. The new version will now start stripping HTML or other formatting off the posts automagically.. This is probably the coolest feature to get added, and should improve the experience for everyone! - Better archiving, and a performance tweak or five - For those of you subscribed to more than one list on lists.evolt.org, you'll now be able to manage them *all* from *one* page. No more having to hop around to 4 different interfaces to change an option on four different lists. From any listinfo page(lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thelist for example) enter your email address in the 'options' field at the bottom, and you'll be taken to a page where if you put in your password(the "send me my password" feature is also fixed now), you can manage all your subscriptions from one page. Very cool for those of you on 2-3 evolt lists. :) ...and a couple other smaller features. A lot of these new features were implemented based on your feedback from the evolt.org survey last month, so thanks for contributing, it really does pay off ;) Hopefully you enjoy these updates, but if you have any problems, or notice anything out of the ordinary, feel free to contact me directly :) .djc. From djc at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 24 14:20:01 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Thu Jan 24 14:20:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [thelist] ADMIN: Mailing list upgrades complete! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: erf. the following paragraph should ready "- List specific information(subscribing, unsubing, archives) are NOW included in the header of the message. Certain email clients take advantage of that extra info and provide you with an easier interface to manage your lists.evolt.org accounts." i owe.. :) .djc. > - List specific information(subscribing, unsubing, archives) are not > included in the header of the message. Certain email clients take > advantage of that extra info and provide you with an easier interface to > manage your lists.evolt.org accounts. From martin at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 24 18:17:01 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Thu Jan 24 18:17:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Status Updates on Various Projects In-Reply-To: <00b101c1a2b5$36642e80$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <0233E20E-1129-11D6-85AA-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> On Monday, January 21, 2002, at 07:52 pm, Michele Foster wrote: > I'd like to assess what's being worked on, what's being held pending > whatever, and progress/status of the various evolt projects. Hi Michele A good clear list - certainly helped me get my head round what's happening. Rudy suggested a Wiki on theforum to throw ideas around, particularly for areas which are still at the "what are we doing with this?" stage. He astutely observed that archives, by their very nature, force you to look backwards whereas a "living document" has a chance of getting us to look forwards It makes sense to extend that to thesite's thinking, and I think it'll make collaboratively maintaining a status list a bit easier too. (sorry Rude for quoting the offlist observation, but I thought it was too good to miss) So I've thrown your update up at http://freezope2.nipltd.net/acorn/evolt/StatusUpdate with purty links to edit forms to create pages for each one. (I've locked all the help and structural pages, but anyone can edit any of the others rn. It would be nice if you set a username pref so we can see who's the last person to edit a doc. If it gets attacked by JoTheCracker I can beef up the security pretty easily) If this makes everyone's life easier, great. If it doesn't and it doesn't get used, nbd as it's only taking up about 50k of disk space. Cheers Martin (who would have thrown it up on meo if it had been as quick to do with Perl/CF/PHP, all of which could have been used just as effectively) _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From isaac at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 24 18:30:01 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Thu Jan 24 18:30:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Status Updates on Various Projects In-Reply-To: <0233E20E-1129-11D6-85AA-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: > Rudy suggested a Wiki on theforum to throw ideas around, > particularly for areas which are still at the "what are we > doing with this?" stage. WTF is a "Wiki"? i From martin at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 24 18:51:00 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Thu Jan 24 18:51:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Status Updates on Various Projects In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <49910B58-112D-11D6-85AA-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> On Friday, January 25, 2002, at 12:34 am, isaac wrote: >> Rudy suggested a Wiki on theforum to throw ideas around, >> particularly for areas which are still at the "what are we >> doing with this?" stage. > > WTF is a "Wiki"? Wiki is Hawaiian for 'quick' - it's a really quick, easy collaborative tool for building content and near perfect for brainstorming. It's so easy to use you don't need to learn how to use it because it follows very simple formatting rules (yes, easier than HTML): http://freezope2.nipltd.net/acorn/evolt/TextFormattingRules Anyone [1] can edit any [2] page by hitting the 'edit this page' link. Creating pages is particularly easy - any two words capitalised LikeThis are a link to a page of the same title (so LikeThis links to ./LikeThis). If the page doesn't exist, the Wiki throws up an edit form to create it. It's better explained on the original Wiki: http://www.c2.com/cgi/wiki? Or just try it. (this one is running on Zope and ZWiki - both open source - yay) Cheers Martin [1] at the moment - I can increase security if needed [2] excluding structural and help pages _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From lindsay at redsquare.com.au Thu Jan 24 18:52:00 2002 From: lindsay at redsquare.com.au (Lindsay Evans) Date: Thu Jan 24 18:52:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Status Updates on Various Projects In-Reply-To: Message-ID: To paraphrase the explanation on the flashcoders-l Wiki (http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/flashcoders-wiki/index.php?WikiWikiWeb): "A WikiWikiWeb is a site where everyone can collaborate on the content. The most well-known and widely used Wiki is the Portland Pattern Repository at http://c2.com/cgi-bin/wiki?WikiWikiWeb. " There is even a PHP version: http://phpwiki.sourceforge.net/ -- Lindsay Evans. Developer, Red Square Productions. [p] 8596.4000 [f] 8596.4001 [w] www.redsquare.com.au > -----Original Message----- > From: thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org > [mailto:thesite-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of isaac > Sent: Friday, January 25, 2002 11:34 AM > To: thesite at lists.evolt.org > Subject: RE: [thesite] Status Updates on Various Projects > > > > > Rudy suggested a Wiki on theforum to throw ideas around, > > particularly for areas which are