From djc at members.evolt.org Fri Mar 1 14:31:01 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Fri Mar 1 14:31:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] February stats for evolt.org Message-ID: <3C7FE4CD.5010100@members.evolt.org> Bom dia evoltistas! Statistics for the short month of February are in for the evolt.org sites, and even with fewer days, we still broke some records! Hits: 2.05 million(bing!) Page Views: 663,900(rounded to nearest 100) Unique Hosts: 111,903(bing! bing!) Page views/day: 23,722 Data transfer: 78.5Gb Data transfer/day: 2.7Gb digging deeper: Top 5 refers for the month: *.google.com (120K referers) google.yahoo.com (16.5K referers) google.de (6500 referers.. hello germany!) google.ca (5850 referers.. take off, eh!) slashdot.org (5286 referers.. my spambot article #2 got picked up) Honorable mention: madman.weblogs.com (895 referers from evolt member madhu melon) MSIE based browsers continued to dominate with 72.5% of requests on the evolt.org sites, followed up by Netscape with 10.5%. Opera made 2.60% of the requests. On the operating sysytem side of things, Windows based operating systems increased the percentage of requests made by about 3% to bring it's total for the month to 76%. Win2k had 36.5% of total requests. Mac based OS's made about 6.4% of the requests and Unix variants were responsible for 3.4% of requests. Our friend(s) using an Atari based OS made his/her precense felt with 4 total requests this month, to bring up the rear :) Top 5 members.evolt.org accounts this month were marceloslg, djc(w00t!), rglastra, deadL0ck, and kroet. Last month, I started picking out one members.evolt.org account that i think is doing something cool, interesting, or wierd. dolsen(m.e.o/dolsen) was the inagural winner with his very interesting site. This month, I'd like to point out Ben Dyer's site, 'Radical Bender' at http://members.evolt.org/OKolzig37/beta/index.php - Not only one of the most entertaining and informative weblogs i've seen in a while, but he's got links to all your favorite evolters websites too! Nice job Ben, keep up the good work :) As always, you can find the whole enchillada at http://browsers.evolt.org/stats/stats.feb2002.html (For you beancounters, let me know if you see any inconsistancies. The m.e.o access_log got corrupted when I rotated it, and I had to manually put together numbers for the hourly m.e.o stats page). Have fun, um fim de semana agrad?vel amigos! .djc. From michele at wordpro.on.ca Sat Mar 2 09:55:03 2002 From: michele at wordpro.on.ca (Michele Foster) Date: Sat Mar 2 09:55:03 2002 Subject: [thesite] CSS Files References: <3C805E75.5083.410FED16@localhost> Message-ID: <021b01c1c202$b87ce300$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Adrian, Since I can't give you access .. here are all the most recent files. http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/Styles/index.html A couple of notes .. (1) Sorry you don't like the commenting .. feel free to delete it. Just remember it was added to cover my ass .. and to keep everyone else that may need to edit the files in the loop. There were some "issues" where we were wondering why something specific was done a certain way, and no comments, so we had no idea. Comments were added in my attempt to show a good example of documenting changes. Like I said, feel free to delete em all. (2) Members.css has been copied over to the meo server. However, there was a problem with the .main class that was messing up some textareas in NN4. So, for this specific and only file, I commented out the line height. Other than this one digression, all of the files should be exactly the same. (3) Lists.css and slate.css, used for leo and beo respectively, have not been copied over to their respective sites. I haven't had time. The html needs to be updated on each of the pages in order to get these newer CSS files to work. Wasn't a high priority on my list, so, like I said, not been done. (4) You can change the CSS on teo to see each file in action. I'll leave the files in your capable hands now. Thanks, Michele ----- Original Message ----- From: "aardvark" | | for instance, i can re-work the CSS stuff i've been meaning to do if you re- | enable my FTP access to the servers... | From roselli at earthlink.net Sat Mar 2 12:07:23 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Sat Mar 2 12:07:23 2002 Subject: [thesite] CSS Files In-Reply-To: <021b01c1c202$b87ce300$95aa2642@aci.on.ca> Message-ID: <3C80CDA3.3670.42C238AE@localhost> > From: "Michele Foster" > > Since I can't give you access .. here are all the most recent files. > > http://members.evolt.org/Mishka/Styles/index.html sweet... forgot about this list... > A couple of notes .. > > (1) Sorry you don't like the commenting .. feel free to delete it. > Just remember it was added to cover my ass .. and to keep everyone > else that may need to edit the files in the loop. There were some > "issues" where we were wondering why something specific was done a > certain way, and no comments, so we had no idea. Comments were added > in my attempt to show a good example of documenting changes. Like I > said, feel free to delete em all. actually, i mean the inline commenting within each style... they were there to help guide jeff on a style change app se he'd have variable names (suggested) to work with and know where they go... the other comments i like, although now i'm wondering if there's a better way to track changes to users don't have to download the extra few bytes... i'm open to suggestions (still love the idea of sourceforge)... > (2) Members.css has been copied over to the meo server. However, > there was a problem with the .main class that was messing up some > textareas in NN4. So, for this specific and only file, I commented out > the line height. Other than this one digression, all of the files > should be exactly the same. this is good to know... one of the things i wanted to ask folks here is about moving some attributes out of the main CSS file and calling them via @import... those attributes would be "line-height", "padding" and "margin" since those are the styles that hose NN4.x... IOW, is it worth it to split them for the few NN4.x users we get... Feb stats suggest that only 10.5% of browsers are netscape, but navigator 4.x doesn't have enough entries to warrant a listing of its own under the raw numbers... > (3) Lists.css and slate.css, used for leo and beo respectively, have > not been copied over to their respective sites. I haven't had time. > The html needs to be updated on each of the pages in order to get > these newer CSS files to work. Wasn't a high priority on my list, so, > like I said, not been done. understood... > (4) You can change the CSS on teo to see each file in action. right-o... > I'll leave the files in your capable hands now. dig... one other question, mostly for jeff (i think)... what's the status of using the style switcher on teo? is it something that v2 will ever see? i ask because this adjusts how i'll prioritize bringing the other CSS files up to date... i still would like to bring them up to date so users can install and use them if they want, but if there's no general changer, it can wait longer... From mwarden at mattwarden.com Sun Mar 3 14:14:14 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Sun Mar 3 14:14:14 2002 Subject: [thesite] infinite loops on leo, part II Message-ID: i brought this up before, but everyone said they weren't experiencing it and i went to check whether my brains was correctly functioning. it's not, but i'm still certain that there are inifinite loops on all 404 pages, resulting from the fix that was installed to find items linked with the old message ids. check it: http://lists.evolt.org/404archive/Week-of-Mon-20020225/date.html if you guys could explain what's handling the 404s here, i'd be happy to take a look. thanks, -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From hblair at hotfootmail.com Sun Mar 3 16:45:01 2002 From: hblair at hotfootmail.com (Hugh Blair) Date: Sun Mar 3 16:45:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] infinite loops on leo, part II In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > -----Original Message----- > On Behalf Of Warden, Matt > > i brought this up before, but everyone said they weren't experiencing it > and i went to check whether my brains was correctly functioning. > > it's not, but i'm still certain that there are inifinite loops on all 404 > pages, resulting from the fix that was installed to find items linked with > the old message ids. check it: > > http://lists.evolt.org/404archive/Week-of-Mon-20020225/date.html > > if you guys could explain what's handling the 404s here, i'd be happy to > take a look. I see the same think - never completes the 404 page. -Hugh From isaac at members.evolt.org Sun Mar 3 16:59:02 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Sun Mar 3 16:59:02 2002 Subject: [thesite] CSS Files In-Reply-To: <3C80CDA3.3670.42C238AE@localhost> Message-ID: > the other comments i like, although now i'm wondering if there's a better > way to track changes to users don't have to download the extra few > bytes... perhaps one comment which says: "changelog in /css.txt", and then throw the info in there? still accessible to anyone, but not being downloaded unnecessarily. > one of the things i wanted to ask folks here is about moving some > attributes out of the main CSS file and calling them via @import... those > attributes would be "line-height", "padding" and "margin" since those are > the styles that hose NN4.x... IOW, is it worth it to split them i do like that idea (and use it in some of my sites), but could that unnecessarily complicate things *should* a style-changer be implemented? isaac -------------------------------------------------------------- triple zero digital | upstairs at 200 the parade, norwood 5067 (08)83320545 | www.triplezero.com.au | isaac at triplezero.com.au From roselli at earthlink.net Sun Mar 3 19:23:00 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Sun Mar 3 19:23:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] CSS Files In-Reply-To: References: <3C80CDA3.3670.42C238AE@localhost> Message-ID: <3C828590.26537.4978AF67@localhost> > > the other comments i like, although now i'm wondering if there's a > > better way to track changes to users don't have to download the > > extra few bytes... > > perhaps one comment which says: "changelog in /css.txt", and then > throw the info in there? still accessible to anyone, but not being > downloaded unnecessarily. not a bad idea... still simple, still available, doesn't rely on anything else... > > one of the things i wanted to ask folks here is about moving some > > attributes out of the main CSS file and calling them via @import... > > those attributes would be "line-height", "padding" and "margin" > > since those are the styles that hose NN4.x... IOW, is it worth it to > > split them > > i do like that idea (and use it in some of my sites), but could that > unnecessarily complicate things *should* a style-changer be > implemented? yes, which is why i'm wondering if that will ever be implemented in v2... i think i asked jeff, but haven't heard back... From ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk Mon Mar 4 17:26:00 2002 From: ppxsjc1 at nottingham.ac.uk (Simon Coggins) Date: Mon Mar 4 17:26:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] PHP patch Message-ID: Hi, Just checking to see if anyone's patched PHP on the evolt.org servers yet. Apparently there is already a working exploit circulating... http://security.e-matters.de/advisories/012002.html Simon From dmah at shaw.ca Mon Mar 4 17:56:00 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Mon Mar 4 17:56:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] PHP patch In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <200203042356.g24NuWC01872@alice.monkeyland.ca> I believe that Dan disabled file uploads as an interim measure. Dean Simon Coggins writes: > Just checking to see if anyone's patched PHP on the evolt.org servers > yet. Apparently there is already a working exploit circulating... > > http://security.e-matters.de/advisories/012002.html From gnarly at punkass.com Wed Mar 6 06:52:00 2002 From: gnarly at punkass.com (Olly) Date: Wed Mar 6 06:52:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Evolt Header Error Message-ID: <01fa01c1c50d$c07ed9b0$0100a8c0@Comp1> Why does http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thelist have a link to FAQs in the header, whereas nowhere else seems to have that link? And when hovering over the link in question (in Opera 6.01, Win2k) it appears in the status bar as "Frequentlyasked questions". Personally I think it should be visible on all the pages... Olly. From roselli at earthlink.net Wed Mar 6 09:06:04 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Wed