> -----Original Message----- > From: thelist-bounces at lists.evolt.org > [mailto:thelist-bounces at lists.evolt.org]On Behalf Of > rytames at telusplanet.net > Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 1:21 AM > To: thelist at lists.evolt.org > Subject: [thelist] Question... > The problem was, I had to leave, so no diploma. I > figured the diploma would be meaningless anyway, > as the academics were not really pleasing. WRONG!! Let me tell you from experience! I went through 3 years of college (the Reagan years) and had to quit. It was pay tuition or eat. It was a hard choice. Well, it's now 20 years later. I've spent the last 12 of them as a "Professional Senior Internet Technologies Developer and Team Lead", one who has created, developed and lead teams in same for projects ranging from $250,000 to 4 million dollars. We've built application servers from the ground up - back in the days that phrase did not exist, much less being able to buy one off the shelf; integrated multiple legacy main frames and minis with telephone systems and desktops; created XML/XSLT Java/Struts based enterprise wide systems to churn out thousands of pages from massive databases to millions of users. And no, we didn't use IIS or ASP (oh yea, we built one of those back in 98, ASP-like processors I mean)! I got laid off in February, and still looking for work! Finally got to talk to a few HR/recruiter types; experience is not my problem. That damn piece of paper, or lack there of is! Yep! the diploma. So don't think for one! minute that a degree is meaningless, even though I helped create cutting edge technology LONG before any school ever thought of teaching it, in fact 90% still don't teach it. In fact, they won't even *let* me teach it, because of that piece of paper. So, do what you have to do, finish! Don't end up like this old man, after 12 years as internet junkie, after being one of the team that opened Chicago's 2nd ISP, after working 7+ years as a senior level consultant at many Fortune 1000 corporations, after making 100k plus a year; end up mowing lawns and helping someone else install glass and mirrors simply to just make ends meet (barely). Finish! Then worry about how to be a web guru. Besides, web gurus are a dime a dozen now-a-days. Any given internet-based technology job gets thousands of applications per each single opening. Companies are picking and choosing who they want. Who has the largest (perceived) skill set, who will work the longest hours, who will work for as close to minimum wage as they can get away with. No relocation, no bonuses, no options. "We have a job, you want it, what will you do for *us*!" Long gone are the internet wild and wooly days of pool table, massage chairs, open frigs of drinks, candy and food. Gone are the days of "damn the marketing schedule, we are going to do this right!". Gone are the massive IPOs and 22 years old getting rich. Welcome to the neo-depression of the early 21st century. Oh, one more thing. If you have an H-1 visa, you have a better chance than if your a citizen. Sorry if I sound cynical, it's just been a long hard 6 months, and there is no end in sight. And I'm not the only one in this boat. I have many others pulling these oars beside me, *and* they do have diplomas. Good luck. Walter PS: your site is too artsy. Too heavy in large images. Remember, if your market is corporate America, then you want sleek, clean easy to read and understand in 3 seconds, that's the attention span of a corporate mucky-muck. But at least there you can get away with large images, since they have fast connections. If your market is small firms, they might give you 2 minutes, and their pipe is not so big. And when you start building sites for the public, don't assume everyone has IE 6, XP and a DSL connection. Design accordingly.