still at the "what are we > > doing with this?" stage. > > WTF is a "Wiki"? From isaac at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 24 19:04:00 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Thu Jan 24 19:04:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Status Updates on Various Projects In-Reply-To: <49910B58-112D-11D6-85AA-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: > Anyone [1] can edit any [2] page by hitting the 'edit this > page' link. OK. Cute. But wait until An*l C*nt hear of this! I can just imagine track #43 on their next album: 43. You use a Wiki (you're gay). Anyway... i np: I Sold Your Dog to a Chinese Restaurant, AC. Don't listen to AC. From martin at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 24 19:04:03 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Thu Jan 24 19:04:03 2002 Subject: [thesite] Status Updates on Various Projects In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <90A12B84-112F-11D6-85AA-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> On Friday, January 25, 2002, at 12:55 am, Lindsay Evans wrote: > There is even a PHP version: > > http://phpwiki.sourceforge.net/ And a plugin for Slashcode: http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a/onlamp/2002/01/17/slash_plugin.html ...which has a fork which is heading towards a Perl Module @ CPAN. ...oh in that article there's a nice explanation: > What A Wiki Is > "The nice thing about a Wiki is its simplicity." > > While the story and comment format is fine for discussions, there's a > whole class of collaborative work that can't be done with a standard > Slash site. Occasionally, it's useful to have a brainstorming session, > where getting ideas down coherently is more important than following a > traditional call-and-response question format. Business people call > this "synergy," but it really means something here. > > Though I can't prove it at the moment, I suspect that's what lead Ward > Cunningham to come up with the idea of a Wiki. It's like one of those > smart whiteboards, where anyone can write anything and erase anything, > but there's still a record of all revisions. The theory goes that > putting simple but effective tools in the hands of smart people and > staying out of the way can produce great results. > > So far, it's effective. The Design Patterns and Extreme Programming > folk (and they do overlap somewhat) regularly use Wikis like the > Portland Pattern Repository to communicate. The editors and developers > of Perlmonks keep track of site issues and create and edit site > documentation on special Wiki nodes. The Perl Kwalitee Assurance team > maintains a list of untested and undertested core Perl modules. > > The nice thing about a Wiki is its simplicity. There are just a few > formatting rules, and it's available to anyone who can manage a few > HTML forms in a Web browser. They're simple to create and maintain. > Perhaps best of all, it's very easy to create and to maintain links > between documents. (I like similar things about the Everything Engine, > though I'm partial.) > > It's very easy to write notes, definitions, or even full documents in > places where you have several trusted, geographically diverse people > who might use the powerful automatic linking to good effect. Several > free software projects have their own Wikis to answer user and > developer questions, and these often become fully fledged FAQs. If > there were a Slash Wiki plugin, you could even write stories or site > guides or your own site FAQ. There's a pretty keen idea on p2 of that too: > (It would also be nice to be able to promote a page to a Story, but > that's probably further down the road.) ie to use a Wiki as a brainstorming/WIP area for articles so they get moved over to the CMS proper when they're finished. Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From djc at members.evolt.org Fri Jan 25 11:24:00 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Fri Jan 25 11:24:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] more downtime :( Message-ID: <3C51938D.1020101@members.evolt.org> this time out of my control... the t1s for stark and evolt are going to be down for around 10-15 minutes at 3pm CST, possibly longer, but hopefully not. they decided to put in a new circuit to handle both t1s instead of having to seperate ones(on two seperate floors). there are also going to be a coupule routing changes, we'll be connected directly to qwests pop in chicago now rather than being one hop off it. anyways, just wanted everyone to know whats up. say a prayer to the gods of routing that it only lasts a short time.. .djc. 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Thank you. ????????????????????????????????? ?????http://love2net.51.net/???????????????? ---------------------------------------------------- INFORMATION This message has been sent using a trial-run version of the TSmtpRelayServer Delphi Component. ---------------------------------------------------- From webguru at vsnl.net Sat Jan 26 15:47:01 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Sat Jan 26 15:47:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Disappearing bio Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020127031605.01c01c68@203.197.12.4> Hey, my bio disappeared suddenly. I sure didn't modify it. Weird. username: themadman Check it out please? Thanks, Madhu <<< * >>> Madhu Menon User Experience Consultant e-mail: webguru at vsnl.net From r937 at interlog.com Mon Jan 28 03:53:00 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Mon Jan 28 03:53:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist] Tip Harvest for the Week of Monday Jan 21, 2002 Message-ID: <01c1a7e1$c7e469c0$e550149a@rudy> oy vey, what happened? looks like the tip harvester summary polled all the tips ever submitted daniel, here's one post to thelist that i think you could go and kill so that it does not end up in the digest [ SNIP ] rudy (109) rudy limeback (112) rudy limeback (r937%40interlog.com) (5) rudy limeback (r937 at NOSPAM.interlog.com) (1) [ SNIP ] From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Jan 28 10:46:00 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Jan 28 10:46:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist] Tip Harvest for the Week of Monday Jan 21, 2002 In-Reply-To: <01c1a7e1$c7e469c0$e550149a@rudy> from "rudy" at Jan 28, 2002 04:54:30 AM Message-ID: <200201281648.JAA01746@alice.monkeyland.ca> Fixed. It happened when Dan moved to the new mailing list code. I have a hidden file .thetips.id that keeps track of the last thelist message processed. This file did not get moved over when Dan did the upgrade so the harvester started from the beginning of thelist's history. Dean rudy writes: > oy vey, what happened? > > looks like the tip harvester summary polled all the tips ever submitted > > daniel, here's one post to thelist that i think you could go and kill so > that it does not end up in the digest > > [ SNIP ] > > rudy (109) > rudy limeback (112) > rudy limeback (r937%40interlog.com) (5) > rudy limeback (r937 at NOSPAM.interlog.com) (1) > > [ SNIP ] From roselli at earthlink.net Mon Jan 28 11:09:00 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Mon