Mar 6 09:06:04 2002 Subject: [thesite] Evolt Header Error In-Reply-To: <01fa01c1c50d$c07ed9b0$0100a8c0@Comp1> Message-ID: <200203061505.g26F55qc007658@leo.evolt.org> > From: "Olly" > > Why does http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thelist have a link > to FAQs in the header, whereas nowhere else seems to have that link? damn... you're good... > And when hovering over the link in question (in Opera 6.01, Win2k) it > appears in the status bar as "Frequentlyasked questions". in IE, the tool-tip is spaced correctly... ahh, it's the line-wrap between "Frequently" and "asked"... Opera seems to concatenate... > Personally I think it should be visible on all the pages... i tend to agree, although i also think it needs to be consistent (because, technically it is visible on all pages as the question mark button under the tab)... From roselli at earthlink.net Wed Mar 6 09:25:01 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Wed Mar 6 09:25:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] ISO entity for { and } ? Message-ID: <200203061524.g26FOUqc008653@leo.evolt.org> you know, i did a damn article on character entities, but this one isn't in the W3C docs... i need to know the character entity code for the { and } characters... i've got an XSL file building a JS function, and, well, it's blowing up... From gnarly at punkass.com Wed Mar 6 10:31:00 2002 From: gnarly at punkass.com (Olly) Date: Wed Mar 6 10:31:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Evolt Header Error References: <200203061505.g26F55qc007658@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <03a201c1c52c$46e2dbf0$0100a8c0@Comp1> ----- Original Message ----- From: "aardvark" Subject: Re: [thesite] Evolt Header Error > > Why does http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thelist have a link > > to FAQs in the header, whereas nowhere else seems to have that link? > > damn... you're good... :-) I spotted it, thought "ooh, thats new, whats it do?" and clicked it. It loaded and SHOCK HORROR! The link had gone. I checked a few other pages/subdomains and it was nowhere to be seen... > > Personally I think it should be visible on all the pages... > > i tend to agree, although i also think it needs to be consistent > (because, technically it is visible on all pages as the question mark > button under the tab)... Good point, I'd forgotten about that button. Besides, that space will be taken by "Food" at some point in the future anyway :-) (BTW how is f.e.o progressing ?) Cheers, Olly. From r937 at interlog.com Wed Mar 6 10:59:00 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Wed Mar 6 10:59:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] ISO entity for { and } ? Message-ID: <01c1c530$46fa5ec0$ca4c149a@rudy> >i need to know the character entity code for the { and } characters... dude, remember that zdnet chart? http://www.zdnet.com/devhead/resources/href/ascii.html ` - = [ ] \ ; * , . / ~ ! @ # $ % ^ ( ) _ + { } | : ? | " ' The characters above do not require encoding. Cut and paste them at will. so i suppose there are numeric entities for them (you look 'em up) but not character entities rudy From roselli at earthlink.net Wed Mar 6 11:19:09 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Wed Mar 6 11:19:09 2002 Subject: [thesite] ISO entity for { and } ? In-Reply-To: <01c1c530$46fa5ec0$ca4c149a@rudy> Message-ID: <200203061718.g26HIaqc014036@leo.evolt.org> > From: "rudy" > > >i need to know the character entity code for the { and } > >characters... > > dude, remember that zdnet chart? > > http://www.zdnet.com/devhead/resources/href/ascii.html > > ` - = [ ] \ ; * , . / ~ ! @ # $ % ^ ( ) _ + { } | : ? | " ' > > The characters above do not require encoding. > Cut and paste them at will. > > so i suppose there are numeric entities for them (you look 'em up) but > not character entities that's the thing, i can't find 'em anywhere... and i sent this to the wrong list... ugh. From r937 at interlog.com Wed Mar 6 12:05:00 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Wed Mar 6 12:05:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] ISO entity for { and } ? Message-ID: <01c1c535$a09bfb00$ca4c149a@rudy> >that's the thing, i can't find 'em anywhere... > >and i sent this to the wrong list... well, i saw your question on thelist, and i don't know xsl or whatever it is, but the numeric representations are { { Left curly brace | | Vertical bar } } Right curly brace i have a table of those if you want From rwd at csi1st.net Wed Mar 6 12:27:00 2002 From: rwd at csi1st.net (Ron Dorman) Date: Wed Mar 6 12:27:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] ISO entity for { and } ? References: <01c1c535$a09bfb00$ca4c149a@rudy> Message-ID: <3C865E1D.F03867A2@csi1st.net> rudy wrote: > { { Left curly brace > | | Vertical bar > } } Right curly brace > > i have a table of those if you want can I butt in and request a copy of your table? Ron D. From r937 at interlog.com Wed Mar 6 12:42:00 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Wed Mar 6 12:42:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] ISO entity for { and } ? Message-ID: <01c1c53e$a589cbc0$ca4c149a@rudy> >can I butt in and request a copy of your table? soiteny http://rudy.ca/htmlchar.htm (16k) built in september 1996 can't remember where i stole it from, but i think it was intended to be shown in a fixed font, because i remember editing it to get it into an html table but note even back then,  - Ÿ Unused From mwarden at mattwarden.com Wed Mar 6 19:37:00 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Wed Mar 6 19:37:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] infinite loops on leo, part II In-Reply-To: Message-ID: whoever fixed this, thanks! On Mar 3, Warden, Matt had something to say about [thesite] infinite loops... > >i brought this up before, but everyone said they weren't experiencing it >and i went to check whether my brains was correctly functioning. > >it's not, but i'm still certain that there are inifinite loops on all 404 >pages, resulting from the fix that was installed to find items linked with >the old message ids. check it: > >http://lists.evolt.org/404archive/Week-of-Mon-20020225/date.html > >if you guys could explain what's handling the 404s here, i'd be happy to >take a look. > >thanks, > >-- >mattwarden >mattwarden.com From mwarden at mattwarden.com Tue Mar 12 18:12:01 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Tue Mar 12 18:12:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] recent comments page Message-ID: http://www.evolt.org/comment/index.html what do you guys think about adding the body of the comments in there as well? it would sure help regulars like myself who have most likely read the articles which are being commented on, as we wouldn't have to open each article just to view the comments. there's surely an argument against giving comments out of context, but, if one was going to respond to the out-of-context comment, they'd have to first open up the article page, so maybe it's not a big deal. thoughts? i know it'd make my life easier and would make checking out what's new on evolt a much quicker (and less "windowed") task. -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From jeff at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 12 18:38:01 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Tue Mar 12 18:38:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] recent comments page In-Reply-To: Message-ID: matt, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Warden, Matt > > http://www.evolt.org/comment/index.html > > what do you guys think about adding the body of the > comments in there as well? it would sure help regulars > like myself who have most likely read the articles which > are being commented on, as we wouldn't have to open > each article just to view the comments. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< check the "show comments with results" checkbox and click the search button. problem solved. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From mwarden at mattwarden.com Tue Mar 12 18:41:01 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Tue Mar 12 18:41:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] recent comments page In-Reply-To: Message-ID: doh! thanks jeff. On Mar 12, .jeff had something to say about RE: [thesite] recent comments page >check the "show comments with results" checkbox and click the search button. > >problem solved. indeed. -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From djc at members.evolt.org Thu Mar 14 16:20:00 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Thu Mar 14 16:20:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] any PHP folks for a minute? Message-ID: Anyone decent with PHP got a bit of time to code a *simple* PHP based formail script? http://members.evolt.org/contact/c2.php is what i've got so far, but have a couple other things that need immediate attention. its nothing serious, just 3 fields. i'd appreciate if anyne can help out :) .djc. From mwarden at mattwarden.com Thu Mar 14 16:48:00 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Thu Mar 14 16:48:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] any PHP folks for a minute? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: yeah, i'll get it. what's the to: address? and i dunno if i can fix the wonkiness of the page (see the "sidebar") tho. also, what's it under? meo_html or something? rock, On Mar 14, Daniel J. Cody had something to say about [thesite] any PHP... >Anyone decent with PHP got a bit of time to code a *simple* PHP based >formail script? > >http://members.evolt.org/contact/c2.php > >is what i've got so far, but have a couple other things that need >immediate attention. its nothing serious, just 3 fields. > >i'd appreciate if anyne can help out :) -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From djc at members.evolt.org Thu Mar 14 20:49:00 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Thu Mar 14 20:49:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] any PHP folks for a minute? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: doh, sorry buddy, andrew f. beat ya to the punch. i'm sure thats cool, thanks for the offer though :) .djc. On Thu, 14 Mar 2002, Warden, Matt wrote: > > yeah, i'll get it. what's the to: address? > > and i dunno if i can fix the wonkiness of the page (see the > "sidebar") tho. > > also, what's it under? meo_html or something? > > rock, > > On Mar 14, Daniel J. Cody had something to say about [thesite] any PHP... > > >Anyone decent with PHP got a bit of time to code a *simple* PHP based > >formail script? > > > >http://members.evolt.org/contact/c2.php > > > >is what i've got so far, but have a couple other things that need > >immediate attention. its nothing serious, just 3 fields. > > > >i'd appreciate if anyne can help out :) > > > -- > mattwarden > mattwarden.com > > _______________________________________________ > For unsubscribe, archive, and options, go to: > http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thesite > From rwd at csi1st.net Thu Mar 14 21:30:01 2002 From: rwd at csi1st.net (Ron Dorman) Date: Thu Mar 14 21:30:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] any PHP folks for a minute? References: Message-ID: <3C916C07.A562AE80@csi1st.net> "Daniel J. Cody" wrote: > doh, sorry buddy, andrew f. beat ya to the punch. i'm sure thats cool, > thanks for the offer though :) yeah, yeah, yeah . . . . finally get out of meetings and look what's happened. nice contact page Dan. Ron D. From amanda at gawow.com Sun Mar 17 14:51:00 2002 From: amanda at gawow.com (A. Erickson) Date: Sun Mar 17 14:51:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] VotingReqs Document Message-ID: <000101c1cdf5$b6138a20$9cd563d8@75CTT01> Hello, all! I just wanted to forward this document (at end of this email) to thesite and see if this can be implemented. We basically need to get together a voting application that can serve a few different functions: - formal voting - polling available to all evolt members (login/pass) - polling available to any site visitor We've hashed through this document pretty thoroughly (I hope!) over on theforum list and the start of the document discussion begins here: http://lists.evolt.org/theforumarchive/Week-of-Mon-20020128/002969.html. I've tried to be very clear in the reqs document and cover the basic aspects. What I did not delve into was how logins or privilege levels would be used to close off polls. I'm hoping that you all can suss that out; it's information that I'm not totally privy to anyway. The levels of voting that I can see needing to be implemented would go something like this: - open poll available to any site visitor - poll open to all evolt members with login/pass - vote open to multiple list groups (thesite, theforum, etc.) - vote open to individual list groups only (thesite, theforum, admin etc.) I am not subscribed to thesite list but will try and follow discussion in the archives. If you have any questions for me, please email me at amanda at gawow.com. Thanks to Isaac, Jeff Howden, Adrian, Elfur, Matt W., Madhu, Rudy, Martin, Michele, Ron Luther, and Erika for help and participation in getting this document together. - amanda The VotingReqs document can be found at the evolt wiki http://freezope2.nipltd.net/acorn/evolt/VotingReqs or pasted below: ....................................................... VotingReqs Background Currently the decision-making body of evolt.org has no method for taking an official vote which includes tracking of the vote, tallying results, recording the vote and notifying voting members of a vote in progress or its results. The current ad-hoc system of ayes and nays (or +1s) works in a general sense but fails when buy-in is required from a larger number of people on an important issue. It also fails in terms of tracking the vote results and progress. A more formalized system of voting has been requested and this document aims to produce a tool to facilitate that process. In addition, this document takes into account an informal polling mechanism for use with visitors or members of the evolt.org site. Definitions Vote: refers to the application which requires a login and password to participate in. A vote is formal. A vote does not show individual voters choices but may tally total number voted throughout the voting period. A vote does not reveal results until the closing of the vote. Even at that time, individual participant votes are not shown. Voting body: individuals participating in a formal vote. Poll: refers to an informal and open application. This also does not show individuals choices but does show a running tally of results that may be viewed at any time. May require login/pass but can be absolutely open--any visitor can participate. Purpose of document The purpose of this document is to outline the requirements for a voting application and polling tool to be used by evolt's general membership and visitors. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -------- Requirements list Voting and Polling Application features: --Create a vote or poll based on login/privilege code. (Only those with a certain privilege code will be able to call a vote or poll -- may need to also specify list-specific voting groups.) --Polls and votes will have a start time and an end time based on GMT. --Notify voting body through individual emails that a vote has been called and give the details including day/time voting closes, nature of a vote and any associated details. --Notify voting body when 24 hours until end of vote. --Notify voting body when a vote has closed. --Tally votes after the closing of a vote and show results. --Does not identify individual voters and votes. (This allows people the anonymity to vote in an unpopular way as well as not be swayed by the voters before them. If possible, anonymity should be kept in perpetuity to all people.) --Allow a voter to go in and change their own vote at any time while the vote is still open. --Votes and results are archived. --A poll will be less formal and can be open to the general public. The poll will keep a running tally of results, viewable at any time. The poll will not reveal individuals voter's preferences nor will it notify voters of anything. --Polls and results are archived. Interface elements: --Initial screen to choose between a poll or a vote. --A field for summation of the subject of the vote or poll. (Any changes to this field after submission should, if possible, trigger an announcement email to the voting body.) --Radio boxes for creating your option(s). --A memo field for additional information which can be toggled on and off. (This could and should include URLs? to archive postings related to the vote at hand as well as any historical notations relevant to the vote.) Show at any time and to any voter how many people have voted and possible number of voters. (for example: 12/20 -12 voters out of a possible 20 have registered their votes) ......................................................./end ___________________________________ amanda at gawow.com + http://gawow.com From joxn at vernum.com Sun Mar 17 15:10:00 2002 From: joxn at vernum.com (Joxn) Date: Sun Mar 17 15:10:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] copyright Message-ID: <3C95069F.2070609@vernum.com> Hey, just a tiny one, but I guess, the copyright metatag on w.e.o should read 1998-2002 now. bye Joxn -- || //\\ \\// |\\|| :: joxn at vernum.com :: \\|| \\// //\\ ||\\| :: 8053703 :: From djc at members.evolt.org Mon Mar 18 11:17:01 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Mon Mar 18 11:17:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] copyright In-Reply-To: <3C95069F.2070609@vernum.com> Message-ID: took a while to find it on weo, but got it changed. also changed on the subsites. thanks for the headsup joxn :) .djc. On Sun, 17 Mar 2002, Joxn wrote: > Hey, > just a tiny one, but I guess, the copyright metatag on w.e.o should read > 1998-2002 now. > From mwarden at mattwarden.com Mon Mar 18 17:26:00 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Mon Mar 18 17:26:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] comments search Message-ID: http://www.evolt.org/comment/index.html click "show comments with results" click "search" then click any of the page numbers at the bottom or the "next 10 comments" you'll have to have more than 10 comments there, of course. "all" get's filled in as the keyword, somehow and nothing is returned. -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 19 10:49:00 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 19 10:49:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links Message-ID: <200203191648.g2JGmSXt029416@leo.evolt.org> so, this link sits on webword: http://www.evolt.org/index.cfm?menu=8&cid=2396&catid=25 but doesn't seem to resolve at all... it points to this: http://evolt.org/article/view/25/2396/ are we still capturing old-style URLs? i thought we were when i tested for the book... did i miss something? From djc at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 19 11:08:00 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Tue Mar 19 11:08:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] recent comments not escaping html Message-ID: if you hit any page on the evolt site right now, the sidebar underneath a recent article by adrian is in italics. looks like the article he was commenting on has an EM tag in it, but the 'most recent comments' isn't stripping it, or something. .djc. From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 19 11:28:09 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 19 11:28:09 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] recent comments not escaping html In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <200203191727.g2JHRgXt031952@leo.evolt.org> > From: "Daniel J. Cody" > > if you hit any page on the evolt site right now, the sidebar > underneath a recent article by adrian is in italics. looks like the > article he was commenting on has an EM tag in it, but the 'most recent > comments' isn't stripping it, or something. the bug could be something else -- allowing me to use in an article title... just a thought... From jeff at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 19 12:28:01 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Tue Mar 19 12:28:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: <200203191648.g2JGmSXt029416@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: aardvark, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: aardvark > > so, this link sits on webword: > http://www.evolt.org/index.cfm?menu=8&cid=2396&catid=25 > > but doesn't seem to resolve at all... it points to this: > http://evolt.org/article/view/25/2396/ > > are we still capturing old-style URLs? i thought we > were when i tested for the book... did i miss something? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< we are capturing them, but the redirect doesn't seem to be working properly in some browsers. cmd> GET /index.cfm?menu=8&cid=2396&catid=25 HTTP/1.0 cmd> Host: www.evolt.org cmd> text/html => index.cfm RequestDone Error = 0 StatusCode = 301 Received 14964 bytes hdr>HTTP/1.1 301 Permanently moved hdr>Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 18:17:40 GMT hdr>Server: Apache/1.3.23 (Unix) hdr>Location : http://www.evolt.org/article/You_Call_em_That_em_Web_Site_Testing/25/2396/index.html hdr>Page-Completion-Status: Normal hdr>Set-Cookie: CFID=1016591; expires=Sun, 27-Sep-2037 00:00:00 GMT; path=/; hdr>Set-Cookie: CFTOKEN=92886779; expires=Sun, 27-Sep-2037 00:00:00 GMT; path=/; hdr>Connection: close hdr>Content-Type: text/html i'm guessing most browsers don't correctly interpret the 301 error code, at least not ie6 or nn4. nn6.2 performs the redirect properly. nn4 just shows an ugly 404 page with a link to the article. ie6 (and i suspect ie5.x also) just throw up an internal error page. that's not terribly useful at all. not sure what the solution is. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 19 13:10:02 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 19 13:10:02 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: References: <200203191648.g2JGmSXt029416@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <200203191909.g2JJ9HXt006475@leo.evolt.org> > From: ".jeff" > > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > > > so, this link sits on webword: > > http://www.evolt.org/index.cfm?menu=8&cid=2396&catid=25 > > > > but doesn't seem to resolve at all... it points to this: > > http://evolt.org/article/view/25/2396/ > > > > are we still capturing old-style URLs? i thought we > > were when i tested for the book... did i miss something? > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > we are capturing them, but the redirect doesn't seem to be working > properly in some browsers. [...] > i'm guessing most browsers don't correctly interpret the 301 error > code, at least not ie6 or nn4. nn6.2 performs the redirect properly. IE5.5/win isn't... but why using 301 instead of 302? i know for a fact 302 has very broad support... > nn4 just shows an ugly 404 page with a link to the article. ie6 (and > i suspect ie5.x also) just throw up an internal error page. that's > not terribly useful at all. not sure what the solution is. 302? From mwarden at mattwarden.com Tue Mar 19 13:58:01 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Tue Mar 19 13:58:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: <200203191909.g2JJ9HXt006475@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: On Mar 19, aardvark had something to say about RE: [thesite] old links >but why using 301 instead of 302? > >i know for a fact 302 has very broad support... I'm pretty sure we were trying to stick to the standard and not the hack... 302 is permenantly moved... which is what we want 301 is temporarily moved (right?)... which is not what we want but, if it don't work, it don't work -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 19 14:35:00 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 19 14:35:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: References: <200203191909.g2JJ9HXt006475@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <200203192034.g2JKYAXt010854@leo.evolt.org> > From: "Warden, Matt" > > >but why using 301 instead of 302? > > > >i know for a fact 302 has very broad support... > > I'm pretty sure we were trying to stick to the standard and not the > hack... which is the hack? > 302 is permenantly moved... which is what we want > 301 is temporarily moved (right?)... which is not what we want > > but, if it don't work, it don't work we currently use 301, based on jeff's header dump... From jeff at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 19 14:36:00 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Tue Mar 19 14:36:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: Message-ID: matt, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Warden, Matt > > I'm pretty sure we were trying to stick to the standard > and not the hack... > > 302 is permenantly moved... which is what we want > 301 is temporarily moved (right?)... which is not what > we want ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< actually, you've got it backwards. 302 is found or temporarily moved, depending on what reference you read. 301 is moved permanently. however, support for 301 seems to be shoddy at best. 301 -- Moved Permanently http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec10.html#sec10.3.2 302 -- Found http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec10.html#sec10.3.3 ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > but, if it don't work, it don't work ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< kind of the reality check for anyone spouting about how their way is standards compliant, eh? .