Jan 28 11:09:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] archives changing URL Message-ID: <200201281708.g0SH8RQu006333@leo.evolt.org> ok, maybe i'm a dolt and this always happens... and maybe this isn't the right list (although i think it is)... last week (Wednesday) i sent a link out to a post in thelist archives: http://lists.evolt.org/archive/Week-of-Mon- 20020121/022147.html this morning the guy goes to the URL and gets a 404... it seems the new page is (i had to track it down for him): http://lists.evolt.org/archive/Week-of-Mon- 20020121/050523.html so, um, whut up wit dat? From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Jan 28 11:15:00 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Jan 28 11:15:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] archives changing URL In-Reply-To: <200201281708.g0SH8RQu006333@leo.evolt.org> from "aardvark" at Jan 28, 2002 12:10:24 PM Message-ID: <200201281716.KAA01883@alice.monkeyland.ca> The archives were broken for a while. I think that Dan re-archived everything which may have changed the numbering. Or it could be a result of the mailing list software upgrade. Dean aardvark writes: > ok, maybe i'm a dolt and this always happens... and maybe this > isn't the right list (although i think it is)... > > last week (Wednesday) i sent a link out to a post in thelist archives: > http://lists.evolt.org/archive/Week-of-Mon- > 20020121/022147.html > > this morning the guy goes to the URL and gets a > 404... it seems the new page is (i had to track > it down for him): > http://lists.evolt.org/archive/Week-of-Mon- > 20020121/050523.html > > so, um, whut up wit dat? From webguru at vsnl.net Mon Jan 28 13:22:01 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Mon Jan 28 13:22:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Member bios In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020128205225.01c0bf00@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020129004050.01c55880@203.197.12.4> At 12:16 AM 1/29/2002, .jeff wrote: >already addressed in the current version on t.e.o. that's awaiting rollout. OK, I just *had* to find a bug to piss you off, so here's another one: Sometimes, I pass on URLs to people like this: http://evolt.org/article/PHPTriad/12/20492/ i.e., I leave out the "index.html" at the end. This creates a problem. When the page is loaded, the link to "Bio" is "http://evolt.org/article/PHPTriad/12/20492/index.html#bio" Now, because you're on the page *without* the index.html specified, clicking on "Bio" reloads the page instead of jumping straight to the bookmark. The fix is easy. Just hyperlink the Bio without the URL, keeping only the bookmark, like this: Bio Then neither type of URL will create a problem. Regards, Madhu <<< * >>> Madhu Menon User Experience Consultant e-mail: webguru at vsnl.net From jeff at members.evolt.org Mon Jan 28 13:42:02 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Mon Jan 28 13:42:02 2002 Subject: [thesite] RE: [admin] [Bug] Member bios In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020129004050.01c55880@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: madhu, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Madhu Menon > > OK, I just *had* to find a bug to piss you off, so > here's another one: > > Sometimes, I pass on URLs to people like this: > http://evolt.org/article/PHPTriad/12/20492/ > > i.e., I leave out the "index.html" at the end. > > This creates a problem. When the page is loaded, the > link to "Bio" is > "http://evolt.org/article/x/12/20492/index.html#bio" > > Now, because you're on the page *without* the > index.html specified, clicking on "Bio" reloads > the page instead of jumping straight to the bookmark. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< yes, that is a problem. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > The fix is easy. Just hyperlink the Bio without the > URL, keeping only the bookmark, like this: > Bio > > Then neither type of URL will create a problem. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< wrong. take a look at the top and you'll see a tag. unfortunately that tag messes up the common, short bookmark link. that's why we try to fabricate the link manually. i'll take a look at only including the "index.html" part if it's present in the url. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From r937 at interlog.com Mon Jan 28 13:44:02 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Mon Jan 28 13:44:02 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist] Tip Harvest for the Week of Monday Jan 21, 2002 Message-ID: <01c1a834$7640ab80$824d149a@rudy> > Fixed. dean, you rock any chance you can also yank it outta the archive? rudy From webguru at vsnl.net Mon Jan 28 13:59:01 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Mon Jan 28 13:59:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Member bios In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020129004050.01c55880@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020129012017.046b61d0@203.197.12.4> At 01:15 AM 1/29/2002, .jeff wrote: >wrong. take a look at the top and you'll see a tag. unfortunately >that tag messes up the common, short bookmark link. Um, might I ask why we have a tag? I don't think will work properly. IIRC, you can only specify the base domain name, not a directory on the site. So is the same as [tests locally to be sure] Yep, I'm right. So... what does the tag accomplish that using proper relative URLs like "/someFolder/someURL.html" won't? Regards, Madhu <<< * >>> Madhu Menon User Experience Consultant e-mail: webguru at vsnl.net From jeff at members.evolt.org Mon Jan 28 14:13:00 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Mon Jan 28 14:13:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Member bios In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020129012017.046b61d0@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: madhu, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Madhu Menon > > Um, might I ask why we have a tag? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< so that relative links work properly -- ie, stylesheet, images, external javascript files, etc. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > I don't think will > work properly. IIRC, you can only specify the base > domain name, not a directory on the site. So href="http://evolt.org/evolt/"> is the same as href="http://evolt.org/"> > > [tests locally to be sure] > > Yep, I'm right. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< no, actually you're wrong. i've used this for quite some time and it's worked without fail. to prove my point, go take a quick peek at w.e.o. find an image that you want to view by itself. view the source of the page. note the path in the html for the image and try to view it in your browser (without taking into account the tag). notice it doesn't come up? now try taking into account the tag and see that it works. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > So... what does the tag accomplish that using > proper relative URLs like "/someFolder/someURL.html" > won't? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< it keeps us from having to preface *all* sourced in document links with "/evolt" -- a task that could be easily forgotten in the editing process. no worries though, v3.0 will not use the tag as the mechanism for creating sites using directly-style urls has been highly refined since i first introduced it with v2.0 and no longer relies on the tag. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From r937 at interlog.com Mon Jan 28 14:16:00 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Mon Jan 28 14:16:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Member bios Message-ID: <01c1a838$eae20340$824d149a@rudy> > you can only specify the base domain name, > not a directory on the site.... > [tests locally to be sure] > >Yep, I'm right. are you sure? the last time i had occasion to use the BASE tag was earlier this month (and i got paid, too!!) and i distinctly remember putting two levels of directory in there, and i swear it was working the way i assumed -- all relative urls were relative to the 2nd level directory rudy From webguru at vsnl.net Mon Jan 28 14:23:01 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Mon Jan 28 14:23:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Member bios In-Reply-To: <01c1a838$eae20340$824d149a@rudy> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020129014736.046dfd50@203.197.12.4> At 01:48 AM 1/29/2002, rudy wrote: >the last time i had occasion to use the BASE tag was earlier this month >(and i got paid, too!!) and i distinctly remember putting two levels of >directory in there, and i swear it was working the way i assumed -- all >relative urls were relative to the 2nd level directory It appears that without the trailing slash at the end of the base URL, it won't work, which is my test didn't either. Bugger. Oh well... I apologise for wasting bandwidth. Madhu (who hasn't used anything much because CMSs handled everything ;) <<< * >>> Madhu Menon User Experience Consultant e-mail: webguru at vsnl.net From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Jan 28 15:24:00 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Jan 28 15:24:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist] Tip Harvest for the Week of Monday Jan 21, In-Reply-To: <01c1a834$7640ab80$824d149a@rudy> from "rudy" at Jan 28, 2002 02:46:21 PM Message-ID: <200201282126.OAA03367@alice.monkeyland.ca> I tried. I tried what was posted on the Mailman FAQ but it didn't seem to work. I blew away the archive and then tried re-running it but it kept pulling the message from somewhere. In the process, I fux0red the sequence numbers (there's a gap now) of the HTML mail files. Should've known better than to play around with things I know nothing of. :) Dean rudy writes: > any chance you can also yank it outta the archive? From mwarden at mattwarden.com Mon Jan 28 17:16:01 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Mon Jan 28 17:16:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Member bios In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020129004050.01c55880@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: On Jan 29, Madhu Menon had something to say about [thesite] [Bug] Member bios >At 12:16 AM 1/29/2002, .jeff wrote: >>already addressed in the current version on t.e.o. that's awaiting rollout. > >OK, I just *had* to find a bug to piss you off, so here's another one: > >Sometimes, I pass on URLs to people like this: >http://evolt.org/article/PHPTriad/12/20492/ > >i.e., I leave out the "index.html" at the end. my doctor always tells me that if it hurts when i do something, i shouldn't do that. >This creates a problem. When the page is loaded, the link to "Bio" is >"http://evolt.org/article/PHPTriad/12/20492/index.html#bio" > >Now, because you're on the page *without* the index.html specified, >clicking on "Bio" reloads the page instead of jumping straight to the >bookmark. > >The fix is easy. Just hyperlink the Bio without the URL, keeping only the >bookmark, like this: Bio > >Then neither type of URL will create a problem. no. it's not that easy, actually. just send along the index.html -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From mwarden at mattwarden.com Mon Jan 28 17:20:00 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Mon Jan 28 17:20:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist] Tip Harvest for the Week of Monday Jan 21, In-Reply-To: <200201282126.OAA03367@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: dean, if ya could, shoot me an email telling me what the problem is and exactly what files you touched. i had to figure this shit out the last time we went through this and should be able to do it again (as long as not a whole lot has changed in the new version as far as which files do what) -- mattwarden mattwarden.com On Jan 28, Dean Mah had something to say about Re: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist]... >I tried. I tried what was posted on the Mailman FAQ but it didn't >seem to work. I blew away the archive and then tried re-running it >but it kept pulling the message from somewhere. In the process, I >fux0red the sequence numbers (there's a gap now) of the HTML mail >files. Should've known better than to play around with things I know >nothing of. :) > >Dean > > >rudy writes: > >> any chance you can also yank it outta the archive? >_______________________________________________ >For unsubscribe, archive, and options, go to: >http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thesite > -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Jan 28 17:31:01 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Jan 28 17:31:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist] Tip Harvest for the Week of Monday Jan 21, In-Reply-To: from "Warden, Matt" at Jan 28, 2002 06:22:02 PM Message-ID: <200201282333.QAA04057@alice.monkeyland.ca> The problem is that the tip harvester went beserk and harvested all tips from the starting of thelist to the current day. The tip harvester then sent a message to thelist saying that 4000+ tips for last week were submitted. I was trying to pull that message from the archive. 1. Deleted all the files in archives/private/thelist/Week-of-Mon-20020128 2. Edited the thelist.mbox file to remove the tip harvester's original message 3. Ran bin/arch thelist I thought that it was supposed to re-create the archives based on thelist.mbox file but somehow it kept putting the tip harvester message back into the HTML files. It didn't put them in the .txt file though. 'b' is a backup of the Week-of-Mon-20020128 directory. 