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From mwarden at mattwarden.com Tue Mar 19 14:40:01 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Tue Mar 19 14:40:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mar 19, .jeff had something to say about RE: [thesite] old links >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< >> but, if it don't work, it don't work >><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > >kind of the reality check for anyone spouting about how their way is standards compliant, eh? sure except the way we're doing it *is* standards compliant i wish the browsers were too anywho, should we change it? what are the implications for search engine indexing? any? those indexes are probably updated by now anyways -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From djc at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 19 14:42:00 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Tue Mar 19 14:42:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 19 Mar 2002, .jeff wrote: > we are capturing them, but the redirect doesn't seem to be working properly in some browsers. > > cmd> GET /index.cfm?menu=8&cid=2396&catid=25 HTTP/1.0 > cmd> Host: www.evolt.org 'Host' is only needed in http 1.1, which your program should be using. unless you're connecting to the server after you specify which file to get, which seems wacky. > i'm guessing most browsers don't correctly interpret the 301 error code, at least not ie6 or nn4. nn6.2 performs the redirect properly. nn4 just shows an ugly 404 page with a link to the article. ie6 (and i suspect ie5.x also) just throw up an internal error page. that's not terribly useful at all. not sure what the solution is. no, most browsers do interpret it correctly. if they're not, its because friendly error messages are turned on(ie5x worked for me on PC and mac). NN4 also showed an evolt page with a link and 'sorry' paragraph on os9.1, linux and windows, so i'm not sure what you're seeing... the problem, as demonstrated above, is that we're using the wrong protocol version to test this out. in http 1.1 301 is a permanent move, 302 is 'found'. in http 1.0 301 is temporarily moved and 302 is perm. try it from a telnet prompt or set your tools to use http1.1 and you'll see .djc. From isaac at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 19 14:43:00 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Tue Mar 19 14:43:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] recent comments not escaping html In-Reply-To: <200203191727.g2JHRgXt031952@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: > the bug could be something else -- allowing me to use in an > article title... you're the bug... From jeff at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 19 15:30:01 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Tue Mar 19 15:30:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: Message-ID: dan, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Daniel J. Cody > > > i'm guessing most browsers don't correctly interpret > > the 301 error code, at least not ie6 or nn4. nn6.2 > > performs the redirect properly. nn4 just shows an > > ugly 404 page with a link to the article. ie6 (and i > > suspect ie5.x also) just throw up an internal error > > page. that's not terribly useful at all. not sure > > what the solution is. > > no, most browsers do interpret it correctly. if they're > not, its because friendly error messages are turned on > (ie5x worked for me on PC and mac). ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< well, friendly http error messages has *long* since been turned off on my machine, so that's not it. it does seem to work on mac/ie5 though. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > NN4 also showed an evolt page with a link and 'sorry' > paragraph on os9.1, linux and windows, so i'm not sure > what you're seeing... ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< yeah, that's what i meant by an ugly 404 page. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > the problem, as demonstrated above, is that we're using > the wrong protocol version to test this out. in http 1.1 > 301 is a permanent move, 302 is 'found'. in http 1.0 301 > is temporarily moved and 302 is perm. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< seriously? they switched them to be the opposite of what they were in http1.0? this is the sort of thing i hate about waving standards in people's face. if the standards can't even get the shit right between different versions, how the heck can we expect browsers to get it right. i think the solution is to use status code 302 since far more browsers know what to do with that. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From filip at netdesign.se Tue Mar 19 15:58:01 2002 From: filip at netdesign.se (Filip Salomonsson) Date: Tue Mar 19 15:58:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20020319225738.A30164@netdesign.se> Daniel J. Cody wrote: > the problem, as demonstrated above, is that we're using the wrong > protocol version to test this out. in http 1.1 301 is a permanent move, > 302 is 'found'. in http 1.0 301 is temporarily moved and 302 is perm. No it isn't. 302 is "Moved temporarily" in 1.0, and "Found" in 1.1. Their meanings are the same, though. 301 and 302 have not been switched in between versions. But the browser support for all 30x responses is basically really crappy. I don't know of any major browser that doesn't interpret 302 as "go here. now.", though. /filip -- trained by sea lions. From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 19 17:39:01 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 19 17:39:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200203192338.g2JNclXt019516@leo.evolt.org> > From: ".jeff" [...] > well, friendly http error messages has *long* since been turned > off on my machine, so that's not it. same here, and i tested it out... > i think the solution is to use status code 302 since far more browsers > know what to do with that. +1 From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 19 17:39:03 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 19 17:39:03 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] recent comments not escaping html In-Reply-To: References: <200203191727.g2JHRgXt031952@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <200203192338.g2JNcmXt019519@leo.evolt.org> > From: "isaac" > > > the bug could be something else -- allowing me to use in an > > article title... > > you're the bug... normally i eat them... so, worth changing the title? From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 19 17:39:09 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 19 17:39:09 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200203192338.g2JNcmXt019521@leo.evolt.org> > From: "Warden, Matt" > > >kind of the reality check for anyone spouting about how their way is > >standards compliant, eh? > > sure > > except the way we're doing it *is* standards compliant to 1.0... or 1.1... or one of them... > i wish the browsers were too +1. but we're all in that boat... > anywho, should we change it? what are the implications for search > engine indexing? any? > > those indexes are probably updated by now anyways SEs regularly traverse pages i've built with 302s... it's worth noting that ASP's response.redirect uses the 302, which given the number of splash skippers and moved pages i've built, still hasn't slowed down the indexing spiders... anyway, since they'd only come in on those URLs from pages with the old links, i'd love to see the source of the URLs updated, but that ain't happening... From isaac at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 19 17:52:00 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Tue Mar 19 17:52:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] recent comments not escaping html In-Reply-To: <200203192338.g2JNcmXt019519@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: > normally i eat them... as do Pixel and i... (i think he enjoys it, whereas i only do it for the laughs). > so, worth changing the title? yeh. From djc at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 19 18:03:01 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Tue Mar 19 18:03:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: <200203192338.g2JNcmXt019521@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 19 Mar 2002, aardvark wrote: > > except the way we're doing it *is* standards compliant > > to 1.0... or 1.1... or one of them... see, to me, this is like using HTML 3.2 instead of HTML4.01 because its easier. why the double standard? > SEs regularly traverse pages i've built with 302s... they got it with the 301's there(obviously) too. From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 19 18:13:01 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 19 18:13:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] recent comments not escaping html In-Reply-To: References: <200203192338.g2JNcmXt019519@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <200203200012.g2K0C6Xt020992@leo.evolt.org> > From: "isaac" > > > normally i eat them... > > as do Pixel and i... (i think he enjoys it, whereas i only do it for > the laughs). crunchy > > so, worth changing the title? > > yeh. go fer it... From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 19 18:13:02 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 19 18:13:02 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: References: <200203192338.g2JNcmXt019521@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <200203200012.g2K0CBXt020991@leo.evolt.org> > From: "Daniel J. Cody" > > > > except the way we're doing it *is* standards compliant > > > > to 1.0... or 1.1... or one of them... > > see, to me, this is like using HTML 3.2 instead of HTML4.01 because > its easier. why the double standard? actually, we use HTML 4.01 instead of XHTML 1.0 because of this very reason... we want more people to see our site as intended than not (or see it, period)... that's actually a really good analogy... > > SEs regularly traverse pages i've built with 302s... > > they got it with the 301's there(obviously) too. yeah, but what if the user clicks the link (like on Webword) and can't get there? what good is an indexed page if you can't see it? either way, i trust you guys will make the right decision, but my only goal was to get it to work for me... and there are a lot of me (win2k/IE5.5) out there... and we all know that many mes aren't nice... From isaac at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 19 18:19:00 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Tue Mar 19 18:19:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] [bug] recent comments not escaping html In-Reply-To: <200203200012.g2K0C6Xt020992@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: > > > so, worth changing the title? > > > > yeh. > > go fer it... you do it. not my article title to change. i guess you can either remove the gear or come up with a diff way to stress the word. up to you. From mwarden at mattwarden.com Tue Mar 19 18:59:00 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Tue Mar 19 18:59:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: <200203192338.g2JNcmXt019521@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: On Mar 19, aardvark had something to say about RE: [thesite] old links >> anywho, should we change it? what are the implications for search >> engine indexing? any? >> >> those indexes are probably updated by now anyways > >SEs regularly traverse pages i've built with 302s... > >it's worth noting that ASP's response.redirect uses the 302, which >given the number of splash skippers and moved pages i've built, >still hasn't slowed down the indexing spiders... > >anyway, since they'd only come in on those URLs from pages with >the old links, i'd love to see the source of the URLs updated, but >that ain't happening... you're missing the point. if a link is a 404, the SE doesn't index it if the link is a 301, the SE indexes it as the first URL (the old url) or the redirect url? if the link is a 302, the SE indexes it as the first URL (the old url) or the redirect url? the idea is to get rid of the old URLs, no? my question was whether they'd be out of the index by now... -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From filip at netdesign.se Tue Mar 19 19:42:01 2002 From: filip at netdesign.se (Filip Salomonsson) Date: Tue Mar 19 19:42:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: References: <200203192338.g2JNcmXt019521@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <20020320024213.A32570@netdesign.se> Warden, Matt wrote: > > if a link is a 404, the SE doesn't index it > if the link is a 301, the SE indexes it as the first URL (the old url) or > the redirect url? > if the link is a 302, the SE indexes it as the first URL (the old url) or > the redirect url? On seeing a 301, it _should_ only index the "new" url. 302s are a bit trickier, I suppose, since the "old" url likely doesn't provide much of a page to index, but may well do so at some other occasion. I don't know how search engines actually handle 301s today, but we to loads of 302s at shorl.com, and we've noticed that Google actually indexes our urls (those returning the 302s), but with the content of the "target" urls. Examples: So I guess with 302s, the old urls just won't go away. /filip -- trained by sea lions. From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 19 22:02:00 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 19 22:02:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: References: <200203192338.g2JNcmXt019521@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <3C97C2F5.20560.24043388@localhost> > From: "Warden, Matt" > > > >anyway, since they'd only come in on those URLs from pages with > >the old links, i'd love to see the source of the URLs updated, but > >that ain't happening... > > you're missing the point. no, we're just looking at it differently... > if a link is a 404, the SE doesn't index it > if the link is a 301, the SE indexes it as the first URL (the old url) > or the redirect url? if the link is a 302, the SE indexes it as the > first URL (the old url) or the redirect url? dunno... but i'm not quite so concerned about SEs as you... > the idea is to get rid of the old URLs, no? no, the idea is to allow the old URLs to still work for as many people as possible... > my question was whether they'd be out of the index by now... out of the SE index, i'm sure, at least based on my searches that always turn up evolt.org articles... but it's an issue of whether those sites linking to us will still have valid links or not... i want *those* links to work... if those links work, then there's really no issue, except for the occasional SE index... of course, once the SE gets to the site, all other links within the site are the new URL scheme... From djc at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 19 22:03:01 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Tue Mar 19 22:03:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] old links In-Reply-To: <20020320024213.A32570@netdesign.se> Message-ID: On Wed, 20 Mar 2002, Filip Salomonsson wrote: > On seeing a 301, it _should_ only index the "new" url. 302s are a bit trickier, > I suppose, since the "old" url likely doesn't provide much of a page to index, > but may well do so at some other occasion. yup > I don't know how search engines actually handle 301s today, but we to loads of > 302s at shorl.com, and we've noticed that Google actually indexes our urls > (those returning the 302s), but with the content of the "target" urls. > Examples: i think when we launched 2.0 and had to deal with the consequences of the 404 template thing, we delt with this very issue. thats why the 301 was put in place - google was returning the 'this page can be found ' pages for almost every article - and they've picked it up well for the last year... .djc. From 99999 at wz163.com Wed Mar 20 20:56:00 2002 From: 99999 at wz163.com (金潮网网管) Date: Wed Mar 20 20:56:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] 酷网推荐 Message-ID: <200203210255.g2L2teXt025021@leo.evolt.org> [ Converted text/html to text/plain ] ???????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????????????????? ? ?????????????????????????????????????? ???? ??????http://www.jcw.cc ????????????????????????????????? ?????[???]????[1]???????????????? ---------------------------------------------------- INFORMATION This message has been sent using a trial-run version of the TSmtpRelayServer Delphi Component. ---------------------------------------------------- ===References:=== 1. http://love2net.51.net/ From jeff at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 26 02:26:01 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Tue Mar 26 02:26:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] "bug" fixes Message-ID: just a quick note, i found out about a new tag in cf5 that allows the flushing of the query cache when called. so, i added it to all the necessary pages. an article, comments, and ratings can go entirely through the process and all the data on the homepage will now reflect the changes in real time. no more waiting for 20 minutes of inactivity for it to show. see changelog for details. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From djc at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 26 10:28:00 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Tue Mar 26 10:28:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] non anti-aliased image? Message-ID: <3CA0A16B.40905@members.evolt.org> trying to get the new meo webmail kinks worked out, and one of the remaining ones is the image i have for evolt in it isn't showing up correctly on the variety of backgrounds that can be used. example: http://members.evolt.org/djc/evolt/temp/badlogo.png i tried almost every logo(including the ones that said they'd work well on any background) on the "Where can i get evolt.org images" page, but non have worked. is there one out there that i don't know about, or can someone take an image of adrians source file(roselli.org/new_evolt i think) and create one? would be appreciated :) .djc. From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 26 11:14:00 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 26 11:14:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] non anti-aliased image? In-Reply-To: <3CA0A16B.40905@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <200203261713.g2QHDnXt031091@leo.evolt.org> > From: "Daniel J. Cody" > > trying to get the new meo webmail kinks worked out, and one of the > remaining ones is the image i have for evolt in it isn't showing up > correctly on the variety of backgrounds that can be used. > > example: http://members.evolt.org/djc/evolt/temp/badlogo.png > > i tried almost every logo(including the ones that said they'd work > well on any background) on the "Where can i get evolt.org images" > page, but non have worked. how's it look with: http://members.evolt.org/djc/stdio/images/logo_aliased.gif that didn't seem to be the one you used in your .png... the other option is we just stuff it onto a background? > is there one out there that i don't know about, or can someone take an > image of adrians source file(roselli.org/new_evolt i think) and create > one? http://roselli.org/new_evolt/logos.asp From djc at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 26 11:59:01 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Tue Mar 26 11:59:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] non anti-aliased image? In-Reply-To: <200203261713.g2QHDnXt031091@leo.evolt.org> References: <200203261713.g2QHDnXt031091@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <36008.63.237.54.129.1017165484.squirrel@members.evolt.org> > how's it look with: > http://members.evolt.org/djc/stdio/images/logo_aliased.gif http://members.evolt.org/djc/evolt/temp/badlogo2.png > that didn't seem to be the one you used in your .png... > > the other option is we just stuff it onto a background? the prob with that for this app at least is there are user selectable styles, with a huge number of possible bgcolors thnx homey >> is there one out there that i don't know about, or can someone take an >> image of adrians source file(roselli.org/new_evolt i think) and create >> one? > > http://roselli.org/new_evolt/logos.asp > _______________________________________________ > For unsubscribe, archive, and options, go to: > http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thesite From lists at mantruc.com Tue Mar 26 12:05:08 2002 From: lists at mantruc.com (javier velasco) Date: Tue Mar 26 12:05:08 2002 Subject: [thesite] non anti-aliased image? References: <200203261713.g2QHDnXt031091@leo.evolt.org> <36008.63.237.54.129.1017165484.squirrel@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <3CA0B810.D4C91D3C@mantruc.com> "Daniel J. Cody" wrote: > the prob with that for this app at least is there are user selectable > styles, with a huge number of possible bgcolors i see 2 solutions: - build some system that detects the backgroung color and applies a white or black text version of the logo according to the background's brightness - frame the logo into a white or black box and leave the transparency away -- Javier Velasco Work - http://www.nurun.cl Me - http://mantruc.com Family - http://evolt.org From djc at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 26 13:36:00 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Tue Mar 26 13:36:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] non anti-aliased image? In-Reply-To: <3CA0A16B.40905@members.evolt.org> References: <3CA0A16B.40905@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <32864.63.237.54.129.1017171346.squirrel@members.evolt.org> i shoulda tried it myself before asking for help.. http://members.evolt.org/djc/temp/badlogo3.png thanks javi and aard at any rate :) i've got copies of the white & black & greyish text as well, which i'll prolly move up to that faq page sometime soon. http://members.evolt.org/images/logo_anti_black.png http://members.evolt.org/images/logo_anti_white.png http://members.evolt.org/images/logo_anti.png > trying to get the new meo webmail kinks worked out, and one of the > remaining ones is the image i have for evolt in it isn't showing up > correctly on the variety of backgrounds that can be used. > > example: http://members.evolt.org/djc/evolt/temp/badlogo.png > > i tried almost every logo(including the ones that said they'd work well > on any background) on the "Where can i get evolt.org images" page, but > non have worked. > > is there one out there that i don't know about, or can someone take an > image of adrians source file(roselli.org/new_evolt i think) and create > one? > > would be appreciated :) > > .djc. > > _______________________________________________ > For unsubscribe, archive, and options, go to: > http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thesite From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 26 14:24:00 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 26 14:24:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] non anti-aliased image? In-Reply-To: <36008.63.237.54.129.1017165484.squirrel@members.evolt.org> References: <200203261713.g2QHDnXt031091@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <200203262023.g2QKN2Xt008762@leo.evolt.org> > From: "Daniel J. Cody" > > > how's it look with: > > http://members.evolt.org/djc/stdio/images/logo_aliased.gif > > http://members.evolt.org/djc/evolt/temp/badlogo2.png 404 > > that didn't seem to be the one you used in your .png... > > > > the other option is we just stuff it onto a background? > > the prob with that for this app at least is there are user selectable > styles, with a huge number of possible bgcolors the one i mention above is supposed to alleviate that by adding a white aliased border around the black aliased text... it was built to handle any possible bg... now, it's possible it isn't perfect... but i can fix that... i hope... From djc at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 26 14:46:00 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Tue Mar 26 14:46:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] non anti-aliased image? In-Reply-To: <200203262023.g2QKN2Xt008762@leo.evolt.org> References: <200203262023.g2QKN2Xt008762@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <32889.63.237.54.129.1017175512.squirrel@members.evolt.org> >> From: "Daniel J. Cody" >> >> > how's it look with: >> > http://members.evolt.org/djc/stdio/images/logo_aliased.gif >> >> http://members.evolt.org/djc/evolt/temp/badlogo2.png > > 404 erf. http://members.evolt.org/djc/temp/badlogo3.png From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 26 15:13:00 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 26 15:13:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] non anti-aliased image? In-Reply-To: <32864.63.237.54.129.1017171346.squirrel@members.evolt.org> References: <3CA0A16B.40905@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <200203262112.g2QLC6Xt011216@leo.evolt.org> > From:"Daniel J. Cody" > > i shoulda tried it myself before asking for help.. > > http://members.evolt.org/djc/temp/badlogo3.png i must be missing something.... how's that look on white? > thanks javi and aard at any rate :) > > i've got copies of the white & black & greyish text as well, which > i'll prolly move up to that faq page sometime soon. > http://members.evolt.org/images/logo_anti_black.png > http://members.evolt.org/images/logo_anti_white.png > http://members.evolt.org/images/logo_anti.png any reason you're going with PNG? the last of the three looks pretty bad in IE5.5 because it sits on white... .gif might be the better way to go if you want transparency that has expected results for all... From djc at members.evolt.org Tue Mar 26 15:56:00 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Tue Mar 26 15:56:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] non anti-aliased image? In-Reply-To: <200203262112.g2QLC6Xt011216@leo.evolt.org> References: <200203262112.g2QLC6Xt011216@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <32992.63.237.54.129.1017179723.squirrel@members.evolt.org> >> From:"Daniel J. Cody" >> >> i shoulda tried it myself before asking for help.. >> >> http://members.evolt.org/djc/temp/badlogo3.png > > i must be missing something.... how's that look on white? white is the only background that *isnt* on the webmail thing AFAIK, which is why i used the white text > any reason you're going with PNG? better features, the license isn't a whore, smaller footprint, better compression, gamma correction, etc. From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 26 16:22:01 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 26 16:22:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] non anti-aliased image? In-Reply-To: <32992.63.237.54.129.1017179723.squirrel@members.evolt.org> References: <200203262112.g2QLC6Xt011216@leo.evolt.org> Message-ID: <200203262221.g2QMLBXt014727@leo.evolt.org> > From: "Daniel J. Cody" > > > > i must be missing something.... how's that look on white? > > white is the only background that *isnt* on the webmail thing AFAIK, > which is why i used the white text ahh... ok > > any reason you're going with PNG? > > better features, the license isn't a whore, smaller footprint, better > compression, gamma correction, etc. i meant based on browser support... err, i did say that, right? From abc at 263.net Tue Mar 26 19:19:01 2002 From: abc at 263.net (friend) Date: Tue Mar 26 19:19:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] 手机最低价，服务送到家。 Message-ID: <200203270118.g2R1ImXt022993@leo.evolt.org> ??? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? http://www.139shop.com/asp/mem-from.asp?uid=waynetan ????????????????? ????????waynetan ????????????????????????????????? ?????http://www.lovexin.com???????????????? ---------------------------------------------------- INFORMATION This message has been sent using a trial-run version of the TSmtpRelayServer Delphi Component. ---------------------------------------------------- From roselli at earthlink.net Tue Mar 26 23:10:01 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Tue Mar 26 23:10:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] title on job links Message-ID: <3CA0DF86.32368.479BCA02@localhost> ok, what happened to the title attributes on the job posting links in the sidebar... where'd they go? From jeff at members.evolt.org Wed Mar 27 02:07:01 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Wed Mar 27 02:07:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] title on job links In-Reply-To: <3CA0DF86.32368.479BCA02@localhost> Message-ID: aardvark, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: aardvark > > ok, what happened to the title attributes on the job > posting links in the sidebar... > > where'd they go? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< dunno. nevertheless they're back now along with a few more bugs i found that have been squashed. as usual, the changes can be found in the changelog: http://test.evolt.org/CHANGELOG.txt enjoy, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From gnarly at punkass.com Wed Mar 27 06:34:01 2002 From: gnarly at punkass.com (Olly Hodgson) Date: Wed Mar 27 06:34:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Harvester Sorting Query Message-ID: <00b001c1d58b$9d32b100$4400a8c0@gatewaycut> So, I go into the tip harvester, click on "Mar 18", then click to sort by Tip Title. Now theres no way in hell that they are in alphabetial order. Is this right? Olly. From dmah at shaw.ca Wed Mar 27 07:54:00 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Wed Mar 27 07:54:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Harvester Sorting Query In-Reply-To: <00b001c1d58b$9d32b100$4400a8c0@gatewaycut> Message-ID: <200203271354.g2RDsRw01205@alice.monkeyland.ca> It's sorted by canonical tip type. Unfortunately, for the last two weeks, the canonical tip type has not been assigned so they are all "Unclassified". What you are seeing is the attribute tip type. I'll be assigning tip types this morning. Dean Olly Hodgson writes: > So, I go into the tip harvester, click on "Mar 18", then click to sort by > Tip Title. > > Now theres no way in hell that they are in alphabetial order. Is this right? From gnarly at punkass.com Wed Mar 27 08:19:00 2002 From: gnarly at punkass.com (Olly Hodgson) Date: Wed Mar 27 08:19:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Harvester Sorting Query References: <200203271354.g2RDsRw01205@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <015801c1d59a$386afca0$4400a8c0@gatewaycut> ----- Original Message ----- From: Dean Mah Subject: Re: [thesite] Tip Harvester Sorting Query > It's sorted by canonical tip type. Unfortunately, for the last two > weeks, the canonical tip type has not been assigned so they are all > "Unclassified". What you are seeing is the attribute tip type. I'll > be assigning tip types this morning. Ah, right, that explains it :-) Cheers, Olly. From roselli at earthlink.net Wed Mar 27 08:34:04 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Wed Mar 27 08:34:04 2002 Subject: [thesite] title on job links In-Reply-To: References: <3CA0DF86.32368.479BCA02@localhost> Message-ID: <200203271433.g2REXOXt020223@leo.evolt.org> > From: ".jeff" > > > ok, what happened to the title attributes on the job > > posting links in the sidebar... > > dunno. nevertheless they're back now along with a few more bugs i > found that have been squashed. as usual, the changes can be found in > the changelog: > > http://test.evolt.org/CHANGELOG.txt good reading... should there be dates on the versions? thanks... From isaac at members.evolt.org Thu Mar 28 00:06:00 2002 From: isaac at members.evolt.org (isaac) Date: Thu Mar 28 00:06:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] FW: [thalist] Headlines from evolt.org for 27-MAR-02 Message-ID: Are these still going out and including every article? I don't think I noticed one come through for my last news piece. > -----Original Message----- > From: thelist-admin at lists.evolt.org > [mailto:thelist-admin at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of Headlines > Sent: Thursday, 28 March 2002 4:25 Pm > To: thelist at lists.evolt.org > Subject: [thelist] Headlines from evolt.org for 27-MAR-02 > > > evolt.org headlines for 27-MAR-02 > > Hi evolters! > > We have some fresh content on evolt.org today, contributed by our > members. Learn something new or review the perspective of someone > else: > > News: ITAA Opposes Digital Rights Management Act (Author: bs0d) > http://www.evolt.org/article/headline/1/23037/index.html > > The Information Technology Association of America (ITAA) this week > called the introduction of the Digital Rights Management Act in the > U.S. Senate a blow to innovation and consumer choice. > > > > > Authors really appreciate feedback from their peers; you can leave a > comment and rate articles by logging into the evolt.org web site. > > Happy reading! > > evolt.org > > -- > For unsubscribe and other options, including > the Tip Harvester and archive of thelist go to: > http://lists.evolt.org Workers of the Web, evolt ! > From roselli at earthlink.net Thu Mar 28 00:19:01 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Thu Mar 28 00:19:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] FW: [thalist] Headlines from evolt.org for 27-MAR-02 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3CA26F2B.16911.4DB3F8D3@localhost> > From: "isaac" > > Are these still going out and including every article? > > I don't think I noticed one come through for my last news piece. cuz you hit your limit... anyway, last headlines mail went out on the 23rd http://lists.evolt.org/archive/Week-of-Mon-20020318/107578.html none for the 26th, the date of your article... http://lists.evolt.org/archive/Week-of-Mon-20020325/date.html your article was approved on the 27th, even though the date of the submission (and article) was the 26th, and so it entered the new articles queue as the 26th... http://lists.evolt.org/adminarchive/Week-of-Mon-20020325/002800.html i'd guess what happened is that it was approved *after* the headline batch ran for the 26th (it was approved at 0:21 AM CST), but it was dated the 26th, so it didn't get picked up by the 27th batch job because it was an old date... of course, to dave, he approved it on the 26th, because he's not in CST, he's earlier still... no announcement went out for the article on the 25th, either, which if looked up, might have similar date/time attributes (around midnight)... problem: - we assume the server is in our time zone, which we see all the time when those messages come in dated so old they fall off my mail view... - we approve late at night, when we have time to review... - we don't check to see if the article date matches the approved date listed in the email announcement to admin... solution: - short term: we read the admin approval announcement and compare the date of the announcement to admin to the date of the article... - long-term: dunno... change time zones? going to bed now... From ben_dyer at imaginuity.com Thu Mar 28 09:19:00 2002 From: ben_dyer at imaginuity.com (Ben Dyer) Date: Thu Mar 28 09:19:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] FW: [thalist] Headlines from evolt.org for 27-MAR-02 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020328091604.019ba718@mail.imaginuity.com> And, on a somewhat related note, are the admin new article notifications still going out? The last two didn't seem to make the admin list (it's been almost a day now)... --Ben On 12:10 AM 3/28/2002, isaac said to me: >Are these still going out and including every article? > >I don't think I noticed one come through for my last news piece. Ben Dyer, Senior Internet Developer, Imaginuity Interactive http://www.imaginuity.com/ I'm reading your e-mail right now. ----------------------------------------------------------------- http://members.evolt.org/OKolzig37/ http://www.evolt.org/ From mwarden at mattwarden.com Thu Mar 28 11:07:09 2002 From: mwarden at mattwarden.com (Warden, Matt) Date: Thu Mar 28 11:07:09 2002 Subject: [thesite] FW: [thalist] Headlines from evolt.org for 27-MAR-02 In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20020328091604.019ba718@mail.imaginuity.com> Message-ID: Ben, do you see them in the archive? i see quite a few of them there now, but i didnt take the time to match them up with the articles on weo... just looked at the sheer number thanks, On Mar 28, Ben Dyer had something to say about Re: [thesite] FW: [thalist]... >And, on a somewhat related note, are the admin new article notifications >still going out? The last two didn't seem to make the admin list (it's >been almost a day now)... > >--Ben -- mattwarden mattwarden.com From ben_dyer at imaginuity.com Thu Mar 28 11:38:01 2002 From: ben_dyer at imaginuity.com (Ben Dyer) Date: Thu Mar 28 11:38:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] FW: [thalist] Headlines from evolt.org for 27-MAR-02 In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020328091604.019ba718@mail.imaginuity.