'a' is a backup of the Week-of-Mon-20020128.txt file. Dean Warden, Matt writes: > dean, if ya could, shoot me an email telling me what the problem is > and exactly what files you touched. i had to figure this shit out > the last time we went through this and should be able to do it again > (as long as not a whole lot has changed in the new version as far as > which files do what) > > -- > mattwarden > mattwarden.com > > On Jan 28, Dean Mah had something to say about Re: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist]... > > >I tried. I tried what was posted on the Mailman FAQ but it didn't > >seem to work. I blew away the archive and then tried re-running it > >but it kept pulling the message from somewhere. In the process, I > >fux0red the sequence numbers (there's a gap now) of the HTML mail > >files. Should've known better than to play around with things I know > >nothing of. :) From mwarden at mattwarden.com Mon Jan 28 17:57:00 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Mon Jan 28 17:57:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist] Tip Harvest for the Week of Monday Jan 21, In-Reply-To: <200201282333.QAA04057@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: On Jan 28, Dean Mah had something to say about Re: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist]... >The problem is that the tip harvester went beserk and harvested all >tips from the starting of thelist to the current day. The tip >harvester then sent a message to thelist saying that 4000+ tips for >last week were submitted. I was trying to pull that message from the >archive. > >1. Deleted all the files in archives/private/thelist/Week-of-Mon-20020128 >2. Edited the thelist.mbox file to remove the tip harvester's original message >3. Ran bin/arch thelist > >I thought that it was supposed to re-create the archives based on >thelist.mbox file but somehow it kept putting the tip harvester >message back into the HTML files. It didn't put them in the .txt file >though. > >'b' is a backup of the Week-of-Mon-20020128 directory. >'a' is a backup of the Week-of-Mon-20020128.txt file. > >Dean ya, im pretty sure you have to edit the -articles file in the database directory too. i'll get it in a bit. thanks deano -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From mwarden at mattwarden.com Mon Jan 28 21:05:01 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Mon Jan 28 21:05:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist] Tip Harvest for the Week of Monday Jan 21, In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Jan 28, Warden, Matt had something to say about Re: [thesite] Re:... >>1. Deleted all the files in archives/private/thelist/Week-of-Mon-20020128 >>2. Edited the thelist.mbox file to remove the tip harvester's original message >>3. Ran bin/arch thelist >> >>I thought that it was supposed to re-create the archives based on >>thelist.mbox file but somehow it kept putting the tip harvester >>message back into the HTML files. It didn't put them in the .txt file >>though. >> >>'b' is a backup of the Week-of-Mon-20020128 directory. >>'a' is a backup of the Week-of-Mon-20020128.txt file. >> >>Dean > >ya, im pretty sure you have to edit the -articles file in the database >directory too. > >i'll get it in a bit. > >thanks deano well, i edited the files in database/ and also took reference of the message out of the Week-of*/ folder, but i couldn't get the archives to rebuild. kept getting this: i686 so, if you know what to do to get them to rebuild, we should be good to go. later, -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From r937 at interlog.com Mon Jan 28 21:34:01 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Mon Jan 28 21:34:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] [Bug] Member bios Message-ID: <01c1a876$0b17c900$824d149a@rudy> > my doctor always tells me that if it hurts when i do something, > i shouldn't do that. matt, you made my day -- hell, you made my week, and it's only monday thanks, dude rudy From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Jan 28 21:37:00 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Jan 28 21:37:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist] Tip Harvest for the Week of Monday Jan 21, In-Reply-To: from "Warden, Matt" at Jan 28, 2002 10:06:43 PM Message-ID: <200201290339.UAA00888@alice.monkeyland.ca> Okay. I had even worse problems running bin/arch this time. It was throwing a lot of errors. I ended up deleting all of the Week-of-20020128* files in the database/ directory and then running bin/arch which seemed to do the trick. Dean Warden, Matt writes: > well, i edited the files in database/ and also took reference of the > message out of the Week-of*/ folder, but i couldn't get the archives to > rebuild. kept getting this: > > i686 > > so, if you know what to do to get them to rebuild, we should be good to > go. From mwarden at mattwarden.com Mon Jan 28 22:02:01 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Mon Jan 28 22:02:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist] Tip Harvest for the Week of Monday Jan 21, In-Reply-To: <200201290339.UAA00888@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: On Jan 28, Dean Mah had something to say about Re: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist]... >Okay. I had even worse problems running bin/arch this time. It was >throwing a lot of errors. I ended up deleting all of the >Week-of-20020128* files in the database/ directory and then running >bin/arch which seemed to do the trick. ya, you have to at least move them to a different directory. i usually do: mkdir bak mv Week-of-* ./bak and then run /bin/arch good thing i did, too, because it wouldn't work for me you know what i was doing wrong? i personally don't find 'i686' to be a satifactory status message *shrug* -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Jan 28 23:00:01 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Jan 28 23:00:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [xxxlist] Tip Harvest for the Week of Monday Jan 21, In-Reply-To: from "Warden, Matt" at Jan 28, 2002 11:03:28 PM Message-ID: <200201290502.WAA01340@alice.monkeyland.ca> Yeah, I moved them to a temporary directory as well. I didn't think of it at the time and didn't notice until just now that you are using the command '/bin/arch' which will return the architecture of the machine that the OS is running on. In this case an i686. I was doing ~mailman/bin/arch which is the archiver command. Dean Warden, Matt writes: > ya, you have to at least move them to a different directory. i usually do: > > mkdir bak > mv Week-of-* ./bak > > and then run /bin/arch > > good thing i did, too, because it wouldn't work for me > > you know what i was doing wrong? > > i personally don't find 'i686' to be a satifactory status message From michele at wordpro.on.ca Wed Jan 30 09:12:01 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Wed Jan 30 09:12:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Site(s) Down ? Message-ID: <002901c1a99f$d6726540$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Hey Folks .. Seems like all the sites are down ? Did I miss a note announcing downtime? Probably .. ;) Mich From dmah at shaw.ca Wed Jan 30 09:33:00 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Wed Jan 30 09:33:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: Site(s) Down ? In-Reply-To: <002901c1a99f$d6726540$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> from "Michele Foster" at Jan 30, 2002 10:07:29 AM Message-ID: <200201301535.IAA01342@alice.monkeyland.ca> lists.evolt.org is up and I can ping www.evolt.org but I'm getting a connection refused when I try to log in to it from ssh. Dean Michele Foster writes: > Hey Folks .. > > Seems like all the sites are down ? > > Did I miss a note announcing downtime? Probably .. ;) > > Mich From lbenne01 at