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020328113244.047d44e8@mail.imaginuity.com> On 11:06 AM 3/28/2002, Warden, Matt said to me: >do you see them in the archive? Nope. That's the next place I checked. They are, however, listed in the new articles queue. The two articles I'm referring to: (Of course, the second one is mine, which is why I even noticed at all. :) >i see quite a few of them there now, but i didnt take the time to match >them up with the articles on weo... just looked at the sheer number Interestingly enough, one (well, two, duplicate submission) just came through fine today, but still no mention of the other two. Really strange... --Ben Ben Dyer, Senior Internet Developer, Imaginuity Interactive http://www.imaginuity.com/ I'm reading your e-mail right now. ----------------------------------------------------------------- http://members.evolt.org/OKolzig37/ http://www.evolt.org/ From roselli at earthlink.net Thu Mar 28 12:19:00 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Thu Mar 28 12:19:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] FW: [thalist] Headlines from evolt.org for 27-MAR-02 In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20020328113244.047d44e8@mail.imaginuity.com> References: Message-ID: <200203281818.g2SIILXt024961@leo.evolt.org> > From: Ben Dyer [...] > Nope. That's the next place I checked. They are, however, listed in > the new articles queue. The two articles I'm referring to: > > 24/index.html> > 25/index.html> ooh, never even saw those two... so, no, i didn't get those emails, either... From webguru at vsnl.net Thu Mar 28 12:52:01 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Thu Mar 28 12:52:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] FW: [thalist] Headlines from evolt.org for 27-MAR-02 In-Reply-To: <20020328181034.1B3B052211@relay.evolt.org> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020329001937.031fe328@203.197.12.4> At 11:40 PM 3/28/2002, Ben wrote: >Nope. That's the next place I checked. They are, however, listed in the >new articles queue. The two articles I'm referring to: > > > Hey, I haven't seen those either. So it's not just you, Ben. wtf? Madhu <<< * >>> Madhu Menon User Experience Consultant e-mail: webguru at vsnl.net From cspruck at mindspring.com Thu Mar 28 13:58:00 2002 From: cspruck at mindspring.com (cspruck at mindspring.com) Date: Thu Mar 28 13:58:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] FW: [thalist] Headlines from evolt.org for 27-MAR-02 Message-ID: At 11:40 PM 3/28/2002, Ben wrote: >Nope. That's the next place I checked. They are, however, listed in the >new articles queue. The two articles I'm referring to: > > > Chances are the mail got lost in the short outage we had the other night, but I can't explain how they made it into the article queue. Chris From dougchick at thenetworkadministrator.com Sat Mar 30 07:16:01 2002 From: dougchick at thenetworkadministrator.com (dougchick at thenetworkadministrator.com) Date: Sat Mar 30 07:16:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] The Bitter Network Administrator Message-ID: <200203301315.g2UDFZXt025261@leo.evolt.org> [ Converted text/html to text/plain ] The Network Administrator sp; A Website Dedicated to Computer Professionals and those not so professional ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Feature Articles: How many certifications before you are a MCTT? (Microsoft Certified Test Taker) (image)Where is the line between having too many certifications and just enough? Does your resume give the impression that you have more experience in test taking than actual work experience? If this sounds like you then here's a quick test to see how you rank. Relax Poindexter...there's no test here. I was just kidding. By Doug Chick (image)[1] ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Are you choosing software for your company by what will look best on your resume? (image) First thing I do when looking for software for my company is research all available software similar to our needs. Then I do a detailed comparative analysis, followed by a call to a list of satisfied customers supplied by the software company. After all, isn?t that what all Network Administrators do? Well, maybe not all... By Doug Chick (image)[2] ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Why wouldn?t Microsoft package it?s own computer like Apple? (image)I Read an article by Phillip Smith that raised an interesting question; Why wouldn?t Microsoft package it?s own computer like Apple or Sun, and stop selling it?s software to computer makers altogether? Microsoft could agree that they created a market that made them a monopoly and to add balance to the industry they would stop selling their product to computer makers and only use it in their own systems. (image)[3] ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Has Monitoring your Network Given you a God Complex? (image)From your desk you can see who and when someone logs in, who and what e-mail they send and what websites that they frequently attend. Knowing this information can sometimes place you in difficult situations. You often ask yourself if you should interfere to help someone that you like, or don't like. See an e-mail that you know is damaging and wonder if you should stop or remove it completely. It's a very difficult position to be in and almost no one, short of other computer people know about it. So what do you do? I am now of the philosophy that, "Unless someone is in danger of being hurt--Stay out of it!" By Doug Chick (image)[4] ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ How many computer catalogs do companies think you need? (image)On an average, I receive 5 computer accessories catalogs by mail, everyday. That?s 25 a week, 100 a month and 1200 an year. Now stacking 10 magazines on top of each other will give you an inch, and 1200 magazines will produce a stack 10 feet high. Let?s review: 5 magazines X 5 days = 25 X 4 weeks = 100 X 12 months = 1200 magazines = a stack 10 feet high. (image)[5] ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Who wants to be a Network Administrator? (image)Why are there so many people out there that are studying so hard to take your job away from you? Money. I was sitting in the movie theater with my wife last night and one of the ads on the screen before the movie started read: Be a Network Administrator and earn 87K a year. Well, two thumbs up again for those lying salary surveys. I don?t really think that those salary surveys are lying as much as I believe that there?s one network administrator out there that makes 47 millions dollars a year and is totally warping the salary curve. (image)[6] ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Is your career dependant on the operating system that you support? (image) If suddenly one day, the president of your company announced that he just struck a deal to change all the servers operating systems in your company to ?Serversoft? (trademark pending) what would you do exactly? Furthermore, what if your company started hiring people that were Serversoft certified, (trademark pending) that had no real life computer experience and were paid more than you? How likely is that to happen? Ask a Novell Administrator. (image)[7] Submit an Article[8] Note, If you did not subscript to the Newsletter and wish to be removed, Click here![9] * Monkey Sling The Network Admins Survival Guide The Language of the End-User Hacker Facts Conspiracy Theory Who Let the Bugs Out * * * * * * * * * * | Copyright 2001 TheNetworkAdministrator.com & DougChick.com | ===References:=== 1. http://www.thenetworkadministrator.com 2. http://www.thenetworkadministrator.com 3. http://www.thenetworkadministrator.com 4. http://www.thenetworkadministrator.com 5. http://www.thenetworkadministrator.com 6. http://www.thenetworkadministrator.com 7. http://www.thenetworkadministrator.com 8. mailto:submit at thenetworkadministrator.com 9. mailto:removeme at thenetworkadministrator.com From amanda at gawow.com Sat Mar 30 14:43:01 2002 From: amanda at gawow.com (A. Erickson) Date: Sat Mar 30 14:43:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Burning gifs from the past Message-ID: <000201c1d82b$d3281fa0$9cd563d8@75CTT01> I noticed that this article popped up in the 'revived article' list. http://www.evolt.org/article/Burning_mad_conversion_software_frustration /25/1987/index.html It's from May 2000 which seems eons ago in web times. It's also from the Commentary & Society section which could get dated really fast. I don't know what sort of priority this is but it seems to me that the revived category might want to avoid: Commentary, Jobs, News and Community News. (I have no idea if some categories are already blocked by our present system.) - amanda ___________________________________ amanda at gawow.com + http://gawow.com From jeff at members.evolt.org Sat Mar 30 15:11:01 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sat Mar 30 15:11:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] RE: [admin] Burning gifs from the past In-Reply-To: <000201c1d82b$d3281fa0$9cd563d8@75CTT01> Message-ID: amanda, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: A. Erickson > > I noticed that this article popped up in the 'revived > article' list. > > Burning mad conversion software frustration > http://evolt.org/article/revived/25/1987/ > > It's from May 2000 which seems eons ago in web times. > It's also from the Commentary & Society section which > could get dated really fast. > > I don't know what sort of priority this is but it seems > to me that the revived category might want to avoid: > Commentary, Jobs, News and Community News. (I have no > idea if some categories are already blocked by our > present system.) ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< presently news, suggestions, faq, jobs, and community news are blocked from showing up as a revived article. teo now also has commentary & society blocked as well. good catch. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From martin at members.evolt.org Sat Mar 30 15:12:00 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Sat Mar 30 15:12:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [admin] Burning gifs from the past In-Reply-To: <000201c1d82b$d3281fa0$9cd563d8@75CTT01> Message-ID: <89CEC93E-4420-11D6-91D1-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> On Saturday, March 30, 2002, at 08:45 pm, A. Erickson wrote: > I noticed that this article popped up in the 'revived article' list. > > http://www.evolt.org/article/Burning_mad_conversion_software_frustration > /25/1987/index.html > > It's from May 2000 which seems eons ago in web times. It's also from the > Commentary & Society section which could get dated really fast. > > I don't know what sort of priority this is but it seems to me that the > revived category might want to avoid: Commentary, Jobs, News and > Community News. (I have no idea if some categories are already blocked > by our present system.) Hi Amanda Sure, some of the articles in that section *could* be dated. But a) only some of them - others are as relevent now as they were then b) is that a problem for a 'revived article'? Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From jeff at members.evolt.org Sat Mar 30 15:29:11 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sat Mar 30 15:29:11 2002 Subject: [thesite] RE: [admin] Burning gifs from the past In-Reply-To: <89CEC93E-4420-11D6-91D1-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: martin, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Martin > > Sure, some of the articles in that section *could* be > dated. But > a) only some of them - others are as relevent now as > they were then > b) is that a problem for a 'revived article'? ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< revived articles are meant to revive the better articles we have available that no longer appear on the homepage. the system we have right now is only meant as an interim solution until we find something better. so, since a good portion of the articles in commentary & society are outdated, it's simply easier to just remove that category from revived articles. .