tufts.edu Wed Jan 30 09:50:59 2002 From: lbenne01 at tufts.edu (Louis P Bennett) Date: Wed Jan 30 09:50:59 2002 Subject: [thesite] bug on leo? In-Reply-To: <200201301535.IAA01342@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <5E61DF6D-1599-11D6-B651-003065D606B6@tufts.edu> hello all. did a quick search for "tip harvester" on google to check for tip syntax, and got this: http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/ ideas? *** Error Occurred While Processing Request Error Diagnostic Information Oracle Error Code = 12541 Error while trying to retrieve text for error ORA-12541 SQL = "SELECT max(tip_date) AS maxdate, min(tip_date) AS mindate FROM thetips" Data Source = "EVOLT" The error occurred while processing an element with a general identifier of (CFQUERY), occupying document position (4:1) to (4:44) in the template file /home/evolt/leo_html/harvest/dsp_home.cfm. Date/Time: Wed Jan 30 09:47:45 2002 Browser: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X; en-US; rv:0.9.8+) Gecko/20020129 Remote Address: 130.64.126.72 HTTP Referrer: http://www.google.com/search?q=tip+harvester&sourceid=mozilla-search From dmah at shaw.ca Wed Jan 30 09:59:00 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Wed Jan 30 09:59:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] bug on leo? In-Reply-To: <5E61DF6D-1599-11D6-B651-003065D606B6@tufts.edu> from "Louis P Bennett" at Jan 30, 2002 10:52:31 AM Message-ID: <200201301601.JAA01503@alice.monkeyland.ca> All evolt.org sites are experiencing trouble at the moment. We are working to resolve the problems as quickly as possible. Dean Louis P Bennett writes: > hello all. did a quick search for "tip harvester" on google to check for > tip syntax, and got this: > > http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/ > > ideas? From isaac at triplezero.com.au Wed Jan 30 21:38:04 2002 From: isaac at triplezero.com.au (Isaac Forman) Date: Wed Jan 30 21:38:04 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas Message-ID: Very rough: QUESTION id, name, description, priv, opendate, closedate, announced (simple flag) OPTION id, questionid, name, description (optional) USER id, priv, name, password, email, (active - not sure if required (see USERGROUP.active)) VOTE id, optionid, userid, timestamp GROUP id, name, description USERGROUP userid, groupid, active (i.e., if user is active within that group) I'm probably missing some terribly obvious fields, so let me know. Just wanted to start it off. If you don't know why I've put something in, ask. Also thought that it might be good to have an option so that the app could contact anyone who is yet to vote on an issue. i.e., once a question has been proposed, you Announce it (hence announced flag). Then maybe 36 hours later, as a courtesy (not required, just if you remember, or if people are forgetting to vote), you Notify, which privately emails all registered voters who are yet to vote on the issue, with a reminder of closing time, etc. Thoughts? isaac -------------------------------------------------------------- triple zero digital | upstairs at 200 the parade, norwood 5067 (08)83320545 | www.triplezero.com.au | isaac at triplezero.com.au From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Jan 30 22:04:00 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Jan 30 22:04:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Jan 31, Isaac Forman had something to say about [thesite] Voting... >Very rough: fair enough :) >QUESTION >id, name, description, priv, opendate, closedate, announced (simple flag) add questiontype values: "vote", "appeal", "revote" ? the announced flag most likely isn't necessary unless you're planning on running the announcement by some cron job or something. that kind of flag would be most useful if the flag existed on the user level, for use when power goes out when going through very long lists of members. but, i dont think it's needed at all in this case >OPTION >id, questionid, name, description (optional) > >USER >id, priv, name, password, email, (active - not sure if required (see >USERGROUP.active)) if you're going to use group, you should probably put priv there, not on user. e.g. i'm on admin but not theforum, i shouldn't be able to vote on theforum's votes. in other words, this stuff should be on a (shiver) role-level rather than user-level. >VOTE >id, optionid, userid, timestamp optionid nullable for abstaining? >GROUP >id, name, description > >USERGROUP >userid, groupid, active (i.e., if user is active within that group) >Also thought that it might be good to have an option so that the app could >contact anyone who is yet to vote on an issue. > >i.e., once a question has been proposed, you Announce it (hence announced >flag). Then maybe 36 hours later, as a courtesy (not required, just if you >remember, or if people are forgetting to vote), you Notify, which privately >emails all registered voters who are yet to vote on the issue, with a >reminder of closing time, etc. you can do this with a cf script and the fields above. -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From r937 at interlog.com Wed Jan 30 22:12:00 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Wed Jan 30 22:12:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas Message-ID: <01c1aa0d$b2507a80$5251149a@rudy> > in other words, this stuff should be on a (shiver) role-level > rather than user-level. member rather than user although roles would be a 1-to-many off of member, if it's necessary to distinguish a member's roles and isaac, please bear in mind my suggestion that you do need some way of synchronizing your data with oracle and/or the subscription tables (which, if you'll pardon the grammar, i don't even know how they work) rudy From isaac at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 30 22:17:00 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Wed Jan 30 22:17:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > add questiontype > values: "vote", "appeal", "revote" good idea. > the announced flag most likely isn't necessary unless you're planning on > running the announcement by some cron job or something. actually, i figure that actually putting together the question/options will often be a gradual process (i.e., stemming from discussion on thesite/theforum for the most part). consider the "announced" flag to be the equivalent of "taken" for the admin email thingy. i.e., stops someone else coming in to announce it again. > >id, optionid, userid, timestamp > optionid nullable for abstaining? yeh, probably. saves having an extra default "abstain" option for every question. > >i.e., once a question has been proposed, you Announce it (hence announced > >flag). Then maybe 36 hours later, as a courtesy (not required, > just if you > >remember, or if people are forgetting to vote), you Notify, > which privately > >emails all registered voters who are yet to vote on the issue, with a > >reminder of closing time, etc. > > you can do this with a cf script and the fields above. yes, exactly. i (as for the user/member role-based crap, rudy? ditto with all the numeric/varchar/text/memo/type stuff. are their direct equiv's between access and mysql?) From isaac at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 30 22:17:02 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Wed Jan 30 22:17:02 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas In-Reply-To: <01c1aa0d$b2507a80$5251149a@rudy> Message-ID: > and isaac, please bear in mind my suggestion that you do need some way of > synchronizing your data with oracle and/or the subscription tables (which, > if you'll pardon the grammar, i don't even know how they work) that's out of my league. will we be forever waiting on UEUE? or should we just move forward without it for now in the voting app? i From roselli at earthlink.net Wed Jan 30 22:20:00 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Wed Jan 30 22:20:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas In-Reply-To: References: <01c1aa0d$b2507a80$5251149a@rudy> Message-ID: <3C587F94.1768.68323CD6@localhost> when's this app gonna be ready? can it address the discussions about voting on theforum? From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Jan 30 22:23:00 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Jan 30 22:23:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Jan 31, isaac had something to say about RE: [thesite] Voting... >> the announced flag most likely isn't necessary unless you're planning on >> running the announcement by some cron job or something. > >actually, i figure that actually putting together the question/options will >often be a gradual process (i.e., stemming from discussion on >thesite/theforum for the most part). consider the "announced" flag to be the >equivalent of "taken" for the admin email thingy. i.e., stops someone else >coming in to announce it again. ok. i rather envisioned it like the article submission process. create, preview, edit, preview, edit, etc., approve, then notification is sent. in this process, the very last step would be "publish" or something and the note would be sent off. of course, just like articles, they could be edited after approval/publication. >(as for the user/member role-based crap, rudy? ditto with all the >numeric/varchar/text/memo/type stuff. are their direct equiv's between >access and mysql?) pretty much. you probably want to avoid memo tho. thanks, -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Jan 30 22:25:00 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Jan 30 22:25:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas In-Reply-To: <3C587F94.1768.68323CD6@localhost> Message-ID: On Jan 30, aardvark had something to say about RE: [thesite] Voting... > >when's this app gonna be ready? > >can it address the discussions about voting on theforum? i think that's the point of this app. if you read the thead on theforum, that's where this thread originated. thanks, -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From roselli at earthlink.net Wed Jan 30 22:35:00 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Wed Jan 30 22:35:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas In-Reply-To: References: <3C587F94.1768.68323CD6@localhost> Message-ID: <3C58833C.18829.68408544@localhost> > From: "Warden, Matt" > > > >can it address the discussions about voting on theforum? > > i think that's the point of this app. if you read the thead on > theforum, that's where this thread originated. except those discussions are about the logic of the voting... where is this app (in development progress)? does it have the voting logic built it? can it without a decision over there? or does the logic get built in and then rolled out to theforum? From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Jan 30 22:37:01 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Jan 30 22:37:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas In-Reply-To: <3C58833C.18829.68408544@localhost> Message-ID: On Jan 30, aardvark had something to say about RE: [thesite] Voting... >where is this app (in development progress)? first message was likst 30 minutes ago. beginning stages. >does it have the >voting logic built it? can it without a decision over there? or does >the logic get built in and then rolled out to theforum? amanda is supposed to be working on a spec document as we speak. we should be able to work off of that. -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From isaac at members.evolt.org Wed Jan 30 22:42:00 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Wed Jan 30 22:42:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > pretty much. you probably want to avoid memo tho. What does mysql use for something that needs more than 255 chars (i.e., a couple paragraphs of description and links to archive postings, etc)? (I won't need to know for this particular project, but I'm curious anyway). i From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Jan 30 22:49:00 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Jan 30 22:49:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Jan 31, isaac had something to say about RE: [thesite] Voting... > >> pretty much. you probably want to avoid memo tho. > >What does mysql use for something that needs more than 255 chars (i.e., a >couple paragraphs of description and links to archive postings, etc)? > >(I won't need to know for this particular project, but I'm curious anyway). TEXT fields: LONGTEXT (2^32 chars), MEDIUMTEXT (2^??? chars), TEXT (2^16 chars) probably easy to find the size on MEDIUMTEXT on mysql.com if i weren't so lazy... -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Jan 30 23:22:01 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Jan 30 23:22:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] teo and feo back up Message-ID: test.evolt.org and food.evolt.org are back up and working properly. just had to give oracle a kick in the butt... -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From skaiser1 at skdesigns.com Thu Jan 31 00:52:00 2002 From: skaiser1 at skdesigns.com (Shirley Kaiser) Date: Thu Jan 31 00:52:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] teo and feo back up In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020130225127.0243d278@mail.midtown.net> At 09:24 PM 1/30/2002, you typed: >test.evolt.org and food.evolt.org are back up and working properly. just >had to give oracle a kick in the butt... Sounds like an interesting start for a tutorial on working with Oracle. ;-) Although I'm not a programmer, I have a feeling that many would enjoy hearing the specifics of your kicking technique. Warmly, Shirley -- Shirley E. Kaiser, M.A., SKDesigns mailto:skaiser1 at skdesigns.com Web Site Design, Development http://www.skdesigns.com/ WebsiteTips: Design Resources http://www.websitetips.com/ Brainstorms and Raves http://www.brainstormsandraves.com/ From garrett at polytechnic.co.uk Thu Jan 31 07:38:01 2002 From: garrett at polytechnic.co.uk (Garrett Coakley) Date: Thu Jan 31 07:38:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] teo and feo back up In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020130225127.0243d278@mail.midtown.net> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020130225127.0243d278@mail.midtown.net> Message-ID: <20020131133618.29fe2618.garrett@polytechnic.co.uk> On Wed, 30 Jan 2002 22:53:38 -0800 Shirley Kaiser