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From amanda at gawow.com Sat Mar 30 15:48:01 2002 From: amanda at gawow.com (A. Erickson) Date: Sat Mar 30 15:48:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] RE: [admin] Burning gifs from the past In-Reply-To: <89CEC93E-4420-11D6-91D1-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <000a01c1d834$e2196a60$9cd563d8@75CTT01> > Sure, some of the articles in that section *could* be dated. But > a) only some of them - others are as relevent now as they were then So, are you thinking it's not a priority? > b) is that a problem for a 'revived article'? I think it is. As a user, I'm *so* not interested in irrelevant info. Personally, as a user, I'd be more interested in a "staff picks" type thing for article revival instead of just a randomizer. - amanda From r937 at interlog.com Sat Mar 30 15:59:01 2002 From: r937 at interlog.com (rudy) Date: Sat Mar 30 15:59:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Burning gifs from the past Message-ID: <01c1d836$2a5483e0$5a50149a@rudy> > presently news, suggestions, faq, jobs, and community news > are blocked from showing up as a revived article. teo now also > has commentary & society blocked as well. good catch. these are still hardcoded, right? jeff, any interest in moving to "category attributes" so that all the various features ( revived / front page / drop down / et cetera ) are generalized? it would mean some code revision, nothing drastic like a conversion, it could be done a bit at a time the other question, of course, would be the admin panels to manage categories at all, we should also build those, i guess the database changes would be the easy part... rudy From martin at members.evolt.org Sat Mar 30 17:45:00 2002 From: martin at members.evolt.org (Martin) Date: Sat Mar 30 17:45:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Re: [admin] Burning gifs from the past In-Reply-To: <000a01c1d834$e2196a60$9cd563d8@75CTT01> Message-ID: <16671102-4438-11D6-BB28-000502172AD3@members.evolt.org> On Saturday, March 30, 2002, at 09:50 pm, A. Erickson wrote: >> Sure, some of the articles in that section *could* be dated. But >> a) only some of them - others are as relevent now as they were then > > So, are you thinking it's not a priority? I think it's not a priority to remove them. And I think that some of the articles in that section we'd be nothing short of dumb to dismiss *just* because they're in that section. >> b) is that a problem for a 'revived article'? > > I think it is. As a user, I'm *so* not interested in irrelevant info. > Personally, as a user, I'd be more interested in a "staff picks" type > thing for article revival instead of just a randomizer. Well yes, so would everyone I think. But looking back at how we were then *is* interesting, particularly when it's opinion and commentary rather than hard news that you can research anywhere. Cheers Martin _______________________________________________ email: martin at easyweb.co.uk PGP ID: 0xA835CCCB martin at members.evolt.org snailmail: 30 Shandon Place tel: +44 (0)774 063 9985 Edinburgh, url: http://www.easyweb.co.uk Scotland From dmah at shaw.ca Sat Mar 30 19:23:00 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Sat Mar 30 19:23:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Harvest Look Updated Message-ID: <200203310123.g2V1NOG01432@alice.monkeyland.ca> Better late than never? I've changed the look of the tip harvester page as suggested by David. Take a look at: http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/dean If no one objects, I will move it into production tomorrow. Dean From djc at members.evolt.org Sat Mar 30 22:06:00 2002 From: djc at members.evolt.org (Daniel J. Cody) Date: Sat Mar 30 22:06:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Harvest Look Updated In-Reply-To: <200203310123.g2V1NOG01432@alice.monkeyland.ca> References: <200203310123.g2V1NOG01432@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <1176.65.25.162.115.1017547537.squirrel@members.evolt.org> nice work! > Better late than never? > > I've changed the look of the tip harvester page as suggested by David. > Take a look at: > > http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/dean > > If no one objects, I will move it into production tomorrow. > > Dean > _______________________________________________ > For unsubscribe, archive, and options, go to: > http://lists.evolt.org/mailman/listinfo/thesite From rwd at csi1st.net Sat Mar 30 22:44:01 2002 From: rwd at csi1st.net (Ron Dorman) Date: Sat Mar 30 22:44:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Harvest Look Updated References: <200203310123.g2V1NOG01432@alice.monkeyland.ca> <1176.65.25.162.115.1017547537.squirrel@members.evolt.org> Message-ID: <3CA69574.40EF7DFD@csi1st.net> "Daniel J. Cody" wrote: > nice work! +1 > > > Better late than never? > > > > I've changed the look of the tip harvester page as suggested by David. > > Take a look at: > > > > http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/dean > > > > If no one objects, I will move it into production tomorrow. I say go. Ron D. From roselli at earthlink.net Sat Mar 30 23:42:01 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Sat Mar 30 23:42:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Harvest Look Updated In-Reply-To: <200203310123.g2V1NOG01432@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <3CA65ACD.29069.5D046B58@localhost> > From: Dean Mah [...] > http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/dean [...] other than the pipes as delimiters, it looks good to me... no, i have no immediate suggestions for delimiters, but something *not* vertical or horizontal would be better so it doesn't get confused as the number 1 or blend in with the icons... bullet? slash? peanut? From dmah at shaw.ca Sat Mar 30 23:57:00 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Sat Mar 30 23:57:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Harvest Look Updated In-Reply-To: <3CA65ACD.29069.5D046B58@localhost> from Message-ID: <200203310557.g2V5vHl02005@alice.monkeyland.ca> aardvark writes: > > From: Dean Mah > [...] > > http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/dean > [...] > > other than the pipes as delimiters, it looks good to me... > > no, i have no immediate suggestions for delimiters, but something > *not* vertical or horizontal would be better so it doesn't get > confused as the number 1 or blend in with the icons... > > bullet? slash? peanut? Small set of cubes? Or would that look too clunky? Dean From dmah at shaw.ca Sat Mar 30 23:58:01 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Sat Mar 30 23:58:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Categorization Message-ID: <200203310559.g2V5x3502014@alice.monkeyland.ca> If anyone wants to help with categorizing old tips in the database, let me know. You need to at least have a registered weo account. Dean From roselli at earthlink.net Sun Mar 31 00:22:01 2002 From: roselli at earthlink.net (aardvark) Date: Sun Mar 31 00:22:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Harvest Look Updated In-Reply-To: <200203310557.g2V5vHl02005@alice.monkeyland.ca> References: <3CA65ACD.29069.5D046B58@localhost> from Message-ID: <3CA6645D.7959.5D29C401@localhost> > From: Dean Mah > > [...] > > > http://lists.evolt.org/index.cfm/a/harvest/b/dean > > [...] > > > > other than the pipes as delimiters, it looks good to me... [...] > > bullet? slash? peanut? > > Small set of cubes? Or would that look too clunky? clunky... and busy... anything cool in the character entity charts? data table (table.data)? From jeff at members.evolt.org Sun Mar 31 00:35:00 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sun Mar 31 00:35:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Categorization In-Reply-To: <200203310559.g2V5x3502014@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: dean, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Dean Mah > > If anyone wants to help with categorizing old tips in > the database, let me know. You need to at least have > a registered weo account. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i'm always willing to help out with that sort of thing. thanks, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From dmah at shaw.ca Sun Mar 31 01:02:00 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Sun Mar 31 01:02:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Categorization In-Reply-To: from <".jeff"@Mar> Message-ID: <200203310702.g2V72RL02147@alice.monkeyland.ca> .jeff writes: > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > From: Dean Mah > > > > If anyone wants to help with categorizing old tips in > > the database, let me know. You need to at least have > > a registered weo account. > ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > > i'm always willing to help out with that sort of thing. Okay, go to: http://lists.evolt.org/~dmah/Private/thetips.cgi You should be able to use the same username and password as the one you use for weo. Dean From webguru at vsnl.net Sun Mar 31 01:15:01 2002 From: webguru at vsnl.net (Madhu Menon) Date: Sun Mar 31 01:15:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] The Bitter Network Administrator In-Reply-To: <20020330180212.92FF1C042@relay.evolt.org> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020331110025.02775a68@203.197.12.4> >The Network Administrator > > sp; A Website Dedicated to Computer Professionals > > and those not so professional Oh man, now this guy is spamming thesite too? Crap! From jeff at members.evolt.org Sun Mar 31 01:18:00 2002 From: jeff at members.evolt.org (.jeff) Date: Sun Mar 31 01:18:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Categorization In-Reply-To: <200203310702.g2V72RL02147@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: dean, ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< > From: Dean Mah > > http://lists.evolt.org/~dmah/Private/thetips.cgi > > You should be able to use the same username and > password as the one you use for weo. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< i can login. i can see the lookup form and summary link. clicking the link opens a new window with a list of categories. clicking a category takes me to a page with a list of tips in that category. clicking the id of the tip opens a new window and i get redirected to a login page. logging in gives me the error: ---Error--- Login Failed You are not allowed to access this area. ---/Error--- using the lookup gives me this error: ---Error--- Internal Server Error The server encountered an internal error or misconfiguration and was unable to complete your request. Please contact the server administrator, djc at members.evolt.org and inform them of the time the error occurred, and anything you might have done that may have caused the error. More information about this error may be available in the server error log. ------------------------------------------------- Apache/1.3.23 Server at lists.evolt.org Port 80 ---/Error--- I hope this helps, .jeff http://evolt.org/ jeff at members.evolt.org http://members.evolt.org/jeff/ From dmah at shaw.ca Sun Mar 31 01:30:00 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Sun Mar 31 01:30:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Categorization In-Reply-To: from <".jeff"@Mar> Message-ID: <200203310730.g2V7UUF02290@alice.monkeyland.ca> .jeff writes: > i can login. i can see the lookup form and summary link. clicking > the link opens a new window with a list of categories. clicking a > category takes me to a page with a list of tips in that category. > clicking the id of the tip opens a new window and i get redirected > to a login page. logging in gives me the error: Ah, the summary link doesn't work. I don't usually use it. Typically I just enter a random ID into the lookup and start from there. I'll look into getting the summary going again. Dean From dmah at shaw.ca Sun Mar 31 01:49:01 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Sun Mar 31 01:49:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Categorization In-Reply-To: <200203310730.g2V7UUF02290@alice.monkeyland.ca> Message-ID: <200203310750.g2V7o7J02317@alice.monkeyland.ca> Dean Mah writes: > .jeff writes: > > > i can login. i can see the lookup form and summary link. clicking > > the link opens a new window with a list of categories. clicking a > > category takes me to a page with a list of tips in that category. > > clicking the id of the tip opens a new window and i get redirected > > to a login page. logging in gives me the error: > > Ah, the summary link doesn't work. I don't usually use it. Typically > I just enter a random ID into the lookup and start from there. > > I'll look into getting the summary going again. Summary is working now. Oh, and it is not a good idea to delete tips at this point. Dean From andrew at thepander.co.nz Sun Mar 31 02:40:00 2002 From: andrew at thepander.co.nz (Andrew Forsberg) Date: Sun Mar 31 02:40:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] The Bitter Network Administrator References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020331110025.02775a68@203.197.12.4> Message-ID: <000d01c1d88e$fef96f40$0201a8c0@berlin> > >The Network Administrator > > > > sp; A Website Dedicated to Computer Professionals > > > > and those not so professional > > Oh man, now this guy is spamming thesite too? Crap! Think it was a joke Madhu. :) I thought the 'Novell admin speaks out' thing was pretty funny. From dmah at shaw.ca Sun Mar 31 13:15:01 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Sun Mar 31 13:15:01 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Harvester Page Changes Message-ID: <200203311915.g2VJFIO01995@alice.monkeyland.ca> 1) I've swapped in the new version of the front page. I'm still using the pipe as the delimiter between the dates until someone comes up with something better. 2) I've added a "Print Tip(s)" link so the tips will be displayed on a white background without the black navbar thingie. 3) I've opened up the tip categorization tool to whoever wants to help out. Dean From dmah at shaw.ca Sun Mar 31 19:17:00 2002 From: dmah at shaw.ca (Dean Mah) Date: Sun Mar 31 19:17:00 2002 Subject: [thesite] Tip Harvester Page Changes Message-ID: <200203311845.g2VIjep01863@alice.monkeyland.ca> 1) I've swapped in the new version of the front page. I'm still using the pipe as the delimiter between the dates until someone comes up with something better. 2) I've added a "Print Tip(s)" link so the tips will be displayed on a white background without the black navbar thingie. 3) I've opened up the tip categorization tool to whoever wants to help out. Dean