wrote: > Although I'm not a programmer, I have a feeling that many would enjoy > hearing the specifics of your kicking technique. Matt has a special pair of steel toecap fluffy slippers that he uses for these occasions. I think they also have aerodynamic bunny ears to aid stability during the 'pre-kick' run up. Thats right isn't it matt? G. -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- WORK: http://spiked.co.uk/ PLAY: http://polytechnic.co.uk/ From mwarden at mattwarden.com Thu Jan 31 09:22:00 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Thu Jan 31 09:22:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] teo and feo back up In-Reply-To: <20020131133618.29fe2618.garrett@polytechnic.co.uk> Message-ID: On Jan 31, Garrett Coakley had something to say about Re: [thesite] teo and... >On Wed, 30 Jan 2002 22:53:38 -0800 >Shirley Kaiser wrote: > > >> Although I'm not a programmer, I have a feeling that many would enjoy >> hearing the specifics of your kicking technique. > > >Matt has a special pair of steel toecap fluffy slippers that he uses for >these occasions. I think they also have aerodynamic bunny ears to aid >stability during the 'pre-kick' run up. > >Thats right isn't it matt? no, i just insult its momma... -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From trafficproducts at trafficwow.net Thu Jan 31 13:08:01 2002 From: trafficproducts at trafficwow.net (trafficproducts at trafficwow.net) Date: Thu Jan 31 13:08:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Best Source of Internet Traffic and Search Engine Placements Message-ID: <200201311907.g0VJ7BQu014913@leo.evolt.org> [ Converted text/html to text/plain ] [1] TrafficWoW Daily Newsletter January 28, 2002 Disclaimer: ----------- This email is NEVER sent unsolicited. THIS IS NOT SPAM. You are receiving this because you have either answered classified ad, posted to our FFA pages, are on the same opt-in list or have sent me something in the past. If you'd like to be removed, see instructions at the bottom of this message. 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Where do we want the next evolticon? 2. Do we want to ban hot pants? This makes it easy to group questions. This helps understand the context in which the question was asked (i.e. there's a thread on theforum about hot pants at evolticons, but the question, read out of context, seems like we're banning hot pants in general, not just at evolticons). It also makes it a lot easier to go find a decision made by poll rather than sorting through hundreds of indiviual questions. still thinking... -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From andrew at thepander.co.nz Thu Jan 31 13:21:01 2002 From: andrew at thepander.co.nz (Andrew Forsberg) Date: Thu Jan 31 13:21:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > >What does mysql use for something that needs more than 255 chars (i.e., a >>couple paragraphs of description and links to archive postings, etc)? >> >>(I won't need to know for this particular project, but I'm curious anyway). > >TEXT fields: LONGTEXT (2^32 chars), MEDIUMTEXT (2^??? chars), TEXT (2^16 >chars) > >probably easy to find the size on MEDIUMTEXT on mysql.com if i weren't so >lazy... TINYTEXT, TINYBLOB (2^8 - 1 bytes) TEXT, BLOB (2^16 - 1 bytes) MEDIUMTEXT, MEDIUMBLOB (2^24 - 1 bytes) LONGTEXT, LONGBLOB (2^32 - 1 bytes) Cheers Andrew -- Andrew Forsberg --- uberNET - http://uber.net.nz/ the pander - http://thepander.co.nz/ From martin at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 31 13:50:00 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Thu Jan 31 13:50:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] teo and feo back up In-Reply-To: <20020131133618.29fe2618.garrett@polytechnic.co.uk> Message-ID: <047A50C0-1684-11D6-A5E9-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> On Thursday, January 31, 2002, at 01:36 pm, Garrett Coakley wrote: >> Although I'm not a programmer, I have a feeling that many would enjoy >> hearing the specifics of your kicking technique. > > > Matt has a special pair of steel toecap fluffy slippers that he uses for > these occasions. I think they also have aerodynamic bunny ears to aid > stability during the 'pre-kick' run up. Important preparatory stage: echo "Computer, I'm going to zap right off to your main memorybanks and reprogram them with a large axe" | oracle.app Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From lindsay at redsquare.com.au Thu Jan 31 16:09:00 2002 From: lindsay at redsquare.com.au (Lindsay Evans) Date: Thu Jan 31 16:09:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] meo ftp down? Message-ID: http is fine, but ftp seems to be down: -> ftp: connect:Connection timed out -- Lindsay Evans. Developer, Red Square Productions. [p] 8596.4000 [f] 8596.4001 [w] www.redsquare.com.au From mwarden at mattwarden.com Thu Jan 31 16:16:01 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Thu Jan 31 16:16:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] meo ftp down? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Feb 1, Lindsay Evans had something to say about [thesite] meo ftp down? > >http is fine, but ftp seems to be down: > >-> ftp: connect:Connection timed out working fine, here. -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From lindsay at redsquare.com.au Thu Jan 31 16:19:01 2002 From: lindsay at redsquare.com.au (Lindsay Evans) Date: Thu Jan 31 16:19:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] meo ftp down? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > working fine, here. okay, my bad, it seems like our firewall is playing up again :o( -- Lindsay Evans. Developer, Red Square Productions. [p] 8596.4000 [f] 8596.4001 [w] www.redsquare.com.au From isaac at members.evolt.org Thu Jan 31 16:50:01 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Thu Jan 31 16:50:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > >probably easy to find the size on MEDIUMTEXT on mysql.com if i weren't so > >lazy... > > TINYTEXT, TINYBLOB (2^8 - 1 bytes) > TEXT, BLOB (2^16 - 1 bytes) Pity there's not something in between these two. TEXT/BLOB would be best then? For the description fields (optional anyway), I'm really only expecting us to need space for maybe a paragraph outlining things, maybe a link or two to threads in theforum archives, etc. I'll leave someone with MySQL skills to set up the DB according to Matt's mods to my suggestion. Will start plotting the app sometime today, hopefully. isaac -------------------------------------------------------------- triple zero digital | upstairs at 200 the parade, norwood 5067 (08)83320545 | www.triplezero.com.au | isaac at triplezero.com.au From mwarden at mattwarden.com Thu Jan 31 17:07:00 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Thu Jan 31 17:07:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Voting Application - initial DB ideas In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Feb 1, isaac had something to say about RE: [thesite] Voting Application... >I'll leave someone with MySQL skills to set up the DB according to Matt's >mods to my suggestion. probably should wait for amanda's spec doc. how's that coming along, amanda? -- mattwarden mattwarden.com